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blessedhope

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Does anyone want to Know on this forum? > What is going on in your world and will be coming very soon. in your life time? The world is falling apart and this forum does not want to talk about it !
 

blessedhope

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And Revelation 1King James Version (KJV)
1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.
3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
 

blessedhope

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And Hosea 4:6King James Version (KJV)
6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.
 

blessedhope

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And He replied, “When evening comes, you say, ‘It will be fair weather, for the sky is red,’ and in the morning, ‘Today it will be stormy, for the sky is red and overcast.’ You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but you cannot interpret the signs of the times.” (Matt. 16:2-3)

So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’ spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. (Matt. 24:15-16)

For then there will be great distress (Great Tribulation), unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again. (Matt. 24:21)

When it comes to developing any kind of time line concerning the End Times, the watershed event has to be the Abomination that Causes Desolation. Why? Because from that time forward, the Bible gives a very clear sequence of events.

First, the Abomination is the event that kicks off the Great Tribulation, a period of judgments 3 1/2 years long.(Matt 24:15,21) After the Great Tribulation, the Lord returns and following His return the Millennium begins. After the Millennium comes Eternity. Any one on Earth during this time will be able to predict these events with reasonable accuracy.

Second, we who study prophecy can also count backward from the Abomination that Causes Desolation and predict the sequence of events leading up to it by applying our knowledge of Scripture.

How Does That Work?
Well, we know that the Abomination involves the anti-Christ standing in the Temple in Israel, proclaiming himself to be God. (Daniel 9:27 and 2 Thes. 2:4)

But that can’t happen until some other things take place first. Obviously the anti-Christ has to be revealed. And the Jews have to build their Temple. This is something that can’t happen until they experience a change in attitude causing them to demand a Temple regardless of the consequences. A recent poll commissioned by the Joint Forum of Temple Mount Organizations showed that 30% of the citizens of Israel want a Temple built, but even if every one of them did just the hint that they were going to build one would send the rest of the world into a tizzy. It simply wouldn’t be permitted.

Some major event has to take place to convince all the Jewish people that building a Temple in Israel is the right thing to do in spite of all the trouble it could cause, and some world leader has to have enough clout to convince the rest of the world, especially the Muslim Middle East, to let them do it.

Daniel 9:27 also reveals that as the End of the Age approaches, a leader from among the people who destroyed the Temple in 67 AD will confirm (enforce) a 7 year covenant with Israel that includes permission to build a new Temple, and that in the middle of this period he will commit the Abomination that Causes Desolation. That explains the persuasive world leader. He’s the anti-Christ, and he will want the Temple built for reasons that have nothing to do with Israel. The unanswered question in Daniel’s prophecy is why the Jews would desire a Temple at that particular time.

Our knowledge of the Old Testament tells us that a Temple was necessary to fulfill the requirements of the Levitical worship system. So then, because of the uproar it would create, it seems logical to assume that the Jews would only want a Temple if they felt it was absolutely necessary for the Nation of Israel to re-instate their Old Covenant worship of God.

How Does That Happen?
Toward the end of his two-chapter prophecy that speaks of a great end times battle between Israel and its neighbors (Ezek. 38-39), Ezekiel noted that God is going to use this battle to reveal Himself to Israel and the world once again. The way He’ll do this is to give Israel a decisive victory in the face of such overwhelming odds that everyone on Earth will realize that only God could have done it. Ezekiel wrote that following the battle God would gather all His people alive at the time to Israel, not leaving any behind. (Ezek. 39:28)

So this battle is the event that compels a national return to God in Israel. And when all the living Jews in the world are suddenly drawn to Israel because God has called them there, they’ll demand a Temple so they can resume their Old Covenant relationship with Him. If He was calling them through the Messiah into a New Covenant relationship they wouldn’t need a Temple, so it has to be a resumption of the Old Covenant, which as we know was interrupted seven years short of it’s promised duration. Their New Covenant call, prophesied in Jeremiah 31:31, happens later during the time of the Two Witnesses (Rev 11) and they’ll respond to it toward the end of the Great Tribulation, according to Zechariah 12:10.

