Free Will and Hell

[SelfInducedHeadache]

First of all in this threat I argue as if the bible was true, althought I have my problem with it.
I'm very confused by myself and the bible. The crux of my headache is;
If God wanted humans to have free will and adore God out of own volution, why should humans fear hell?

Now I know this sounds wack, but bear with me. From what I've read in the bible and heard from christians God wants Humans to love him without ulterior motive. They shouldn't praise him out of fear. But at the same time most of those christians also believed that hell is ultimate punishment for abandoning God- Lake of fire and man eating bugs all inclusive-. Obviously most of the people I've spoken to feared this punishment and argued it'll be better to believe in God just in case hell exists.
-But isn't this a contradiction? One wouldn't be a true christian if they praised God out of fear. And also if God wanted us to have a free choice, woulnd't it mean he isn't allowed to make hell more deadly than it's without divine interference. The same wayone won't says it's a free choice if somebody held a gun to your head, just replace the gun with infinite torment by divine verdict.
So a more reasonable interpretation of hell would be a place without God, were Humans are about equaly evil as currently on earth, given on earth there aren't enough christians to make a difference. So if God wanted us to be truly free, humans would actualy be able to live in hell.

Of course humans would first have to deal with all of the worst people who have existed and the devil, but even evil people are rational and capable to stricke a deal between eachother, allowing an existence about as good, as we currently have. Also all biblical imagery of hell would be caused by actions of humans or Satan.
I'm by no way recommending going to hell, just stating it wouldn't as bad as most people think.
​

Does any of this make sense???
If not, why and what part of my deduction is wrong? Bible quotes much apprecheated

 

[Windmillcharge]

Of course humans would first have to deal with all of the worst people who have existed and the devil, but even evil people are rational

We only deal with people as part of what is happening in our lives.
We are not responsible for the irrational acts of unbelievers.

You claim to be rational, sorry not true.
If a doctor tells you you will die unless one changes one lifestyle.
The rational person changes their lifestyle.

Equally the rational person knows there is a God and that they should live as God directs. Only the irrational ignore God's commands.

 

[Stumpmaster]

Hooray, an agnostic that wants Bible quotes!

Hi SelfInducedHeadache. I suggest Panadol for the headache. Do you have that in Switzerland?

First of all in this threat I argue as if the bible was true, althought I have my problem with it.
I'm very confused by myself and the bible. The crux of my headache is;
If God wanted humans to have free will and adore God out of own volution, why should humans fear hell?

First of all, humans do not have freewill about everything that relates to their existence. We have no choice over whether we are conceived and born or not, we have no choice over the physical features we are born with, and we have no choice over the realities of Creation and the design of the Universe we live in.
Rom 9:20-21
(20) But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?"
(21) Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?

Secondly, when it comes to God's Plan and Purpose for His Creation, humans in particular, He does indeed give us the option of reward for obedience or punishment for disobedience, but He does this out of love.
Heb 12:5-11
(5) And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks unto you as unto children, My son, despise not you the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when you are rebuked of him:
(6) For whom the Lord loves he chastens, and scourges every son whom he receives.
(7) If you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chastens not?
(8) But if you be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are you bastards, and not sons.
(9) Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
(10) For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.
(11) Now no chastening for the present seems to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised (trained) thereby.

Thirdly, God has provided the Way for us to saved from our sin. Christ is that Way. He is the only sinless human to live on Earth, everyone else is tainted by sin, but those who love God and put their faith in His Son Jesus Christ are saved from the penalty for sin, protected from the presence of sin, and victorious over the power of sin. This is because of Jesus Christ's willingness to take God's Judgment of sin upon Himself and appease God, which is what He did when He died as an innocent man upon the Cross.
Joh 3:16-21
(16) For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
(17) For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
(18) "He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
(19) And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
(20) For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.
(21) But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God."

I am happy to answer any more questions like this...Blessings in Christ.

 

[Giuliano]

First of all in this threat I argue as if the bible was true, althought I have my problem with it.
I'm very confused by myself and the bible. The crux of my headache is;
If God wanted humans to have free will and adore God out of own volution, why should humans fear hell?​

Let me quote Oscar Wilde: "There are only two tragedies in life: one is not getting what one wants, and the other is getting it." People who lead their lives in this world as if others don't matter can get away with a quite a lot since this world is fairly balanced between good and evil. Someone who treats his fellow humans as prey or objects can often look more successful than his victims. Such an evil person is glad the world is the way it is, he's glad he can do things and get away with it. In short, he's actively working to make this world more of a hell than it need be.

