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Inter-Faith Discussion/

Discussion in 'Inter-Faith Discussion' started by firstthings1st., Oct 27, 2016.

  1. firstthings1st.

    firstthings1st. Member

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  2. Angelina

    Angelina Prayer Warrior Staff Member Admin

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    Amen! Well said Walter! :m1212:
     
  3. firstthings1st.

    firstthings1st. Member

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    We must earnestly contend with our faith in Jesus Christ until the very end of time: Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
    Jude 1:3, Jude: The entire chapter: http://biblehub.com/kjv/jude/1.htm ,
    James 1: all verses http://biblehub.com/kjv/james/1.htm
     
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  4. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    nice. How do we justify this with "blessed assurance," though, and what might be a seeker's clues to tell them when they are no longer contending with their faith?

    (which, when you think about it, is a strange way to put that, isn't it? Contend with your own faith? I am going to go ask Lex about that, make sure that It is worded right, but i already know that It is, because those who contend with their faith are not those whose faith is the same today as it was the day they made their initial profession, no changes allowed, and just cemented more firmly in place now).
     
  5. firstthings1st.

    firstthings1st. Member

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    I would say to answer the above is to go to this scripture: And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly. https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Hebrews+11%3A6-8&version=NIV
     
  6. KLeft

    KLeft New Member

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    I believe that Jesus Is the son of God, confused about if I should prey to Jesus as God, or to God as God. I know they are one and the same, but people refer to them as if they are three different beings. I don't pray as often as I know I should, I want to but I just can't seem to get there. I use to pray more often, but to this day I've never seen any changes in the people I prayed for. My son is atheist, my other son Believes, but nothing more. I am separated for and hanging on to my faith, but wondering if I am even in the book. I truly feel God is their for me on many things, I can only say was an act of God. We never went hungry, even when it didn't look good, Things seem to always fall into place, except things I wanted most. I can't find a good Church close to me, it's either Catholic, Protestant, Or Baptist. I work for a beer company so baptist is out, and I am not sure what covenant the others have. I use to go to a very small nondenominational until it split up. With that said, I have asked Jesus to save me, and for forgiveness often, because I have many issues I am trying to control but failing, most of witch is my tongue. In short I'm a basket case trying to get out of the mud, but still hopeful.
     
  7. Stranger

    Stranger Well-Known Member

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    If you believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God and have received Him as your Saviour, then you are born-again. If you have doubts that you have done that, then pray to God that you are doing that.

    Your list of churches you apparently don't want to be a part of, cover most churches. Catholic, Protestant. and Baptist (also Protestant). You might try the Presbyterian Church of America. (PCA). They broke away from the United Presbyterian Church due to women and homosexual preachers. The PCA is conservative. I have been a member of many churches, and this is the one I enjoyed my time the most.

    Stranger
     
  8. Angelina

    Angelina Prayer Warrior Staff Member Admin

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    Hi KLeft, welcome to [email protected] I'm glad to have you join us. I know that it can get confusing when we pray and I started out very much like you in prayer. Now days I pray this way ~ Dear Father...in Jesus mighty name. Jesus says in his word that if we ask in his name, it shall be done according to his will of course. I believe in prayer and have seen miracles and lives changed through it. My Pastor from a former church used to work for a cigarette company at one time but we did not judge him for it. Eventually God opened other doors for him and he is in full-time ministry. I am also looking for a fellowship to lay down roots but it seems to be a difficult task at times but I advise that you keep pressing through. I have been to a local A.O.G and may just become a regular. The important thing is that we fellowship with other believers so that we can grow, stay accountable and be able to encourage one another with our personal testimonies and the wonderful things God has done and is doing in our lives . God is good. Welcome again!

    Angelina
     
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  9. Questor

    Questor Messianic Gentile

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    One contends with disbelief by your trust in YHVH through Yeshua's redemptive action. Increasing your trust in G-d is partly done by experience...leaning on him to solve problems for you that you do not understand by asking him to solve them. If you don't ask, you done get.

    For instance, you might need a job, or a better job. This is something within G-d's will for you, since work is a good and pleasant thing, and G-d wants you to be able to support yourself. So, you then ask him to look at your talents and desires, and to make a plan for your life that will enable you to enjoy the world sufficiently for contentment, but also to be used of G-d for his purposes. And you keep asking, until you get, not losing hope, or stopping your trust in his eventual answer to your prayer.

    Disbelief is automatic as the Adversary automatically tries to get you to lose your hope and trust. And you fight back with what you know, the scriptures, and prayer....also other people praying for you. You are contending with the Adversary to retain, and increase your faith by trusting G-d to help you. That is using your faith to contend for faith. And when it seems hard, you yell, "ABBA!" which is what I do, and which works, if not always instantly.

    You ask for faith in YHVH, in Yeshua, in the Ruach as you comforter and helper, and he will increase it, as faith is a gift from G-d. Then you also acquire assurance in what you believe by listening to the Word being read...by reading it aloud to your self, in hearing expositions on the Word by good teachers, and by searching your Bible every time you hear anything...to see if it is indeed true.

