Built on The Wrong Apostle:

[H. Richard]

This article was written by me and used on Christian debate sites. I believe it to be true based on the scriptures given.

It is believed, by many, that the grace church was started by Peter on the day of Pentecost. But if you look close all that is written in Acts, spoken by Peter, is to get the Jews (Israel) to accept Jesus as their Messiah and king so that He would return and setup the kingdom that was promised in the covenant God made with Abraham. This covenant was not made to the Gentiles.

Even in Acts 8 & 9 where we see Saul being converted it was still time for the Jews to accept Jesus as their king so that He could return and set up the promised kingdom.

Luke 13:6 10
The Parable of the Barren Fig Tree 6 He also spoke this parable: "A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard, and he came seeking fruit on it and found none.
7 Then he said to the keeper of his vineyard, 'Look, for three years I have come seeking fruit on this fig tree and find none. Cut it down; why does it use up the ground?'
8 But he answered and said to him, 'Sir, let it alone this year also, until I dig around it and fertilize it.
9 And if it bears fruit, well. But if not, after that you can cut it down.'"
NKJV

God set the Jewish nation aside and went to the Gentiles when He, in 70 AD, had the Temple destroyed.

We see that Saul/Paul was chosen by God to be THE apostle to the Gentiles. His gospel of the grace of God was hidden in God and revealed to him (Paul), not the 12.

The 12 were apostles to the Jews. No where in the scriptures do we see Jesus and the 12 rescinding the Law of Moses, yet Paul taught that we are no longer under the Law of Moses and are dead to it. No where in the preaching of Peter, in the book of Acts, do we see any mention of salvation by the shed blood of Jesus on the cross. The reason is very simple. It was not revealed to them until Jesus told it to Paul.

Many say that James rescinded the law in Acts 15. But did he really? He said the Gentiles did not have to keep the law but nowhere in Acts 15 did he say the Jews did not have to keep it. If you go up to Acts 21:18 25 you will see that the 12 are still teaching the Jews that they are under the Law of Moses.

I believe that if people would REALLY see the words in the scriptures for what they say they would find that the religious have perverted the scriptures to say what they want them to say in order to keep the religious ideas they have. Satan does not want people to believe God’s promises given to Paul. Most of these religious ideas came through the RCC who built their church on the wrong apostle. If you look close you will see that the RCC has many of the religious rituals performed by the Jews in their Temple worship. The church for this age is built on the writings of the apostle Paul who was sent to the Gentiles by the Son of God, Jesus.

Acts 9:13 16 NKJV
13 Then Ananias answered, "Lord, I have heard from many about this man, how much harm he has done to Your saints in Jerusalem.
14 And here he has authority from the chief priests to bind all who call on Your name."
15 But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a chosen vessel of Mine to bear My name before Gentiles, kings, and the children of Israel.
16 For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My name's sake."

Acts 22:20 21 NKJV (Paul talking to Jesus in context)
20 And when the blood of Your martyr Stephen was shed, I also was standing by consenting to his death, and guarding the clothes of those who were killing him.
21 Then He said to me, 'Depart, for I will send you far from here to the Gentiles.'"

Gal 2:9 10 NKJV
9 and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised.
10 They desired only that we should remember the poor, the very thing which I also was eager to do.

Do the religious churches teach the agreement that was made in Gal 2:9 10 between the 12 and Paul? I think not. Do they teach that, under grace, we are no longer under the law of Moses that was taught by Jesus and the 12 to the Jews? I think not. Do they teach that the whole world will be judged by Paul’s gospel of grace, I think not.

Rom 2:16 NKJV (Paul wrote)
16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

Since Paul said the world will be judged according to his gospel then it would be wise to actually know his gospel.

Written by H Richard

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

I see from Acts 2 that the church was indeed set up in Acts 2. The church was not started by Peter but was founded, built by Christ Who is the head of His church...

Matthew 16:18-19 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."