What happens to such a person when he dies? You say you're an agnostic. Maybe people simply stop existing? Maybe it's reasonable to think that unless you have observed things for yourself -- or met someone who has -- or can believe a holy book which says they don't cease to exist.

You have just met someone who does claim to have seen souls after their physical bodies died. Me. I don't expect you to take my word for that however. There are many deluded people in this world, I can see that and expect you can see it too. The best an agnostic can do is guess and keep an open mind, perhaps leaning to one opinion or another until he can find real evidence on his own. So I'll go forward to describe a few things I saw, and I think my experiences also line up with what the Bible says.

I never saw any kind of force being used to keep souls in hell by force. Hell has several levels and different places. Where someone goes depends mostly on the strongest motives he has. I saw a place where people were torturing each others. God was not keeping there. They were keeping themselves there.

Now I know this sounds wack, but bear with me. From what I've read in the bible and heard from christians God wants Humans to love him without ulterior motive. They shouldn't praise him out of fear. But at the same time most of those christians also believed that hell is ultimate punishment for abandoning God- Lake of fire and man eating bugs all inclusive-. Obviously most of the people I've spoken to feared this punishment and argued it'll be better to believe in God just in case hell exists.

It is problematical, to be sure. Such people remind me of Job a little. Remember how he worried so much about his children? He wasn't aware of them sinning but felt he needed to sacrifice for them, just in case. Result: They all died. Job may have been "righteous" but he also had an impure idea about God. That impure idea worried him, and I'd say it created a curse.

It is good for some people who aren't yet convinced that God is Love completely to take the route that just in case God wants to punish them, they ought to behave better. Still they have an impure idea that needs correcting. Job had his revelation finally; we can hope other people will also.

-But isn't this a contradiction? One wouldn't be a true christian if they praised God out of fear. And also if God wanted us to have a free choice, woulnd't it mean he isn't allowed to make hell more deadly than it's without divine interference. The same wayone won't says it's a free choice if somebody held a gun to your head, just replace the gun with infinite torment by divine verdict.
So a more reasonable interpretation of hell would be a place without God, were Humans are about equaly evil as currently on earth, given on earth there aren't enough christians to make a difference. So if God wanted us to be truly free, humans would actualy be able to live in hell.

The Bible sometimes says God did something when it's His laws. Say you jump off a cliff and kill yourself. I could say God killed you because He created gravity. The Bible is like that in places.

Here is what seems to happen. We are made so if we choose to do the loving things, we become more like God. If we choose to do hateful things, we become less like God -- and the danger is we can become stubborn and hardhearted. People can become like Pharaoh in Exodus. It was crazy for him to drive into the sea along with his army; but his heart was so hard, he seemed to crave death over admitting a mistake. You can observe it in real life now too where some people do such crazy things, you have to conclude they want to be stopped, they may be suicidal even.

What is happening there? Oh, they still have a conscience of sorts; and when someone knows he's such a horrible person, he doesn't want to be around decent people. He surely doesn't want to be around God. His conscience is telling him something is wrong, but he still refuses to change.

I don't think God personally created hell. I think He created the laws that brought it into being however. Some seem to think this verse says God created hell -- I don't see it says that.

Matthew 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

Prepared, yes -- but prepared by whom? Such people, lacking all compassion, did their best to make the world more hell-like. It seems to me they were creating it for themselves and may get it.

Ecclesiastes 10:8 He that diggeth a pit shall fall into it; and whoso breaketh an hedge, a serpent shall bite him.

Naturally too, the people who preach hellfire almost with glee may wind up there. There are some people who seem to enjoy the idea of people who disagree with their beliefs going to burn in hell forever. They are in danger of it themselves, if you ask me.

Of course humans would first have to deal with all of the worst people who have existed and the devil, but even evil people are rational and capable to stricke a deal between eachother, allowing an existence about as good, as we currently have. Also all biblical imagery of hell would be caused by actions of humans or Satan.
I'm by no way recommending going to hell, just stating it wouldn't as bad as most people think.

​

Does any of this make sense???
If not, why and what part of my deduction is wrong? Bible quotes much apprecheated

Some sections of hell aren't that bad, to be honest. I once saw a section where the people didn't know they were in hell. They had the same misconceptions they had while in human bodies. Most of them seemed to "visiting" while their physical bodies were asleep. I assumed that if their bodies died, they'd be back in the same area.

Dominion over the "creation" was given to man. Man continues to exercise that dominion, even when he doesn't know it. I would not blame either God or Satan. The problem is man. Yet I say God was right to give that dominion to man. Yes, we make mistakes; but they aren't permanent. If some men want to create a hell for themselves, let it be so. It's a way of taking them out of circulation for a while. All will end well. We will see that God didn't make a mistake in giving man dominion over the creation. There will come a day when hell has served its man-made purpose and it can be done away with by being tossed into the Lake of Fire.

Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Men and women will learn that the path of Love is the better path. We were all created in the image and likeness of God -- and someday we'll all admit it and be willing to live that way instead of pretending to be something else.

 

[Base12]

So a more reasonable interpretation of hell would be a place without God, were Humans are about equaly evil as currently on earth, given on earth there aren't enough christians to make a difference. So if God wanted us to be truly free, humans would actualy be able to live in hell.

You may be closer to the Truth than you realize.

The debate almost always comes down to the subject of Hell doesn't it?

How can a 'Loving God' torment people forever or annihilate them completely?

The answer is... He doesn't.

Click on the link below when you get tired of being given the 'runaround' on your quest for serious answers...

If Children come from Hell, how did they get there to begin with?

Good luck and welcome to the Forum!

 

[Renniks]

course humans would first have to deal with all of the worst people who have existed and the devil, but even evil people are rational and capable to stricke a deal between eachother, allowing an existence about as good, as we currently have. Also all biblical imagery of hell would be caused by actions of humans or Satan.
I'm by no way recommending going to hell, just stating it wouldn't as bad as most people think.

Here's what I think: a place with out God has to be terrible, because without him, nothing good can exist. No love, no real companionship or beauty. Anything you find good here, even imperfectly good, will not be there. That's why it's terrible, but people who want to be God themselves will still refuse to bow to him.

 

[Dcopymope]

First of all in this threat I argue as if the bible was true, althought I have my problem with it.
I'm very confused by myself and the bible. The crux of my headache is;
If God wanted humans to have free will and adore God out of own volution, why should humans fear hell?

Now I know this sounds wack, but bear with me. From what I've read in the bible and heard from christians God wants Humans to love him without ulterior motive. They shouldn't praise him out of fear. But at the same time most of those christians also believed that hell is ultimate punishment for abandoning God- Lake of fire and man eating bugs all inclusive-. Obviously most of the people I've spoken to feared this punishment and argued it'll be better to believe in God just in case hell exists.
-But isn't this a contradiction? One wouldn't be a true christian if they praised God out of fear. And also if God wanted us to have a free choice, woulnd't it mean he isn't allowed to make hell more deadly than it's without divine interference. The same wayone won't says it's a free choice if somebody held a gun to your head, just replace the gun with infinite torment by divine verdict.
So a more reasonable interpretation of hell would be a place without God, were Humans are about equaly evil as currently on earth, given on earth there aren't enough christians to make a difference. So if God wanted us to be truly free, humans would actualy be able to live in hell.

Of course humans would first have to deal with all of the worst people who have existed and the devil, but even evil people are rational and capable to stricke a deal between eachother, allowing an existence about as good, as we currently have. Also all biblical imagery of hell would be caused by actions of humans or Satan.
I'm by no way recommending going to hell, just stating it wouldn't as bad as most people think.
​

Does any of this make sense???
If not, why and what part of my deduction is wrong? Bible quotes much apprecheated

So you were basically told to believe in God, or else the lake of fire is your fate. I'll keep it simple, to show you why this doesn't make sense to you, just simple logic. If simply not believing in God dooms you to hell, he wouldn't bother with the pretense of a court appearance in the first place. There would be no prophesied "judgement day", since according to many Christians, the verdict has already been established that hell is your destination no matter what. What would happen to you as a human would be similar to what happens to Satan. For Satan, there is no "judgement day", or "Great White throne" judgement, his fate is already the lake of fire, as Jesus states, and as revelation plainly shows. The lake of fire was never meant for humans, it was for Satan and the rest of his angel pals.

(Matthew 25:40-41) "And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. {41} Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:"

No court day appearance to speak of for Satan:

(Revelation 20:7-10) "And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, {8} And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. {9} And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. {10} And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever."

But there will be for unbelievers:

(Revelation 20:11-15) "And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. {12} And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. {13} And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. {14} And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. {15} And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

Now, inevitably, some Christians will then cite scriptures such as the one below stating that those who don't believe in Jesus are "condemned" already. However, as you'll see, Jesus doesn't define the "condemnation" as fire and brimstone.

(John 3:18-21) "¶ He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. {19} And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. {20} For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. {21} But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God."

The word for "condemnation" being used here is "judgement", not fire and brimstone. In other words, since believers accepted the ransom paid for their souls, they will not see their day in court to be judged "according to their works", because the record of their iniquity has been expunged. The judgement itself is the "condemnation", not the lake of fire. At no point in scripture is it explicitly stated that the lake of fire is the fate of every non-believer.

