• Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Gottservant

Well-Known Member
Oct 19, 2022
1,815
519
113
45
Greensborough
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Hi there,

So I realised there is a glaring inequality, between government and people of faith: the standard for government is that difference matters, the standard for people of faith, is that difference doesn't matter! Let me explain what I mean. Say you have a transgender person, and you don't want your customers to think the transgender lifestyle is irreverent in a good way. You think, my customers need their gender respected and a transgender person either can't or will find it more difficult to acknowledge (the gender). That's not a condemnation of being transgender, as much as it is about being gender respectful. You don't hire someone short to a basketball team; calling yourself ten feet tall doesn't make you taller.

But this is the kicker, right? Government doesn't have its privileges stripped. Imagine telling Government, you have to hire statesman that have been both liberal and conservative? You would never get the bill passed! The whole point is that you are surrounding yourself with people, who are of a like mindset. A mindset that is divided between liberal and conservative obligations will never do as great a job, as someone who is all liberal or all conservative. See how hypocritical that is?

Now, how is it, that you can force a wedding cake maker to put homosexual figurines on the top, but you can't force a senator pledge allegiance to two parties? This is the Devil's work! The Devil doesn't respect gender at all, he doesn't care. He will break up couples, he will dishearten children, he will abuse innocence. God is against this. God doesn't have to swear allegiance to Himself and the Devil. That is our greatest hope. We need to be recognised culturally, as having a derivative expectation of identification, as is exemplified in congress. This is what is destroying our nations! Government is passing laws that it doesn't see are blind, to its own inner workings. "It is for the nation" they think "who cares why?". When God is why!

Now, I am not saying revolt or disdain - I am saying this is something we need to pray about. We don't want things to get worse, because we put our neck out on the foundation of equality without thinking what it may mean. There are transgender people that may think "I don't want people of faith, to be in my organisation, they will make the company look authoritarian" that's fine. Jesus said "go from town to town, if you have to" rejection is not the end. We can stand on Jesus' Word, in this respect. The example we set, is more important, than the fleeting work we are a part of, when the circumstances are right. Even then, prayer is necessary, the example Governments sets, is what we want. We want government to say "God rules us, we rule the people, but the people are free to associate with who ever wants to join them, in the spirit of friendship".

The point is that we can educate people from a position of strength. We don't need to be forced to tolerate people whose views are concretely different to ours. We can allow them to express themselves, in ways that company policy shapes - because we have legislation in place, to justify the approach we want people such as those who are transgender to take. We might want the figurines on the wedding cake, to be kept apart - as a way of symbolizing that it is a spiritual union, rather than a physical union, between same-sex couples. That would be ok, under legislation that keeps the same importance political parties have under a distinguished example, for examples set in the business arena of the culture or the faith arenas of the culture. It's just not right that senators have freedom of selection and the rest of the country does not?

I don't know if you want to think about this, its a very simple argument. As I've already said, you may just want to pray about it, and see if there is a way to leverage understanding, from the perspective of governance.

God bless. I hope you understand that I have not set out to condemn people, but care that the standards they want to live by, not be ignored.
 

Windmillcharge

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2017
2,934
1,823
113
68
London
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom
The point is that we can educate people from a position of strength. We don't need to be forced to tolerate people whose views are concretely different to ours. We can allow them to express themselves, in ways that company policy shapes - because we have legislation in place, to justify the approach we want people such as those who are transgender to take.

The position of strength is that governments are legislating that lgtb views are to be supported by all.
It is a very intolerant secular society.

