I have no wrath

[Not me]

Isaiah 27:4 (NASB)
"I have no wrath. Should someone give Me briars and thorns in battle, Then I would step on them, I would burn them completely.

Let us paraphrase this;

Though someone sins, I will punish and will burn and destroy them completely, yet I have no wrath.

God says; “He has no wrath.” ??

How can such a thing be? For scripture speaks greatly of the “wrath of God”

Than this begs the question what is the “wrath of God?”

That which is called in scripture the “wrath of God” is that thing that is experienced when something that is not perfect touches perfection.

When that man in the OT reached out to steady the Ark he instantly died for the wrath of God consumed him. Why?

Because it was the natural result of something that was not perfect (sinful) coming in contact with perfection. For God’s presence was really and truly in the Ark and no evil or sinful or any thing that has any disorder in it of any kind can touch or stand before the Presence of the God of Perfection.

For the wrath of God can only be experienced by that which is not perfect, by that which is under the curse. By that which has fallen from it’s first state of perfection. For all things came forth from God in a perfect state. It is the fall that manifested that thing that was contrary to God. Which bringing forth manifested the experience of wrath to that creature that has lost it’s first state of perfection.

For God is love and in Him dwells no darkness or any evil thing. Wrath being what it is by nature is precluded from being in the Divine Nature itself. It is something that can only be manifested to that thing that would come against perfect love, (which is what God is.) For perfect love is alone that thing that is perfect and perfect love demands that it share itself with all so that it’s perfection of existence might be experienced by all. This is why God calls Himself a consuming fire. For His Divine Nature is a consuming desire to share His perfect love with all.

This is why He warned against any and all creatures touching the Holy Mountain as His presence descended, not that He was angry but to protect all from His presence for He knew that no fallen creature could come into His Presence of perfect love and live, unless they had the same nature as His which is the Divine Nature.

The Divine Nature come to birth in us (which is what salvation is) is perfection of love come to birth in us. Which Divine Nature can never experience the “wrath of God” for it is perfect as our Heavenly Father is perfect. Free from all things of darkness free from all things that would cause anything but love to be manifested for all eternity.

For the God of love says;

“I have no wrath”

Blessings to all, for in our God there is no wrath, but only love, with which He wishes to share with all His creatures. To all that are willing to receive Him, He gave power to become His son’s and daughter’s, so that they too might become as He is, and walk in perfect love.

Much love in Christ, Not me

 

[bbyrd009]

the prob there imo is that you have made God's sharing contingent upon our profession, and not upon becoming like a little child, and actually following the clear instructions

also, not sure about that paraphrase, likely the thorns and briars being stepped on there and not the ppl

 

[Not me]

the prob there imo is that you have made God's sharing contingent upon our profession, and not upon becoming like a little child, and actually following the clear instructions

also, not sure about that paraphrase, likely the thorns and briars being stepped on there and not the ppl

Thanks for your thoughts.

Blessings as we search into this great and awesome God who, in Him is no wrath.

Much love in Christ, Not me

 

[amadeus]

the prob there imo is that you have made God's sharing contingent upon our profession, and not upon becoming like a little child, and actually following the clear instructions

also, not sure about that paraphrase, likely the thorns and briars being stepped on there and not the ppl

Indeed:

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect" Matt 5:48

"But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein." Luke 18:16-17

As for the thorns and briars if we have any they will be burned up. The problem is that if we have nothing else that can make it through the fire, we will have nothing at all. The foundation, if it is the right one will survive the fire, but that foundation must be Jesus himself, the Rock. Not coming to him like a little child will find us on a foundation of sand:

"And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it." Matt 7:26-27

Anything we have built on the rock may burn up and we'll be saved, but if we build on the sand we are dead in the water no matter the quality of our building materials and the skill of our hands:

"According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ." I Cor 3:10-11

 

[Miss Hepburn]

I guess Lucifer will never be touching perfection...that would be a quick sizzle.

 

[Episkopos]

Isaiah 27:4 (NASB)
"I have no wrath. Should someone give Me briars and thorns in battle, Then I would step on them, I would burn them completely.

Let us paraphrase this;

Though someone sins, I will punish and will burn and destroy them completely, yet I have no wrath.

God says; “He has no wrath.” ??

How can such a thing be? For scripture speaks greatly of the “wrath of God”

Than this begs the question what is the “wrath of God?”

That which is called in scripture the “wrath of God” is that thing that is experienced when something that is not perfect touches perfection.

When that man in the OT reached out to steady the Ark he instantly died for the wrath of God consumed him. Why?

Because it was the natural result of something that was not perfect (sinful) coming in contact with perfection. For God’s presence was really and truly in the Ark and no evil or sinful or any thing that has any disorder in it of any kind can touch or stand before the Presence of the God of Perfection.

