1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Church Leaders Belief About Antichrist

Discussion in 'Eschatology & Prophecy Forum' started by stone, Dec 17, 2007.

  1. stone

    stone New Member

    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    0
    John Calvin(1509-1564) (Presbyterian)"Some persons think us too severe and censorious when we call the Roman pontiff Antichrist. But those who are of this opinion do not consider that they bring the same charge of presumption against Paul himself, after whom we speak and whose language we adopt...I shall briefly show that (Paul's words in II Thess. 2) are not capable of any other interpretation than that which applies them to the Papacy." Taken from "Institutes" by John Calvin. Martin Luther(1483-1546) (Lutheran)"We here are of the conviction that the papacy is the seat of the true and real Antichrist...personally I declare that I owe the Pope no other obedience than that to Antichrist." (Aug. 18, 1520) John Knox(1505-1572) (Scotch Presbyterian)Knox wrote to abolish "that tyranny which the pope himself has for so many ages exercised over the church" and that the pope should be recognized as "the very antichrist, and son of perdition, of whom Paul speaks." Taken from "The Zurich Letters" pg. 199 by John Knox. Cotton Mather(1663-1728) (Congregational Theologian)"The oracles of God foretold the rising of an Antichrist in the Christian Church; and in the Pope of Rome, all the characteristics of that Antichrist are so marvelously answered that if any who read the Scriptures do not see it, there is a marvelous blindness upon them." Taken from "The Fall of Babylon" by Cotton Mather Thomas Cranmer(1489-1556) (Anglican)"Whereof it followeth Rome to be the seat of antichrist, and the pope to be very antichrist himself. I could prove the same by many other scriptures, old writers, and strong reasons." (Referring to prophecies in Revelation and Daniel.) Taken from "Works" by Cranmer, Vol. 1, pp. 6-7. John Wesley(1703-1791) (Methodist)Speaking of the Papacy he said, "He is in an emphatical sense, the Man of Sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled the Son of Perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers...He it is...that exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped...claiming the highest power, and highest honor...claiming the prerogatives which belong to God alone." Taken from "Antichrist and His Ten Kingdoms" by John Wesley, pg. 110. Roger William(1603-1683) (First Baptist Pastor in America)He called the Pope "the pretended Vicar of Christ on earth, who sits as God over the Temple of God, exalting himself not only above all that is called God, but over the souls and consciences of all his vessals, yea over the Spirit of Christ, over the Holy Spirit, yea, and God himself...speaking against the God of heaven, thinking to changed times and laws: but he is the son of perdition (II Thess. 2)." You can add to those names these men that believed the same sort of thing. Wycliff, Tyndale, Sir Isaac Newton, Fox, Finney, Moody, Spurgeon.See the book, THE PROPHETIC FAITH OF OUR FATHERS, by Froom for further information on this subject. --or GREAT PROPHECIES OF THE BIBLE by Woodrow.
     
  2. Peacebewithyou

    Peacebewithyou New Member

    Messages:
    426
    Likes Received:
    0
    Heretics who left the Church have nothing nice to say about it.*yawn* what a suprise.
     