    The exposure to the Word not only changes you ability to believe and trust in G-d, but also helps you to increase in wisdom, in prudence, in all manner of ways that help to keep us out of trouble, for as broken humans we are prone to error automatically...it is the default setting.

    You can also ask for wisdom and understanding, as these too are gifts in the spirit that are used in conjunction with faith. Be cautious about asking for things you do not understand, or are not ready to dive into head first...you often get far more than you would have believed possible. I asked for patience, and went on one heck of a roller coaster ride with being actively frustrated to teach me patience...and I learned, eventually, but only a little.

    Nowadays, I simply ask Abba to change me in the way he wants me to be changed, and things get better in handfuls rather than drips and drops.
     
  10. Questor

    Questor Messianic Gentile

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    Well, they are separate, individual expressions of the same G-d, that have their own personality and assigned power and tasks, however the sense of them as many rather than one is because we are working with two space/time continuims, and thus, are perceived as separate, when they are essentially one. I often picture G-d as a huge Mainframe computer, the Ruach haKodesh as a Radio signal blasting out to Believers, and Yeshua as a printer, getting the world out to all!!

    It's not a problem...you pray to YHVH in the righteousness of Yeshua's redeeming work at the stake, and the Ruach haKodesh, if you are a Believer in Yeshua trusting him for your salvation, is within you, and connected to both YHVH and Yeshua. And you pray to YHVH because Yeshua prayed to him, and the perfect model prayer taken from the Amidah is the 'The Lord's Prayer, which is addressed to our 'Father in Heaven.

    The trinitarian concept was dreamed up by Constantine's people at the Council of Nicea to make a single statement that would have the force of law in a polythiestic society that thought nothing of 3 gods in one, which is how theyunder stood it...or even three separate but equal gods, which is what some of the argument was about. Describing the ins and outs of the differing roles and personalities of the Ein Sof, and why they are that way is fascinating, but rarely completely accurate, for we can only describe this kind of thing imperfectly. But there is only one G-d, and Yeshua is now the Human expression of him in our reality, while Abba remains with the majority of his total SELF in Heaven.


    I don't pray as often as I know I should, I want to but I just can't seem to get there. I use to pray more often, but to this day I've never seen any changes in the people I prayed for.

    I don't know that anyone prays as they should, only that some prayer is better than none, and you should not compare your praying time or intensity or frequency with anyone else... you are in a relationship, not talking to your employer.

    As for the effectiveness of prayer, you have to ask, and keep on asking, sometimes daily for years before you see a result...partly because G-d wants to know you are serious in your desire sufficiently to keep asking him (the squeaky door principle), and he likes persistence, and also because he often needs time to develop the situation and circumstances for your prayer to be answered, and sometimes he will not answer yes because the person you are praying for is refusing his intervention, or it is not time yet for the intervention.

    Luke 18:2-5 (CJB)
    2 “In a certain town, there was a judge who neither feared God nor respected other people.
    3 There was also in that town a widow who kept coming to him and saying, ‘Give me a judgment against the man who is trying to ruin me.’
    4 For a long time he refused; but after awhile, he said to himself, ‘I don’t fear God, and I don’t respect other people;
    5 but because this widow is such a nudnik, I will see to it that she gets justice — otherwise, she’ll keep coming and pestering me till she wears me out!’”

    Abba really likes persistence! But the more people praying for a thing, the more help from the Ruach haKodesh, and people being in agreement for what is prayed for. Healing is always a difficult one, because the one being healed cannot be healed against their will, or against G-d using them for his purposes. So you ask, and you trust G-d, and you ask again...and again, trusting him.

    My son is atheist, my other son Believes, but nothing more.
    Pray and keep praying daily, and then hand the problem over to G-d to fix until you get your answer, to it is the next day, and time to ask again.

    I am separated for and hanging on to my faith, but wondering if I am even in the book.

    If you Believe in Yeshua's work on the stake, that he died for Mankind's sin, and if you have invited him into your life, and have been baptised by any bible believing person, he always says yes. If you ask for the infilling of the Ruach, you will receive it. As for staying in the book of life, once written there through Yeshua, well Yeshua will make sure that nothing gets in the way of your relationship with him so long as YOU want it. You can walk away, deliberately, sinning purposefully for a very long time in outright rebellion, and still he will take you back if you will repent, and begin again. There is no sin, no rebellious act, that cannot be forgiven except for assigning evil intent to the Ruach haKodesh or to Abba, because that is Blaspheming the spirit. Basically, the song, "I'll Take you Back', is a perfect song for this. It doesn't mean you can freely sin, and G-d will still accept you, only that when you fall, being human, he will forgive you...always.






    I truly feel God is their for me on many things, I can only say was an act of God. We never went hungry, even when it didn't look good, Things seem to always fall into place, except things I wanted most.

    G-d is always faithful to give you what you need...but not always what you want until you are able to have what you want without being damaged by having it, or by damaging others.


    I can't find a good Church close to me, it's either Catholic, Protestant, Or Baptist. I work for a beer company so baptist is out, and I am not sure what covenant the others have. I use to go to a very small nondenominational until it split up.