--Christ said He would "build my church" showing Christ is the builder of the church, not Peter. The possessive pronoun "my" shows the church belongs to Christ.
--the terms "church" and "kingdom" are used interchangeably.
--Peter was given the "keys" to the church/kingdom of heaven. The 'keys' here are obviously not literal, physical metal keys but is figurative that Peter would be given the power/authority to gain entrance into the kingdom. If someone gave me their house keys, they are giving the ability, authority to gain access into their house.

The keys, the ability to gain access into the kingdom, would be the gospel of Christ as preached by Peter in Acts 2 where he preached the death, burial and resurrection of Christ which includes the shed blood of Christ. Those that obeyed the gospel (Acts of the Apostles 2:38) were the ones who gained entrance into the kingdom/church. John 3:5 "Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." One must first be born of water and Spirit (water baptism) in order to enter the kingdom.

Those baptized were the ones added to the church/kingdom (Act of the Apostles 2:47). This promise of Acts 2:38 was, in verse 39, to the Jews, their descendants and those afar off (Gentiles), as many (Jew and Gentile) the Lord God shall call. God calls men through His gospel (2 Thessalonians 2:14) and anyone, Jew or Gentile, that obeys the gospel call by being baptized (Jews in Acts 2:38 and Gentiles Acts 10:47-48) are added to the church/kingdom of God.

The 'mystery' spoken about in the NT was that both Jew and Gentile would make up God's kingdom/church (Ephesians 3:3-6) where in that kingdom, "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:28. This mystery of the relationship between Jew and Gentile being brought together in the church was revealed to all the Apostles, (Ephesians 3:5).

Paul taught the same faith Peter and other Apostles taught (Galatians 1:23)…"Nothing in the New Testament more emphatically nails down the fact that Paul did not "bring a brand-new way of salvation." The gospel he preached was exactly the truth he persecuted. The conflict which underlies Paul's extensive writings on faith vs. law is not a conflict between two ways of understanding the gospel; but it is a conflict between the one faith vs. the Law of Moses as interpreted by the Judaizers who made keeping it necessary and essential unto salvation (Acts 15:1)." Coffman Commentary

In Acts 15, all the Apostles rejected that the OT law of Moses had to be obeyed for one to be saved, that is, one did not have to be circumcised in order to be saved. Circumcision was the first step, a sign of the covenant between God and the Jew (Genesis 17:10-14). Since cirumcision of the OT law of Moses therefore was determined in Acts 15 as not being necessary to salvation, then the implication of that is the OT law of Moses is no longer in force, no longer in effect. The OT law of Moses made distinctions between foods and made distinctions between Jew and Gentile. The vision given Peter by God Acts 10 was to show Peter and the Jews those distinctions no longer exist, which again, implies the OT law of Moses was no longer in effect, no longer binding.

 

[justbyfaith]

yet Paul taught that we are no longer under the Law of Moses and are dead to it.

See such verses as Romans 8:4, Romans 8:7, Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6; Romans 5:5, Galatians 3:14.

These kinds of verses show that the law, while it no longer condemns us from the outside (and that this is what it means that we are not under the law, are dead to the law, and are delivered from the law); that it still does indeed govern us from the inside (see also Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16) who are under the new covenant.

 

[justbyfaith]

We are to accept the authority of every true apostle.

1Co 1:10, Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and thatthere be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
1Co 1:11, For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
1Co 1:12, Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
1Co 1:13, Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

1Co 3:1, And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
1Co 3:2, I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
1Co 3:3, For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
1Co 3:4, For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

This article was written by me and used on Christian debate sites. I believe it to be true based on the scriptures given.

It is believed, by many, that the grace church was started by Peter on the day of Pentecost. But if you look close all that is written in Acts, spoken by Peter, is to get the Jews (Israel) to accept Jesus as their Messiah and king so that He would return and setup the kingdom that was promised in the covenant God made with Abraham. This covenant was not made to the Gentiles.

Even in Acts 8 & 9 where we see Saul being converted it was still time for the Jews to accept Jesus as their king so that He could return and set up the promised kingdom.

