Eschatological and Millennial Theories and their problems.

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Dave L

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I believe every main eschatology or millennial theory rests on one error. They all teach the Kingdom of God is physical instead of being spiritual. So all try to build a physical kingdom on earth in Christ’s name. This includes Amillennialists, Postmillennialists, and Premillennialists who look for a physical kingdom of the future that will last 1000 years.

But scripture teaches the Kingdom is here now - spiritually. It is not of this world. And it is everlasting.

The Amillennialists say the kingdom is here now, but it is physical. And this led to the persecution of innocent people by the Institutional State Churches over the centuries.

The Postmillennialists say the same thinking the Church will finally influence and dominate civil laws and magistrates. A sort of "Christianized" world. Some Dominion Postmillennial groups plan a violent takeover of the world.

Premillennialist and Dispensationalists see a physical kingdom ruling the world by force after Jesus returns.

But the common error in all groups is the physical kingdom concept and the comingling of Church and State that Jesus keeps separate when he says his kingdom is not of this world.


Any thoughts appreciated.
 

Harvest 1874

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It is apparent you have not thoroughly read that text book of yours, the scriptures are quite clear in respects to the two phases of the kingdom, that is to say there will be an earthly phase as well as a spiritual phase to the kingdom.

"My kingdom is not of this world: IF my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight..."(John 18:36).

When our Lord stated that his kingdom was not of this world he did not mean to suggest that his kingdom would never be establish here on earth, if so he would have never admonished us to pray, “Thy kingdom come thy will be done on earth even as it is in heaven”. No what he meant was that his kingdom (that is the earthly phase of that kingdom) was not of this world, this “present evil world” (Gal 1:4), but that in due time following the completion of the Church and the destruction of the present order of things, his kingdom would be established on earth, and the Father’s will would be done here even as it is in heaven.

For the day of the Lord will come (Greek, heko, will arrive; be here) as a thief in the night (unobserved, quietly) in which the heavens (the ecclesiastical heavens, the religious powers and influences of the world, both the seen and the unseen) will pass away with a great noise (turmoil and confusion), and the elements (of society) will melt with fervent heat (great tribulation, tumult, strife, human passion and wrath, anarchy); both the earth (the social order as now presently organized under Satan’s control) and the works (pride, rank, aristocracy, royalty) that are in it will be burned up (swallowed up, dissolved).” 2 Pet 3:10

Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens (new powers of spiritual control, God’s Kingdom his glorified Church) and a new earth (i.e. society reorganized and in harmony with God’s kingdom), wherein dwells righteousness.” (2 Pet 3:5-7, 10-13)

Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world," and until the era or the "world to come" DOES COME, Christ's kingdom will not control the earth. And for this we are taught to hope and pray, "Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven."

The prophecies of Book of Revelation state that when Christ would return at the end of the Age, the seventh Trumpet would sound -- THEN the kingdom of this world would become Christ's. "And the seventh angel sounded…The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord, and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever" (Rev 11:15). Not before.

Some doubt whether it really is a literal kingdom of God on earth for which we are to pray. When they read, “the kingdom of God is within you” (Luke 17:21), they erroneously conclude that the kingdom spoken of is only a condition of heart within a Christian, not a literal kingdom. This is a mistake. A better translation of Luke 17:21 reads, “The kingdom of God is (to be) in your midst,” or “among you.” It is indeed to be a literal kingdom exercising supreme rule upon the earth, with Christ as king, causing God's will to be done on earth.

There is a great fallacy in the nominal Christian world today. Taking as their authority the mistranslated scripture “The kingdom of God is within you”, they teach that Christ rules only in the hearts of men, that when a man accepts Christ, Christ comes to that man; when all men have accepted him, he shall have fully come. They say that will constitute the kingdom of Christ.

