Brunei

[Butterfly]

I found it interesting to read the article about Gearoge Cloony, Elton John, and the UN backing a boycotte of hotels owned by the country. I wondered how and where you stand with regards to the issues that have led to this boycotte.
The reason is the laws that have been passed in the country , under sharia law, to hold homosexuals to account and legally be allowed to stone and kill them. To me this is barbaric - but I have seen so many really strong reactions to the homosexual issue on different forums overs the years. One of the leaders in the USA stated that if his son or daughter were gay he would take them out to a lake and ' see if they could swim ' ( actually heard him say that in an interview )
So would you follow the boycotte if you had the money to stay at the wealthy hotels that they own ?
I would , definately without a doubt, and personally I think the leader who stated he would kill his son or daughter ( in a round about way ) should have been held to account for that statement. I understand other people have come out and agreed with him for his comments - do you really think someone deserves to lose their life because of their sexuality ?
This is a question that my son put to me earlier in the week - how would respond to him if he asked you ?
Rita

 

[CoreIssue]

Physically, the death penalty no longer applies. Spiritually it is a death penalty in the lake.

 

[Butterfly]

But that wasn't my question , my question was ' would you boycotte the hotels'
Do you agree that the death penalty in this case.?
They are personal questions - so if you were personally asked those questions , what would you answer.
Your answer is no different to politicians who go round the houses rather than give a personal response, or opinion.
Rita

 

[Windmillcharge]

do you really think someone deserves to lose their life because of their sexuality

You are asking the wrong question.
Why when islam is so opposed to homosexuality is it that Christians are being perscuted by the authorities and nothing is done about clear anti homosexual messages coming from islam?

To answer your question, It has never been the law that the death penalty applied to homosexuality in the US or in the UK. It has been illegal to perform homosexual acts, but they resulted in prison, not death.

 

[Butterfly]

Your missing the point of this discussion - I am trying to get opinions on this particular story ,
Would you boycotte the hotels ?
Do you agree with what is happening in Brunei ?
In some respects you have both done what I thought some would do.
Is it that difficult just to have a personal answer to the questions, you either agree or disagree , you would either boycott or you wouldn't, then perhaps it would be good to ask ' why ' you answered as you did ,
I have said I would boycotte and I think it is totally wrong to punish in this way.
Why, because you are punishing the whole person and it is barbaric , and when Jesus stood up for the girl who was going to be stoned for adultery , he defended her by making it clear that not one person accusing her was innocent.
Rita

 

[CoreIssue]

But that wasn't my question , my question was ' would you boycotte the hotels'
Do you agree that the death penalty in this case.?
They are personal questions - so if you were personally asked those questions , what would you answer.
Your answer is no different to politicians who go round the houses rather than give a personal response, or opinion.
Rita

No on the death penalty. But no special legal rights and protections.

As far as I can tell the hotels only in Brunei, where I would never go.

There is also an airline.

 

[Windmillcharge]

Your missing the point of this discussion - I am trying to get opinions on this particular story

If you quote part of a reply then that reply is notified to the poster.

If you are going to be consistent you are going to have to boycot every product that comes from every muslim country and every buisness owned by muslims.

What is my view. I am sorry that they will not follow Gods law and live hetro sexual lives. I am sorry that there rejection of God and his standards also includes rejecting his offer of salvation.

You say it is barbaric to punish someone for there sexuality. Yet God will punish all who have not accepted Jesus's forgiveness of their sins. They will be punished for the sins they have commited.
Being 'gay' does not get anyone through Gods justice. Only faith in Jesus's death and resurrection does that.

 

[Butterfly]

There are a number of hotels in the uk - the Dorchester is a famous one , but I couldn't afford to step up on on the first step !
When you say legal rights or protection, do you not think they deserve the same protection as everyone else as citizens of a country ? ( don't have to answer unless you want to, I am just curious
Thank you for answering X
Rita

 

[CoreIssue]

The UN rushed to the defense of homosexuals, Muslims, illegal immigrants and more.

