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Featured Dispensationalism

Discussion in 'Christian Debate Forum' started by Episkopos, Oct 11, 2018.

  1. Episkopos

    Episkopos Well-Known Member

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    I have posted this video which I think is fair and balanced. I very much like this brother and his kindly approach. He actually acts like a brother. It's a bit long...but very worth the listen. Enjoy! :)

     
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  2. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    Am watching it. when he says dispesensationalism came about in the 1800's - if what he means is that no one believed Jesus would return soon to gather us until the 1800's then I disagree, because the Thessalonians thought it had happened and were distressed they were still here! Paul didn't disabuse them of a false notion that Jesus would return and gather and some would be left - he reminded them that he told them they would see the man of perdition come FIRST.

    This is more a reminder so I don'tforget. I'm listening and thinking as I go.
     
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  3. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    When he says Darby believed scripture should be taken literally and not spiritually, I'm not sure all dispensationalists believe that. I still don't know if I am, to use your earlier term, "dispie," but if I am, I believe it will all happen literally just as the prophets said, but that it is the spirit of the word that helps us, not so much the literal letter.
     
  4. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    I don't agree with him that historical narrative should most likely be taken literally and not spiritually. I think it is both. The exodus is historical but it also has closely followed my own walk and my own missteps. He has also let me become very thirsty to see what I would do, as He did with them, yet He doesn't have me in a physical desert.
     
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  5. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member

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    One thing to keep in mind. Dispensationalists cannot support any of their claims directly from scripture. They float a theory, and then sever scripture from its context to support what they say. Ask any of them to quote scripture directly saying there will be a 7 year tribulation, or a pre-trib rapture, or a restored Roman Empire, and so on and they will come up blank. It is false prophecy in search of evidence. You'll hear lots of scripture, but always removed from its context and never directly bearing on their topic.
     
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  6. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    I next believe he is wrong when he says disp ies believe you must take all the bible literally. I find it hard to believe being a dispie means you can't think a parable is not a historically correct story. I HAVE heard a pet phrase i abhor, which is: if the literal reading makes sense, seek no other meaning. I think it's wrong. You should always be seeking the Spirit of the word - it's what helps a man most.
     
  7. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    So now I am to where the video is playing of the other 3 men. I do not agree with Gibbs that it matters if Revelation was written in 65 or 95. Either the prophecy matches in every single detail exactly what happened in 70 AD or it does not. It does not matter to me the year it was written, it only matters if every single detail occurred or did not.
     
  8. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    Ah, and now it is back to the nice, calm gentleman, who agrees that the date should not be such a n arm flapping problem. I have often seen men hammer a point to death and have tried to show them that the point they are hammering could fall and the rest of their construct still stand. I have done so because they are not being logical or truthful on some point because of the fear that their whole construct would stand or fall on th at one point, when it isn't so. They usually can't hear me, even when I try to help them rather than kick their castle!
     
  9. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    we already know for a fact that a million plus Hebrews never physically left Egypt, but they did leave it spiritually i guess
     
  10. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    logic is a trap lol
     
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  11. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    How do we know that for a fact?
     
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  12. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    Rather a sweaty and panicked intellectual dishonesty is a trap.
     
  13. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    An hour and 18 minutes in - long video but good - he is going to some length to argue that not all of the bible is literal, but he is going on too long. Of COURSE dispies do not think the entire bible is literal. What I've heard them most often say is IF the literal sense makes sense, seek no other sense. (Which, as I've said, I disagree with. A lot of it is literal and historical and ALSO has spiritual meanings and applications.)
     
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  14. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    I do agree with him that our focus should not be on endtimes. I do not agree that we should not at ALL look into prophecy because it's not for us to know or concern ourselves with. We are told to love His coming. We are told that when we see these things happen we should look up/look for Him.
     
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  15. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    Still not done with the video. I will say that he picked three men who do not do a good job, who should not be teaching, and who make a lot of false statements.

    I like that he demonizes neither side (his own or theirs). They (the 3 men) tend to demonize other views or say other views have a nefarious agenda. Of course, I have heard men who aren't dispies do this same thing to dispies. Neither should be doing this.