Even the pagan Roman ruler, Herod, knew better than that. He was a hard and realistic man. When he heard from the wise men of the East that someone had been born King of the Jews, he gave no mystical meaning to it. He considered it a threat to his physical ruler-ship of one segment of the Roman Empire. Believing in direct and decisive action, he went to the highest Jewish authorities he knew--the Chief Priests and Scribes, and demanded to know where, according to their prophets, this new king should be born. They quoted the prophecy of Micah 5:2:

And thou, Bethlehem, in the Land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda; for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.”--Matt 2:6

In other words, “The government shall be upon his shoulder.” Herod did not ascribe some symbolic meaning to this prophecy. He did not limit it to a mere spiritual ruler-ship in the hearts of men. On the contrary, he considered his worst fears confirmed. Here was a definite threat that, unless he acted, the government might be wrested from the Roman Empire and vested in another king.

After the reformation there was a tendency to give a purely spiritual connotation to the earthly kingdom promises. It was then that the translation was rendered, “The kingdom of God is within you.” It should have actually read, “God's Royal Majesty is among you.” In other words: “The king is present. Christ is here. He is in your midst!

Assuming a superior attitude, the Pharisees in Luke 17:20 impatiently and arrogantly demanded to know, “When will this Kingdom that you speak of come?

Surely the Kingdom of God was not in the midst of the hearts of the Pharisees’! Hence Jesus meant “The Kingdom of God is right here within your presence or midst.” Stated another way, “In your very presence, the Kingdom work is going on and you are not aware of it. You are erroneously looking for an outward, spectacular display that would be apparent to everyone.” The Kingdom was right there in the sense that the King of that Kingdom was present.

For further insight I would suggest the following two blog post, “Two Phases of the Kingdom” and “The Two Salvations”.
 

Enoch111

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Any thoughts appreciated.
To boldly claim that there will be no physical kingdom of God on earth -- AFTER HAVE BEEN SHOWN SCRIPTURE -- is simply delusional. And the greatest delusionals are the Amillennialists.

Now do you wish to get into some serious Bible study about this, or do you wish to continue harboring delusions?
 

Hidden In Him

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I believe every main eschatology or millennial theory rests on one error. They all teach the Kingdom of God is physical instead of being spiritual. So all try to build a physical kingdom on earth in Christ’s name. This includes Amillennialists, Postmillennialists, and Premillennialists who look for a physical kingdom of the future that will last 1000 years.

But scripture teaches the Kingdom is here now - spiritually. It is not of this world. And it is everlasting.

The Amillennialists say the kingdom is here now, but it is physical. And this led to the persecution of innocent people by the Institutional State Churches over the centuries.

The Postmillennialists say the same thinking the Church will finally influence and dominate civil laws and magistrates. A sort of "Christianized" world. Some Dominion Postmillennial groups plan a violent takeover of the world.

Premillennialist and Dispensationalists see a physical kingdom ruling the world by force after Jesus returns.

But the common error in all groups is the physical kingdom concept and the comingling of Church and State that Jesus keeps separate when he says his kingdom is not of this world.


Any thoughts appreciated.

Dangerous thing to separate the Christian faith from physical realities, and the literal fulfillment of Biblical promises. During NT times, similar theology was proposed regarding Christ not actually having come in the flesh, and it was rank heresy.

Not much for debating, so I will leave it at that. But since you were asking for our thoughts, those are mine.
 

Naomi25

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I believe every main eschatology or millennial theory rests on one error. They all teach the Kingdom of God is physical instead of being spiritual. So all try to build a physical kingdom on earth in Christ’s name. This includes Amillennialists, Postmillennialists, and Premillennialists who look for a physical kingdom of the future that will last 1000 years.

But scripture teaches the Kingdom is here now - spiritually. It is not of this world. And it is everlasting.

The Amillennialists say the kingdom is here now, but it is physical. And this led to the persecution of innocent people by the Institutional State Churches over the centuries.

The Postmillennialists say the same thinking the Church will finally influence and dominate civil laws and magistrates. A sort of "Christianized" world. Some Dominion Postmillennial groups plan a violent takeover of the world.

Premillennialist and Dispensationalists see a physical kingdom ruling the world by force after Jesus returns.

But the common error in all groups is the physical kingdom concept and the comingling of Church and State that Jesus keeps separate when he says his kingdom is not of this world.


Any thoughts appreciated.

You say Amillennialists "say the Kingdom is here now, but it is physical."

