1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Explaining Christ As Life

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by soul man, Feb 7, 2019.

  1. soul man

    soul man Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    674
    Likes Received:
    572
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    From the heart of Warren Litzman

    In Acts 28:28, when the gospel went to the Gentiles, by no stretch of the imagnation could the Gentiles receive the same gospel as had been given to Israel.
    The salvation of the Lord is radically different between the Jew and the Gentile.
    Once, Gentiles were saved by believing the Jewish gospel, and now the Jews are saved by accepting the Gentile gospel. I see no way these two can be combined or even an extension of each other.

    Regarding gifts of the Spirit, the key to understanding how God works today in the supernatural realm hinges on the revelation of Christ as the believer’s life. If Christ is the life of the believer (Gal. 2:20) then the believer has no life of his own and certainly no message, ministry or
    works of his own.
    I have been in the signs/gifts ministry for over fifty years.
    I have seen and heard a lot of things, mostly things that did not work, were man-centered and not of God.
    When a believer has a revelation of Christ as his life, his only life, there is no room for him to be anything other than a vessel containing Christ.
    If the believer no longer lives, and the life he now lives is the Christ-life, and if Christ is all in the believer’s life, all ministries and gift operations are of the Christ in him.

    This by no means is to say there will no longer be supernatural works. I see Christ the healer at work today in grace, just as much as when I was solely in the healing ministry.
    It means Christ is the doer, not the
    believer; and by this understanding that Christ is in every born-again believer there will be no special ministries, no big name prophets or apostles.

    Christ lives in all believers and the Holy Spirit can direct anyone at any time to help others, even super-naturally.
    The gifts of the Spirit take a radical change in Paul’s teaching when he had a revelation of Christ as his life. In 1 Corinthians 13, Paul introduces the fact that certain ministries would pass away when that which is perfect is come (1 Cor. 2:6; Phil. 3:15; Col. 1:28). These are “gifts of the Spirit of Christ,” for He alone is the gifted one, and the gifts are operated by the Holy Spirit, who lives in our soul, and uses us as the need appears.

    Remember, Paul spent about three years in the Pentecostal ministry before he had a revelation of Christ as his life. The revelation of Christ as the believer’s life was that which is perfect.
    Not that the believer is perfect, but
    the new life in the believer, Christ, is perfect.
    You will have to use an old King James Bible to see this. Salvation in grace is perfect because Christ in the believer is perfect as the believer’s life.
    The believer is not saved in his old life because the old life is crucified with Christ (Rom. 6:6); he is only saved by Christ in him (Rom. 5:10). The salvation of the soul is a life-long adventure and has to do with the believer’s love affair with the Christ in him.
     
  2. Dave L

    Dave L Guest

    Abel, Job, Abraham and all believers of the OT believed the same gospel as we do today. Only we no longer see through a glass darkly, but face to face with the full revelation in scripture.

    “And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.” (Galatians 3:8) (KJV 1900)
     
  3. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,816
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    While this should be true, I am afraid that many people with good intent blur the understanding for the masses still. Know what I mean Dave?
     
    bbyrd009 likes this.
  4. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6,317
    Likes Received:
    4,432
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    This is completely false. There is only ONE GOSPEL -- the Gospel of God or the Gospel of Christ.

    The same Gospel was to go progressively from Jerusalem to Judea, to Samaria, and then to the uttermost parts of the world. The Gospel is briefly that *JESUS SAVES*.
     
  5. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,590
    Likes Received:
    2,518
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    Could someone tell me why those in the sheep/goats judgment (Matthew 25) are judged according to their works, of whether they will be condemned to eternal punishment, or invited into God's kingdom?
     
  6. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,816
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    This is what I wrote on someone's blog this week concerning the parable of the separation of the sheep from the goats: -

    The basis for the Parable of the Sheep and the Goats can be found in Isaiah 58, but in the parable, there is a twist. It speaks of Sheep and of Goats who call Christ Lord.

    The sheep do what they do because that is what is required of them to become the salt of the earth.

    The goats do not see Christ's purposes in the needs around them and will only meet those needs if it is of direct benefit to them to receive their reward/inheritance.