 

[SelfInducedHeadache]

You may be closer to the Truth than you realize.

The debate almost always comes down to the subject of Hell doesn't it?

How can a 'Loving God' torment people forever or annihilate them completely?

The answer is... He doesn't.

Click on the link below when you get tired of being given the 'runaround' on your quest for serious answers...

If Children come from Hell, how did they get there to begin with?

Good luck and welcome to the Forum!

Thanks for this interesting welcome.
Like you've said, this really boils down to the subject of hell. I've already read into your thread and I must say, althought I've never ever thought of karma and christianity matching, it just works. It is even one of the more reasonable interpretations of the entire Hell-God-Love-Justice conumdrum I've read. Especially because it's optimistic and doesn't make God look like a unreasonable tyrant.
Weirdly most christians still straight-out proclaim reincarnation to be non-christian.

 

[SelfInducedHeadache]

Equally the rational person knows there is a God and that they should live as God directs. Only the irrational ignore God's commands.

Assuming the bible is true, as I've stated at the top, here I'll argue within bible; Wouldn't the rational clockwerklike people still be cast into hell, because they won't follow God out of devotion but out of tactic, a simple calculation so to speak? They're incapable of making such a choice by emotion, they've already deconstructed theyself into bioengeneered supercomputers. The only way they could follow God wholeheartedly is if the choice wouln't make a difference, making the whole thing meaningless.

 

[Justadude]

The concept of "hell" and eternal punishment makes no sense. If a person is that bad why not just end their existence after they're dead? What's the benefit of torturing them for eternity?

 

[Dcopymope]

The concept of "hell" and eternal punishment makes no sense. If a person is that bad why not just end their existence after they're dead? What's the benefit of torturing them for eternity?

Its called being held accountable for their actions, so they must stand before God to be judged.

 

[Justadude]

Its called being held accountable for their actions, so they must stand before God to be judged.

So put them on trial and if they're guilty, end their existence. Torturing them for eternity doesn't accomplish a single thing.

IMO, "hell" is just a primitive thinking holdover that humanity will eventually move on from.

 

[Dcopymope]

So put them on trial and if they're guilty, end their existence. Torturing them for eternity doesn't accomplish a single thing.

IMO, "hell" is just a primitive thinking holdover that humanity will eventually move on from.

The torturing part is up for debate among Christians. Some believe they cease to exist, others believe its a place of eternal torment. Considering that the lake of fire is called the second death, I lean more towards believing the former. Mind you, this is not to say that Satan doesn't deserve to be tormented for being such an asshole. They don't "move on", it kills the body and spirit. The only ones moving on are those whose names are found in the book of life, into the new earth to come.

 

[Justadude]

The torturing part is up for debate among Christians. Some believe they cease to exist, others believe its a place of eternal torment. Considering that the lake of fire is called the second death, I lean more towards believing the former. Mind you, this is not to say that Satan doesn't deserve to be tormented for being such an asshole. They don't "move on", it kills the body and spirit. The only ones moving on are those whose names are found in the book of life, into the new earth to come.

You'd think something so seemingly important wouldn't be so uncertain, especially if it all comes from a god (as is claimed).

 

[Dcopymope]

You'd think something so seemingly important wouldn't be so uncertain, especially if it all comes from a god (as is claimed).

It used to be uncertain to me, but not anymore upon further research.

 

[Hidden In Him]

-But isn't this a contradiction? One wouldn't be a true christian if they praised God out of fear.

Correct. Scripture teaches that the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, as it (potentially) keeps one from abandoning oneself to a sinful life. But the greatest wisdom is to Love God (1 John 4:18), i.e. so completely that there is no more fear of Him.

Hope that helps, and welcome to the Forum.
Hidden

 

[Enoch111]

If God wanted humans to have free will and adore God out of own volition, why should humans fear hell?

1. First of all Hell -- Gehenna -- the Lake of Fire was created for the devil and his angels.

2. God does not want any human being in Hell. And that is why the Lord Jesus Christ -- God manifest in the flesh -- came to earth to die for our sins and to rise again for our justification.

3. The Church (believers) has been commanded to preach this Gospel to each and every human being, so that (1) they turn from their sins and idols and (2) believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, receiving Him as Lord and Savior.

4. The only reason anyone will go to Hell is because he or she refuses to obey the Gospel. God presently commands all men everywhere to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[Truth OT]

I'm by no way recommending going to hell, just stating it wouldn't as bad as most people think.
​

Does any of this make sense???
If not, why and what part of my deduction is wrong? Bible quotes much appreciated

I'm once tried to rationalize hell myself. As it turned out, my studying of the bible led ME to believe that hell as an eternal place of torment was not fully backed by scripture.
The Rich Man & Lazarus

 

[SelfInducedHeadache]

What happens to such a person when he dies? You say you're an agnostic. Maybe people simply stop existing? Maybe it's reasonable to think that unless you have observed things for yourself -- or met someone who has -- or can believe a holy book which says they don't cease to exist.

