A suggestion for evolution threads.

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This Vale Of Tears

Indian Papist
Jun 13, 2013
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I believe they should be relocated to the Unorthodox Doctrines or Meet Christianity forum

Evolution is not a Christian belief and in fact sets itself up in hostility to Christianity by trying to eliminate the Creator and the divine manner in which man was created. It is at loggerheads with what Christians have believed for 2000 years and cannot be reconciled with Christian belief.

Moreover it should be noted that though the evolutionists here claim it's nothing but science, they impose it on a Christian board which indicates they intend to insert it as a religious belief. If it truly was just science and nothing more, then it would be on a science forum, but here it is, not only on CB, but on every Christian discussion board who has not taken measures to restrict this imposition.

That's my opinion, that because evolution is categorically not a Christian belief, it has no place in general Christian discussions. I hope you'll consider my suggestion.
 
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Madad21

Boast in Christ
Dec 28, 2013
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This Vale Of Tears said:
I believe they should be relocated to the Unorthodox Doctrines or Meet Christianity forum

Evolution is not a Christian belief and in fact sets itself up in hostility to Christianity by trying to eliminate the Creator and the divine manner in which man was created. It is at loggerheads with what Christians have believed for 2000 years and cannot be reconciled with Christian belief.

Moreover it should be noted that though the evolutionists here claim it's nothing but science, they impose it on a Christian board which indicates they intend to insert it as a religious belief. If it truly was just science and nothing more, then it would be on a science forum, but here it is, not only on CB, but on every Christian discussion board who has not taken measures to restrict this imposition.

That's my opinion, that because evolution is categorically not a Christian belief, it has no place in general Christian discussions. I hope you'll consider my suggestion.
I agree

I would also like to petition of the "New World Bible versions" thread to be moved in to the unorthodox section. especially when you have certain people trying to build a conspiracy case against our modern Bible versions.
 

sojourner4Christ

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May 23, 2014
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I believe they should be relocated to the Unorthodox Doctrines or Meet Christianity forum

Evolution is not a Christian belief...

Moreover it should be noted that though the evolutionists here claim it's nothing but science, they impose it on a Christian board which indicates they intend to insert it as a religious belief...

...evolution is categorically not a Christian belief, it has no place in general Christian discussions.
Well stated. I would agree wholeheartedly.

would also like to petition of the "New World Bible versions" thread to be moved in to the unorthodox section. especially when you have certain people trying to build a conspiracy case against our modern Bible versions.
There's nothing unorthodox about the search for the truth and exposing the works of Satan. All Christians use a 'bible' of some sort. We're examining which are holy and which are unholy, as the Lord so commands.

There is a conspiracy of her prophets in the midst thereof, like a roaring lion ravening the prey; they have devoured souls; they have taken the treasure and precious things; they have made her many widows in the midst thereof. Eze 22:26 AV
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This Vale Of Tears

Indian Papist
Jun 13, 2013
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Madad, it looks like somebody took your suggestion to heart. That thread just got locked up.
respect-013.gif
 

Madad21

Boast in Christ
Dec 28, 2013
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This Vale Of Tears said:
Madad, it looks like somebody took your suggestion to heart. That thread just got locked up.
respect-013.gif
Im surprised, I mean it was so productive.......................................................................not
 

River Jordan

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Jan 30, 2014
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So anything that any one of us feels "cannot be reconciled with Christian belief" should be relegated to the Unorthodox Doctrines forum? Or is it just those things TVoT doesn't like?

Oh, and the reason it comes up so often here isn't because evolution is a religion, it's because it's an issue within the Christian community. Specifically, it's an issue for conservative Christians (most of the Christians in the rest of the world have no problem with it). If conservative Christians didn't devote so much time and resources towards fighting it, it'd never come up in places like this.
 

Madad21

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Dec 28, 2013
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Well for one its not like Vales gonna get his wish lets be honest.