The ones being educated are those who do not supprt whole heartedly the lgtb position.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gottservant

TinMan

Well-Known Member
Mar 26, 2023
2,407
331
83
27
Michigan Saginaw
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Hi there,

So I realised there is a glaring inequality, between government and people of faith: the standard for government is that difference matters, the standard for people of faith, is that difference doesn't matter! Let me explain what I mean. Say you have a transgender person, and you don't want your customers to think the transgender lifestyle is irreverent in a good way. You think, my customers need their gender respected and a transgender person either can't or will find it more difficult to acknowledge (the gender).
Why not think that both customers and employee should be respected period.?

s That's not a condemnation of being transgender, as much as it is about being gender respectful. You don't hire someone short to a basketball team; calling yourself ten feet tall doesn't make you taller.
Muggsy Bogues played in the NBA for 14 seasons for the Washington Bullets, Charlotte Hornets, Golden State Warriors, and the Toronto Raptors. He was 5'3"

But this is the kicker, right? Government doesn't have its privileges stripped. Imagine telling Government, you have to hire statesman that have been both liberal and conservative? You would never get the bill passed! The whole point is that you are surrounding yourself with people, who are of a like mindset. A mindset that is divided between liberal and conservative obligations will never do as great a job, as someone who is all liberal or all conservative. See how hypocritical that is?
Government works best when it is split and to get anything done the various sides have to come together and find common ground.

Now, how is it, that you can force a wedding cake maker to put homosexual figurines on the top, but you can't force a senator pledge allegiance to two parties? This is the Devil's work! The Devil doesn't respect gender at all, he doesn't care. He will break up couples, he will dishearten children, he will abuse innocence. God is against this. God doesn't have to swear allegiance to Himself and the Devil. That is our greatest hope. We need to be recognised culturally, as having a derivative expectation of identification, as is exemplified in congress. This is what is destroying our nations! Government is passing laws that it doesn't see are blind, to its own inner workings. "It is for the nation" they think "who cares why?". When God is why!

Now, I am not saying revolt or disdain - I am saying this is something we need to pray about. We don't want things to get worse, because we put our neck out on the foundation of equality without thinking what it may mean.
Actually the issue is that public business can't refuse to do business with minorities.
 

TinMan

Well-Known Member
Mar 26, 2023
2,407
331
83
27
Michigan Saginaw
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The position of strength is that governments are legislating that lgtb views are to be supported by all.
It is a very intolerant secular society.

The ones being educated are those who do not supprt whole heartedly the lgtb position.
can you give some specific examples of such legislation?
 

ButterflyJones

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2023
1,575
1,229
113
USA
youtube.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Here's the thing.
Before both federal and states laws conceded by law to the lbgtqxyz agenda points, the lgbtqxyz's were calling for tolerance.

Now that the law has made tolerance of their community a law, the lgbtqxyz's want, and achieve, their right to punish anyone who is intolerant of their lifestyles and behaviors.
 
  • Like
Reactions: dev553344

Gottservant

Well-Known Member
Oct 19, 2022
1,815
519
113
45
Greensborough
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Why not think that both customers and employee should be respected period.?
That requires negotiation of beliefs, which in turn requires wisdom.
Muggsy Bogues played in the NBA for 14 seasons for the Washington Bullets, Charlotte Hornets, Golden State Warriors, and the Toronto Raptors. He was 5'3"
Ok sure, but he wasn't the first pick.
Government works best when it is split and to get anything done the various sides have to come together and find common ground.
Many more things than Government, work when it has to be debated.
Actually the issue is that public business can't refuse to do business with minorities.
Perfection requires a standard, that the Devil can't interfere with (selah)
 

Gottservant

Well-Known Member
Oct 19, 2022
1,815
519
113
45
Greensborough
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Here's the thing.
Before both federal and states laws conceded by law to the lbgtqxyz agenda points, the lgbtqxyz's were calling for tolerance.

Now that the law has made tolerance of their community a law, the lgbtqxyz's want, and achieve, their right to punish anyone who is intolerant of their lifestyles and behaviors.
Which is precisely the right that members of government enjoy tolerance for - they are not expected to welcome allegiance that is bi-party.

Well, if government doesn't have to listen to the opposition, why do we?
 