  3. stone

    stone New Member

    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    0
    (Peacebewithyou;27180)
    Heretics who left the Church have nothing nice to say about it.*yawn* what a suprise.
    Those church leaders were bible scholars and based their opinions on the bible.Antichrist in Daniel chapter 11:From Dan. 11:21 on it talks of the vile person; you can tell from close examination that it is talking of the same leader till the end of Dan. 11. That is the antichrist.He will be the last one to occupy the estate of the two men in Dan. 11:19 and 20. I see the guy in Dan. 11:19 to be Julius Caesar, and 11:20 to be Caesar Augustus, the guy that raised the taxes that made Joseph go to Bethlehem. He raised two taxings and died in peace. The estate they both occupied is ruler of the Roman state and pontifex maximus, chief roman pontif, ruler of the Roman religion. That estate passed on to the popes of Rome, and it has lasted from the time of Julius Caesar till now. Antichrist should be the last one to occupy that estate, or the last roman pontiff, if I am correct about the guy in verse 11:20 as being caesar Augustus. [Estate means legal position, or inherited title.]Dan. 11:16, 17 and first half of 18, is Pompey. The guy that attacked Jerusalem and was chased down and defeated by Julius Caesar.The fourth kingdom in Dan. chapter 2 is Rome, and that is the empire that will be ruling when Jesus comes back. You can see from Dan.9:26, that the prince that shall come, (the antichrist) will be of the people that destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD. So the antichrist must be a Roman leader.Pope's title vicar of Christ means antichrist by definition.JESUS CHRIST HAS NO VlCAR. Vicar, from the Latin "vicarius" means "in the place of" e.g. vicarius sacrifice of Christ being His sacrifice in the place of the sinner. Papal claims such as infallibility, Head of the Church, Holy Father, all seek to put the Pope in the place of Christ, which place only the Living Christ can have. This false assumption of Rome is expressly put forward in the Papal title "Vicar of Jesus Christ".The New Testament was written in Greek, and the Greek translation of " vicar of Christ" is "Anti (instead of)-christos", or in our English Bible, "Antichrist". The word "Antichrist" is not just a word of wild insult, but is a Bible warning of the false role assumed by the Popes of Rome as supposed vicars of Christ, (See 1 John 2:18 D.V.). The Greek word for "Vice President" is "Anti-Proedros"; Because Anti, which means opposite, also means "replacement" or "instead", as in Vicar or Viceroy or Vicarious. The Bull Unam Sanctam... Issued by POPE BONIFACE VIII reads as follows: "The Roman Pontiff judges all men, but is judged by no one. We declare, assert, define and pronounce: to be subject to the Roman Pontiff is to every human creature necessary for salvation that which was spoken of Christ 'thou has subdued all things under his feet' may well seem verified in me... I have the authority of the King of Kings. I am all in all and above all, so that God himself and I, the vicar of God, have but one consistory, and I am able to do all that God can do." "Christ entrusted His office to the chief pontiff;... but all power in heaven and in earth has been given to Christ;... therefore the chief pontiff, who is His vicar, will have this power."Corpus Juris chap. 1 column 29, translated from a gloss on the words Porro Subesse Romano Pontiff "We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty" ...Pope Leo XIII "All the names which are attributed to Christ in Scripture, inplying His supremacy over the church, are also attributed to the Pope."Verse about the antichrist:II Thes. 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.Well, as you can see, there are reasons why great bible scholars would believe such a thing.
     
  4. Peacebewithyou

    Peacebewithyou New Member

    Messages:
    426
    Likes Received:
    0
    (stone;27182)
    Those church leaders were bible scholars and based their opinions on the bible.So what? I could quote Catholic Bible scholars who would give their opinion based on scripture, Early Church Fathers, and 2,000 years of Christian tradition that your "scholars" are wrong. Pope's title vicar of Christ means antichrist by definition.JESUS CHRIST HAS NO VlCAR. Vicar, from the Latin "vicarius" means "in the place of" e.g. vicarius sacrifice of Christ being His sacrifice in the place of the sinner. Papal claims such as infallibility, Head of the Church, Holy Father, all seek to put the Pope in the place of Christ, which place only the Living Christ can have. This false assumption of Rome is expressly put forward in the Papal title "Vicar of Jesus Christ".g.
    Vicar of Christ: A title of the pope implying his supreme and universal primacy, both of honour and of jurisdiction, over the Church of Christ. It is founded on the words of the Divine Shepherd to St. Peter: "Feed my lambs. . . . Feed my sheep" (John 21:16-17), by which He constituted the Prince of the Apostles guardian of His entire flock in His own place, thus making him His Vicar and fulfilling the promise made in Matthew 16:18-19. 18And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. 19And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Are you not familar with those verses?
     