But they are silent on the persecution of Christians.

 

[Enoch111]

I found it interesting to read the article about Gearoge Cloony, Elton John, and the UN backing a boycotte of hotels owned by the country.

More Left-Liberal hypocrisy and nonsense. These are the very same people who have been urging Western nations to take in more and more Muslim migrants, knowing full well that homosexuality is a crime under Sharia law, and if Muslims become a majority in the West, they will enforce Sharia law.

The sultan of Brunei is so rich that he could care less if people did not use his hotels. Evidently he is worth at least 20 billion dollars.

 

[Butterfly]

If you quote part of a reply then that reply is notified to the poster.

If you are going to be consistent you are going to have to boycot every product that comes from every muslim country and every buisness owned by muslims.

What is my view. I am sorry that they will not follow Gods law and live hetro sexual lives. I am sorry that there rejection of God and his standards also includes rejecting his offer of salvation.

You say it is barbaric to punish someone for there sexuality. Yet God will punish all who have not accepted Jesus's forgiveness of their sins. They will be punished for the sins they have commited.
Being 'gay' does not get anyone through Gods justice. Only faith in Jesus's death and resurrection does that.

I have different views - I believe Jesus died for the whole of mankind, that's not to say we will not stand before him, and I believe in refiners fire.
I believe God is a fair and just God, where as I think his people can be unfair in thier judgements.
We judge on what we think we know about a person, God judges on what he knows , and his knowledge is so much more.
The King of Brunei is the one that owns the hotels - so I guess people think that if the boycott enough of his hotels and refuse to stay there that it may have an impact - not sure it will achieve that as he is proberbly too rich to even notice !

Just one thing, if a gay person comes to faith and accepts forgiveness, he / she would still be gay !
Rita

 

[Nancy]

I found it interesting to read the article about Gearoge Cloony, Elton John, and the UN backing a boycotte of hotels owned by the country. I wondered how and where you stand with regards to the issues that have led to this boycotte.
The reason is the laws that have been passed in the country , under sharia law, to hold homosexuals to account and legally be allowed to stone and kill them. To me this is barbaric - but I have seen so many really strong reactions to the homosexual issue on different forums overs the years. One of the leaders in the USA stated that if his son or daughter were gay he would take them out to a lake and ' see if they could swim ' ( actually heard him say that in an interview )
So would you follow the boycotte if you had the money to stay at the wealthy hotels that they own ?
I would , definately without a doubt, and personally I think the leader who stated he would kill his son or daughter ( in a round about way ) should have been held to account for that statement. I understand other people have come out and agreed with him for his comments - do you really think someone deserves to lose their life because of their sexuality ?
This is a question that my son put to me earlier in the week - how would respond to him if he asked you ?
Rita

I'm totally with you on this Rita. If they actually will do this to gays, then why not the adulterers, fornicators, liars, thieves, and so on. We are in a broken world. People are BORN broken in many ways, mental, physical, emotional..."Let him who has no sin..." It is NOT for us to judge the sin of those "without" the Church of Jesus Christ.

 

[Butterfly]

Oh it's the sultan of Brunai , didn't think it was King, but I could not remember what his title was- thanks Enoch x
Well we all know about the UN, we have heard it over and over again ! ( should have memorised it by now )
It doesn't mean that subjects cannot be discussed, I was just curious - - so I thought I would ask.
Is that a crime !?
Rita

 

[Enoch111]

It doesn't mean that subjects cannot be discussed, I was just curious - - so I thought I would ask. Is that a crime !? Rita

Not at all Rita. Westerners (including Amnesty International) continue to miss the point about Islam and Sharia law, while slapping the wrists of vicious criminals instead of making the punishment fit the crime.