    When the sheep do something to meet the needs of other people, they do so without cost or expectation of any repayments for the provisions that they have provided.

    On the other hand, the goats have an expectation of being paid back for the provisions they have provided, like if they change the flat tyre on a car for a woman, then they believe that the woman owes them for the service provided. A bit like their expectation that God owes them for them calling themselves "Christian" and calling Christ Lord.

    The identification of the people as either sheep or goats is only a reflection on the true heart condition of the people in this parable.

    As told in Isaiah 58, we are to keep the "Sabbath Day" holy and we do that by the God/god centred character found within our hearts.

    For the sheep that is God centred. For the Goats that is god centred.

    For a church that is Isaiah 58 centred in their mission outlook, it will grow because they will draw the people around them into a relationship with God.

    Shalom
     
    bbyrd009 likes this.
  7. Dave L

    Dave L Guest

    Salvation was always about Jesus, the cross, and regeneration. But the details unfolded over time. All of the faithful in Hebrews 11 were born again. Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.
     
  8. Episkopos

    Episkopos Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6,810
    Likes Received:
    6,960
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada

    That judgment is for they who are without Christ....who don't know Him and yet receive Him though His servants.
     
  9. Episkopos

    Episkopos Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6,810
    Likes Received:
    6,960
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    The key in all this is to find our lives in Christ by abiding in Him. Then our life is IN Christ and not just Christ being somewhere inside of us. People tend to be happy with a superficial relationship of Christ being an inner forgiver for a life that is NOT IN Christ.
     
  10. soul man

    soul man Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    674
    Likes Received:
    572
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    Care to show where "your life" in Christ is.
     
  11. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,590
    Likes Received:
    2,518
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    Hi Jay,

    Why do you suppose that Jesus prophesied a judgment by works to determine salvation?

    After all, Scripture shows our salvation to be by faith and not of works. Why portray this judgment as a judgment to salvation by works if it were actually by faith, since that would be contradictory? Unless it actually what it says, that is.

    I'm certain God is not trying to confuse us, right?

    Much love!
    Mark
     
    soul man likes this.
  12. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,590
    Likes Received:
    2,518
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    If this is a judgment for those who are without Christ, how is it that Christ will say to them:

    Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
    Matthew 25:34

    Inheriting the kingdom, isn't that for the redeemed, the saved? Here they "inherit the kingdom" because their works were approved. How can that be?

    Much love!
    Mark
     
    soul man likes this.
  13. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,590
    Likes Received:
    2,518
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    Romans 8
    1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
    2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
    3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
    4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
    5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
    6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
    7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
    8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
    9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

    10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.


    Being in the flesh is not something we do and don't do. We're not in the flesh if we are indwelt by the Holy Spirit, also called the Spirit of Christ. Being "in Christ" is determined by "the Spirit of God dwell in you".

    And having the Spirit dwelling in us, so that we are in fact "in Christ", this then means there is no condemnation for us. That's over.

    Please don't misunderstand me, I'm not trying to defend a superficial relationship with Christ. But I do believe very strongly that until we can divorce ourselves from the notion that we can improve our standing with God by having better behavior, we will consign ourselves to that superficial relationship.

    I believe that focus on our behavior will keep us focused on ourselves, but humility and the focus on God's forgiveness and redemption will throw us into God's most strong and loving arms.

    Much love!
    Mark
     
  14. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,816
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    Dave, I am of the opinion that you have missed the intent of this comment by more than a country mile.
     
  15. Dave L

    Dave L Guest

    Please explain how. If you are telling the truth about me, spell it out clearly.
     
  16. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,816
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    Simply because how we live our lives is a true reflection of our actual relationship with God. Does not the scriptures tell us that by our fruits we will be known?
     
    bbyrd009 likes this.
  17. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,816
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    I think that you are a smart man Dave and that you should be able to work it out for yourself.

    My prayer for you is that God will continue to draw you to himself. It is your response and your actions that will be the fruit of proof for you.
     
  18. Dave L

    Dave L Guest

    So you are admitting your accusation was false?
     
  19. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,816
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    The fruit of your response speaks volumes to me about the person of who you are in Christ.
     
  20. Dave L

    Dave L Guest

    If you are not lying about me, back up your opinion with facts.
     
Loading...