For the wrath of God can only be experienced by that which is not perfect, by that which is under the curse. By that which has fallen from it’s first state of perfection. For all things came forth from God in a perfect state. It is the fall that manifested that thing that was contrary to God. Which bringing forth manifested the experience of wrath to that creature that has lost it’s first state of perfection.

For God is love and in Him dwells no darkness or any evil thing. Wrath being what it is by nature is precluded from being in the Divine Nature itself. It is something that can only be manifested to that thing that would come against perfect love, (which is what God is.) For perfect love is alone that thing that is perfect and perfect love demands that it share itself with all so that it’s perfection of existence might be experienced by all. This is why God calls Himself a consuming fire. For His Divine Nature is a consuming desire to share His perfect love with all.

This is why He warned against any and all creatures touching the Holy Mountain as His presence descended, not that He was angry but to protect all from His presence for He knew that no fallen creature could come into His Presence of perfect love and live, unless they had the same nature as His which is the Divine Nature.

The Divine Nature come to birth in us (which is what salvation is) is perfection of love come to birth in us. Which Divine Nature can never experience the “wrath of God” for it is perfect as our Heavenly Father is perfect. Free from all things of darkness free from all things that would cause anything but love to be manifested for all eternity.

For the God of love says;

“I have no wrath”

Blessings to all, for in our God there is no wrath, but only love, with which He wishes to share with all His creatures. To all that are willing to receive Him, He gave power to become His son’s and daughter’s, so that they too might become as He is, and walk in perfect love.

Much love in Christ, Not me

Nice try..I suppose. You think you found a key "positive" sounding verse that eliminates all other verses in the bible that make you uncomfortable?

But you are missing the point...again. Wrath is not in God...God puts on His wrath like a garment the way a man of war puts on his sword. After the enemy is scattered the sword comes off again. Likewise when the judgment that requires God's wrath is over He removes His garment of vengeance.

You may have heard this verse before finding your key verse..."vengeance is mine says the Lord."

Is. 59: 17 For he put on righteousness as a breastplate, and an helmet of salvation upon his head; and he put on the garments of vengeance for clothing, and was clad with zeal as a cloak.
18 According to their deeds, accordingly he will repay, fury to his adversaries, recompence to his enemies; to the islands he will repay recompence.
19 So shall they fear the name of the Lord from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the Lord shall lift up a standard against him.

In all of this you still will not learn that the truth has a polarity...both good and bad "sounding" extremities. Choosing one or the other is of the carnal mind that seeks survival for itself in a loophole. You are quick to grasp at error and resist truth like it was a plague.

I was wondering if you were a lawyer by trade. I see that same willingness to look for loopholes as if by the law you could escape the truth.

BTW..the Hebrew word for "fury" in v18 is the same word that you cited for God having no wrath IN Him.

Chemah...

 

[Not me]

[

Nice try..I suppose. You think you found a key "positive" sounding verse that eliminates all other verses in the bible that make you uncomfortable?

But you are missing the point...again. Wrath is not in God...God puts on His wrath like a garment the way a man of war puts on his sword. After the enemy is scattered the sword comes off again. Likewise when the judgment that requires God's wrath is over He removes His garment of vengeance.

You may have heard this verse before finding your key verse..."vengeance is mine says the Lord."

Is. 59: 17 For he put on righteousness as a breastplate, and an helmet of salvation upon his head; and he put on the garments of vengeance for clothing, and was clad with zeal as a cloak.
18 According to their deeds, accordingly he will repay, fury to his adversaries, recompence to his enemies; to the islands he will repay recompence.
19 So shall they fear the name of the Lord from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the Lord shall lift up a standard against him.

In all of this you still will not learn that the truth has a polarity...both good and bad "sounding" extremities. Choosing one of the other is of the carnal mind that seeks survival for itself in a loophole. You are quick to grasp at error and resist truth like it was a plague.

I was wondering if you were a lawyer by trade. I see that same willingness to look for loopholes as if by the law you could escape the truth.

There is no argument, God uses wrath. As stated in the OP there is a “wrath of God.”

But the question is; what is the wrath of God?

The wrath of God is, as I stated the natural result of what happens when something that is not perfect touches perfection. This is the wrath of God, the natural result of something touching it’s contrary. Which is in fact what hell is, but that is another subject for another day.

To your statement that “

“truth has “polarity” both good and bad sounding extremes”

This is just nonsense.

For truth is truth. It is neither good or bad. It just is. The truth may be that John killed Sue, that may be a bad truth, but it is still, just truth.

As a seeker of truth I would think you would know this first step towards truth.