I'm not sure if this is a typo, or a mistaken understanding of what Amil's believe. In point of fact, they believe that the Kingdom is now, but is spiritual. Christ reigns in his millennial Kingdom from heaven, inaugurated when he ascended, finished when he returns to usher in the eternal state.
 
D

Dave L

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You say Amillennialists "say the Kingdom is here now, but it is physical."

I'm not sure if this is a typo, or a mistaken understanding of what Amil's believe. In point of fact, they believe that the Kingdom is now, but is spiritual. Christ reigns in his millennial Kingdom from heaven, inaugurated when he ascended, finished when he returns to usher in the eternal state.
Traditionally they saw the Church (Kingdom) as a physical institution as many still do. But like you imply, Amillennialism is true if you keep the church believers only. And not a physical institution.
 
D

Dave L

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Dangerous thing to separate the Christian faith from physical realities, and the literal fulfillment of Biblical promises. During NT times, similar theology was proposed regarding Christ not actually having come in the flesh, and it was rank heresy.

Not much for debating, so I will leave it at that. But since you were asking for our thoughts, those are mine.
If we define the kingdom according to Jesus. It comes without observation, flesh and blood cannot enter it. Only the born again can see it. It is not of this world and is eternal, not 1000 years. etc., etc.
 
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Dave L

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To boldly claim that there will be no physical kingdom of God on earth -- AFTER HAVE BEEN SHOWN SCRIPTURE -- is simply delusional. And the greatest delusionals are the Amillennialists.

Now do you wish to get into some serious Bible study about this, or do you wish to continue harboring delusions?
I posted this to show there is no physical kingdom on tap, only spiritual.
 
D

Dave L

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It is apparent you have not thoroughly read that text book of yours, the scriptures are quite clear in respects to the two phases of the kingdom, that is to say there will be an earthly phase as well as a spiritual phase to the kingdom.

"My kingdom is not of this world: IF my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight..."(John 18:36).

When our Lord stated that his kingdom was not of this world he did not mean to suggest that his kingdom would never be establish here on earth, if so he would have never admonished us to pray, “Thy kingdom come thy will be done on earth even as it is in heaven”. No what he meant was that his kingdom (that is the earthly phase of that kingdom) was not of this world, this “present evil world” (Gal 1:4), but that in due time following the completion of the Church and the destruction of the present order of things, his kingdom would be established on earth, and the Father’s will would be done here even as it is in heaven.

For the day of the Lord will come (Greek, heko, will arrive; be here) as a thief in the night (unobserved, quietly) in which the heavens (the ecclesiastical heavens, the religious powers and influences of the world, both the seen and the unseen) will pass away with a great noise (turmoil and confusion), and the elements (of society) will melt with fervent heat (great tribulation, tumult, strife, human passion and wrath, anarchy); both the earth (the social order as now presently organized under Satan’s control) and the works (pride, rank, aristocracy, royalty) that are in it will be burned up (swallowed up, dissolved).” 2 Pet 3:10

Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens (new powers of spiritual control, God’s Kingdom his glorified Church) and a new earth (i.e. society reorganized and in harmony with God’s kingdom), wherein dwells righteousness.” (2 Pet 3:5-7, 10-13)

Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world," and until the era or the "world to come" DOES COME, Christ's kingdom will not control the earth. And for this we are taught to hope and pray, "Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven."

The prophecies of Book of Revelation state that when Christ would return at the end of the Age, the seventh Trumpet would sound -- THEN the kingdom of this world would become Christ's. "And the seventh angel sounded…The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord, and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever" (Rev 11:15). Not before.

Some doubt whether it really is a literal kingdom of God on earth for which we are to pray. When they read, “the kingdom of God is within you” (Luke 17:21), they erroneously conclude that the kingdom spoken of is only a condition of heart within a Christian, not a literal kingdom. This is a mistake. A better translation of Luke 17:21 reads, “The kingdom of God is (to be) in your midst,” or “among you.” It is indeed to be a literal kingdom exercising supreme rule upon the earth, with Christ as king, causing God's will to be done on earth.