  5. stone

    stone New Member

    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    0
    (Peacebewithyou;27186)
    Vicar of Christ: A title of the pope implying his supreme and universal primacy, both of honour and of jurisdiction, over the Church of Christ. It is founded on the words of the Divine Shepherd to St. Peter: "Feed my lambs. . . . Feed my sheep" (John 21:16-17), by which He constituted the Prince of the Apostles guardian of His entire flock in His own place, thus making him His Vicar and fulfilling the promise made in Matthew 16:18-19. 18And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. 19And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Are you not familar with those verses?
    Matthew 16:18 is misinterpreted by the Catholic Church.Jesus had just asked Peter who He (Jesus) was, and Peter replied, "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. Then Jesus said to Peter: "And I say also unto thee, that thou art Peter (Petros, meaning a little pebble or moveable stone). And upon this rock (Petra, huge boulder or bedrock) I will build My church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." (Matt 16:16,18) Jesus used a play on words; in essence He was saying, Peter, you are a pebble, but upon this bedrock foundation I will build My church. The bedrock foundation is Peter's statement that he made, that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God.In I Corinthians 3:11 it says, "For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ."Jesus Christ is the foundation of the church. The true church is founded upon Jesus Christ the Rock; not Peter the pebble.Psalms 18:31 For who is God except the Lord? or who is a rock except our God?1 Corinthians 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that islaid, which is Jesus Christ.Christ, not Peter, is the only foundation of the church upon which menmust build.[As a matter of fact, in the last days of Augustine, (one of thecatholic church's early fathers) he said regarding this scripture,"Thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build my church", - Augustine said Christ was the Rock; he agreed with the protestants.Jerome and Augustine disagreed on every point yet both are calledearly roman catholic fathers of the church. Information taken from thebook, FIFTY YEARS IN THE CHURCH OF ROME, by Charles Chiniquy, formercatholic priest. You can read the book online, find it on metacrawler.Peter was never a pope. Pope or chief Roman pontiff (pontifex maximus) is a title from the Old pagan religion of ancient Rome. [It is not a Christian title; doesn't come from the New Testament.] In Peter's time, the emporer was Roman Pontiff. Tiberius and Nero were the pontiffs in Peter's day. Read this book:peter's Tomb Recently Discovered in Jerusalem, published by F. Paul Peterson, P O Box 7351, Ft. Wayne IN 46807, copyright 1960The apostle Peter's body was not buried at Rome. There is no proof that Peter was ever in Rome. Peter himself called all Christians lively stones:1 Peter 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.All Christians have the command to feed the flock.Matthew 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Matthew 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you:...Jesus Christ Himself, is the head of the church.Ephesians 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
     
  6. Christina

    Christina New Member

    Messages:
    10,900
    Likes Received:
    88
    This idea of the Pope being antichrist is ridiculous it has no basis in scripture yes you can pick out a scripture here and a scripture there and say look it fits but that is not the way to read the bible it is not what God says its what men said. Now granted these men were interpreting the best they could for their times. The same way those who witnessed the destruction of the temple and Jerusalem in 70 AD thought it to be The abomination of desolation and they were the most learned scholars of their day. But they were wrong time had to pass we had to get to this Gen, knowledge had to increase as God said before the true meaning of Rev. and antichrist could be revealed. If everyone would stop trying to listen to men stop trying to find the answers out side scripture Come to the book without preconceived ideas and notions from the past God tells exactly who he is what will happen when he is here and what you are supposed to do.Revelation and antichrist is about the whole world and all its people it has nothing to do per say with the pope or the catholics it is if anything Christians against antichristians only problem is many of the christians will be fooled into being antichristiansGet your mind above men and into Gods Word
     