Blessings,

Much love in Christ, Not me

 

[Not me]

I guess Lucifer will never be touching perfection...that would be a quick sizzle.

Your pretty much on point;

If you would allow me, that is why satan will sizzle. Because after all is said and done, only God and His goodness will fill the all and all.

So those creature that have chosen evil, goodness is their highest contrary, so they can only experience God’s goodness, which fills the all and all, as their highest contrary, and the expression of something touching it highest contrary is fire.

So satan will sizzle and all those with him. For there is no other way they can experience the goodness of God but as their highest contrary.

Anyways, food for thought.

Blessings,

Much love in Christ, Not me

 

[Miss Hepburn]

So satan will sizzle and all those with him. For there is no other
way they can experience the goodness of God but as their highest contrary.

I just thought of something, Not me! Why isn't satan sizzling now? Whassup with that? Anybody?

 

[amadeus]

I just thought of something, Not me! Why isn't satan sizzling now? Whassup with that?

Why only satan if anyone is going to sizzle now? Lots of people living in their death or their sin. But... there is still time.

 

[Not me]

I just thought of something, Not me! Why isn't satan sizzling now? Whassup with that?

That I cannot really say, but maybe the fact God has not yet separated the good from the evil, there is still a mixture. Now this is just thought on why, so I’m not dogmatic about it. It’s just a thought.

Gotta go blessings,

Much love in Christ, Not me

 

[Episkopos]

[


There is no argument, God uses wrath. As stated in the OP there is a “wrath of God.”

But the question is; what is the wrath of God?

The wrath of God is, as I stated the natural result of what happens when something that is not perfect touches perfection. This is the wrath of God, the natural result of something touching it’s contrary. Which is in fact what hell is, but that is another subject for another day.

To your statement that “

“truth has “polarity” both good and bad sounding extremes”

This is just nonsense.

For truth is truth. It is neither good or bad. It just is. The truth may be that John killed Sue, that may be a bad truth, but it is still, just truth.

As a seeker of truth I would think you would know this first step towards truth.

Blessings,

Much love in Christ, Not me

What is actual nonsense is what you are trying to "teach". You take a verse out of context and then write in all your ideas into it...that have no bearing on anything except what is religiously comforting to you. When corrected you just obfuscate and continue down the same road.

 

[Helen]

Ps 103:9 "He will not always chide: neither will He keep His anger for ever."

Micah 7 “Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? He retaineth not His anger for ever, because He delighteth in mercy.”

God's anger was poured out upon Jesus on the cross. -" He saw the travail of His soul, and was satisfied"

John 12:28 "Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.
29 The people therefore, that stood by, and heard it, said that it thundered: others said, An angel spake to him.
30 Jesus answered and said, This voice came not because of Me, but for your sakes.
31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto Me.
33 This He said, signifying what death he should die. "

Jesus took the judgement on Himself...that is why God sent Him. That was always the Plan since before the creation of the world ...the Lamb was slain.

And God was "well pleased".

God wins, He always does....and always intended to.

 

[bbyrd009]

Indeed:

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect" Matt 5:48

"But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein." Luke 18:16-17

As for the thorns and briars if we have any they will be burned up. The problem is that if we have nothing else that can make it through the fire, we will have nothing at all. The foundation, if it is the right one will survive the fire, but that foundation must be Jesus himself, the Rock. Not coming to him like a little child will find us on a foundation of sand:

"And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it." Matt 7:26-27

Anything we have built on the rock may burn up and we'll be saved, but if we build on the sand we are dead in the water no matter the quality of our building materials and the skill of our hands:

"According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ." I Cor 3:10-11

nice, imo. I do believe one will refer more to Christ than Josh once "Meet John Doe" is understood...ha and imo how apropos "Josh" turns out to be too lol

 

[bbyrd009]

I guess Lucifer will never be touching perfection...that would be a quick sizzle.

ag, i guess "he" already had it all, but preferred the tree of knowledge? "It's like this and like that?"

 

[Helen]

[


There is no argument, God uses wrath. As stated in the OP there is a “wrath of God.”

But the question is; what is the wrath of God?

The wrath of God is, as I stated the natural result of what happens when something that is not perfect touches perfection. This is the wrath of God, the natural result of something touching it’s contrary. Which is in fact what hell is, but that is another subject for another day.

To your statement that “

“truth has “polarity” both good and bad sounding extremes”

This is just nonsense.

For truth is truth. It is neither good or bad. It just is. The truth may be that John killed Sue, that may be a bad truth, but it is still, just truth.

As a seeker of truth I would think you would know this first step towards truth.

Blessings,

Much love in Christ, Not me

Jesus took the sting of God's anger and wrath.