There is a great fallacy in the nominal Christian world today. Taking as their authority the mistranslated scripture “The kingdom of God is within you”, they teach that Christ rules only in the hearts of men, that when a man accepts Christ, Christ comes to that man; when all men have accepted him, he shall have fully come. They say that will constitute the kingdom of Christ.

Even the pagan Roman ruler, Herod, knew better than that. He was a hard and realistic man. When he heard from the wise men of the East that someone had been born King of the Jews, he gave no mystical meaning to it. He considered it a threat to his physical ruler-ship of one segment of the Roman Empire. Believing in direct and decisive action, he went to the highest Jewish authorities he knew--the Chief Priests and Scribes, and demanded to know where, according to their prophets, this new king should be born. They quoted the prophecy of Micah 5:2:

And thou, Bethlehem, in the Land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda; for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.”--Matt 2:6

In other words, “The government shall be upon his shoulder.” Herod did not ascribe some symbolic meaning to this prophecy. He did not limit it to a mere spiritual ruler-ship in the hearts of men. On the contrary, he considered his worst fears confirmed. Here was a definite threat that, unless he acted, the government might be wrested from the Roman Empire and vested in another king.

After the reformation there was a tendency to give a purely spiritual connotation to the earthly kingdom promises. It was then that the translation was rendered, “The kingdom of God is within you.” It should have actually read, “God's Royal Majesty is among you.” In other words: “The king is present. Christ is here. He is in your midst!

Assuming a superior attitude, the Pharisees in Luke 17:20 impatiently and arrogantly demanded to know, “When will this Kingdom that you speak of come?

Surely the Kingdom of God was not in the midst of the hearts of the Pharisees’! Hence Jesus meant “The Kingdom of God is right here within your presence or midst.” Stated another way, “In your very presence, the Kingdom work is going on and you are not aware of it. You are erroneously looking for an outward, spectacular display that would be apparent to everyone.” The Kingdom was right there in the sense that the King of that Kingdom was present.

For further insight I would suggest the following two blog post, “Two Phases of the Kingdom” and “The Two Salvations”.
Good post. We are presently in the Kingdom and will enter the fullness of the kingdom in the new heavens and earth on the last day.
 

bbyrd009

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hmm. Wadr i'm hearing "when we all get to heaven" alla sudden, there at the end?
The "we" entering the kingdom thing?
 
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Harvest 1874

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If we define the kingdom according to Jesus. It comes without observation, flesh and blood cannot enter it. Only the born again can see it. It is not of this world and is eternal, not 1000 years. etc., etc.

You're talking about the heavenly phase of the kingdom, the earthly phase during the mediatorial reign is a 1000 years during which time the Lord will judge the world (mankind) in righteousness and at its completion all who are approved, i.e. the "sheep class" will be ushered into the everlasting kingdom, which as is its namesake everlasting.
 
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Dave L

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You're talking about the heavenly phase of the kingdom, the earthly phase during the mediatorial reign is a 1000 years during which time the Lord will judge the world (mankind) in righteousness and at its completion all who are approved, i.e. the "sheep class" will be ushered into the everlasting kingdom, which as is its namesake everlasting.
You are mistaking the "physical millennium" (will never happen) with the New Heavens and earth.
 

Jay Ross

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Hello

This is an interesting topic and our determination of what this means to us is very dependant on our understanding of the scriptures.

In Daniel_ 2 we are told that God will establish his kingdom here on the earth during the time of the Kings mentioned in the fifth segment of the statue prophecy concerning the events surrounding the Babylonian Kingdom. God's everlasting Kingdom has not yet been "physically" established here on the face of the earth. God will establish His Everlasting Kingdom which will never be destroyed, here on the earth in our near future during the time of these kings. At this time a stone was cut out without hands and will come down and strike the statue on its feet and break them into pieces and cause the statue to fall so that it will all be crushed together to become like chaff and be blown away by the wind and be no more. Then the stone will become a great mountain that will fill the whole earth.

How long does the stone that comes down and strikes the image of the statue, take to crush the image and for the wind to blow away the chaff that remains of the statue? The prophecy of the statue does not give us that information as to how long this process takes, but we know that the spiritual aspects of the image of the statue is not completely gone until the end of the next age which happens in our distant future.

