This has been rattling around in my head for the last couple of days so I thought I would throw it out there to see what people think...I saw two gentlemen discussing when they thought 'the last generation' began. One was insistent that it began in 1948 with the birth of Israel.The other was equally insistent when he said it began in 1967 with the retaking of eastern Jerusalem from Jordan and the reuniting of the city.I would like your thoughts on this.I do however have one request:When you chose to include scripture to support your thoughts or to refute someone else's, for the love of all that is good, pure, and holy PLEASE ensure that it is relevant...to...the...topic...at...hand.I have invited others to come and see this site and their first comment upon looking at some of the threads is almost always, "Why do they post so many scripture verses that have little or anything to do with the topic of the thread?" Volume does not = value.Thank you in advance, and again I look forward to hearing your thoughts.
1948 Or 1967
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Great question Polar I do think 1967 was a major marking point and perhaps completed the process that began in 1948. So does one count from the beginning of the process or the completion of the process? The Fig tree has always represented Israel the Land/Nation as a Whole not just Jerusalem which is only a part of the whole So are we told to watch for when this tree is full grown ?Matthew 2432) Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nighNo! we are told just the opposite when its tender young and just putting forth leaves. So we are IMHO supposed to start counting at the beginning....so I will have to go with 1948 ..Israel didn't exist as a nation for some 1900 years .....Then this fig tree putteth forth her new leaves ...The parable is called the Parable of the fig tree (Israel) not the parable of Jerusalem ... It was the entire nation that ceased to exist not just the city of Jerusalem..Therefore the entire nation had to restored. That started or End Time clock.
Good question Polar. I am not going to quote anything so this is generally from memory and study thru the years.I go with 1948 as a the start in prophecy when God turns focus back to Israel. I think the clock has been ticking since then.I think 1967 is a substantual continuation of 1948 and confirmation things are unfolding as they should. 1973 as well.I think Psalm 83 is yet to happen. It may be the next main event. Israel will expand its borders far beyond what they now are. All Israels' surrounding enemies will be delivered a sudden and decisive blow that will send them reeling way back into the desert. Israel will "finally" have "all" its promised lands and borders and there will be a time of peace and safety. At least for a short while. Bill Salus lays outlines it pretty good.On the generation question , the numbers people will say a 70 year generation for a newborn in 1948 brings us close to 2018. Some numbers people like to subtract the 7 year trib from this which comes out to 2011. Some numbers people still interpret the old testament generation as being 120 years. Some numbers people said year 2000 was the big one. Numbers people are often selling books as a primary motive. I hold them at arms length and read as a sceptic, but bottom line I think we are the generation witnessing these events. I am pushing 60 and may miss the rest of it. I think anyone who is younger will probably not miss it.Not yet in the public domain is an event in the last few years that clearly shows the timetable continues. I have been able to examine parts of it and it is factual and provable. It may be in the public domain in early 2010. It will be a Profound announcement.This latest re-birth of Israel (1948) was spoken about in the OT (Isaiah I think) "In one day Israel will again become a nation" . Anyone who follows the events shortly before May 14 , 1948 will find the planners, right out of the blue , chose the name "Israel" at the very last moment without any knowlege of the OT prophecy. Neat how things work out as intended.Thanks again for the question Polar. I look forward to your opinion as well if you have one yet. Certainly is an interwsting and exciting topic. One of my favorites. Talk laterMartin W.
Awesome! You guys gave some things to chew on.I will be sharing your input with a friend and get their feedback, as well. Many thanks for your input! Anyone else?
