Dead faith.

[Behold]

-
What is "dead faith", as found regarding a verse in James.?

Dead faith is when you become cold to the things of God and probably backslide.

People who get lost/stuck in Hebrews, Matthew and James, which are the heretics handbook, do not actually read those verses in James very closely.. But instead they just teach a bumper sticker ...."dead faith".

So, Listen....

First you have to have to recognize that there is the "justification by faith, without the deeds of the law"", and "saved by Grace through faith".....as a one time event where God took our faith and gave us the Righteousness of Christ... So, that FAITH, is singular and one time, as proven by the fact that you are BORN AGAIN, one time.

= We took Jesus and God took us...born again..Eternal Redemption...."we have PEACE WTH GOD", because we are justified by the FAITH that God accepted to give us the New Birth.

So, that is COMPLETE.....Born again, is not a evolutionary process. WE are born as a SON of God.. A BRIDE of CHRIST.. THE BODY OF CHRIST....BRETHREN,.....not as an infant who needs to turn into a boy, who need to grow into a SON.
We are born again a "SON of God".

So, let look at the verses....

Notice this......"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone"".
Notice that faith it still there, but it's alone. So, its dead, but still there... And when its active, when a person is walking the walk....then there is fruit.

This Faith that James is talking about.... is "work out your salvation".....In other words. You HAVE SALVATION.....its YOURS...... so, learning how to operate it as a DISCIPLE...would be, Discipleship....

Now lets get to the revelation so that we can bury the heretic's wrongly dividing of James.

Notice this verse carefully...."Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me Your faith without thy works, and I will shew YOU my faith by my works..
Look carefully at this part.....James says...>"And i will show YOU YOU YOU my FAITH....by my works..

So, reader, who is James showing His faith to?? = A.) NOT GOD
James is showing faith to other BELIEVERS......... they are the "YOU".
We are to show that we are IN THE FAITH, that its not DEAD, by proving our good works before OTHER PEOPLE..... Or as James says..>"ill show YOU YOU YOU my Faith, by my works.".
This is the perfect correlation with "you shall know them, (believers) by their fruit", their works...
You shall recognize a believer who has no works as someone whose faith is "dead"...(Backslidden) vs, someone like James who will show YOU his living faith by His WORKS.

So, in all cases of Faith, regarding bearing fruit, this is discipleship, and is separate from "Justified by Faith" = Salvation, whereby God has eternally accepted you and saved you and will keep you.

There is "Faith" that God accepts ONE TIME, to save you, and the proof He did is that you are born again = once.
And then there is the walking out, the working out, the learning how to live a perfected Christian Discipleship. "work out your salvation in awe and wonder" = that is the daily living out the faith that you are inside of, being "in Christ".

 

[justbyfaith]

People who get lost/stuck in Hebrews, Matthew and James, which are the heretics handbook,

All scripture is inspired of the Lord and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in righteousness (2 Timothy 3:16).

Look carefully at this part.....James says...>"And i will show YOU YOU YOU my FAITH....by my works..

So, reader, who is James showing His faith to?? = A.) NOT GOD
James is showing faith to other BELIEVERS......... they are the "YOU".

Indeed, Romans 4:2 bears this out.

We are to show that we are IN THE FAITH, that its not DEAD, by proving our good works before OTHER PEOPLE..... Or as James says..>"ill show YOU YOU YOU my Faith, by my works.".

Now before man, we show forth our living faith by our works; while before God, who sees the invisible, our faith alone is sufficient. For it is faith that we are saved by, and our works show forth to those who are looking on from the outside, that our faith is genuine; to man.

That being said, Jesus is both God and Man.

So, He sees our invisible faith; but is nevertheless going to judge us by our works.

Consider what it says in Jonah 3:10. God saw their works and repented of judging them.

Of course, Jesus can see our faith (consider Matthew 9:2, Mark 2:5, and Luke 5:20); it should be noticed that Jesus saw the faith of the four friends of the paralyzed man by what they did, in that they dug through the ceiling in order to get to Jesus so that their friend could be healed.

That being said, man looks on the outward appearance but God looks on the heart (1 Samuel 16:7); while Jesus is both God and Man.

 

[DPMartin]

-
What is "dead faith", as found regarding a verse in James.?

Dead faith is when you become cold to the things of God and probably backslide.