Wrangler

Well-Known Member
Feb 14, 2021
12,992
4,798
113
55
Shining City on a Hill
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
So I realised there is a glaring inequality, between government and people of faith: the standard for government is that difference matters, the standard for people of faith, is that difference doesn't matter!
Your premise is wrong. It is wrong because you have embraced what I call The Perversion of Equality.

At the genus level, difference does not matter. However, at the next level of analysis, difference matters. It always mattered and differences will always matter. Today's notion of equality is scam, a rip off of the American Spirit where we have equal rights after being created equally. Equality supposes that equal starting point continues at all points in life. And of course it does not.

Among people of faith, is God's Chosen People.
  • Jew and Gentile
  • Saved & Damned
  • Accept or Reject Jesus
  • Man or Woman
  • Spirit or Carnal
In government, if being a man or woman did not matter, surgery would not be needed. In the faith, if being a man or woman did not matter, there would not be these 2 verses. v 21, difference does not matter; submit to one another out of respect for the Anointed. However, v22 differences matter; it applies only to the wife and not to the husband; and the reason to submit is due to authority of her husband and his lordship as done to THE Lord.


21 And the Spirit makes it possible to submit humbly to one another out of respect for the Anointed. 22 Wives, it should be no different with your husbands. Submit to them as you do to the Lord.
Eph 5:21-22 (VOICE)
 

Windmillcharge

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2017
2,934
1,823
113
68
London
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom
  • Like
Reactions: Wrangler

TinMan

Well-Known Member
Mar 26, 2023
2,407
331
83
27
Michigan Saginaw
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Here's the thing.
Before both federal and states laws conceded by law to the lbgtqxyz agenda points, the lgbtqxyz's were calling for tolerance.

Now that the law has made tolerance of their community a law, the lgbtqxyz's want, and achieve, their right to punish anyone who is intolerant of their lifestyles and behaviors.
evidence?
 

TinMan

Well-Known Member
Mar 26, 2023
2,407
331
83
27
Michigan Saginaw
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
That requires negotiation of beliefs, which in turn requires wisdom.
Is it really that hard to put Matthew 7:12 into practice?

Ok sure, but he wasn't the first pick.
I believe he was first round draft pick in 87.

The point is smart employer hire talented people no mater what shape or size or color they happen to be.

Many more things than Government, work when it has to be debated.

Perfection requires a standard, that the Devil can't interfere with (selah)
and this has what to do with non-discrimination?
 

Windmillcharge

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2017
2,934
1,823
113
68
London
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom

TinMan

Well-Known Member
Mar 26, 2023
2,407
331
83
27
Michigan Saginaw
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Your premise is wrong. It is wrong because you have embraced what I call The Perversion of Equality.

At the genus level, difference does not matter. However, at the next level of analysis, difference matters. It always mattered and differences will always matter. Today's notion of equality is scam, a rip off of the American Spirit where we have equal rights after being created equally. Equality supposes that equal starting point continues at all points in life.
No, equality is about equal opportunity
 

TinMan

Well-Known Member
Mar 26, 2023
2,407
331
83
27
Michigan Saginaw
Faith
Christian
Country
United States

Wrangler

Well-Known Member
Feb 14, 2021
12,992
4,798
113
55
Shining City on a Hill
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
No, equality is about equal opportunity
Again, this is incorrect. There is no equality of opportunity in reality. We have different parents, siblings, extended family, friends, neighbors, teachers, genetics, aspirations, talents, etc.

We have equal rights. "Equality" is a market tested term to foist Cultural Marxism onto unsuspecting, freedom loving Americans.
 

TinMan

Well-Known Member
Mar 26, 2023
2,407
331
83
27
Michigan Saginaw
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Again, this is incorrect. There is no equality of opportunity in reality. We have different parents, siblings, extended family, friends, neighbors, teachers, genetics, aspirations, talents, etc.
None of which has anything to do with opportunity

We have equal rights. "Equality" is a market tested term to foist Cultural Marxism onto unsuspecting, freedom loving Americans.
Is that why it was included in the constitution?