1. Every country has the right to institute and apply its own laws (including Muslim Brunei).

2. Brunei had announce back in 2013 that it would be instituting Sharia law, which includes death by stoning for adultery and gay sex.
"On the other hand, the word “al-fahsha = الْفَاحِشَةَ” is used in the Quran to describe the act of zina. The very same word al-fahsha is used to refer to the bad deed of Prophet Lot (pbuh)’s community in the Quran, which allows homosexual relation to be classified within the scope of zina. The punishment inflicted on the people of Prophet Lot (pbuh) being similar to the stoning punishment (rajm), which is the prescribed punishment for zina in the Torah, also supports this opinion."
Punishment for Homosexuality in Islam

3. The Quran, as stated above, has taken its cue from the Torah (in the Bible) which also prescribes death by stoning for adultery and homosexuality.

4. These strict Islamic laws have already been in place in Saudi Arabia and other countries for many years, so this is nothing new.

5. The sultan of Brunei does not give a hoot about any such feeble boycotts. He could shut down all his hotels and continue to prosper.

6. Radical Islam's long-term goal is to conquer the West psychologically and politically through (a) shouting "Islamophobia" whenever anyone exposes Islam, (b) migrant invasion to flood the West with Muslims and (c) Muslim politicians who uphold Sharia law and work for its establishment while undermining Western values and laws. If and when Islam takes over, the same laws will come into play in the West.

 

[CoreIssue]

Not at all Rita. Westerners (including Amnesty International) continue to miss the point about Islam and Sharia law, while slapping the wrists of vicious criminals instead of making the punishment fit the crime.

1. Every country has the right to institute and apply its own laws (including Muslim Brunei).

2. Brunei had announce back in 2013 that it would be instituting Sharia law, which includes death by stoning for adultery and gay sex.
"On the other hand, the word “al-fahsha = الْفَاحِشَةَ” is used in the Quran to describe the act of zina. The very same word al-fahsha is used to refer to the bad deed of Prophet Lot (pbuh)’s community in the Quran, which allows homosexual relation to be classified within the scope of zina. The punishment inflicted on the people of Prophet Lot (pbuh) being similar to the stoning punishment (rajm), which is the prescribed punishment for zina in the Torah, also supports this opinion."
Punishment for Homosexuality in Islam

3. The Quran, as stated above, has taken its cue from the Torah (in the Bible) which also prescribes death by stoning for adultery and homosexuality.

4. These strict Islamic laws have already been in place in Saudi Arabia and other countries for many years, so this is nothing new.

5. The sultan of Brunei does not give a hoot about any such feeble boycotts. He could shut down all his hotels and continue to prosper.

6. Radical Islam's long-term goal is to conquer the West psychologically and politically through (a) shouting "Islamophobia" whenever anyone exposes Islam, (b) migrant invasion to flood the West with Muslims and (c) Muslim politicians who uphold Sharia law and work for its establishment while undermining Western values and laws. If and when Islam takes over, the same laws will come into play in the West.

Just three points:

Mohammed plagiarized the Old Testament.

Saudi Arabia has a hybrid form of sharia law and islam.

In Islam sex with boys under 18 is not homosexuality. It is allowed.

Some believe paradise will have 72 virgins and boys for the men going there.

 

[Butterfly]

Thanks for all the info- although I must admit my comment about ' knowing it off by heart ' is linked to the fact that the doom and gloom about the Muslims just seems to dominate at times.
I realise that you can start a thread with a Sheria law issue without the discussion including things about Muslims, but my intention was to have a debate along the lines ' how far would you go to stand up for injustice '
Would you ever make a stand to act for the injustice of a person you consider to be a sinner, Jesus did , but I wonder whether we would !
I wonder whether we would defend someone who was Gay if they were being bullied, mistreated ect
The story of the Good Samaritan - the person who was injured was considered ' an unclean person ' but the parable shows that this should not be a barrier
Or perhaps the lepers- definately a ' no go ' but Jesus crossed that line .......