Luke 13:6 10
The Parable of the Barren Fig Tree 6 He also spoke this parable: "A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard, and he came seeking fruit on it and found none.
7 Then he said to the keeper of his vineyard, 'Look, for three years I have come seeking fruit on this fig tree and find none. Cut it down; why does it use up the ground?'
8 But he answered and said to him, 'Sir, let it alone this year also, until I dig around it and fertilize it.
9 And if it bears fruit, well. But if not, after that you can cut it down.'"
NKJV

God set the Jewish nation aside and went to the Gentiles when He, in 70 AD, had the Temple destroyed.

We see that Saul/Paul was chosen by God to be THE apostle to the Gentiles. His gospel of the grace of God was hidden in God and revealed to him (Paul), not the 12.

The 12 were apostles to the Jews. No where in the scriptures do we see Jesus and the 12 rescinding the Law of Moses, yet Paul taught that we are no longer under the Law of Moses and are dead to it. No where in the preaching of Peter, in the book of Acts, do we see any mention of salvation by the shed blood of Jesus on the cross. The reason is very simple. It was not revealed to them until Jesus told it to Paul.

Many say that James rescinded the law in Acts 15. But did he really? He said the Gentiles did not have to keep the law but nowhere in Acts 15 did he say the Jews did not have to keep it. If you go up to Acts 21:18 25 you will see that the 12 are still teaching the Jews that they are under the Law of Moses.

I believe that if people would REALLY see the words in the scriptures for what they say they would find that the religious have perverted the scriptures to say what they want them to say in order to keep the religious ideas they have. Satan does not want people to believe God’s promises given to Paul. Most of these religious ideas came through the RCC who built their church on the wrong apostle. If you look close you will see that the RCC has many of the religious rituals performed by the Jews in their Temple worship. The church for this age is built on the writings of the apostle Paul who was sent to the Gentiles by the Son of God, Jesus.

Acts 9:13 16 NKJV
13 Then Ananias answered, "Lord, I have heard from many about this man, how much harm he has done to Your saints in Jerusalem.
14 And here he has authority from the chief priests to bind all who call on Your name."
15 But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a chosen vessel of Mine to bear My name before Gentiles, kings, and the children of Israel.
16 For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My name's sake."

Acts 22:20 21 NKJV (Paul talking to Jesus in context)
20 And when the blood of Your martyr Stephen was shed, I also was standing by consenting to his death, and guarding the clothes of those who were killing him.
21 Then He said to me, 'Depart, for I will send you far from here to the Gentiles.'"

Gal 2:9 10 NKJV
9 and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised.
10 They desired only that we should remember the poor, the very thing which I also was eager to do.

Do the religious churches teach the agreement that was made in Gal 2:9 10 between the 12 and Paul? I think not. Do they teach that, under grace, we are no longer under the law of Moses that was taught by Jesus and the 12 to the Jews? I think not. Do they teach that the whole world will be judged by Paul’s gospel of grace, I think not.

Rom 2:16 NKJV (Paul wrote)
16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

Since Paul said the world will be judged according to his gospel then it would be wise to actually know his gospel.

Written by H Richard

Built on the wrong Apostle??
Is it not built on the Revelation of Jesus Christ? As the dispute of Apostles ...the Revelation of Jesus Christ was sent to “you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.” ...
“they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised.”
-Ephesians 2:17-18 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. [18] For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Still the corner stone being The Revelation of Jesus Christ. Not the Revelation of Peter. Not the Revelation of Paul. Ephesians 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone ;

1 Peter 1:13 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;

Ephesians 1:17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
Again, not Peter or Paul but “revelation in the knowledge of him.”

Revelation 1:1-2 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: [2] Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

“he that is not against us is for us.”

 

[Enoch111]

I see from Acts 2 that the church was indeed set up in Acts 2.

I agree. It is a false dichotomy and false theology that Peter was merely focused on the Jews. Indeed, to keep people from making such an egregious blunder, we find Peter being compelled (more or less against his will) to go the the house of Cornelius. And that was not the only interaction of Peter with Gentiles.