Lev 7:36 Which the LORD commanded to be given them of the children of Israel, in the day that he anointed them, by a statute for ever throughout their generations. They became the state of Israel in 1948. 1967 was the sixth day war. Tensions and oonflict in 1956-57 with Egypt concerning the Suez canal. The Arab had control of Jerusalem before Hitler and they co-existed with the each other. In my personal opinion, what most theologians teach about Daniel in speaking about in the 70 7's are not accurate in theory, because the books have remained sealed on what God is saying and I believe them to perhaps mean weeks and months, not years that far back. For what was written in Daniel chapters 7-12 have been HID from ALL MEN until the time of the END Daniel 12:4,9. Vickie
Hello Martin. We all do have many opinions, no one knows clear understanding because this comes from the books being kept sealed until the time of the End. Daniel 12:4,9. Though, it is exciting to place our opinions out to others. The CHANGE that OBAMA is coming on America as it is quickly developing through this administration, will bring in events that we will all identify with rather quickly as we have all been studious, making ourselves aware towards these events spoken of in Daniel and the prophecies of the END. It will come around here pretty quick. This time next year America will be even more changed. Obama brought prophecy with his words that America is ready for Change and he is bringing it. He has been placed in this office by God to bring America into captivity and ruled in ways America has not known, nor ever experienced. We are going into captivity before long, all Christians or either killed by the sword as Zechariah 13:7-9 says 2/3's of the sheep will perish and it is close to coming forth. If it is God's will you will be seeing it soon. The same as all of us will. Vickie
Can someone help me out with what Vicki is trying to say.Because I read the scriptures she posted and then read them again as part of the entire chapter each are found in, and I do not see where they apply to what we are talking about.The whole "what most theologians teach about Danielin speaking about 70 7s is not accurate in theory" really doesn't sit well, either.But I sometimes marvel at how much I don't know and am open to being enlightened. Anyone?
With all due respect to Vickie's opinions I'm not sure I see the corlation either ... the Book was closed in Dan. but until when? Dan 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, [even] to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. When was it to be unsealed the time of the End which started in 1948 this when the book was opened ....69 of Danils weeks(of years) passed ended with the crisifiction the last week (of years) 7 years .. is the tribulation week To understand the timing of the scriptures is a some what complicated subject ... That one has to study in depth to understand If one doesnt understand the solar and lunar calender are differnt ..That there is Gods time and Mans time ... That Jewish figures of speech (called Idioms) play into this ... For example a week is not a week of Days but a week of years(7 years) one can become very confused easily. What this has to do with 1948 vs 1967 ... Im not sure whats being said.
Martin, I spoke with the people originally discussing this and one pointed out that in Genesis, during the time of Abraham and Sarah, the length of a generation was 100 years.He felt perhaps that is the timeline that should be applied here.He also felt strongly that the clock started ticking in 1948.
There are three generations in scripture a 40 year generation, a 70 year generation, and 120 year generation (some count this as 100 years) Now the scripture of the fig tree says that before the generation that wittiness's the events of 1948 ( the fig tree) all die Christ will return .... To my way of thinking sense God was referring to our generation appox.(1948)what is a typical lifetime generation today ? About 70 years ... Although possible for people to live 120 to 100 years its not a common term for a generation in our day .... So if we go with common most likely genration for our day we are talking 70 years 60 have passed .... as of May 2008 We just passed the 61 year ......That leaves us 9 years at most ...or anywhere in between now and 2018
Polar, If you only have a nodding acquainetence with scripture, you may not know when something has a direct bearing on a subject. You may think I am the same as some others. The dates mentioned have no bearing on the Generation mentioned at Matt 24:34. First: The word translated generation just mans a period of time when certian things are happening or when certain people are living. It does not point to a specific time period. If the generation did point to a specific date it would be 1914, when WW1 started. This is not speculation!! Daniel made many longrange prophecies, one of which bears on the date 1914. At Daniel 4:10 we are told of a huge tree. This tree is to be cut down and banded for seven times. This seven times were seven years in the case of Nebuchadnezzar, but in the long range prophecy the time would amount to a period of 2,520 years. A formula used in ancient times was a year for a day, Num 14:34, Eze 4:6. In these prophecies they used 30 days for a month, 360 days for a year. 7 Years times 360= 2,520 years. When this tree was cut down and banded it symbolized the Kingdom of God on earth would be ended, for a period of time, and then be put in place again, after a period of seven times, 2,520 years. The Kingdom, with God ruling over the Israelites ended in 607BC with thhe destruction of Jerusalem, by Nebuchadnezzar. 2,520 years later is 1914,the time when the Kingdom of God would again be put in place, with Jesus as King of that kingdom. WHAT EVIDENCE IS THERE??? What was to happen when the kingdom was agian set up?? Notice Rev 12:1-5 where it talks about the beginning of a kingdom, then verse 7-9 tells us what happens soon after Jesus is installed on his throne. War in heaven, and Satan and his demons are thrown out of heaven to the earth. THINK, if many demons are thrown to earth, what would that do to earth??? WE KNOW, WAR broke out on earth, Rev 12:12. So if any generation can be called the last generation, it would be the one that started in 1914. This also started with the Bible also calls the Last Days, 2Tim 3:1-5, 2Pet 3:3,4. If you notice, Jesus is one of the four Horses of Revelation, Chapter 6. Notice verse two where Jesus receives a crown. Jesus then begins his ride, right along with the other horses for a period of time. The Bible says Jesus rules in the midst of his enemies, Ps 110:1,2, 1Cor 15:24,25. In Rev 19:11-21, Jesus completes his ride, at Armageddon, brings an end to this system and sets up a paradise on earth, Rev 21:3,4. All this during the last generation, starting in 1914.