People who get lost/stuck in Hebrews, Matthew and James, which are the heretics handbook, do not actually read those verses in James very closely.. But instead they just teach a bumper sticker ...."dead faith".

So, Listen....

First you have to have to recognize that there is the "justification by faith, without the deeds of the law"", and "saved by Grace through faith".....as a one time event where God took our faith and gave us the Righteousness of Christ... So, that FAITH, is singular and one time, as proven by the fact that you are BORN AGAIN, one time.

= We took Jesus and God took us...born again..Eternal Redemption...."we have PEACE WTH GOD", because we are justified by the FAITH that God accepted to give us the New Birth.

So, that is COMPLETE.....Born again, is not a evolutionary process. WE are born as a SON of God.. A BRIDE of CHRIST.. THE BODY OF CHRIST....BRETHREN,.....not as an infant who needs to turn into a boy, who need to grow into a SON.
We are born again a "SON of God".

So, let look at the verses....

Notice this......"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone"".
Notice that faith it still there, but it's alone. So, its dead, but still there... And when its active, when a person is walking the walk....then there is fruit.

This Faith that James is talking about.... is "work out your salvation".....In other words. You HAVE SALVATION.....its YOURS...... so, learning how to operate it as a DISCIPLE...would be, Discipleship....

Now lets get to the revelation so that we can bury the heretic's wrongly dividing of James.

Notice this verse carefully...."Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me Your faith without thy works, and I will shew YOU my faith by my works..
Look carefully at this part.....James says...>"And i will show YOU YOU YOU my FAITH....by my works..

So, reader, who is James showing His faith to?? = A.) NOT GOD
James is showing faith to other BELIEVERS......... they are the "YOU".
We are to show that we are IN THE FAITH, that its not DEAD, by proving our good works before OTHER PEOPLE..... Or as James says..>"ill show YOU YOU YOU my Faith, by my works.".
This is the perfect correlation with "you shall know them, (believers) by their fruit", their works...
You shall recognize a believer who has no works as someone whose faith is "dead"...(Backslidden) vs, someone like James who will show YOU his living faith by His WORKS.

So, in all cases of Faith, regarding bearing fruit, this is discipleship, and is separate from "Justified by Faith" = Salvation, whereby God has eternally accepted you and saved you and will keep you.

There is "Faith" that God accepts ONE TIME, to save you, and the proof He did is that you are born again = once.
And then there is the walking out, the working out, the learning how to live a perfected Christian Discipleship. "work out your salvation in awe and wonder" = that is the daily living out the faith that you are inside of, being "in Christ".

are you going to tell use something we don't know or might not have considered, or are you going to continue with this kidding pool Christianity? that frankly even most non-Christians have heard and are familiar with.


because if this is all the deeper you are then maybe you should be listening more then yakking.

 

[quietthinker]

-
What is "dead faith", as found regarding a verse in James.?

Dead faith is when you become cold to the things of God and probably backslide.

People who get lost/stuck in Hebrews, Matthew and James, which are the heretics handbook, do not actually read those verses in James very closely.. But instead they just teach a bumper sticker ...."dead faith".

So, Listen....

First you have to have to recognize that there is the "justification by faith, without the deeds of the law"", and "saved by Grace through faith".....as a one time event where God took our faith and gave us the Righteousness of Christ... So, that FAITH, is singular and one time, as proven by the fact that you are BORN AGAIN, one time.

= We took Jesus and God took us...born again..Eternal Redemption...."we have PEACE WTH GOD", because we are justified by the FAITH that God accepted to give us the New Birth.

So, that is COMPLETE.....Born again, is not a evolutionary process. WE are born as a SON of God.. A BRIDE of CHRIST.. THE BODY OF CHRIST....BRETHREN,.....not as an infant who needs to turn into a boy, who need to grow into a SON.
We are born again a "SON of God".

So, let look at the verses....

Notice this......"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone"".
Notice that faith it still there, but it's alone. So, its dead, but still there... And when its active, when a person is walking the walk....then there is fruit.

This Faith that James is talking about.... is "work out your salvation".....In other words. You HAVE SALVATION.....its YOURS...... so, learning how to operate it as a DISCIPLE...would be, Discipleship....

Now lets get to the revelation so that we can bury the heretic's wrongly dividing of James.

Notice this verse carefully...."Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me Your faith without thy works, and I will shew YOU my faith by my works..
Look carefully at this part.....James says...>"And i will show YOU YOU YOU my FAITH....by my works..