  7. Peacebewithyou

    Peacebewithyou New Member

    Messages:
    426
    Likes Received:
    0
    (stone;27188)
    [As a matter of fact, in the last days of Augustine, (one of thecatholic church's early fathers) he said regarding this scripture,"Thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build my church", - Augustine said Christ was the Rock; he agreed with the protestants.Jerome and Augustine disagreed on every point yet both are calledearly roman catholic fathers of the church. Information taken from thebook, FIFTY YEARS IN THE CHURCH OF ROME, by Charles Chiniquy, formercatholic priest. You can read the book online, find it on metacrawler..
    Chiniquy was a nut-job. After he was excommunicated by the Catholic Church, he became an outspoken anti-Catholic preacher who made up outlandish claims. One of my personal favorites is that the American Civil War was a plot against the United States of America by the Vatican, and that the Vatican was behind the Confederate cause, the death of President Lincoln and that Lincoln's assassins were faithful Roman Catholics serving the Pope. Too funny. So it's no wonder that he made up that bit about St. Augustine. Here are some actual quotes: Augustine regarding Peter: "Among these [apostles] Peter alone almost everywhere deserved to represent the whole Church. Because of that representation of the Church, which only he bore, he deserved to hear ‘I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of heaven’" (Sermons 295:2 [A.D. 411]). "Some things are said which seem to relate especially to the apostle Peter, and yet are not clear in their meaning unless referred to the Church, which he is acknowledged to have represented in a figure on account of the primacy which he bore among the disciples. Such is ‘I will give unto you the keys of the kingdom of heaven,’ and other similar passages. In the same way, Judas represents those Jews who were Christ’s enemies" (Commentary on Psalm 108 1 [A.D. 415]). "Who is ignorant that the first of the apostles is the most blessed Peter?" (Commentary on John 56:1 [A.D. 416]). I know very little about "end times" as it doesn't interest me in the least. Kriss however, seems to know quite a bit. So if she (no fan of the Catholic Church) says the Pope does not equal the anti-Christ - I'm sticking with her. Just out of curiosity, are you SDA?
     
  8. For Life

    For Life New Member

    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    0
    I know very little about "end times" as it doesn't interest me in the least. Kriss however, seems to know quite a bit. So if she (no fan of the Catholic Church) says the Pope does not equal the anti-Christ - I'm sticking with her.
    I've read a little about Martin Luther. I think I would give what he says more credibility than you have given him. Maybe even as much as you give Kriss.
     
  9. Christina

    Christina New Member

    Messages:
    10,900
    Likes Received:
    88
    Why dont you give God some credidablity he tells you who it is if you care to know when you guys are through listening to men let me know hey try something really novel here make a list of things you know about the antichrist, things he doesthen we could apply the Word and common sense
     
  10. Christina

    Christina New Member

    Messages:
    10,900
    Likes Received:
    88
    Here I'll start you off1. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, This is real likely half the christian world thinks the pope is antichrist so Im sure they are not going to be following himIslam, right, Im sure the millions if not billions of muslim are going to throw down their Qurans and (w)hore after the popeOh we got the Jews bet they are itching to follow the PopeNow I wonder how many Athiests, homosexuals, Buddists, North koreans, Hindu's, New agersare going to be following the popeWell now that about rules out everyone except Catholics and the other half of the christians But hey how can that be the Christ followers are the ones who arent supposed to follow the antichrist(pope)So at this point I see there is no one to follow the Popebut God says the Whole world follows after him somethings not right here..... ah could it be the pope is not antichristOk whats the number 2 thing he does ?
     
  11. stone

    stone New Member

    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    0
    (kriss;27200)
    Here I'll start you off1. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, This is real likely half the christian world thinks the pope is antichrist so Im sure they are not going to be following himIslam, right, Im sure the millions if not billions of muslim are going to throw down their Qurans and (w)hore after the popeOh we got the Jews bet they are itching to follow the PopeNow I wonder how many Athiests,homosexuals,Buddists,North koreansare going to be following the popeWell now that about rules out everyone except Catholics and the other half of the christians But hey how can that be the Christians are the ones who arent supposed to follow the antichrist(pope)So at this point I see there is no one to follow the Popebut God says the Whole world follows after him somethings not right here..... ah could it be the pope is not antichristOk whats the number 2 thing he does ?
    What those church leaders were saying is that the papacy is the seat of the antichrist. The antichrist himself is the man that will be the last one to occupy that seat. [However, every man that occupies that seat is pretending to be a substitute for Christ on the Earth, which translated into Greek would be anti-Christos.] --anti meaning instead of or substitute forWhen the last man to occupy the seat of the antichrist gets here, what it says in that verse will be true in the way that it was meant. You need to understand how it was meant to be understood.Revelation 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. The man called the antichrist is going to be a man that is highly skilled in the use of flattery. Daniel 11:21 And in his estate shall stand up a vile person, to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceably, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries. [Note: The bible uses figures of speech because that is the way that men talk. That word "all" in Rev.13:8, may not literally mean all. There is a figure of speech which the bible uses called a synecdoche. It is substituting a whole for a part, or a part for a whole. That word "all" might mean very many literally, but stated as all, in a figure of speech.] The bible indicates that antichrist is going to be making wars. That means not everyone is following him. He is making war against those that don't.An example of the use of all as a figure of speech:Matthew 3:5 Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan, Matthew 3:6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.According to other places in the New Testament you can see that not every single person in Judaea was baptized. That word "all" in verse 3:5 is used as a figure of speech which literally means very many, but not everyone. If you know anything about the history of the popes, there were popes that were atheists. They just got elected to the position because of the power and prestige of the office.Here is a famous quote by an atheist pope. Find it on Google."How well we know what a profitable superstition this fable ofChrist has been for us and our predecessors." [Pope Leo X 1513 -1521] And of course pope Borgia, ...research himJust because a man is a pope, that does not even mean he believes in God. There have been atheist popes.Baptizing little babies that don't believe anything, can result in an organization full of atheists. You can teach people about God and Jesus but you cannot make them believe it.According to the bible, Acts 8, a person is only a candidate for baptism after he is a believer.
     
