Interpretation Is The Problem.

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rdventen

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Simply put, that the problem with a translation is in it's Interpretation given to it. There are many good translations of the Bible out, but also there are a lot of bad Interpretations with in many of them. And this is where the danger lies. here is an example, maybe not a good one but here it is. We are told in the Bible (KJV) that the scriptures were written by Holy men of God, this is the right Interpretation but in some of the other translations it says that men of God wrote the scriptures this is a wrong Interpretation.
 
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Butch5

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Simply put, that the problem with a translation is in it's Interpretation given to it. There are many good translations of the Bible out, but also there are a lot of bad Interpretations with in many of them. And this is where the danger lies. here is an example, maybe not a good one but here it is. We are told in the Bible (KJV) that the scriptures were written by Holy men of God, this is the right Interpretation but in some of the other translations it says that men of God wrote the scriptures this is a wrong Interpretation.

I agree to an extent, however, I believe the bigger problem is that Christians just believe what they are taught. Most that I know rely on their "pastor" to teach them rather than searching the Scriptures for themselves. I am amazed when I see Christians arguing dogmatically for a doctrine when you have shown them that said doctrine runs contrary to Scripture. It seems to me that Christians don't understand the Scriptures and rather than spend the time learning they accept what they are taught and of course they are taught Paul's words, 'if anyone including an angel preaches any other doctrine than what you have heard...'
 

Martin W.

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Simply put, that the problem with a translation is in it's Interpretation given to it. There are many good translations of the Bible out, but also there are a lot of bad Interpretations with in many of them. And this is where the danger lies. here is an example, maybe not a good one but here it is. We are told in the Bible (KJV) that the scriptures were written by Holy men of God, this is the right Interpretation but in some of the other translations it says that men of God wrote the scriptures this is a wrong Interpretation.
It is not my intention to disagree with you , argue , or split hairs but I would like to point out the following:

.... you have capitalized the h in holy
eg: ... "Holy men of God" .
My copy of KJV reads: ...... "but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."

I do not have my Greek concordance with me right now but it would be interesting to compare ( holy) men to (Holy) Ghost in this usage.

..... furthermore the context (2Peter1 12-21) is about prophecy of scripture . The point being made by Peter is that prophecy of scripture came from God ...... (Not from the prophet's interpretation) As A matter of fact Peter is clearly distancing the man from the prophecy , so whether it is written as man or holy man is irrelevant.


.....I think that comes across very clearly no matter what translation is used. For convenience I have reproduced a few below: They all say the same thing to me:

(NIV) [sup]21[/sup]For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.
(KJV)[sup]21[/sup]For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
(NASB)[sup]21[/sup]for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.
(ASV)[sup]21[/sup] For no prophecy ever came by the will of man: but men spake from God, being moved by the Holy Spirit.
(YOUNGS literal)[sup]21[/sup]for not by will of man did ever prophecy come, but by the Holy Spirit borne on holy men of God spake.
(LIVING paraphrased)[sup]21[/sup] or from human initiative. No, those prophets were moved by the Holy Spirit, and they spoke from God.
(AMPLIFIED)[sup]21[/sup]For no prophecy ever originated because some man willed it [to do so--it never came by human impulse], but men spoke from God who were borne along (moved and impelled) by the Holy Spirit.


If anyone has read this far I would like to point out we are still missing the real message Peter was giving. I will reproduce it in the next post.
 

jiggyfly

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It is not my intention to disagree with you , argue , or split hairs but I would like to point out the following:

.... you have capitalized the h in holy
eg: ... "Holy men of God" .
My copy of KJV reads: ...... "but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."

I do not have my Greek concordance with me right now but it would be interesting to compare ( holy) men to (Holy) Ghost in this usage.

..... furthermore the context (2Peter1 12-21) is about prophecy of scripture . The point being made by Peter is that prophecy of scripture came from God ...... (Not from the prophet's interpretation) As A matter of fact Peter is clearly distancing the man from the prophecy , so whether it is written as man or holy man is irrelevant.


.....I think that comes across very clearly no matter what translation is used. For convenience I have reproduced a few below: They all say the same thing to me:

(NIV) [sup]21[/sup]For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.
(KJV)[sup]21[/sup]For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
(NASB)[sup]21[/sup]for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.
(ASV)[sup]21[/sup] For no prophecy ever came by the will of man: but men spake from God, being moved by the Holy Spirit.
(YOUNGS literal)[sup]21[/sup]for not by will of man did ever prophecy come, but by the Holy Spirit borne on holy men of God spake.
(LIVING paraphrased)[sup]21[/sup] or from human initiative. No, those prophets were moved by the Holy Spirit, and they spoke from God.
(AMPLIFIED)[sup]21[/sup]For no prophecy ever originated because some man willed it [to do so--it never came by human impulse], but men spoke from God who were borne along (moved and impelled) by the Holy Spirit.


If anyone has read this far I would like to point out we are still missing the real message Peter was giving. I will reproduce it in the next post.

Good point, I checked and it is the same Greek word hagios in both cases.
 

Martin W.

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2 Peter 1


(I think the heart of Peters message is here:)
make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; and to godliness, brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness, love. For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. But if anyone does not have them, he is nearsighted and blind, and has forgotten that he has been cleansed from his past sins.
(Not once do I see where it says to spend a lot of time debating various translations that all pretty much say the same thing anyway)

If we all just read Peter's writing slowly and carefully we could save a lot of anguish and debating.