Correction , as with a stupid naughty child is never ( or should never be) be in wrath or anger... the chastising Hand is in, and by Love.

 

[bbyrd009]

somthen Josh did not take the sting of God's etcetc?
that what youre saying?

You think you found a key "positive" sounding verse that eliminates all other verses in the bible that make you uncomfortable?

^
i think you think what he thinks is purty close there Epi, yeh

God puts on His wrath like a garment the way a man of war puts on his sword. After the enemy is scattered the sword comes off again.

We heard you in the garden, and knew we were naked, so we hid.
Who told you that you were naked?

What is actual nonsense is what you are trying to "teach". You take a verse out of context and then write in all your ideas into it...that have no bearing on anything except what is religiously comforting to you. When corrected you just obfuscate and continue down the same road.

well, i think he does have a point too, Epi, and prolly it is not wise to assume that any one pov is the whole truth? I do think there is some denial about works though, yeh.

Believers dont seem to be willing to accept that there s no judgement for beliefs, and there is only a judgement for works...as the Quoted Isaiah even makes clear?

 

[Enoch111]

Isaiah 27:4 (NASB)
"I have no wrath. Should someone give Me briars and thorns in battle, Then I would step on them, I would burn them completely.

This has been INCORRECTLY translated. Here is the correct translation:
Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together. (KJV)

There is a question in that verse, not a statement. "Fury" is more appropriate here than "wrath", and "together" is more accurate and appropriate than "completely".

The context is the destruction of Satan (presented as Leviathan, the crooked Serpent) and the redemption and restoration of Israel. So in this context God's wrath was directed against Satan but taken away from Israel, which will be regathered from all corners of the earth after the Second Coming of Christ, and a believing remnant will be redeemed.

And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall beat off from the channel of the river unto the stream of Egypt, and ye shall be gathered one by one, O ye children of Israel. (v 12)

 

[Not me]

Ps 103:9 "He will not always chide: neither will He keep His anger for ever."

Micah 7 “Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? He retaineth not His anger for ever, because He delighteth in mercy.”

God's anger was poured out upon Jesus on the cross. -" He saw the travail of His soul, and was satisfied"

John 12:28 "Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.
29 The people therefore, that stood by, and heard it, said that it thundered: others said, An angel spake to him.
30 Jesus answered and said, This voice came not because of Me, but for your sakes.
31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto Me.
33 This He said, signifying what death he should die. "

Jesus took the judgement on Himself...that is why God sent Him. That was always the Plan since before the creation of the world ...the Lamb was slain.

And God was "well pleased".

God wins, He always does....and always intended to.

Yes God always wins!

When all is said and done and God fills all things, no creature will ever experience wrath again forever in His Kingdom of Love, for God is love.

Blessings who’s heart is after Christ

Much love in Christ, Not me

What is actual nonsense is what you are trying to "teach". You take a verse out of context and then write in all your ideas into it...that have no bearing on anything except what is religiously comforting to you. When corrected you just obfuscate and continue down the same road.

What is the Divine response?

It can only be, to really and truly speak to the issue at hand.

The reason my posts bother you so much is;

Galatians 4:29 (NASB)

“But as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so it is now also.”

So it plays out before the eyes of all, that all may see.

I don’t expect you will, but on the off chance you might, in the quietness of your prayer closet when no body can see but God, ask God about it.

Blessings and hoping all good things for you in Christ.

Much love in Christ, Not me

Ps, after reading what I wrote, what struck me was the utter arrogance of such a statement. Than I thought, unless of course it was the truth???

So than after giving God some time to minister to the heart. (mine)

I thought of the arrogance of the statements;

“It is no longer I that live but Christ that lives in me”

Again;

To actually believe that Jesus/God has come to make His abode in you.

Oh the arrogance of such a faith.

Death to the heretic.

So to Him who judges righteously do I commit my writings;

But rest assured, if I speak from myself they will come to nothing, but if from the Spirit of Christ in me, they will produce His fruit in His time.

Blessings again, Not me

 

[Not me]

This has been INCORRECTLY translated. Here is the correct translation:
Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together. (KJV)

There is a question in that verse, not a statement. "Fury" is more appropriate here than "wrath", and "together" is more accurate and appropriate than "completely".

The context is the destruction of Satan (presented as Leviathan, the crooked Serpent) and the redemption and restoration of Israel. So in this context God's wrath was directed against Satan but taken away from Israel, which will be regathered from all corners of the earth after the Second Coming of Christ, and a believing remnant will be redeemed.

And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall beat off from the channel of the river unto the stream of Egypt, and ye shall be gathered one by one, O ye children of Israel. (v 12)

Not incorrectly translated but both words can be translated the same for they are transposed back and forth depending on the translations.

Blessings,

Much love in Christ, Not me