But as far as the Christian belief goes the creation account is no where identical with an evolution formula, its really what your trying to put in where you feel there are empty spaces in the biblical account. (or rather omittance I should say)
In a way Its not all that much different to non trinitarians arguing on a trinitarian based forum against the trinity. you have to expect to run up against staunch trinitarians. most of which probably wont want you there. Im not surprised you run up against this stuff, if anything wouldn't you expect it?

This is just the way I see it, I cant answer for Vale. :)
 

River Jordan

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Madad21 said:
Well for one its not like Vales gonna get his wish lets be honest.
I hope not, 'cause if he does I want young-earth creationism similarly treated.

But as far as the Christian belief goes the creation account is no where identical with an evolution formula, its really what your trying to put in where you feel there are empty spaces in the biblical account. (or rather omittance I should say)
Obviously I disagree. Like many Christians around the world I have no problem reconciling evolution with scripture. I think it's pretty obvious even.
 

Madad21

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River Jordan said:
I hope not, 'cause if he does I want young-earth creationism similarly treated.


Obviously I disagree.
I dont mind if you disagree it doesn't bother me what others choose to believe,
I just dont understand why you get upset with creationists on a Christian forum. It would be like me going on a atheist forum and arguing creation and then getting all anti with them because they just cant seem to allow a creationist point of view in their thinking.

Do you like to entertain a slim chance that maybe the Christian evolution perspective might someday take hold here and flourish. I mean you've been here long enough to know that thats never going to happen. so the next question is why do you keep coming back?

If you keep coming back because you love the Christianity then why not enjoy that side of it without trying to push evolution on Christians, because then all your doing is coming back at us with little jabs about us being irrational and narrow minded etc. Thats not Christianity, thats judgement on Christians for believing in the Bible that informs their reasoning. And most of us dont just follow blindly as you have assumed in the past (I personally spend around 7-8 hours a night in biblical studies that include and in-depth knowledge of ancient and contemporary history, traditions languages social structures theologies, just to mention a few, its no easy ticket doing real study to really understand God and the Bible. It takes a lot of commitment to study like this as I think you'll understand.

And If thats not the reason you keep coming back then the only reason I can think is because you love to argue and debate evolution with creationist Christians, and if that's the case then why do you get upset with us for doing what it is you want us to do in the first place?

Im not having a go at you please dont get me wrong Im just trying to understand.


Like many Christians around the world I have no problem reconciling evolution with scripture. I think it's pretty obvious even.
Many Christian believe a lot of strange things doesn't make it true, wouldn't you agree, I mean we get some doozys here from time to time.
And then many Christian dont know what to believe, while others cant seem to let go of what they used to believe, the lists go on.

It maybe obvious to you, but its not obvious to others who believe what the bible tells them, And the Bible tells of a six day creation and it also tells them about the messiah Jesus Christ. The part about Jesus needs to be infallible, so its only natural that one would assume the rest of the bible is also infallible otherwise how can we believe anything the bible says? you cant blame Christians for not being willing to budge on the Word and we will argue in its defense, this to me is what is pretty obvious
 

River Jordan

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Madad21 said:
I dont mind if you disagree it doesn't bother me what others choose to believe,
I just dont understand why you get upset with creationists on a Christian forum. It would be like me going on a atheist forum and arguing creation and then getting all anti with them because they just cant seem to allow a creationist point of view in their thinking.

Do you like to entertain a slim chance that maybe the Christian evolution perspective might someday take hold here and flourish. I mean you've been here long enough to know that thats never going to happen. so the next question is why do you keep coming back?

If you keep coming back because you love the Christianity then why not enjoy that side of it without trying to push evolution on Christians, because then all your doing is coming back at us with little jabs about us being irrational and narrow minded etc. Thats not Christianity, thats judgement on Christians for believing in the Bible that informs their reasoning. And most of us dont just follow blindly as you have assumed in the past (I personally spend around 7-8 hours a night in biblical studies that include and in-depth knowledge of ancient and contemporary history, traditions languages social structures theologies, just to mention a few, its no easy ticket doing real study to really understand God and the Bible. It takes a lot of commitment to study like this as I think you'll understand.