  12. Christina

    Christina New Member

    Messages:
    10,900
    Likes Received:
    88
    The only place he is going to sit is in the holie of holies declaring himself to be God Amobination of desolation spoken of in Daniel and the last time I looked that had nothing to with the Pope and its not in Rome.
     
  13. Christina

    Christina New Member

    Messages:
    10,900
    Likes Received:
    88
    Revelation 9:1 "And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit [pit of the abyss]."The "star" that falls to the earth is the star of Isaiah 14. The star is "Lucifer", who will be the Antichrist once he arrives on earth. Satan is given the key, or authority to the bottomless pit, for this is where Satan's fallen angels are held. AlsoLuk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. Satan is to be God's executioner of God's divine wrath that is to be poured out upon the earth. God is going to give Satan the right to have his way with all who are blind to God's Word. Remember, God removed the wall of protection around Job; for Satan. The only stipulation God gave Satan was that he was not allowed to take Job's life. Job had the will; Satan did the testing, and God allowed it. This is an example of what is to happen in these end times; and that is why we must be ready, and with our spiritual armor on.Right now, today, Satan is not in that bottomless pit, but in heaven. He is the accuser of the saints before the throne of God. The fallen angels are in the pit, or the abyss. The pit is not a place, or location, but a point of degradation. Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, [which] go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. Rev 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition
     
  14. Unorthodox Christian

    Unorthodox Christian New Member

    Messages:
    501
    Likes Received:
    1
    The Pope is one but many spirits of the Anti-Christ. Professing to believe in the Son of God, yet hold a man equal to the Son of God.The Pope and the Imam Mahdi play a major role in the coming of the Anti-Christ. The Abomination of Desolation has already occured at the Dome of Rock. It's just a matter of time before this Mahdi or Messiah of the World comes and Claims Allah is God, nullify Yeshua HaMashiach.
     
  15. Christina

    Christina New Member

    Messages:
    10,900
    Likes Received:
    88
    the abomination of desolation can not occur until antichrist stands in the holy place where he ought not and declares himself God this will be the mid tribulation point. You have to remember that Satan comes in peaceably and heals the deadly wound to the one world system sets up a one world government he plays the role of Political Beast for the first half of the tribulation he will then set up a one world religion probably claim Mahdi and messiah are the same he does not take the title (play the role ) of Antichrist until he declares himself God at mid point.This is the abomination of desolation spoken by Daniel
     