Much speculated writing has been composed on this aspect of the coming of God's everlasting Kingdom and how it will be played out. Much of what has been written is based on man's understandings and desires, but those who do know the truth of the matter, also know that when the vacuum is produced by the removal of the present dominating evil spirits for a time of many days, that God will appoint/give dominion to the Son of Man such that all of mankind during that dominion should worship Him during that Age.

Do we know the sign post events that herald when God will established His Ever Lasting Kingdom? Yes we do. But, there are a number of events that will occur around when God's Ever Lasting Kingdom will be established that are all related. The most prominent one is when the nations are assembled at Armageddon to be judged and the wicked heavenly host are thrown out of heaven after being judged around the same timeframe gathered together to be imprisoned for many days to await their determined fate f being dispatched into the Lake of Fire at the end of the Age.

The manifestation of God's Kingdom at present is spiritual, within the people, but it is not everlasting within the people as they can be encouraged to relinquish their grasp of being a part of God's heavenly Kingdom here on the earth through the influence of the wicked fallen heavenly hosts that presently have dominion over the people of the earth if the people of the earth so chose to live within their respective dominions.

How can this be so? It is the way that God has planned it from the very beginning.

Shalom
 

Naomi25

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Traditionally they saw the Church (Kingdom) as a physical institution as many still do. But like you imply, Amillennialism is true if you keep the church believers only. And not a physical institution.

To say that they saw (and still do) the Church as the Kingdom's physical manifestation, is to simplify it and only look at one aspect of it. While that is indeed true, there could be no 'manifestation' without the King or the reign itself. That is strictly happening in heaven and is spiritual. Christ repeatedly tells us in scripture that his Kingdom is not of this world. Thus, we are partakers of something not of this world, making our true citizenship in heaven, not here.
You say in your OP:

But the common error in all groups is the physical kingdom concept and the comingling of Church and State that Jesus keeps separate when he says his kingdom is not of this world.

Your premise is that all end time schools of thought are erroneous because they see the Kingdom as physical, and that they, as you say in the quote above, see a co-mingling of Church and State.
Amillennialism see's the millennium as primarily a spiritual state, and we do not see the 'earthly State' as having anything to do with either the Church, or the heavenly Kingdom of Christ.
So I can't quite see how the Amil position fits into you category of the 'mistaken'...sorry!
 
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Dave L

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To say that they saw (and still do) the Church as the Kingdom's physical manifestation, is to simplify it and only look at one aspect of it. While that is indeed true, there could be no 'manifestation' without the King or the reign itself. That is strictly happening in heaven and is spiritual. Christ repeatedly tells us in scripture that his Kingdom is not of this world. Thus, we are partakers of something not of this world, making our true citizenship in heaven, not here.
You say in your OP:



Your premise is that all end time schools of thought are erroneous because they see the Kingdom as physical, and that they, as you say in the quote above, see a co-mingling of Church and State.
Amillennialism see's the millennium as primarily a spiritual state, and we do not see the 'earthly State' as having anything to do with either the Church, or the heavenly Kingdom of Christ.
So I can't quite see how the Amil position fits into you category of the 'mistaken'...sorry!
If you consider the Catholics (Amillennial), they most certainly saw the Church/State as the physical kingdom. Lutherans and Reformed as well.
 
D

Dave L

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Hello

This is an interesting topic and our determination of what this means to us is very dependant on our understanding of the scriptures.

In Daniel_ 2 we are told that God will establish his kingdom here on the earth during the time of the Kings mentioned in the fifth segment of the statue prophecy concerning the events surrounding the Babylonian Kingdom. God's everlasting Kingdom has not yet been "physically" established here on the face of the earth. God will establish His Everlasting Kingdom which will never be destroyed, here on the earth in our near future during the time of these kings. At this time a stone was cut out without hands and will come down and strike the statue on its feet and break them into pieces and cause the statue to fall so that it will all be crushed together to become like chaff and be blown away by the wind and be no more. Then the stone will become a great mountain that will fill the whole earth.