So, reader, who is James showing His faith to?? = A.) NOT GOD
James is showing faith to other BELIEVERS......... they are the "YOU".
We are to show that we are IN THE FAITH, that its not DEAD, by proving our good works before OTHER PEOPLE..... Or as James says..>"ill show YOU YOU YOU my Faith, by my works.".
This is the perfect correlation with "you shall know them, (believers) by their fruit", their works...
You shall recognize a believer who has no works as someone whose faith is "dead"...(Backslidden) vs, someone like James who will show YOU his living faith by His WORKS.

So, in all cases of Faith, regarding bearing fruit, this is discipleship, and is separate from "Justified by Faith" = Salvation, whereby God has eternally accepted you and saved you and will keep you.

There is "Faith" that God accepts ONE TIME, to save you, and the proof He did is that you are born again = once.
And then there is the walking out, the working out, the learning how to live a perfected Christian Discipleship. "work out your salvation in awe and wonder" = that is the daily living out the faith that you are inside of, being "in Christ".

Dead faith Behold, is evident when a person dismisses God's Commandments.....when their daily lives are lived with no regard for them all the while claiming Salvation.

 

[Enoch111]

What is "dead faith", as found regarding a verse in James.?

There is no such thing as "dead" faith (as such). James simply says that faith without works is meaningless or absent (hence"dead"). And that is very true.

 

[RogerDC]

What is "dead faith", as found regarding a verse in James.?

James 2:26 says “faith without works is dead” - “works” simply means keeping God’s commandments - so James is really saying, “faith without obedience is dead”.

First you have to have to recognize that there is the "justification by faith, without the deeds of the law"", and "saved by Grace through faith".....as a one time event where God took our faith and gave us the Righteousness of Christ... So, that FAITH, is singular and one time, as proven by the fact that you are BORN AGAIN, one time.

We are not saved by a “one time event”. For starters, scripture says God tests our faith:
”now for a little while you may have to suffer various trials, so that the genuineness of your faith … is tested by fire (1Peter1:6-7);

1Thess 2:4 says God “tests our hearts”;

”Blessed be the man who endures trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life which God has promised to those who love Him” (James 1:12);

”Do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested … Be faithful unto death, and I will give you the crown of life” (Rev 2:10);

”By faith Abraham, when he was tested, offered up Isaac” (Heb 11:17);

”After these things, God tested Abraham … Do not lay you hand on the lad or do anything to him, for now I know that you fear God” (Genesis 22:1-12).

You can’t be “saved” by your faith before God tests your faith, and that “test” can last a life-time (“Be faithful unto death, and I will give you the crown of life” (Rev 2:10). Jesus himself said some believe “for a while” but then fall away (Luke 8:13).

So salvation is not a “one time event” - it is a process that begins with justification by faith, after which we must remain justified by abiding in Christ by keeping his commandments (1John 3:24, 1John 2:3-5).
This is what is meant by “a man is justified by works and not by faith alone” (James 2:24).

No one is saved until after they die and are judged and granted eternal life by Christ. Until then, a believer only has the hope of salvation.

 

[mailmandan]

In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims they have faith but lack resulting evidential works. That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. So James is not teaching that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine.

Now "faith without works is dead" (James 2:20) does not mean that faith is dead until it produces works and then it becomes a living faith (which is like saying that a tree is dead until it produces fruit and then it becomes a living tree) or that works are the source of life in faith or that we are saved by works. James is simply saying faith that is not accompanied by evidential works demonstrates that it's dead. If someone merely says-claims they have faith but lack resulting evidential works, then they demonstrate that they have an empty profession of faith/dead faith and not authentic faith. Works are the fruit, by product and demonstrative evidence of authentic faith.

James is discussing the evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3). Works bear out the justification that already came by faith. In James 2:26, the comparison of the human spirit and faith is focused on their modes of operation. The spirit (Greek pneuma) may also be translated as "breath." As a breathless body exhibits no indication of life, also fruitless faith exhibits no indication of life. The source of the life in faith is not works; rather, life in faith is the source of works (Ephesians 2:5-10).

 

[justbyfaith]

You can’t be “saved” by your faith before God tests your faith,

Abraham's faith was counted to him as righteousness (i.e. he was saved by his faith) at the time of Genesis 15:6; which was many years before God tested his faith by requiring him to offer up Isaac.