  16. stone

    stone New Member

    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    0
    (kriss;27207)
    Revelation 9:1 "And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit [pit of the abyss]."The "star" that falls to the earth is the star of Isaiah 14. The star is "Lucifer", who will be the Antichrist once he arrives on earth. Satan is given the key, or authority to the bottomless pit, for this is where Satan's fallen angels are held. AlsoLuk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. Satan is to be God's executioner of God's divine wrath that is to be poured out upon the earth. God is going to give Satan the right to have his way with all who are blind to God's Word. Remember, God removed the wall of protection around Job; for Satan. The only stipulation God gave Satan was that he was not allowed to take Job's life. Job had the will; Satan did the testing, and God allowed it. This is an example of what is to happen in these end times; and that is why we must be ready, and with our spiritual armor on.Right now, today, Satan is not in that bottomless pit, but in heaven. He is the accuser of the saints before the throne of God. The fallen angels are in the pit, or the abyss. The pit is not a place, or location, but a point of degradation. Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, [which] go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. Rev 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition
    Let's look at the book of Job. God asked Satan where he came from. Satan said he was walking up and down in the Earth. Satan went to heaven to present himself before the Lord. Satan came from walking in the Earth. Right now, Satan and his devils that follow him have the right to walk to and fro on the Earth, looking for people to tempt, and destroy and compel to do evil. They also have the right to go into heaven and accuse people. Jesus cast devils out of people. Devils don't have physical bodies, they are evil spirits. That is why they can enter into people and control their minds. The fallen angels are the devils. They must be on the Earth now to possess people, just like they were on the Earth in the time of Jesus possessing people and Jesus did cast them out of people. They could not have been in the bottomless pit if Jesus cast them out of people.Job 1:7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it. Job 2:2 And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.Luke 22:3 Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve. Satan could not enter into Judas if Satan was in heaven. Satan is an evil spirit without a body and that is why he could enter into Judas. Satan had to be on the Earth to enter into Judas. Satan has the right to go into heaven and appear before the Lord to accuse people, like he did in Job. Then he comes back down to Earth to deceive and hurt people. When Satan is cast out of heaven in Revelation 12, to me it means he will no longer have the right to go into heaven and accuse people. He must stay on the Earth for the last 3.5 years till the end.The antichrist is going to be a man that is possessed by Satan. Satan will be an evil spirit that has entered into him and is controlling his mind. Satan himself is the chief devil, that rules over the other devils.Revelation 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. From that verse in Revelation you can see that the first beast, who is called the antichrist by preachers, is a man. The number of his name is the number of a man. He is a man that will be possessed and controled by Satan. The red dragon, in Rev. 12, (who is Satan) has the 7 heads and 10 horns just like the antichrist beast does. This show that antichrist will be possessed by Satan himself, the chief devil.Look at these scriptures from Revelation:Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. The beast (antichrist) and the false prophet is the same two people that are in Rev. 13. They will be cast alive into the Lake of fire. Now this is what happens to Satan; it is something different.Revelation 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. Revelation 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, Revelation 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.So the first beast and the second beast of Revelation chapter 13 are cast into the Lake of fire. Satan is cast into the bottomless pit. This proves that the first beast (the antichrist) is not Satan.This proves that the second beast, (the false prophet) is not Satan. There are 3 different persons in these scriptures, proving that Satan is not the Antichrist.The antichrist is going to be a man that is possessed and controlled by Satan.
     
  17. armor_bearer

    armor_bearer New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    I would like to add something...In the Philippines, where 90% of its population are roman catholics, it's very hard to ignore the traditions and rituals of this church. Basing my understanding of the bible, these practices are so unbiblical, like, worship of idols, praying to mary and the saints, in fiestas where they dance on the streets holding up high a statue of (so called) mary or any saint, etc. if catholics say that the roman church is the church established by Jesus Christ himself, then why do they allow these things? how do they interpret the bible?
     
  18. Jordan

    Jordan Active Member

    Messages:
    4,884
    Likes Received:
    5
    (armor_bearer;27317)
    I would like to add something...In the Philippines, where 90% of its population are roman catholics, it's very hard to ignore the traditions and rituals of this church. Basing my understanding of the bible, these practices are so unbiblical, like, worship of idols, praying to mary and the saints, in fiestas where they dance on the streets holding up high a statue of (so called) mary or any saint, etc. if one says that the roman church is the church established by Jesus Christ himself, then do they allow these things?
    II Corinthians 11:4 - For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.JagLovest ye in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour.P.S. Just focus on God alone, since He is the one giveth wisdom. Thou need no man to teach you...just Him.
     