How long does the stone that comes down and strikes the image of the statue, take to crush the image and for the wind to blow away the chaff that remains of the statue? The prophecy of the statue does not give us that information as to how long this process takes, but we know that the spiritual aspects of the image of the statue is not completely gone until the end of the next age which happens in our distant future.

Much speculated writing has been composed on this aspect of the coming of God's everlasting Kingdom and how it will be played out. Much of what has been written is based on man's understandings and desires, but those who do know the truth of the matter, also know that when the vacuum is produced by the removal of the present dominating evil spirits for a time of many days, that God will appoint/give dominion to the Son of Man such that all of mankind during that dominion should worship Him during that Age.

Do we know the sign post events that herald when God will established His Ever Lasting Kingdom? Yes we do. But, there are a number of events that will occur around when God's Ever Lasting Kingdom will be established that are all related. The most prominent one is when the nations are assembled at Armageddon to be judged and the wicked heavenly host are thrown out of heaven after being judged around the same timeframe gathered together to be imprisoned for many days to await their determined fate f being dispatched into the Lake of Fire at the end of the Age.

The manifestation of God's Kingdom at present is spiritual, within the people, but it is not everlasting within the people as they can be encouraged to relinquish their grasp of being a part of God's heavenly Kingdom here on the earth through the influence of the wicked fallen heavenly hosts that presently have dominion over the people of the earth if the people of the earth so chose to live within their respective dominions.

How can this be so? It is the way that God has planned it from the very beginning.

Shalom
Thanks for the interesting post. Many replace the Kingdom (as in restoration of Israel, i.e. believers in Christ that takes place in the resurrection on the last day) with a temporal earthly "millennium" that Jesus knew nothing of. The restoration of Israel finds fulfillment in the New Heavens and earth on the last day. And not in an earthly kingdom that "comes with observation" contrary to Jesus' words.
 

Enoch111

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Many replace the Kingdom (as in restoration of Israel, i.e. believers in Christ that takes place in the resurrection on the last day) with a temporal earthly "millennium" that Jesus knew nothing of.
How is it possible that Jesus "knew nothing of" His Millennial Kingdom, when the book of Revelation is called "the Revelation of JESUS CHRIST"? Therefore it is Christ who has given us an overview of the Millennium through the apostle John.

REVELATION 20
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

The restoration of Israel finds fulfillment in the New Heavens and earth on the last day.
This is incorrect, since the New Heavens and the New Earth come into existence AFTER the Millennium. And yes, redeemed and restored Israel will continue into the New Heavens and the New Earth after the Millennium.
And not in an earthly kingdom that "comes with observation" contrary to Jesus' words.
This is an EGREGIOUS ERROR, since "cometh not with observation" refers to the New Birth, which is invisible to everyone except God, and this internal Kingdom will become an external, visible Kingdom after the Second Coming of Christ. Scriptures have already been provided (and ignored). But keeping things in proper context is essential to understanding God's plans and purposes.
 
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Dave L

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How is it possible that Jesus "knew nothing of" His Millennial Kingdom, when the book of Revelation is called "the Revelation of JESUS CHRIST"? Therefore it is Christ who has given us an overview of the Millennium through the apostle John.

REVELATION 20
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.


This is incorrect, since the New Heavens and the New Earth come into existence AFTER the Millennium. And yes, redeemed and restored Israel will continue into the New Heavens and the New Earth after the Millennium.

This is an EGREGIOUS ERROR, since "cometh not with observation" refers to the New Birth, which is invisible to everyone except God, and this internal Kingdom will become an external, visible Kingdom after the Second Coming of Christ. Scriptures have already been provided (and ignored). But keeping things in proper context is essential to understanding God's plans and purposes.
Jesus was Amillennial. = no millennium. He taught the kingdom was then present and spiritual. And said his kingdom is not of this world. Nor did it come with observation. If we make Revelation 20 conform to this, it takes on proper meaning. But to read Jewish ideas of a physical kingdom into it, adds to the Book of Revelation. It is safer to stick with Jesus' kingdom definitions.
 