Also on the heels of Ezekiel’s battle, the anti-Christ will emerge with a plan to restore peace to the Middle East. He first appears as a peacemaker as foretold in Daniel 8:25. He will cause deceit to prosper, and he will consider himself superior. When they feel secure, he will destroy many and take his stand against the Prince of princes. Yet he will be destroyed, but not by human power. I prefer the King James translation of the second sentence, which begins, “By means of peace he will destroy many …”. So the battle of Ezekiel 38-39 creates the circumstances for both the anti-Christ and the Temple to appear on the scene, setting the stage for the Abomination that Causes Desolation.
 

blessedhope

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And Connecting The Dots
Using our Bible knowledge to back into the present from the Abomination that Causes Desolation, so far we find the sequence looks like this.

The Abomination can’t happen till the Temple’s built. But that can’t happen till a 7-year covenant is confirmed permitting its construction. (By the way, this 7-year period is often called Daniel’s 70th week because it’s the last week of years in a prophecy consisting of 70 weeks of years given to Daniel in about 538 BC. Dan. 9:24-27)

The 7-year covenant can’t happen till someone from among the descendants of the Roman people emerges with a plan for peace in the Middle East. And that can’t happen till the battle described in Ezekiel 38-39 puts the Middle East in all out war.

Ezekiel’s battle can’t happen until God is ready to reveal Himself to Israel again, bringing Jews from all over the world to Israel clamoring for a Temple so they can re-instate their Old Covenant relationship with Him.

For all of my 25 plus years as a student of prophecy, scholars have been expecting the Battle of Ezekiel 38. Yet the conditions that make it possible have never been met. For one thing, Israel has never known a single day of peace, let alone the prolonged period necessary for them to be described as a peaceful and unsuspecting people, the way they were in Ezekiel 38:8,11,14. Something has to happen to make them feel like they no longer have a threatening enemy while leaving Iran, Russia, and the other nations Ezekiel identified in position to attack.

Recently, several writers, myself included, have seen two other Old Testament prophecies as likely preludes to Ezekiel 38. In Psalm 83 it appears that all of Israel’s next door neighbors will rise up in an attack intended to destroy the Jewish nation, and Isaiah 17 specifically mentions Israel’s destruction of Damascus. The defeat of Israel’s neighbors fills in two more blanks in the end times sequence. First, it explains why none of them are mentioned in Ezekiel 38, when logic dictates that they should be right in the thick of things. Second, it reveals how the Jews can be caught with their guard down. With Syria, Hamas, Hezbollah, Lebanon, and the others defeated, Israel will finally have some breathing room. Since Russia and Iran have traditionally used these neighbors as proxies rather than having a face-to-face confrontation, Israel may feel there’s no longer any threat from them either.

But Wait, There’s More!
And neither God’s revelation to Israel nor the emergence of the anti-Christ can happen until the Church is gone, for two very good reasons.

1. In Acts 15:14 James clearly prophesied that after the Lord had taken the church He would return and rebuild the Temple. Simon has described to us how God at first showed his concern by taking from the Gentiles a people for himself. The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written: “After this I will return and rebuild David’s fallen tent. Its ruins I will rebuild, and I will restore it” (Acts 15:14-16).

After the Lord has taken the Church, He’ll return and rebuild the Temple. Two Greek words are critical to our understanding of this passage. The one translated tent also means Tabernacle, a reference to the Temple. The one translated taking means to lay hold of, or take up in order to carry, or carry away. I believe it’s a veiled reference to the Rapture of the Church preceding God’s return to Israel.

If so, it’s consistent with God’s way. He seems to focus either on Israel or the Church, never both at once. In the greater context of the passage James was illustrating this very point from the other end of the Church Age. He told the gathered Apostles that God was setting Israel aside while He took from among the Gentiles a people for Himself. But after He had taken them, He would return to restore Israel.