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One scientific theory is that there have been a whole series of God-created 'Big Bangs' in which the universe expands, slows, then begins to fall back in on itself, sparking another Big Bang, and another, and another.Perhaps each of these cycles is a 'generation'?
[quote name='Polar;68849]This has been rattling around in my head for the last couple of days so I thought I would throw it out there to see what people think...I saw two gentlemen discussing when they thought 'the last generation' began. One was insistent that it began in 1948 with the birth of Israel.The other was equally insistent when he said it began in 1967 with the retaking of eastern Jerusalem from Jordan and the reuniting of the city.I would like your thoughts on this.I do however have one request:When you chose to include scripture to support your thoughts or to refute someone else's' date=' for the love of all that is good, pure, and holy PLEASE ensure that it is relevant...to...the...topic...at...hand.I have invited others to come and see this site and their first comment upon looking at some of the threads is almost always, "Why do they post so many scripture verses that have little or anything to do with the topic of the thread?" Volume does not = value.Thank you in advance, and again I look forward to hearing your thoughts.[/QUOTE']hi polar... firstly, the phrase "last generation" does not seem to be a biblical phrase, so I am not sure where you are getting the phrase itself from... and thus, since it is not itself a biblical phrase, the meaning could be almost anything...perhaps you are referring to Luke 21:32 where Jesus uses the phrase "this generation"... Luk 21:32 ESV Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all has taken place." ?the problem I see with most Dispensational interpretations is that typically, in the OT, a "generation" was about 30 years, though the term "generation" could mean various things... "In NT Gr. geneá literally means space of time, circle of time, which only in a derived sense signifies the meaning of a time, a race; then generally in the sense of affinity of communion based upon the sameness of stock. Race or posterity (Act_8:33, "who shall declare his posterity?" [a.t.] i.e., the number of His followers as spoken of the Messiah and quoted from Isa_53:8; Sept.: Gen_17:12; Num_13:22; Est_9:28). A descent or genealogical line of ancestors or descendants. Generation (Mat_1:17; Sept.: Gen_15:16; Gen_25:13; Deu_23:3) as used in special reference to the physical or moral circumstances of a particular period, just as we speak of an age or time referring to the spiritual state of its society (Heb_3:10 [cf. Luk_7:31; Luk_11:31; Act_13:36]). The connection alone must decide whether the sense is limited to the state of society at a certain time or whether the word refers simply to race or stock. Spoken of the period of time from one descendant to another, that is, the average duration of human life, reckoned apparently by the ancient Jews at one hundred years (cf. Gen_15:16 with Exo_12:40-41); by the Greeks at three generations for every one hundred years, that is, thirty-three and a half years each. Hence, in the NT of a less definite period, an age, time, period, day, as ancient generations, that is, times of old (Luk_1:50, "generation to generation," i.e., to the remotest ages [cf. Rev_1:6; Act_14:16; Act_15:21; Eph_3:5, Eph_3:21, of future ages; Col_1:26. See Sept.: Gen_9:12; Psa_72:5; Pro_27:24; Isa_34:17; Joe_3:20]). In Luk_16:8, "in their very own generation" (a.t.), means they are wiser in their day, so far as it concerns this life. Metaphorically spoken of the people of any generation or age, those living in any one period, a race or class, e.g., "this generation" means the present generation (Mat_11:16; Mat_12:39, Mat_12:41-42, Mat_12:45; Mat_16:4; Mat_17:17; Mat_23:36; Mat_24:34; Mar_8:12, Mar_8:38; Mar_9:19; Mar_13:30; Luk_7:31; Luk_9:41; Luk_11:29-32, Luk_11:50-51; Luk_17:25; Luk_21:32; Act_2:40; Phi_2:15). Spoken of a former generation (Act_13:36; Heb_3:10); of the future (Luk_1:48; Sept.: Deu_32:5, Deu_32:20; Psa_12:8; Psa_14:5; Psa_24:6; Psa_78:6, Psa_78:8). The word geneá in Mat_24:34 may have had reference to the kind of Jew with whom Jesus was conversing during that particular time (Mat_21:23; Mat_23:29). He was telling them that this generation or type, such as the Sadducees and Pharisees of that day, would not pass away until all these things occurred and until His coming again in His parousía (G3952), Second Coming, which has proven to be true. He was prophesying the destruction of their nation (Mat_24:15-28). ....Deriv.: genealogéō (G1075), to reckon by generations; genetḗ (G1079), from his birth or the beginning of his life.Syn.: génos (G1085), kind, family, generation; génnēma (G1081), generation, but with the idea of having had birth from; éthnos (G1484), nation or people of the same kind; aiṓn (G165), an age, era.(Word Study Dictionary, Zodihates)"geneaThayer Definition:1) fathered, birth, nativity2) that which has been begotten, men of the same stock, a family2a) the several ranks of natural descent, the successive members of a genealogy2b) metaphorically a group of men very like each other in endowments, pursuits, character2b1) especially in a bad sense, a perverse nation3) the whole multitude of men living at the same time4) an age (i.e. the time ordinarily occupied be each successive generation), a space of 30 - 33 years"and if, when Jesus was speaking, His prophecy in Lk. did not literally come to pass, then what other conclusion can we come to but that Jesus was a false prophet? The thing is, Jesus' prophecy did in fact come true in AD 70 when the Romans sacked Jerusalem... THAT generation indeed did not pass away without the things Jesus speaking of in Luke 21 actually coming to pass.If you are referring to another area in Scripture, I apologize if I sidetracked the discussion....blessings,ken
Intersesting. I had grown up originally hearing 40 years then sixty, but obviously since that date has passed that was incorrect, as well.My question is, what gives credence to the number 70 (other than that fact that 40 and 60 have already passed)?Anyone?Christina;69194 said:
Does anyone else feel this way?I am surprised that no one here has either spoken up in agreement or in challenge of this.If what she says is accurate then the most important event in our lifetime is less than a decade away.If what she says is accurate, then the beginning of the Great Tribulation is less than three years away.If what she says is accurate, then the 'Restrainer' will be removed in even less time than that.If what she says is accurate, the pre-Tribulation Rapturists should be blowing their 401Ks on increasing Christian outreach for souls.I have seen my 'certainty' of '60 years' pass and that makes me skeptical about 70. But that skepticism by no means guarantees I am correct. She could be 100% correct. Or not. I know we are near the end and I feel this sense of urgency. I also know that timetables mean nothing and we should just keep moving forward with our eyes focused on Him.But sometimes, through interaction and cross-talk, new insights emerge that can be a blessing.I would appreciate feedback on her comments. Anyone?Christina;69194 said:
Personally I think the discussion of when the end-time will come is somewhat pointless... we should all just live our lives in preparation for it.Matthew 24:36
We can not exactly know the time when it is going to happen. But we can feel it's getting closer... Like we can not know when the baby in the womb coming out, but we can feel it's about time.However, to not discuss about Endtime, whether it's a how, or a why, or what is it or when, is just like sweeping God's Words into the rug, because Christ said to watch and look for signs. And talking about the last days does edify the Body of Christ.... we must stand and put our armor on, not take it off and sweep it to the rug.So in my opinion, I find your statement rather absurd.Deadwheat1224;72375 said:
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