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Featured Do you belong to "the [true] Church" (1 Tim 3:15)?, if so, how do you prove it?

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by ReChoired, Jan 27, 2020.

  1. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Do you belong to "the [true] Church" (1 Tim 3:15)?, if so, how do you prove it?

    This is the theme for this Thread.

    For instance, I personally, would begin with the scriptures (KJB) and attempt to identify the true church from clear descriptions given about it, and see whether that which I belonged to was a match for what was written in biblical description.

    Here is how one so does it:





    As another example, here is how another person went about it -

    Library Of Sermons 21 – The Search For The True Church – Pocket Book – Joe Crews – Amazing Facts (PDF)





    What are the clear identifying marks of the true church as they are found in scripture?
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2020
  2. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    In Revelation 12:17, we see a clear description of the true church, notice:

    Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

    [1] the dragon (Satan, etc) is wroth (angry, furious) with her

    [2] the dragon (Satan, etc) makes "war" with the "remnant of her seed"

    [3] there is a "remnant" left of "her seed"

    [4] this "remnant of her seed" is said to "keep the commandments of God"

    [5] this "remnant of her seed" is said to "have the testimony of Jesus Christ"​

    So, in order to know whether we belong to the true church as just described by this very singular verse (others we shall consider shortly), let us identify from scripture the definition of some of the terms used.

    [1] "testimony of Jesus Christ" is identified and defined in the same book of Revelation in chapter 19:

    Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.​

    Thus, the "testimony of Jesus [Christ]" is (meaning 'equal to') "the spirit of prophecy", and we may see this in greater detail throughout the scriptures, such as Revelation 1:2,9 and so on. Let's come back to this again in a bit.

    [2] "remnant", is seen coming onto the stage of history after certain historical (prophetically foretold) events occured:

    Joe 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
    Joe 2:29 And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.
    Joe 2:30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.
    Joe 2:31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.
    Joe 2:32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.​

    So we see this order of events, that was yet future from the time it was foretold.

    [1] "The sun shall be turned into darkness"

    [2] "and the moon into blood"

    both of which would take place "before the great and terrible day of the LORD come"​

    [3] "the remnant" appears on the scene, being "call[ed]" forth of God.​
     
  3. mjrhealth

    mjrhealth Well-Known Member

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    I suppose that all comes down to which religion you belong to. This one will blow up for sure.
     
  4. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Not at all. If you truly believe that you belong to the true church (1 Timothy 3:15), then you should be able to demonstrate that.
     
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  5. mjrhealth

    mjrhealth Well-Known Member

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    That depends on which church you belong to, mens ideas of what the Lords Church varies as does how it will Look. Just ask any Catholic. How did God put it.

    Act 7:47 But Solomon built him an house.
    Act 7:48 Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,
    Act 7:49 Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?
    Act 7:50 Hath not my hand made all these things?

    and again

    1Pe 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
    1Pe 2:6 Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.

    As Jesus put it to a friend of mine when Asked, if you ask how you are, you are like bricks in a church each and everyone of us who are His.
     
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  6. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    I am not asking for men's opinions. 1 Timothy 3:15 states that there is "the" (definite article) true church. In another place it states "one faith" (Ephesians 4:5). There are not many true churches. There is only one. Revelation 12 is one place which shows this. One woman. Not many as the harlots of the Great Whore (Roman Catholicism).
     
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  7. mjrhealth

    mjrhealth Well-Known Member

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    I know that and you know that and there a few others that know that, but many will beg to differ. I have being pointing that out for years.

    And many will say, there church is His church and stand there busily persecuting His church just as it was spoken
     
  8. Stranger

    Stranger Well-Known Member

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    Yes there is the Church of Jesus Christ. One Church composed of those who place faith in Jesus Christ. It is encompasses all believers in all denominations. The Roman Church is full of believers in Christ. Just like the Baptist churches are also. And the Presbyterian, etc. etc.

    The Great Whore you speak of is not the Roman Church. It is the complete apostate religious system that will include many denominations and even other faiths. You can almost see it coming together today.

    Stranger
     
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  9. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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  10. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Thank you, but no. This thread is about that which is True, in regards the true church, not that which is heresy as held by the fallen churches.
     
  11. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    No. That there are true believers inside of Roman Catholicism (Great Whore of Revelation 17 and Beast of the Sea of Revelation 13), or other fallen churches, doesn't make their systems of theology true. God winks at ignorance.

    In Revelation 18 it is written:

    Rev 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.
    Rev 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
    Rev 18:3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
    Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
    Rev 18:5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.​

    Therefore, God's people are indeed in the false system of Roman Catholicism, and her harlot daughters (Revelation 17), but they are to be called out of those false systems into the (singular) true church, as identified in Revelation 12. It is not a 'nebulous everywhere and nowhere'. The true church, has order, structure, offices, functions, and gifts as seen in Acts 6:3, Acts 15, 1 Corinthians 12-14; Ephesians 4-5 and elsewhere.

    Scripture, as already spoken of in Revelation 12, and elsewhere, tells how to identify the true church. If you think that the true church is 'a nebulous everywhere and nowhere' membership, you have left the pattern given and are not in the true church, even if you are a believer.