Later, Paul alluded to this sequence in Romans 11:25-27. I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: “The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins.”

As I’ve pointed out before, in Paul’s day the phrase full number was a nautical term that stood for the number of crewmen necessary before a ship could legally set sail. Apparently God has assigned a specific number to the church before it can be raptured. When that number is complete, the Church will “come in” to the place prepared for us. Come in was another nautical term meaning “to arrive at the intended destination”, which Jesus described as His father’s house in John 14:1-3. Then God will turn again to Israel, reversing the hardening of Israel’s heart, taking the blinders from their eyes, and offering salvation once more.

2. In 2nd Thessalonians 2:6-7 Paul explained that the anti-Christ could not be revealed until the power that’s restraining him is taken out of the way (literally out of the midst). To most evangelical scholars the power Paul wrote about is the Holy Spirit. Since this power is sealed within us (Ephe 1:13) it stands to reason that if the Holy Spirit is taken out of the way we have to go too. Here’s another hint of the Rapture of the Church, this time preceding the appearance of the anti-Christ.

So if the Rapture has to precede both the revelation of God to Israel and the revelation of the anti-Christ to the world, then the Rapture has to precede the battle of Ezekiel 38 as well. Since no one knows what the full number of the Church is, no one can know in advance exactly how long before Ezekiel 38 the Rapture will take place. It could literally happen any day, and there’s no day more likely than any other. For that reason we can’t locate it any more specifically in the End Times sequence than to say that it must precede Ezekiel 38.

But apart from the rapture, the sequence of events will go like this. The Battle of Psalm 83/Isaiah 17 come first, then when Israel feels secure the Battle of Ezekiel 38 will erupt. Then comes anti-Christ’s appearance as a peace maker, the 70th week of Daniel begins, the Abomination that Causes Desolation takes place , then the Great Tribulation, the Second Coming, the Millennium, and Eternity. The first of these could be very close. So close that you can almost hear the footsteps of the Messiah. 11-05-08



2 Corinthians 5:6 So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. 7 For we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.
 

ezekiel

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Yea the seas will rage they will over flow the banks the earth will belch out fire and brimstone from inside and fire and brimstone will fall from above. Yea the Earth will quake the land masses will move out of the place. Woe to them with riches and bunkers that say rocks kill us surely they will. The Heavens will shake the planets move out of the places where they dwell in. The Watchers that teach war yea they will fall also. The Heaven will be on fire to melt all the works.
 

Tropical Islander

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OP and extended OP: Seems like a lot of random circle hypothesis in one go around. Start with one nice idea and build the rest of the circle dominos in a conclusive realtionship to the initial assumption. Take out any of the dominos and most if not all will fall as a result. 1) "anti-Christ was not revealed" - Really? "Holy Spirit is taken out of the way" - Really? "rapture of the Church precede the appearance of the anti-Christ" - Really?, "then the Rapture has to precede the battle of Ezekiel 38 as well" - Really?. What would be left of all of these conclusions if a war starts in a few weeks/months that kills 2/3rd in Israel 5/6th in Russia and 9/10th in the US? And there was no rapture? What would be left of what so many people currently regard as christian religion?
 

Tropical Islander

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Short History of Pre-Trib Rapture Doctrine

Most of us know people who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture. As a result, such are not building up their most holy faith to endure to the END of this Antichrist War on the Saints. Thinking one will be raptured BEFORE the antichrist war on the saints is NOT good preparation to endure to the END of such a war. The Lord made it explicit that IMMEDIATELY AFTER the Tribulation is when He sends His angels for His elect. Matt 24:29-31. Perhaps a short true history of who, how, and when the pre-tribulation rapture doctrines originated would be helpful for you to help those whom you know to be in denial or failing to prepare because of this Jesuit doctrine. Jesuit? Yes, two Jesuit priests laid the foundations of the pre-trib rapture doctrine, unknown in the history of the Church, prior to the Reformation.