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Jay Ross

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Thanks for the interesting post. Many replace the Kingdom (as in restoration of Israel, i.e. believers in Christ that takes place in the resurrection on the last day) with a temporal earthly "millennium" that Jesus knew nothing of. The restoration of Israel finds fulfillment in the New Heavens and earth on the last day. And not in an earthly kingdom that "comes with observation" contrary to Jesus' words.

Sadly, Dave L, your response to my post also shows a lack of understanding.

Matthew_25 shows that Jesus knew when the everlasting Kingdom of God would be established here on the earth and the signs that will be associated with that. The start of the Everlasting Kingdom will be associated with the restoration/redemption of Israel that will occur when Israel see the Son of Man dealing with the Assembled nations of the earth arrayed in order to trample Jerusalem once more at the completion of the assigned time of 2,300 years as told to us in Daniel_8:9-14 and referred to by Paul in Romans_11:25-26 as to the time when all of Israel will be saved.

The Parable of he Ten virgins happens at the beginning of the Last Age before the Age of Eternity, which mankind has labelled as the Millennium Age because of what we can read in Revelation_20, when God rejoices in the renewing of the marriage vows/covenant with Israel the Bride.

This event is then followed by the Parable of The Talents which speaks of Satan's plans during his incarceration in the Bottomless Pit for 1,000 years where his faithful servants, in this case religious faithful servants who have been given the means, i.e. large sums of money, to oppress the peoples of the earth, to keep them from worshipping the Son of Man who has been given dominion over all of the peoples of the earth such that they should worship Him.

The last event spoken about in this chapter occurs at the end of the last age before the start of the Age of Eternity, when Christ returns with all of the heavenly hosts from heaven to bring in the final judgement of the nations between the Seep and the Goats just before the second death and Hades are dispatched into the Lake of Fire such that Sin is no more present on the earth.

Jesus also gave us clues in Luke_14:25-35 as to when Israel will be redeemed and the reason for the Nations of the world coning up against Jerusalem to overcome the Israelites' attempt to build a temple to force God's hand into redeeming them at then end of the allotted time of the visitation of the iniquities of the fathers against their children and their children's children during the third and the fourth age of their existence. It is at this time that Israel will see a King, i.e. Christ, come, with all authority and power to judge the nations of the earth, and their fear was that this king would also deal harshly with them after He had deal with the nations of the earth. Because of this fear, Israel then seeks the King's terms of peace for them and in this passage, Jesus also warns that if the salt has lost its saltiness, that they would be discarded onto the dung heap.

Also In Luke_19, Jesus in the Parable of the Minas hints at the fact that Israel will also God to their King, i.e. God, to inform Him of their desire that they no longer want the nobleman who went away to become a king over them. This parable is the same parable but told to a different audience, i.e. the disciples, by Jesus in the Parable of the Talents, where a Nobleman/a man, i.e. Satan, goes away for a period of time to gain a Kingdom which is not rightfully his to have.

Because of a lack of understanding, previous scholars have suggested that during the Millennium Age, for want of a better time period title, that God wants all of Israel to be back in the land of Canaan, but the reality is that God wants all of Israel to remain scattered among all of the nations of the earth, but planted in god soil so that they can grow to bring a great harvest of souls into the Kingdom during the Millennium Age. In the Old Testament in the book of Ezekiel we are told a number of times that God will bring Israel into Good Soil to teach them about the mountain of Israel, i.e. the rock that comes down out of heaven which is God's salvation plan for all of mankind and becomes a great mountain, so that they can then teach the people who live around them. This is why God has scattered Israel to the four corners of the earth, so that Israel can be a blessing to all of the nations of the earth. Sadly we have all become fixated on the "Promised Land" rather than on the promise make to Abraham That Abraham's descendants will inherit the whole earth where God is intending to make His abode among the righteous people of the earth.

It is all there to discover if we are prepared to scratch the surface and dig into God's word.

If we, who call Jesus "Lord, Lord," will humble ourselves and respond to His calling for our lives, then we too will become a Holy Priesthood in the service of the Lord during the Millennium Age and will also receive the same inheritance as Israel.

When Does this happen? Well Daniel_7:26-27 tells us that this will happen after Satan, the false prophet and the Beast have been judged and then punished at the end of the last Age before the Age of Eternity.

Shalom