    Good churches are hard to find. I have never found one, but I have fellowship with many Beleivers wherever I go...Abba arranges for me to meet them. Church happened whenever there are two people together, talking about G-d...like right now...even with distance, and time constraints. Still, it is another thing to ask G-d for, and then set out exploring any non-denominational church with an open mind and heart. Read their website faith statement, and then check them out.

    Baptists are not all holier-than-thou non-drinkers, or disapproving of where you need to work, because you may be there to be light to someone else. If they dislike your job so much, they might find you a better one! Even Reform Protestant Denominations are not always a problem...it so much depends on the people, and whether they are close offshoots of the Anglican Church, or not so close. And really, no church is going to be perfect, because people aren't perfect. The main thing to look for is the use of the Bible in the sermons, and that they have a serious Bible study at least once a week, because that is how you get to know people. Don't volunteer for anything until you know the people, because it will make them nervous about your trying to get at home too fast, and do not help them financially until you know them well, and understand what they are doing.



    With that said, I have asked Jesus to save me, and for forgiveness often, because I have many issues I am trying to control but failing, most of witch is my tongue. In short I'm a basket case trying to get out of the mud, but still hopeful.[

    We all start as a big mess, and get slightly less messy until we are made incorrupt...it is never complete until we are with Yeshua. Don't beat yourself up...we all go through this! Just begin, and keep trying, fall down, and get up.
     
  11. KLeft

    KLeft New Member

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    Thank you, it's has been uplifting, and eye opening to read this. It's been a while since I felt any amount joy in side, thank you again.
     
  12. KLeft

    KLeft New Member

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    I didn't list those Churches because I don't want to be a part of them. I went to baptist Churches growing up as a child, but stopped through my teenage years. I started back after I was married, but the covenant they swore their oath reads I will not take part in drinking, or in selling alcohol, so that rules me out as I work for a beer company, and the other denotations I have know idea about at all. Thank you for your help.
     
  13. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    hmm, i don't remember Baptists being so restrictive...blind leading the blind anyway imo.
     
  14. Questor

    Questor Messianic Gentile

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    Those are things they want you to not do if you officially join the church, and are thus a official member, and representative of the church. Just don't formally join, but participate, and love on them, and in time, G-d will make things work as they should...or give your strength to stay where you work, again, to be a light to others.
     
  15. Questor

    Questor Messianic Gentile

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    All the Baptists I know are easy going people, and not overly against partaking of the odd beer, or glass of wine. I myself have wine each week at Shabbat, to take communion, but it's not a problem in my life. When it is a problem, you avoid it!
     
  16. firstthings1st.

    firstthings1st. Member

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    He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
    He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Mark 16:16
     
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  17. firstthings1st.

    firstthings1st. Member

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    And a person must continue with their faith walk with Christ until the end of time.
    John 8:31-32
    King James Version (KJV)

    31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

    32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

    Acts 16: All verses, esp. vrs. 30, 31.

    30And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

    31And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
     
  18. firstthings1st.

    firstthings1st. Member

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    Acts 16 KJV
     
  19. firstthings1st.

    firstthings1st. Member

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    Please, Check in the Previous Posts 16, 17, and 18.
     
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  20. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    fwiw it sounds to me like you are doing fine. The confusion about Trinity likely exists because Trinity is just a doctrine of men anyway, mostly used to divide people; you don't have to accept other peoples' concepts about God, even if they wear a tie and have charisma and signed a Contract for Jesus, ok. 65 million people have left that system already, where prayer is defined as something you do on your knees with your eyes closed, and there is a list if boxes to check to consider yourself saved. Those are not "church" anyway, you are the Church.

    Your son is likely just claiming "Atheist" as a rejection of either that or you, and the parable of the Vineyard Owner with Two Sons should be considered there imo. If you do what God does, and just ignore or even signal acceptance when you hear "atheist," rather than offering resistance, recognizing that people say things for lots of reasons, but they only do things they believe in, then a lot of your anxiety about effecting change will likely go away. You are a father, so of course your behavior has an effect on your kids. You are seeking God, and have quite naturally gone to the societally accepted place to further that search, and i suggest that your kids maybe just detect some hypocrisy that you are blind to there.

    i know this is hard to contemplate, having been raised to believe that God is wherever "church" was, but even your syntax, your lingo, ends up framing God in a religious perspective, rather than maybe a more daily-use or moral one, and i can tell you that the people that have never told you about the baptism of fire--because they do not even know what it is--are not the best ones to be emulating in your speech anyway. God has no interest in a religious relationship with you.


    see, you go there to talk about sin and death, right, and what you life will be like someday, after you die; and this does not comport with God's plan, to bring heaven to earth, with you as the Body of Christ. So there is a basic misunderstanding, mostly centered around a bad definition of "eternal life" imo, which i'm not sure but i'm currently thinking God means that collectively, whereas we are of course absorbed with where we, specifically, will land after we die; almost surely a moot point, that can only end in judgement of others, which imo is why that is presented in the way it is in the Book.

    Basket Case in the mud is a pretty good perspective imo--if you get much better, see, then you will be no use to God. You start being assured that you know things--contrary to Scripture--and might even start believing you can tell other people how to get saved, lol.
     
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