At the time of the Reformation, the vast majority of Protestants were convinced that the Pope was the personification of the antichrist. Most today now understand the pope to be the second beast, the false prophet of the antichrist prince. However, at the time of the Reformation, it was universally believed by all Protestants, that the Roman Church was the Harlot Religion System of Revelation seventeen. Today there is still good cause to see the Roman Church as the religious component of Babylon, meaning confusion, in the antichrist war on the saints.

This understanding that the Roman Church is the Religious Babylon brought millions of believers out of the Roman Catholic religious system, during the Reformation. Understanding that the Roman Church is the religious component of the confusion of Babylon, in the antichrist war on the saints in these last days, will also bring millions from the bondage of the Roman Church to freedom in Christ.

Because of how many during the Reformation saw the Roman Church as the Babylon harlot of Religion, it became expedient for certain Roman theologians to turn the attention of the people away from the Papacy. Indeed the Jesuits were responsible for the origin of the pre- tribulation rapture doctrines. It was two Jesuit priests who rightly deserve the title as the founders of pre-tribulation rapture doctrines. These two Jesuits invented a counter-interpretation to that held unanimously by the Protestants. They taught that the revelation of the antichrist was at some far distant date. In the entire history of the Church prior to the writings of these two Jesuit priests all believed the eminent Resurrection, Rapture, and Return of the Lord was a single simultaneous event, happening in the twinkling of an eye, on the last day, at the last trump. When is the Last Day? When is the Last Trump?

It was a Jesuit priest named Ribera who, in the days of the Reformation, first taught the basic ideas of the pre-tribulation rapture. Just putting the revealing of the antichrist way off in the future was a very effective way of taking the heat off of the Papacy during the Reformation. Then another Jesuit priest named Emmanuel Lacunza, built on Ribera's teachings and wrote a book called The Coming of Messiah in Glory and Majesty. True to Jesuit style and stealth, Lacunza knew the Protestants were not going to widely receive a book written by a Jesuit priest. The Jesuit, Lacunza, therefore wrote his book under the assumed name of Rabbi Ben Ezra. This fictitious Rabbi Ben Ezra, was presented in Lacunza's book as a scholarly Jewish Rabbi who had accepted Christ as his Savior. By this ploy the Jesuit Lacunza was able to get his book to have a good reception in the Protestant world. No Protestants in the Reformation era would have allowed a copy of The Coming of Messiah in Glory and Majesty in their homes if they had any idea that the book was written by a Jesuit.

Because Lacunza presented the book as written by a scholarly Jewish Rabbi who had become a Christian believer in the Lord Jesus Christ, he knew the Protestants would love and receive his Jesuit book. The Jesuits certainly have not gotten less subtle, and it does not seem the Church has gotten more discerning. Lacunza's book, The Coming of Messiah in Glory and Majesty, was a very successful, elaborate forgery. In his book, Lacunza taught the new idea that Jesus returns TWICE, or TWO Second Comings. The Jesuit Lacunza was the first in all history to teach two second comings of the Lord Jesus Christ. Lacunza taught that at the first stage of His return He raptures His Church so they can escape the reign of the future antichrist. His book was first published in Spanish in the 1812.

Shortly after Lacunza's book was published, a Protestant leader in England by the name of Edward Irving discovered Lacunza's book. Edward Irving translated Lacunza's book into English in 1827. The Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, 1966 issue, pages 648-649, describe Edward Irving and the controversy over his teachings in Scotland and England in the early 1800's. He was excommunicated by the London presbytery, and in 1833 was condemned and deposed from the ministry of the Church of Scotland because of his teaching concerning "the sinfulness of Christ's humanity". He also began to teach a "rapture of the Church", after a young Scottish girl by the name of Margaret MacDonald went into a trance and described a vision in which she said she saw the Saints leaving the earth at the return of the Lord, before the tribulation. Her trance and vision took place in the spring of 1830, while living in Port Glasgow, Scotland. Her "revelation" was recorded in a book written by R. N. Norton and printed in London in 1861.