  19. Christina

    Christina New Member

    Messages:
    10,900
    Likes Received:
    88
    (stone;27299)
    Let's look at the book of Job. God asked Satan where he came from. Satan said he was walking up and down in the Earth. Satan went to heaven to present himself before the Lord. Satan came from walking in the Earth. Right now, Satan and his devils that follow him have the right to walk to and fro on the Earth, looking for people to tempt, and destroy and compel to do evil. They also have the right to go into heaven and accuse people. Jesus cast devils out of people. Devils don't have physical bodies, they are evil spirits. That is why they can enter into people and control their minds. The fallen angels are the devils. They must be on the Earth now to possess people, just like they were on the Earth in the time of Jesus possessing people and Jesus did cast them out of people. They could not have been in the bottomless pit if Jesus cast them out of people.Job 1:7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it. Job 2:2 And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.Luke 22:3 Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve. Satan could not enter into Judas if Satan was in heaven. Satan is an evil spirit without a body and that is why he could enter into Judas. Satan had to be on the Earth to enter into Judas. Satan has the right to go into heaven and appear before the Lord to accuse people, like he did in Job. Then he comes back down to Earth to deceive and hurt people. When Satan is cast out of heaven in Revelation 12, to me it means he will no longer have the right to go into heaven and accuse people. He must stay on the Earth for the last 3.5 years till the end.The antichrist is going to be a man that is possessed by Satan. Satan will be an evil spirit that has entered into him and is controlling his mind. Satan himself is the chief devil, that rules over the other devils.Revelation 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. From that verse in Revelation you can see that the first beast, who is called the antichrist by preachers, is a man. The number of his name is the number of a man. He is a man that will be possessed and controled by Satan. The red dragon, in Rev. 12, (who is Satan) has the 7 heads and 10 horns just like the antichrist beast does. This show that antichrist will be possessed by Satan himself, the chief devil.Look at these scriptures from Revelation:Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. The beast (antichrist) and the false prophet is the same two people that are in Rev. 13. They will be cast alive into the Lake of fire. Now this is what happens to Satan; it is something different.Revelation 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. Revelation 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, Revelation 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.So the first beast and the second beast of Revelation chapter 13 are cast into the Lake of fire. Satan is cast into the bottomless pit. This proves that the first beast (the antichrist) is not Satan.This proves that the second beast, (the false prophet) is not Satan. There are 3 different persons in these scriptures, proving that Satan is not the Antichrist.The antichrist is going to be a man that is possessed and controlled by Satan.
    The first beast is not Satan as you say because it the one world system Satan is the 2nd beast Satan has NOT been able to walk to and fro upon the earth sense Christ died upon the cross and for all intensive purpose conquered death who is Satan he is currently physically held by Michael until there is war in heaven and he is kicked out Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Rev 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night. Rev 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, [ye] heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. Rev 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man [child]. the Antichrist is Satan himself No man even a possessed man doing these things it would be obvious to everyone the whole world would never be fooled The whole world will not follow a man a man cannot create a great delusion a man cannot heal the deadly wound This is Satan disguised as an Angel of Light claiming to be christonly the fake return of a fake christ fit all criteria of the AntichristLook at the words in this verse2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong (1753) delusion, that they should believe a lie Strong greek word "energeia"a) in the NT used only of superhuman power, whether of God or of the Devil
     
  20. Unorthodox Christian

    Unorthodox Christian New Member

    Messages:
    501
    Likes Received:
    1
    (kriss;27211)
    the abomination of desolation can not occur until antichrist stands in the holy place where he ought not and declares himself God this will be the mid tribulation point. You have to remember that Satan comes in peaceably and heals the deadly wound to the one world system sets up a one world government he plays the role of Political Beast for the first half of the tribulation he will then set up a one world religion probably claim Mahdi and messiah are the same he does not take the title (play the role ) of Antichrist until he declares himself God at mid point.This is the abomination of desolation spoken by Daniel
    Sister, how in the World can you explain Al Aqsa? The Original temple of Solomon now occupied by the Muslims?
     
Loading...