The Church is NOT built upon Peter (the little rock, comparatively a pebble) but Christ (the massive Rock of Ages). And while Peter was assigned to the Jews and Paul to the Gentiles, both of them ministered to BOTH groups.

So this thread is promoting a major fallacy.

 

[H. Richard]

We are to accept the authority of every true apostle.

1Co 1:10, Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and thatthere be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
1Co 1:11, For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
1Co 1:12, Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
1Co 1:13, Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

1Co 3:1, And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
1Co 3:2, I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
1Co 3:3, For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
1Co 3:4, For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

 

[H. Richard]

We are to accept the authority of every true apostle.

1Co 1:10, Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and thatthere be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
1Co 1:11, For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
1Co 1:12, Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
1Co 1:13, Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

1Co 3:1, And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
1Co 3:2, I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
1Co 3:3, For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
1Co 3:4, For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

And I bet you think you are the true apostle.

 

[Davy]

The OP is just more junk from men's doctrines of Hyper-dispensationalism.

Dispensationalism basis of Hyper-dispensationalism = basis started by John Darby in 1830s Britain who also pushed a pre-trib rapture. Darby's unique form of Dispensationalism was designed to support the pre-trib rapture, as it postulates Israel being a new nation on earth after Christ's return, with Christ and His Church ruling from Heaven. Thus there is a false separation created between the idea of Jews and Gentiles, when Apostle Paul never taught any such thing involving Christ's Church (see Galatians 3:28).

Hyper-dispensationalism, a.k.a. "grace movement" = a cult.

There's different divisions of the movement involving a dividing of the Book of Acts, but the worst division are those like the OP here that teach only a certain group of Paul's Epistles apply to Christ's Church, and in trying to isolate Paul's preaching of The Gospel into another gospel that only Paul had.

The reality per Scripture is that Apostle Paul recognized others with the Apostles that came before him as being in Christ...

Rom 16:7
7 Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellowprisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.
KJV

That reveals the early Church in Christ existed prior to Apostle Paul's conversion on the road to Damascus. Acts 9 shows this clearly also once Saul (Paul) was converted.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

The OT law of Moses made distinctions between foods and made distinctions between Jew and Gentile. The vision given Peter by God Acts 10 was to show Peter and the Jews those distinctions no longer exist,

“...was to show Peter and the Jews those distinctions no longer exist.” Those distinctions no longer exist...what does that mean going forward...in Jesus Christ said returning to what is passed and looking back one is not fit for the Kingdom of God?

 

[justbyfaith]

And I bet you think you are the true apostle.

Resorting to insults?

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

“...was to show Peter and the Jews those distinctions no longer exist.” Those distinctions no longer exist...what does that mean going forward...in Jesus Christ said returning to what is passed and looking back one is not fit for the Kingdom of God?

By the OT law being removed by Christ there was no longer a middle wall of partition between Jew and Gentile where both are now one in the church/kingdom, Ephesians 2:14-15. Luke 9:62 Jesus knew man would encounter various problems in life that would prevent one from being a disciple. Those that become Christians and members of the kingdom/church cannot allow for these distractions to pull him away. Nothing wrong in taking care of worldly issues but not let those issues lead one away from the kingdom/church.

 

[Davy]

“...was to show Peter and the Jews those distinctions no longer exist.” Those distinctions no longer exist...what does that mean going forward...in Jesus Christ said returning to what is passed and looking back one is not fit for the Kingdom of God?

Confusion going on with that topic.

Our Lord Jesus did not nail all of God's laws to His cross. As written, He nailed the ordinances in the law to His cross, pointing to the blood ordinances, religious and ceremonial ritual, etc.

There is no New Testament Scripture telling us it's now healthy to eat away from God's healthy list.

1 Tim 4:3-5
3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
KJV

That is often very wrongfully mistaught to mean that we now can eat any meat we want and it will be healthy, as long as we offer thanks to God over it. That's not the actual meaning though, because the subject is about those who were condemning to any meat at all! The specific meats Paul was talking about he directly pointed to there with, "meats, which God hath created to be received".

