Christians are not sinners

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robert derrick

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There is always one or two Scriptures that ends all dispute of doctrine of God, and they are usually the most obvious ones staring us in the face:

Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners.

Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.


God's people are not sinners, and sinners are not God's people.

There are no Scriptures speaking of saved and redeemed sinners, but only of saved and redeemed saints in Christ Jesus.

Those falling all over themselves to call themselves sinners, in most humble fashion, never ever refer to themselves as saints.

How can them that say they are as depraved as any sinner in the world ever refer to themselves as the righteous?

They even accuse the chiefest of the apostles as claiming to have been the chiefest of sinners during His apostleship.

Paul was not the apostle of sinners, but rather was the apostle of the saints, questioning how any that are called to be saints, can possibly continue in sins in this present world.

Sinners say they can. God does not.
 

Robert Gwin

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There is always one or two Scriptures that ends all dispute of doctrine of God, and they are usually the most obvious ones staring us in the face:

Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners.

Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.


God's people are not sinners, and sinners are not God's people.

There are no Scriptures speaking of saved and redeemed sinners, but only of saved and redeemed saints in Christ Jesus.

Those falling all over themselves to call themselves sinners, in most humble fashion, never ever refer to themselves as saints.

How can them that say they are as depraved as any sinner in the world ever refer to themselves as the righteous?

They even accuse the chiefest of the apostles as claiming to have been the chiefest of sinners during His apostleship.

Paul was not the apostle of sinners, but rather was the apostle of the saints, questioning how any that are called to be saints, can possibly continue in sins in this present world.

Sinners say they can. God does not.

I certainly look forward to the day that I can say that I am no longer a sinner Robert, but unfortunately I cannot say that at present. Even the saints are sinners sir, but like all of us, we can be washed clean of those sins, but the blood of Christ. Rev 7:14. There have been 3 humans on this earth who at one time were sinless, but only one remained sinless until his death. We do our utmost to pattern our lives after him 1 Pet 2:21, but for now we have to recognize that is an impossibility.
 

robert derrick

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I certainly look forward to the day that I can say that I am no longer a sinner Robert, but unfortunately I cannot say that at present. Even the saints are sinners sir, but like all of us, we can be washed clean of those sins, but the blood of Christ. Rev 7:14. There have been 3 humans on this earth who at one time were sinless, but only one remained sinless until his death. We do our utmost to pattern our lives after him 1 Pet 2:21, but for now we have to recognize that is an impossibility.
Quote one Scripture speaking of the saints in Christ Jesus being sinners. Any Scripture speaking of the sinners in Christ.

Until then, your doctrine is false, and perhaps if you stop calling yourself a sinner, you will begin to live more like a saint.

Sorry sir, but I am not one of those to be impressed by the modern fetish of seeing who can call themselves sinners just like everybody else.

That is a voluntary humility to please sinners, not the confession of faith among the saints of God.
 
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robert derrick

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The only sinners and transgressors spoken of among the people of God, are those being cut off from God, branches being broken off to wither and die and be burned.

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
 
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robert derrick

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guess maybe you haven’t gotten to the part about anyone who says they have no sin yet huh
Like all souls in mortal bodies, I have sin in my corrupt flesh. And like all saints in mortal bodies, I have no lust in my heart to do them in the flesh.

There's plenty of sin left in our mortal bodies to be tempted with: saints just don't allow them to reign over their bodies and do them.

But, if it makes sinners feel better to be ignorant of the truth of Scripture, and so let the sins of the flesh reign over their mortal bodies, then have at it. They just need to make sure they get all the pleasure they can out of those sins for the season remaining to us on earth:

Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season.

Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.

Enduring temptation is not doing the sin, but only being tempted by the sins that remain in our flesh.
 
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robert derrick

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There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Is there any sinner wanting to also say they walk after the flesh? Or they are sinners that walk not after the flesh?

I.e. sinners not now in condemnation, who walk after the flesh and go on still in their sins and trespasses?
 

Robert Gwin

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Quote one Scripture speaking of the saints in Christ Jesus being sinners. Any Scripture speaking of the sinners in Christ.

Until then, your doctrine is false, and perhaps if you stop calling yourself a sinner, you will begin to live more like a saint.

Sorry sir, but I am not one of those to be impressed by the modern fetish of seeing who can call themselves sinners just like everybody else.

That is a voluntary humility to please sinners, not the confession of faith among the saints of God.

You can already quote it Rob, For alll have sinned, simple as that.

May I ask you to define what you believe a saint is?
 

robert derrick

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You can already quote it Rob, For alll have sinned, simple as that.

May I ask you to define what you believe a saint is?
Usually you are not so disingenuous about your responses. I am disappointed.

All have sinned. Not all are sinning. All were sinners by Adam. All are not sinners by Christ.

You are purposely wresting the Scripture to apply what was once for all, to what is no more for Christians: born again no more to be sinners, but called to be saints.