    And he does go on to say that when you fellowship broadly, and with some Christians who don't view some things just as you do, you actually come to discover that they do have some good reasons for what they believe and that they aren't pawns of satan or with some nefarious agenda.

    I have heard this morning that "dispies" try to escape the cross of Christ and that they have a bad/nefarious agenda for what they teach. (Granted, I am considering that dispies are those who believe in a pre trib gathering and I could be wrong about that. It may be possible to believe in our pre trib gathering and not be a dispie, I'm still not certain exactly what a dispie is and think not all of them believe all the same on everything...) But, we do like to label and then denigrate others who hold some different views, even when they love our Lord and have the Spirit.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2018
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  16. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Another nonsensical attack on Dispensationalists. Why don't you make the effort to properly understand this method of Bible interpretation?
     
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  17. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    First of all "dispies" is a derogatory term used by those who are ignorant about what Dispensationalism means, and simply believe all the lies and propaganda which have been in circulation for sometime.

    Since I am a Dispensationalist, I can tell you that the true teaching of Dsipensationalism is that the Bible must be taken in its plain literal sense UNLESS there is good reason not to.

    For example, there are many who teach that the book of Revelation is purely symbolic, and all the events described therein were already fulfilled in the first century. We know that that is pure fantasy, since the New Heavens and the New Earth have not been established as yet, and an "end of sins" and "eternal righteousness" worldwide is still a long way off.

    In other words metaphors in the Bible should be understood for what they are, but plain Scriptures should not be spiritualized and allegorized on a whim. Dispensationalists also understand that there are depths and layers to Bible interpretation, that Christ is revealed throughout the OT, as well as in the Old Covenant, that there are types of Christ from Adam onwards, etc.

    The reason for the bitter animosity (and in some cases hatred) against Christian brothers and sisters is because Dispensationalism has shown Christians that Covenant Theology, Amillennialism, Post-Millennialism, Preterism, etc. are completely false. These ideas originated in the Catholic Church but were never challenged by the Protestant Reformers (who were too busy with focusing on the Gospel and other Bible doctrines).

    One of the major errors addressed by Dispensationalism is the arrogant assumption that God is finished with the Jews and with Israel, even though the Bible makes it crystal clear that just as God has an eternal plan and purpose for the Church in the New Jerusalem (redeemed Jews and Gentiles in one Body, the Body of Christ), He also has an eternal plan and purpose for redeemed and restored Israel on earth in the Millennium, and beyond.

    At the same time, we need to be clear that there are variations even among Dispensationalists, and Hyper-Dispensationalism is an example of falsely interpreting Scripture. This is known as Bullingerism or Acts 28 Ultra-Dispensationalism, which teaches that the Church did not begin at Pentecost, but with Paul turning away from the Jews (Acts 28:28), that water baptism is not necessary for Christians, etc. True Dispensationalists have already written against this nonsense.

    In brief, Dispensationalism opposes nonsensical Bible interpretation, and every Christian should be in agreement with that. In fact every Christian should be a Dispensationalist.
     
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  18. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    I finished it. I love the last 15 minutes or so. I love that he says he has brothers and loves those brothers who are dispies. I love that he encourages loving dialogue so that maybe it WOULD be possible to come to agreement, or if not, to not demonize each other. He is a wise man.
     
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  19. stunnedbygrace

    stunnedbygrace Well-Known Member

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    And yes, I realize "dispie" is often meant derogatorily in some manner or fashion. I don't care. I will even call myself a dispie. I believe in our pre trib gathering and that we should pray to be counted worthy to escape the tribulation coming on the whole world to test its people. I believe if I need more testing to come out as gold, then God would do the right thing concerning me and leave me to be tested more, even if it meant persecution, to skim off my slag. I trust Him to do what is right concerning me.
     
  20. Heart2Soul

    Heart2Soul Well-Known Member

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    I am totally ignorant about dispensationalists....doing a little research into it....ummmm I guess I might be one and didn't even know it. Well labels only serve to identify peoples differences of beliefs or opinions....that does not render my salvation and my faith in God and His Word as being invalid. IMHO
     
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