And If thats not the reason you keep coming back then the only reason I can think is because you love to argue and debate evolution with creationist Christians, and if that's the case then why do you get upset with us for doing what it is you want us to do in the first place?

Im not having a go at you please dont get me wrong Im just trying to understand.
I think I see the problem here. You think I'm upset at creationists, when I'm actually not upset at them at all. And I'm here for the same reason most people are here...to discuss topics that interest me.

Many Christian believe a lot of strange things doesn't make it true, wouldn't you agree, I mean we get some doozys here from time to time.
And then many Christian dont know what to believe, while others cant seem to let go of what they used to believe, the lists go on.
I didn't say that because most Christians outside the US have no problem with evolution, therefore evolution is true. I just pointed that out to demonstrate that your claim about evolution being incompatible with Christianity isn't necessarily true.

It maybe obvious to you, but its not obvious to others who believe what the bible tells them, And the Bible tells of a six day creation and it also tells them about the messiah Jesus Christ. The part about Jesus needs to be infallible, so its only natural that one would assume the rest of the bible is also infallible otherwise how can we believe anything the bible says? you cant blame Christians for not being willing to budge on the Word and we will argue in its defense, this to me is what is pretty obvious
But not everyone takes a black/white, all or none approach to scripture. There are other ways of thinking about this, and hopefully it doesn't bother you when someone like me shows up and expresses it.
 

sojourner4Christ

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May 23, 2014
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Evolution is not a Christian belief...



...evolutionists here claim it's nothing but science, they impose it on a Christian board which indicates they intend to insert it as a religious belief.

...evolution is categorically not a Christian belief, it has no place in general Christian discussions.
What is actually taking place is a life and death battle between two spiritual positions. Evolution is a key tenet in the religion of humanism, just as creationism is a key tenet in Christianity. Man is innately "religious" (this fact alone is an unbridgeable chasm between humans and primates) and he is going to worship something, or someone, as a god--even if it is just more money and power. And since atheists/agnostics are humanistic to the core and do not believe in a "higher power," evolution is the only game in town for them. The cosmos is a reality--it exists and is observable--and if one attempts to explain where it came from and how it got here, apart from the creative act of God, evolution is presently the only viable alternative. But, when Christians dare to explain this magnificent universe in terms of Divine creation, evolutionists are offended--their religion has been slandered.

-- D. B.
 
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Madad21

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River Jordan said:
But not everyone takes a black/white, all or none approach to scripture. There are other ways of thinking about this, and hopefully it doesn't bother you when someone like me shows up and expresses it.
Not at all,

I personally dont think I hold that black and white all or none approach, I think scripture deserve a lot of vigorous diligent study, even learning other languages can help us pick up on a lot we havent seen before in the text, all the things I mentioned before can enlighten us to a whole new understanding, being in their shoes then and bringing that information in to the now.
The only thing I find with the Genesis account is the 6 day account being told to us as a literal 6 days, where as everywhere else in the bible we are given actual time frames, for example how long certain kings were in place or how long Israel was in the desert and how long Noah was on the boat etc.
 

River Jordan

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I understand that, but keep in mind a non-young-earth interpretation of Genesis goes back to just a few centuries after Christ. For example, St. Augustine argued in the 4th century that the Genesis creation account was not about passage of time, but more of a literary means of putting things in a logical sequence. Even before that Origen of Alexandria argued against such literalism when it comes to Genesis.

So you see, even well before the advent of science (let alone the scientific discoveries that led to the conclusion of an ancient earth and evolution) there was considerable debate within Christianity about how to interpret the Genesis accounts.
 