When you have people in power who relay that they would ' drown ' a son or daughter if they came out and said they were gay, what does that say about following Jesus !! ( the guy was a Christian - well claimed to be - sadly I cannot remember his name ) Many around him came out and agreed with what he said - is that honestly the kind of Christianity that you want to be a part of ?

These were some of the questions I had intended to bring into the discussion - to challenge how we treat people just because ' they do not fit into our mode of what is okay '
Rita

 

[bbyrd009]

Physically, the death penalty no longer applies. Spiritually it is a death penalty in the lake.

I found it interesting to read the article about Gearoge Cloony, Elton John, and the UN backing a boycotte of hotels owned by the country. I wondered how and where you stand with regards to the issues that have led to this boycotte.
The reason is the laws that have been passed in the country , under sharia law, to hold homosexuals to account and legally be allowed to stone and kill them. To me this is barbaric - but I have seen so many really strong reactions to the homosexual issue on different forums overs the years. One of the leaders in the USA stated that if his son or daughter were gay he would take them out to a lake and ' see if they could swim ' ( actually heard him say that in an interview )
So would you follow the boycotte if you had the money to stay at the wealthy hotels that they own ?
I would , definately without a doubt, and personally I think the leader who stated he would kill his son or daughter ( in a round about way ) should have been held to account for that statement. I understand other people have come out and agreed with him for his comments - do you really think someone deserves to lose their life because of their sexuality ?
This is a question that my son put to me earlier in the week - how would respond to him if he asked you ?
Rita

id tell him to go find out what "homospirituals" means, and then maybe reflect on "digging a pit for others"

 

[Taken]

I found it interesting to read the article about Gearoge Cloony, Elton John, and the UN backing a boycotte of hotels owned by the country. I wondered how and where you stand with regards to the issues that have led to this boycotte.
The reason is the laws that have been passed in the country , under sharia law, to hold homosexuals to account and legally be allowed to stone and kill them. To me this is barbaric - but I have seen so many really strong reactions to the homosexual issue on different forums overs the years. One of the leaders in the USA stated that if his son or daughter were gay he would take them out to a lake and ' see if they could swim ' ( actually heard him say that in an interview )
So would you follow the boycotte if you had the money to stay at the wealthy hotels that they own ?
I would , definately without a doubt, and personally I think the leader who stated he would kill his son or daughter ( in a round about way ) should have been held to account for that statement. I understand other people have come out and agreed with him for his comments - do you really think someone deserves to lose their life because of their sexuality ?
This is a question that my son put to me earlier in the week - how would respond to him if he asked you ?
Rita

I do not "follow after" every person who has fame, a platform, stage or microphone.

Personally, I tend to IGNOR persons in the Music, Motion Picture and Arts industry as them being an influence to follow their ideas and philosophies.

I am quite capable of rejecting, refusing to do business with people I do not agree with, without trying to publically destroy an others livelihood.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Butterfly]

I do not "follow after" every person who has fame, a platform, stage or microphone.

Personally, I tend to IGNOR persons in the Music, Motion Picture and Arts industry as them being an influence to follow their ideas and philosophies.

I am quite capable of rejecting, refusing to do business with people I do not agree with, without trying to publically destroy an others livelihood.

Glory to God,
Taken

Well it wasn't really about the celebrities, they were just mentioned in the news report, I don't follow them either. So can I take it that you would never boycot anything , even if it was in defence of something you felt strongly about ?
So, just out of interest , and this is off topic. Would you ever go on strike over anything ?
Did you agree with the recent government shut down over in the US - that cost a lot of people money didn't it , but it was for a cause.
Rita

 

[Butterfly]

id tell him to go find out what "homospirituals" means, and then maybe reflect on "digging a pit for others"

I had never heard of that word, so I typed it in to google, so many things come up about it- but I am not sure I really got what it was !!! Lol
Are you addressing my son , not sure I understand what pit he is digging for others - sorry I am bit confused ( doesn't take much !! )
Rita