What God showed Peter with the blanket of unclean meats did not... change God's health laws. The unclean animals Peter was shown was to symbolize the Gentiles having been given The Gospel Salvation also, and to not treat Gentile believers on Christ as spiritually unclean. It wasn't about unclean meats suddenly being made clean. That's men's doctrines adding that idea into the Scripture.

Christian Doctrine for Foods Now:
The unclean list first given in the OT is still in effect, but it is not a Salvation issue. Instead, it still is a health issue, which is why our Heavenly Father gave those different lists to begin with. If you're invited to a non-believer's house for dinner, so you can hopefully spread The Gospel, then eat what they put before you. It may not be healthy, but you're trying to convert the poor unsaved soul. Apostle Paul also said to eat whatever is sold in the shambles (market), meaning, if that's what is available, then eat, asking no questions.

This is one of the reasons why many brethren are sick. They continually eat away from God's healthy list of foods, because they are told that anything is now healthy simply by praying over it.

 

[justbyfaith]

Rom 14:14, I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.

Luk 11:41, But rather give alms of such things as ye have; and, behold, all things are clean unto you.

1Ti 4:1, Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2, Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
1Ti 4:3, Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4, For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5, For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
1Ti 4:6, If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Confusion going on with that topic.

Our Lord Jesus did not nail all of God's laws to His cross.............

The unclean list first given in the OT is still in effect,...........

Christ did take ALL of the OT out of the way...........'He taketh away the first so that He may establish the second' Hebrews 10:9. (Hebrews 7:12; Hebrews 8:6-7)


The NT makes no distinction in foods as the OT law did. Nothing wrong at all for a Christian to eat pork or shellfish, etc.

Acts 10:13 God approves the eating of meant therefore being a vegetarian is not better or make one more spiritual than one who eats meat. The sheet contained both clean and unclean animals. God is showing Peter the distinction between clean and unclean foods is gone to parallel the distinction between Jew and Gentile is gone. If the distinction between food remains then the distinction between jew and Gentile remains.

Mark 7:17-19 "And when he was entered into the house from the multitude, his disciples asked of him the parable. And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Perceive ye not, that whatsoever from without goeth into the man, it cannot defile him; because it goeth not into his heart, but into his belly, and goeth out into the draught? This he said, making all meats clean." AS God did with Peter in showing Gentiles are clean Jesus did in Mark 7:26 to show all meats are clean as that Gentile woman whom Jesus showed mercy.

 

[Davy]

Christ did take ALL of the OT out of the way...........'He taketh away the first so that He may establish the second' Hebrews 10:9. (Hebrews 7:12; Hebrews 8:6-7)

The Old Testament Books do not contain just the old covenant. Jesus nailed the 'ordinances' in the law to His cross, and that certainly involved the old covenant, but it did not do away with all of God's laws.

The ordinances in the law is a specific issue involving the old covenant requirements, especially the blood ordinances and ceremonial worship requiring the Levitical priesthood. I am not promoting the old covenant when I say this. It is still... against God's law to do murder today. Apostle Paul in 1 Timothy 1 showed God's law is good, and is not made for the righteous, but for the sinner and the ungodly. He never... preached anywhere in his Epistles that all of God's laws were done away with the old covenant.

The NT makes no distinction in foods as the OT law did. Nothing wrong at all for a Christian to eat pork or shellfish, etc.

Well, yes the New Testament does make a distinction. Apostle Paul did in 1 Timothy 4:3 about meats God created to be received, which means the healthy meat list God gave in Deut.14. Those in that list are the meats God specifically "created to be received" from the first.

Eating pork, shellfish, etc., isn't a Salvation issue like it was per the old covenant. It is still... a HEALTH ISSUE. That's why God gave us that clean meat list in the first place, so the flesh body would be healthy. Pork is not healthy because God created it to be a scavenger to clean the earth. It retains those poisons, and that's what you're eating. Same with catfish, a bottom feeder, and shellfish. They are scavenger meats God designed to cleanse the earth and waters. God designed our flesh bodies to eat meats which process grains, animals that graze, like the cow, deer, etc.