 

[mailmandan]

In James 2:21, we notice that James does not say that Abraham's work of offering up Isaac resulted in God accounting Abraham as righteous and the accounting of Abraham's faith as righteousness was made in Genesis 15:6, many years before his work of offering up Isaac recorded in Genesis 22. The work of Abraham did not have some kind of intrinsic merit to account him as righteous, but it showed or manifested the genuineness of his faith. This is the "sense" in which Abraham was "justified by works." He was shown to be righteous.

 

[justbyfaith]

and the accounting of Abraham's faith as righteousness was made in Genesis 15:6, many years before his work of offering up Isaac

That's what I said...

 

[Behold]

Dead faith Behold, is evident when a person dismisses God's Commandments.....when their daily lives are lived with no regard for them all the while claiming Salvation.

There is no salvation or faith found, that God will ever accept, that has anything to do with "commandment" keeping.
Salvation is based on a Messiah, a Cross, and a Resurrection.
You should go there for yourself, and get away from the OLD COVENANT that Christ replaced with His Blood.

 

[justbyfaith]

There is no salvation or faith found, that God will ever accept, that has anything to do with "commandment" keeping.
Salvation is based on a Messiah, a Cross, and a Resurrection.
You should go there for yourself, and get away from the OLD COVENANT that Christ replaced with His Blood.

Commandment keeping is the result of faith under the New Covenant (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16, Romans 8:7, Romans 8:4).

 

[quietthinker]

There is no salvation or faith found, that God will ever accept, that has anything to do with "commandment" keeping.
Salvation is based on a Messiah, a Cross, and a Resurrection.
You should go there for yourself, and get away from the OLD COVENANT that Christ replaced with His Blood.

Your answer Behold indicates a misunderstanding of both the old and the new covenant.
This is the standard answer which those who have no power to keep God's Commandments peddle. They instead invent their own (traditions) putting them forward as commandments while figuring in their hearts they have impunity when it comes to breaking God's.

 

[justbyfaith]

On the other hand, we do not obtain our salvation by the works of the law, either (Galatians 2:16, Romans 3:20-21).

 

[BreadOfLife]

On the other hand, we do not obtain our salvation by the works of the law, either (Galatians 2:16, Romans 3:20-21).

Who said anything about works of the Mosaic Law??
Jesus fulfilled the Mosaic Law.

The works that are an essential element of the faith of a Christian wewre prepared FOR us by God in advance (Eph. 2:10).
They're not "OUR" works. We're just the instrument - so that that whole "works salvation" nonsense goes right down the drain.

 

[Behold]

Your answer Behold indicates a misunderstanding of both the old and the new covenant.
This is the standard answer which those who have no power to keep God's Commandments peddle. They instead invent their own (traditions) putting them forward as commandments while figuring in their hearts they have impunity when it comes to breaking God's.

There is no "keeping the commandments" to be accepted by God.
If you keep them all, and are not born again, you end up in Hell after you die, having kept all the commandments.
Understand?
Commandment keeping has no effect on your sin.
Its your SIN you have to deal with, to be accepted by God. How do you deal with it? You deal with it by becoming God's righteousness. This is God's gift to you, if you are born again.
So, any type of self effort, has no effect on sin...>"enduring" "abiding", "commandment keeping".."obedience".... none of this has any effect on you sin. its your sin that God has to deal with, ON THE CROSS, that is "SALVATiON.
You cannot, after you are saved, "repent and confess" yourself clean and pure.
You can't do this before you are saved, and its the same situation after you are born again.

 

[BreadOfLife]

In James 2:21, we notice that James does not say that Abraham's work of offering up Isaac resulted in God accounting Abraham as righteous and the accounting of Abraham's faith as righteousness was made in Genesis 15:6, many years before his work of offering up Isaac recorded in Genesis 22. The work of Abraham did not have some kind of intrinsic merit to account him as righteous, but it showed or manifested the genuineness of his faith. This is the "sense" in which Abraham was "justified by works." He was shown to be righteous.

That's what I said...

James compares the works of the harlot Rahab having justified her in the sight of God - just as the works of Abraham justified him.
There was NO other point where Rahab was considered "righteous" or was justified - prior to doing God's will.

James 2:21, 25
Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up his son Isaac on the altar?
And in the same way was not also Rahab the prostitute justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way?

This is actually the point that James is trying to make in this chapter.
Faith = BELIEF + WORKS (obedience).