    In fact the true church is found in the Sanctuary (Psalms 77:13), as each phase of the sanctuary shows the movement and characteristics of the true church.

    Outer court - Ezekiel 10:5

    Holy Place - Exodus 26:33

    Most Holy Place- Exodus 26:33

    As there are 3 places. There are 3 phases of the true church.

    Adam unto Moses and Israel (Israelites) was the first Outer Court Phase -

    Acts 7:38 This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:​

    The Disciples and Apostles of Jesus Christ moved by faith into the Holy Place, and became the next phase -

    Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
    Act 2:2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
    Act 2:3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
    Act 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

    Act 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

    Psa 133:1 A Song of degrees of David. Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity!
    Psa 133:2 It is like the precious ointment upon the head, that ran down upon the beard, even Aaron's beard: that went down to the skirts of his garments;
    Psa 133:3 As the dew of Hermon, and as the dew that descended upon the mountains of Zion: for there the LORD commanded the blessing, even life for evermore.

    Act_10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    Act_11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.

    Rev 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

    They received a new name:

    Act_11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.​

    The third phase, is easily identified after that and a new name.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
  12. Philip James

    Philip James Well-Known Member

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    They went out from us, but they were not really of our number; if they had been, they would have remained with us. Their desertion shows that none of them was of our number.
     
  13. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Me-thinks that you're afraid to look at the thread....because you know that it will change your mind.
     
  14. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    There are many churches (or denominational groups) who all claim to be the *true Church*. The leader of the pack is the Roman Catholic Church. Then we have the Church of Jesus Christ of the Latter Day Saints. Then we have Sun Myung Moon's Unification Church. Then we have the Restored Church of God, an offshoot of the Worldwide Church of God of Herbert Armstrong. Then we have the Church of Christ. Then we have the Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, the Christadelphians, etc.

    However the true Church of God is hidden from human eyes. Only God knows who are His true children who have been saved by grace, washed in the blood of the Lamb, and placed within the Body of Christ. Some of them may even be found in some of the above cults.
     
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  15. Philip James

    Philip James Well-Known Member

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    You are the light of the world. A city set on a mountain cannot be hidden.

    Nor do they light a lamp and then put it under a bushel basket; it is set on a lampstand, where it gives light to all in the house.


    16
     
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  16. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately, this cannot be applied to the denominations claiming to be the true Church of God. This applies only to the true children of God.
     
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  17. Helen

    Helen Well-Known Member

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    @Stranger Good word..agree..I posted mine at the bottom before I read everyones responses.

    Do I belong to the One true Church -

    Yes.

    There is only one One Church...if anyone is a blood washed child of God we are part of the one true Church... His Church is a Church without walls.

    Eph 4:4
    "There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
    One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
    One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all
    ."
     
  18. Philip James

    Philip James Well-Known Member

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    If there is any encouragement in Christ, any solace in love, any participation in the Spirit, any compassion and mercy,

    complete my joy by being of the same mind, with the same love, united in heart, thinking one thing.

    Do nothing out of selfishness or out of vainglory; rather, humbly regard others as more important than yourselves,

    each looking out not for his own interests, but (also) everyone for those of others.

    Have among yourselves the same attitude that is also yours in Christ Jesus,
     
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  19. Mike Waters

    Mike Waters Well-Known Member

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    How do I go about the business of trying to ensure that I belong to the "true Church of God"?

    By accepting that all other believers are as likely to be as partly wrong and partly right as myself.:rolleyes:
    That way I know that I belong to the only small 'c' catholic (all embracing) Church.
     
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  20. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    You say you belong to the "One True Church". Ok, where is it in the world? The "One True Church" was easily identifiable in scripture. We clearly see it in Acts, with the council there in Acts 1-2, and having another council in Acts 15, with specific members. They had Elders and Deacons, who all knew one another at that council. None were nebulous.

    Again, they were not a 'nebulous everywhere and nowhere' set of people.

    The OP is not advocating that persons cannot be Christians where they presently are, but the OP is focused upon where the One True Church specifically is. For instance:

    Act_2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.​

    Therefore, the "One True Church" has specific "doctrine" that was there from the beginning. Let's see one of those doctrines:

    Peter taught that king David is both "dead" and "buried" and that his tomb ("sepulchre") was still there, and that king David was not yet in Heaven, but is still asleep in that grave, seeing "corruption" (decay, returning to the dust from whence he came):

    Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.

    Act 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,

    Act_13:36 For David, after he had served his own generation by the will of God, fell on sleep, and was laid unto his fathers, and saw corruption:​

    Have you continued in that "doctrine"? If not, you may be a Christian, but you are in the wrong 'church', which has corrupt doctrine of Babylon (either Great Whore Mother or harlot daughters), and need to "Come out of her my people ...", into the "One True Church" which does so teach. If you do not come out you are disobedient to the voice of the One True Shepherd and do not therefore follow him, and are therefore, none of His by default (God said it, I am just relaying it).

    There is to be "One Fold, One Shepherd" (John 10:16; Isaiah 56:8).
     
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