Acts 10:13 God approves the eating of meant therefore being a vegetarian is not better or make one more spiritual than one who eats meat. The sheet contained both clean and unclean animals. God is showing Peter the distinction between clean and unclean foods is gone to parallel the distinction between Jew and Gentile is gone. If the distinction between food remains then the distinction between jew and Gentile remains.

This matter I'm talking about isn't about being a vegetarian. It's about eating clean meats that God created to be received vs. unclean meats.

And the sheet of unclean animals Peter was shown had nothing... to do with changing God's healthy meat list given back in the Old Testament Books. God was simply using the unclean animals as a metaphor for His Salvation going also to the Gentiles, which those Gentiles under the old covenant Israel had deemed unclean against God's salvation.

Those laws on the clean vs. the unclean meats are still... in effect today. The difference is that eating off the unclean list is no longer a salvation issue. Yet those unclean meats are still... unhealthy. That did NOT change.

 

[justbyfaith]

Christ did take ALL of the OT out of the way...........'He taketh away the first so that He may establish the second' Hebrews 10:9. (Hebrews 7:12; Hebrews 8:6-7)


The NT makes no distinction in foods as the OT law did. Nothing wrong at all for a Christian to eat pork or shellfish, etc.

First of all, not one jot or tittle shall pass away from the law until heaven and earth pass away.

Secondly, if anyone is relying on his works to save him, he is required to obey all of the OT and NT law from conception into eternity:

Gal 3:10, For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

about meats God created to be received, which means the healthy meat list God gave in Deut.14. Those in that list are the meats God specifically "created to be received" from the first.

1Ti 4:4, For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5, For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

 

[Davy]

First of all, not one jot or tittle shall pass away from the law until heaven and earth pass away.

Secondly, if anyone is relying on his works to save him, he is required to obey all of the OT and NT law from conception into eternity:

Gal 3:10, For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.



1Ti 4:4, For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5, For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

This matter is not about trying to be saved by following God's laws. That's a false idea YOU are trying to bring into the conversation.

As for your quote of 1 Tim.4:4-5 WITHOUT the 1 Tim.4:3 verse, where Paul begins the subject about meats which God 'created to be received', your omission of that verse shows you'd rather believe unclean meats are healthy just because God created it. So good health to ya bro, let's see how healthy you are living on buzzard meat!

 

[FHII]

He never... preached anywhere in his Epistles that all of God's laws were done away with the old covenant

I'm not so sure that is true. Have you read 2 Cor 3?

2 Corinthians 3:3 KJV
Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

That which was written with ink and on tables of stone is being discussed. I can safely assume that means both the 10 commandments and the rest.

2 Corinthians 3:7 KJV
But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

Here only that which was engaged in stone is mentioned... And it specifically does say it was to be done away.

2 Corinthians 3:11 KJV
For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

Again it clarifies that the law (not Moses' continence) was done away with.

2 Corinthians 3:6 KJV
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

I back tracked for a moment to show that they were ministers of a new testament. In contrast, there had to be and old testament for there to be a new one.

2 Corinthians 3:14 KJV
But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

And this verse confirms that the old testament, being a vail, was done away with.

So these verses make reference to the 10 commendments, the Law of Moses, and actually old testament and say literally it was done away with.

That's not to say similarities don't exist between the new covenant and the old. But the old wasn't rewritten and amended or parts strucken out. It was done away with totally and a new covenant was written.

 

[Enoch111]

This matter I'm talking about isn't about being a vegetarian. It's about eating clean meats that God created to be received vs. unclean meats.

Since God and Christ have declared all meats to be clean under the New Covenant, Christians are free from the dietary restrictions of the Old Covenant. However, if weaker Christians prefer to maintain those restrictions they are free to do so. At the same time, they are not free to tell other Christians that dietary restrictions still apply.