Madad21

Boast in Christ
Dec 28, 2013
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True, of this I have no doubt, this is where we get a lot of our theory's from even today as these ideas have progressed and matured and especially with the advent of science and the way in which its really taken off in the 20th century. All these philosophies can now be played out in the numbers and these numbers sourced from a multitude of different sources.

Did you know that in the bible in a time where there was a ton of healing going on by the laying on of hands etc, Timothy is advised by Paul to take medicine for a reoccurring illness he had.
1 Timothy 5 23 Stop drinking only water, and use a little wine because of your stomach and your frequent illnesses.

I really think that is something, that there is a real practicality in our everyday life to just look after ourselves the best way we know how, because God needs us to be in control of our own bodys in order to continue in the work he has for us. Its not all about spiritual healings and praying over people, God gave us the wisdom to look after these things and so He expects us to deal with it.

In the same way we have the wisdom to deal with our understanding in many issues, just as long as we dont get so tied up in these things we forget what it is Jesus is calling us for, as long as Jesus sits on the throne of our lives in center stage and we seek after him earnestly and apply His teaching to our daily lives, It shouldn't really matter how God created the earth or why Timothy had to take medicine instead of asking for healing.

But in respect of each others differences we need to love each other and except that we do not all think a like.

Thanks for talking with me again River, Im off to bed mate Ive just finished another long shift and my eyes are hanging out my head and the cats are hungry and driving me up the wall.
Much love to you Sis and God bless today.
 

This Vale Of Tears

Indian Papist
Jun 13, 2013
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sojourner4Christ said:
.



What is actually taking place is a life and death battle between two spiritual positions. Evolution is a key tenet in the religion of humanism, just as creationism is a key tenet in Christianity. Man is innately "religious" (this fact alone is an unbridgeable chasm between humans and primates) and he is going to worship something, or someone, as a god--even if it is just more money and power. And since atheists/agnostics are humanistic to the core and do not believe in a "higher power," evolution is the only game in town for them. The cosmos is a reality--it exists and is observable--and if one attempts to explain where it came from and how it got here, apart from the creative act of God, evolution is presently the only viable alternative. But, when Christians dare to explain this magnificent universe in terms of Divine creation, evolutionists are offended--their religion has been slandered.

-- D. B.
I agree with that assessment. Evolution has as it's main mission and motivation the removal of God the Creator as the only explanation for everything we see. As silly as it sounds, evolutionists are attempting to kill God. Christians who push evolution are much like Christians who push the legalization of drugs, unwittingly aiding the enemy instead of the truth of God.

BTW, since this is a serious request. I would LOVE it if a moderator could weigh in on this.
 

Madad21

Boast in Christ
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Sorry I didnt mean to rail road your thread bud, maybe you could PM one of the mods?
 

This Vale Of Tears

Indian Papist
Jun 13, 2013
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I thought that was the point of putting it on this section, so the mods will see it. One of them has already seen that trying to discuss anything with an evolutionist is like sweeping a dirt floor. If there's any time to consider a change, it's now.
 

lforrest

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This Vale Of Tears said:
I agree with that assessment. Evolution has as it's main mission and motivation the removal of God the Creator as the only explanation for everything we see. As silly as it sounds, evolutionists are attempting to kill God. Christians who push evolution are much like Christians who push the legalization of drugs, unwittingly aiding the enemy instead of the truth of God.

BTW, since this is a serious request. I would LOVE it if a moderator could weigh in on this.
The statement of faith may not be totally inclusive of all orthodox doctrine, but you can be sure everything it says is part of christian orthodoxy.

It says, "We believe that God is the Creator, Sustainer, and Ruler of the universe." Therefore I have no issue with moving topics that run contrary to this statement to the unorthodox forum where I have the ability. The forums I moderate include: General, Eschatology, Current Events, and Apologetics.

But wherever the topic may be, please patiently deal with heterodox doctrine while offering your admonitions. Don't allow your heart to be hardened towards them, and let gentleness be evident to all.