Once again, where does Scripture speak of any Christian as a sinner? The subject here is Christians being saved in Christ Jesus, not unbelieving sinners that go on still in their sins and trespasses.

May I ask you to define what you believe a saint is?

I don't define anything other than what Scripture says about the things of God.

So look up everything about the saints in Scripture, and you can define it, and you will never be able to define a saint as a sinner in Scripture.

If you do, show it.

Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.

And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.


No righteous saint is an ungodly sinner, and no sinner is a godly saint.

On this point at least, you are stuck trying to teach your own mind for doctrine of God, and so you are found lying against the Scriptures.
 
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robert derrick

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Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.

And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?


Where does the ungodly sinner stand? Not with the righteous.

Where will the ungodly sinner appear? Not with the righteous.

Calling oneself an ungodly sinner by feigned humility, only condmens oneself with their own mouths.
 
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Lambano

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It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost. (1 Timothy 1:15).

Note that "I am" (eimi ego) is in the present active indicative case, indicating Paul considered himself a sinner at the time he wrote the letter. Not "I was".

Simul iustus et peccator: At the same time justified and yet a sinner.
 

Behold

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It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost. (1 Timothy 1:15).


Paul said he was "chief of sinners".
Heretics who are trying to work their way into heaven having no faith in Christ to get them to heaven, twist Paul's verse into their false doctrine.
Or, they learned it from some liar in their pulpit, in their cult.

Let me explain Paul's comment.

"I am chief of sinners"..

What does he Mean?
Well he explains it to those who didnt read more of what He said..
He explains it like this..
(paraphrase)

God wanted to show the world His amazing Grace, so he chose me......a person who was helping to KILL CHRISITANS.......as the person who did the most for God, including writing most of the New Testament.
So, God, showing His GRACE, chose me....the worst sort of sinner..... A CHRISTIAN MURDER.....to be his chosen vessel out of all the apostles, and all future Christians.
= This is God's Grace.....that he would choose a "chief of sinners".......the worst type......>ME.......to become such a trophy of His Grace, and in this way, YOU can understand the depth of God's Mercy.
 
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robert derrick

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Jesus and Paul both taught eternal security of the one now found in Christ!

Eternal salvation is for the one now obeying Christ and not found in transgression.

For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.

Eternal salvation is for them that obey Him, surety of eternal salvation is continuing in obedience to Him, and eternal security is obtaining eternal salvation in the resurrection of the dead.

Surety without obedience is a lie, and security is only after enduring obediently unto the end.
 

Cassandra

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It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost. (1 Timothy 1:15).

Note that "I am" (eimi ego) is in the present active indicative case, indicating Paul considered himself a sinner at the time he wrote the letter. Not "I was".

Simul iustus et peccator: At the same time justified and yet a sinner.

You go, Lambano!!!! I should've thought to look it up in Greek!.. It sure is present active indicative case!! I googled the Dickens out of it.
 

Behold

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Eternal salvation .

There is no such thing as salvation that is not eternal.

Listen, to teach that Salvation is Temporary, is to teach that the Blood of Jesus, is not eternal.

Salvation, is not you trying to be good, robert.
Salvation... Is JESUS who is PERFECT< SINLESS, dying for you, so that you are given by God, the righteousness of Jesus.

Salvation is JESUS........ Eternal LIFE is JESUS.

If you have Jesus in you, born again, then you have Eternal Life.
There is no changing this, by bad behavior, any more then you can save yourself by good behavior.
 

Lambano

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You go, Lambano!!!! I should've thought to look it up in Greek!.. It sure is present active indicative case!! I googled the Dickens out of it.
Aw, thanks, Cassandra.

There is a deeper truth that Robert is aware of, but I don't think he's going at it the right way. How do we self-identify? We identify ourselves with Christ, which makes us saints, holy ones. But we also remember our identification with the rest of the human race, sinners, to keep us humble and connected with the world Christ came to save.
 
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dev553344

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There is always one or two Scriptures that ends all dispute of doctrine of God, and they are usually the most obvious ones staring us in the face:

Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners.

Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.


God's people are not sinners, and sinners are not God's people.

There are no Scriptures speaking of saved and redeemed sinners, but only of saved and redeemed saints in Christ Jesus.

Those falling all over themselves to call themselves sinners, in most humble fashion, never ever refer to themselves as saints.

How can them that say they are as depraved as any sinner in the world ever refer to themselves as the righteous?

They even accuse the chiefest of the apostles as claiming to have been the chiefest of sinners during His apostleship.

Paul was not the apostle of sinners, but rather was the apostle of the saints, questioning how any that are called to be saints, can possibly continue in sins in this present world.

Sinners say they can. God does not.
Parable of the tax collector and Pharisee. The tax collector called himself a sinner and the Lord looked on him with compassion.
 
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Cassandra

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And if it is just that when we receive Christ, we need do nothing, why did Christ, Paul, Peter, etc, need to give us any counsel at all? Wouldn't we just innately know these things?
 
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