Faith is NOT simply "belief".
James smashes that false teaching in verse 19 by telling his readers that even the DEMONS do that much. What the demons DON'T do is obey (works) - so, where they might BELIEVE in the truths about God - they don't have faith.

 

[BreadOfLife]

There is no "keeping the commandments" to be accepted by God.
If you keep them all, and are not born again, you end up in Hell after you die, having kept all the commandments.
Understand?
Commandment keeping has no effect on your sin.
Its your SIN you have to deal with, to be accepted by God. How do you deal with it? You deal with it by becoming God's righteousness. This is God's gift to you, if you are born again.
So, any type of self effort, has no effect on sin...>"enduring" "abiding", "commandment keeping".."obedience".... none of this has any effect on you sin. its your sin that God has to deal with, ON THE CROSS, that is "SALVATiON.
You cannot, after you are saved, "repent and confess" yourself clean and pure.
You can't do this before you are saved, and its the same situation after you are born again.

That's NOT what James is saying in chapter 2.

James is talking about the obedience of faith that we must have as Christians - the SAME obedience of faith that Paul s talks about in Rom. 1:5, 16:26. We must deal with our sin - but that's NOT what's being talked about here.

James 2:14-26 is ALL about the fact that faith is made up of TWO essential components:
BELIEF and WORKS, which is the obedience part. Either one on its own is worthless (dead).

 

[atpollard]

James 2:14-26 is ALL about the fact that faith is made up of TWO essential components:
BELIEF and WORKS, which is the obedience part. Either one on its own is worthless (dead).

I agree, either one ALONE negates the other. A person that claims FAITH but lives in total disobedience to GOOD WORKS (that God created in advance that we should walk in them - Eph 2:10) is actually proclaiming a lack of true (genuine or saving) FAITH in their life. Any person that is WORKING FOR their salvation (in order to earn the love of God) is proclaiming their lack of true (genuine or saving) FAITH in, and knowledge of, God.

It is no mistake the Ephesians 2:8-9 proclaim that God saves us (grace not works), and then Ephesians 2:10 then immediately tells us that those ALREADY SAVED have good works that God pre-planned for them to do. FAITH and WORKS ... in that order and both because of God.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I agree, either one ALONE negates the other. A person that claims FAITH but lives in total disobedience to GOOD WORKS (that God created in advance that we should walk in them - Eph 2:10) is actually proclaiming a lack of true (genuine or saving) FAITH in their life. Any person that is WORKING FOR their salvation (in order to earn the love of God) is proclaiming their lack of true (genuine or saving) FAITH in, and knowledge of, God.

It is no mistake the Ephesians 2:8-9 proclaim that God saves us (grace not works), and then Ephesians 2:10 then immediately tells us that those ALREADY SAVED have good works that God pre-planned for them to do. FAITH and WORKS ... in that order and both because of God.

I gotta disagree with you here.

Eph. 2:8-10
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

We agree that we are saved by God's grace. We obtain that saving grace because of the Sacrifice of Jesus on Calvary.
However - we obtain salvation through our cooperation with God's grace. THIS is what James is talking about.

Because WE are a work in progress - the Bible tells us that salvation is a lifelong process. It's not a one-time, slam dunk event.
The Scriptures assure us that we as Christians are ALREADY SAVED (Rom. 5:1, 8:24, Eph. 2:5–8)
This is Initial Salvation – God give us the initial grace to believe.

However, because Salvation is a LIFELONG process – it ALSO says that I am BEING SAVED (1 Cor. 1:8, 2 Cor. 2:15, 7:1, Phil. 2:12, Heb 12:14). This is Ongoing Sanctification – God is sanctifying us throughout our life as we cooperate with his grace.

Because of this, I have the hope that I WILL BE SAVED (Matt. 24:13, Rom. 5:9–10, 1 Cor. 3:12–15).
This is Final Sanctification/Salvation – We die and go to heaven having endured in faith to the end.

At ANY point in our life - we can turn away from God by our own doing - and the Scriptures warn us to remain faithful in order to obtain God's promises (Matt. 7:19-23, Matt. 10:22, Matt. 24:13, Matt. 25:31–46, John 15:1-6, Rom. 11:22, 1 Cor. 9:27, 1 Cor. 4:4, 1 Tim. 4:1, Heb. 3:6, Heb. 3:12-14, Heb 6:4-6, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, 1 John 5:13, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).