Indeed nobody knows and nobody should preach they are absolute, so everybody can communicate their experiences and everything can be treated with the same sincerity and openness.

I never saw any kind of force being used to keep souls in hell by force. Hell has several levels and different places. Where someone goes depends mostly on the strongest motives he has. I saw a place where people were torturing each others. God was not keeping there. They were keeping themselves there.

I find the concept of hell being caused by humans interesting and very possible inside the bible. So hell is a Danteland, because some sick people want it to be like this. One question thought; have people inside hell tried to stop the worse people? It truly interests me.

Here is what seems to happen. We are made so if we choose to do the loving things, we become more like God. If we choose to do hateful things, we become less like God -- and the danger is we can become stubborn and hardhearted. People can become like Pharaoh in Exodus. It was crazy for him to drive into the sea along with his army; but his heart was so hard, he seemed to crave death over admitting a mistake. You can observe it in real life now too where some people do such crazy things, you have to conclude they want to be stopped, they may be suicidal even..

Irrefutably, selfhate, selfloathing and stubbornness are a deadly poison. On the other hand do you think God is the only path or were some people capable to reach the top e.g: buddas and the lamas?

Dominion over the "creation" was given to man. Man continues to exercise that dominion, even when he doesn't know it. I would not blame either God or Satan. The problem is man. Yet I say God was right to give that dominion to man. Yes, we make mistakes; but they aren't permanent. If some men want to create a hell for themselves, let it be so. It's a way of taking them out of circulation for a while. All will end well. We will see that God didn't make a mistake in giving man dominion over the creation. There will come a day when hell has served its man-made purpose and it can be done away with by being tossed into the Lake of Fire.

Inspiring, truly inspiring, I'll probably steal this and write a story. No, this is another great and valuable perspective.

+The cat is definitely a total +100%

 

[Jane_Doe22]

If God wanted humans to have free will and adore God out of own volution, why should humans fear hell?
​

First of all in this threat I argue as if the bible was true, althought I have my problem with it.
I'm very confused by myself and the bible. The crux of my headache is;
If God wanted humans to have free will and adore God out of own volution, why should humans fear hell?

Now I know this sounds wack, but bear with me. From what I've read in the bible and heard from christians God wants Humans to love him without ulterior motive. They shouldn't praise him out of fear. But at the same time most of those christians also believed that hell is ultimate punishment for abandoning God- Lake of fire and man eating bugs all inclusive-. Obviously most of the people I've spoken to feared this punishment and argued it'll be better to believe in God just in case hell exists.
-But isn't this a contradiction? One wouldn't be a true christian if they praised God out of fear. And also if God wanted us to have a free choice, woulnd't it mean he isn't allowed to make hell more deadly than it's without divine interference. The same wayone won't says it's a free choice if somebody held a gun to your head, just replace the gun with infinite torment by divine verdict.
So a more reasonable interpretation of hell would be a place without God, were Humans are about equaly evil as currently on earth, given on earth there aren't enough christians to make a difference. So if God wanted us to be truly free, humans would actualy be able to live in hell.

Of course humans would first have to deal with all of the worst people who have existed and the devil, but even evil people are rational and capable to stricke a deal between eachother, allowing an existence about as good, as we currently have. Also all biblical imagery of hell would be caused by actions of humans or Satan.
I'm by no way recommending going to hell, just stating it wouldn't as bad as most people think.
​

Does any of this make sense???
If not, why and what part of my deduction is wrong? Bible quotes much apprecheated

I meant to reply to this before, but got time crunched. I also haven't read the replies to the OP (sorry, time crunch).

My view / my denomination's view on the after life / this subject is different than other Christians. It's not you die, then God send you to heaven or an eternal barbecue.

Rather: the temporary resting place for those whom reject God / His ways is a place of suffering not because God's tormenting you, but because you are aware of your failing / pain you've caused in this life. It's the pain & metaphorical darkness you've invited into your own life.

After a time, the Savior washes away even that, and a wicked person is given a afterlife more mind-boggling-joyful than they could ever imagine and the fullest cup they internally could hold. However: that mind-boggling-joyful cup is extremely tiny compared to the the level of joy experienced by somebody whom has embraced God / His ways. Him / His ways are the ultimate us happiness. That's why He so desperately wants each of us to embrace them.