John Nelson Darby was a leader and prolific writer among the Plymouth Brethren. Darby was part of the Irvingite movement. He was strongly influenced by Irving, and Lucunza's book which Irving had translated into English, and particularly by the book by Norton, of the vision of Margret MacDonald. By 1850 John Darby had organized the Jesuit fraud of TWO second comings of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the pre- tribulation rapture fraud, into a system of prophetic teachings called dispensationalism.

In 1860's John Darby was put on the payroll of the British East India company. The British East India Company has historically been held by the Illuminati blood lines of European royalty, (Greek kings as Daniel would call them). John Darby was sent to America with the specific Illuminati goal of weakening the strong faith of American Christians. Darby's dispensationalism was sure to be successful in America in that purpose for which he was put on the Illuminati payroll.

Americans were and have been proven to be particularly easy to be taken by the Jesuit originated, non-scriptural, doctrines of pre-trib lala land. The reason is because of what is the make up of the people group known as Americans. Perhaps the best way of describing the American people group is one which came from a stock of hard working, risk taking, God fearing, people, who delight in making plans and take special delight in having their plans come together. Americans are good planners. As a people group they do not even want God messing up their plans, unless He would pouf them out in a fabled pre- trib rapture to heaven before anything bad would happen to otherwise mess up their plans.

In America in the 1860's Darby's dispensational TWO SECOND COMINGS dispensational interpretations met with wide open reception across the entire spectrum of American Protestant and biblical Christianity. A lawyer of very dubious character who had become a Congregationalist preacher, named C.I. Scofield came under the influence of Darby and the Plymouth Brethren. That brought the Scofield Reference bible and most know the history from that point certainly has led to the great apostasy, not the rapture, but the great falling away from The Faith.

For a good, short, clear verification of this history I would just recommend looking at the article title DISPENSATION which James L. Blevins wrote in the Holman Bible Dictionary. J. Preston Eby has also done some fine work on this subject. Perhaps the best and most comprehensive work on the subject of the history and background of pre-trib rapture doctrines has been done by Dave Macpherson. Dave Macpherson is the author of The Rapture Plot, The Incredible Cover Up, The Great Rapture Hoax, Unbelievable Pre-Trib Origin and Late Great Pre-Trib Rapture. All of Dave Macpherson's books are excellent, well written, and well researched. The best source of truth on the subject however, is the more sure word written in the KJV Holy Bible. The GJiGT book can also be a particularly helpful tool in regard to illustrating what the more sure word of God says in full context on the subject of the Great Tribulation. How the GJiGT book is organized makes it useful to quickly debunk any pre-trib supposed proof texts wrested from their context.

The Scofield Reference Bible was destined to have a tremendous impact upon the beliefs of many. There were three million copies published in the first 50 years. Through this Bible, Scofield carried the teaching of the TWO Second Comings and the two stage rapture to almost the whole of American Christianity. It is truly amazing when one finds that this TWO Second Comings, and a pre-tribulation rapture for the super duper saints, and three and a half years of hell on earth for the not so super duper saints, is NOT supported by a single verse of scripture in context rightly divided by the Holy Ghost. Astonishing, yet as Fly told Babe – That is just the way things are. Also, The Lord Jesus Christ said it would be like this – that in these last days of such strong delusion, with such a vast majority of false teachers having been taught these Jesuit doctrines, in the Jesuit infiltrated Protestant seminaries, - Mat 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

The truth train of history of pre-trib rapture doctrine begins with two Jesuit priests. The first was named Ribera. His writings influenced the Jesuit priest Lacunza. Lacunza influenced Irving, Irving influenced Darby, Darby influenced Scofield, Scofield and Darby influenced D.L. Moody, and Moody influenced a very large part of evangelical Christianity, and almost the entire Pentecostal movement. Someone once said all roads lead to Rome, and in the case of the pre-trib rapture doctrines that remains accurate.