God has never been the source of our anguish and arguments (and we all know that.)

Be careful what influences you.

Make sure it is holy with a capitol h

Martin W.

[sup]
[/sup]

Good point, I checked and it is the same Greek word hagios in both cases.

Thanks jiggy
 

rdventen

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2 Peter 1


(I think the heart of Peters message is here:)

(Not once do I see where it says to spend a lot of time debating various translations that all pretty much say the same thing anyway)

If we all just read Peter's writing slowly and carefully we could save a lot of anguish and debating.

God has never been the source of our anguish and arguments (and we all know that.)

Be careful what influences you.

Make sure it is holy with a capitol h

Martin W.

[sup]
[/sup]



Thanks jiggy



Bible Interpretation: That's Just Your Interpretation
CP1004

INTERPRETATION OF THE BIBLE- Introduction
How many times has this happened to you? You quote the Bible in a conversation only to hear, “That’s just your interpretation?” Is one interpretation of the Bible as good as any other?



INTERPRETATION OF THE BIBLE- Not an Abstract Art
When someone says, “That’s just your interpretation,” usually what they are implying is that no one interpretation of the Bible is better than any other. But the Bible is not abstract art, which we can look at any way we want to. Instead, the Bible is a collection of history books, songs, proverbs, letters, sermons and prophecies — what they’re doing is simply playing with it.



INTERPRETATION OF THE BIBLE- Rules of the Game
Yet having said this, I’m well aware of the fact that people do interpret the bible very differently. You see to “interpret” the Bible properly, you just can’t take a part of it and interpret it in some fanciful manner. Some people, of course, do that, but they’re not really interpreting the Bible — what they’re doing is simply playing with it.



INTERPRETATION OF THE BIBLE- Differences
In addition, let me point out that most differences in Biblical interpretation by people who are seriously committed to understanding it, are pretty minor indeed. The big picture — who God is, what God has done in history, what God expects of us now, and what God has in store for us in the future — is pretty clear. The differences that remain are the kinds of differences you would really expect whenever finite, sinful human beings are trying to understand an infinite perfect God.



INTERPRETATION OF THE BIBLE- Conclusion
The next time someone says to you, “That’s just your interpretation,” you might try saying something like this, “Well, then, what’s your interpretation?” Ask them to show you just how their interpretation fits the language and context of the bible better. Often, here’s what you’re going to find, that the person is just making excuses to avoid having a close encounter with the clear teachings of the Word of God.



On Biblical interpretation, that’s the CRI Perspective. I’m Hank Hanegraaff.
 

Martin W.

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When someone's doctrine is challenged there are a multitude of catch phrases used as an escape clause:
...... "that is your interpretation"
......."those are just men's teachings"
...... "can you quote the scripture for that"
..... "my church does not teach that"
..... "judge not"
..... "where is your Christian love and acceptance"


............ and on and on. Pick any phrase you want, or invent your own. All it is is a smokescreen in a failing argument. Nothing more.

Whenever we are presented with new information, or doctrines, or beliefs , we should consider them , check carefully the bible , and then accept or discard them. Another correct response might be "I dont know for sure". Remember we are not required to be experts on everything and not all are scholars.

The biggest danger arises is when we are not experts or scholars yet (wrongly) defend incorrect teachings. Lots of that goes on nowadays.
 

jiggyfly

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Whenever we are presented with new information, or doctrines, or beliefs , we should consider them , check carefully the bible , and then accept or discard them. Another correct response might be "I dont know for sure". Remember we are not required to be experts on everything and not all are scholars.

The biggest danger arises is when we are not experts or scholars yet (wrongly) defend incorrect teachings. Lots of that goes on nowadays.


[font="tahoma][size="3"]Good point Martin, I think this is a problem with religion, period. The gospel is simple and it's "Good News". Men have made it complicated and confusing by trying to grasp and reciprocate it carnally, misrepresenting God and His thoughts and this has been going on for thousands of years. HolySpirit reveals and leads us to all truth, if the scriptures alone had this ability then everyone would be in agreement on what they mean. But the reality is that the christian religious institution is no where near being in one accord on many of the so called doctrines of the faith again misrepresenting the body of Christ. So much has been misinterpreted, misunderstood, mishandled and mis represented concerning the truth especially the later half of the last 16 centuries.[/size][/font]
[font="tahoma][size="3"]
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[font="tahoma][size="3"]
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bling

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What do we do with what we do know?

We can always find stuff to disagree about, how about we start doing stuff from just Loving God and others with all our heart, soul mind, and energy?
 
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Helen

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I thought this was an excellent opening post.

I was browsing , just to make a change from all Law and Grace, and Faith and works threads.... I wanted to read something a bit different...and enjoyed the opening post.

There are many interesting old threads on here. As the old saying goes..."Variety is the spice of life! " Even eating ice cream all the time gets boring ....I think! :D
 

amadeus

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I thought this was an excellent opening post.

I was browsing , just to make a change from all Law and Grace, and Faith and works threads.... I wanted to read something a bit different...and enjoyed the opening post.

There are many interesting old threads on here. As the old saying goes..."Variety is the spice of life! " Even eating ice cream all the time gets boring ....I think! :D
About the ice cream you are certainly right although it seldom, if ever, has become boring to me.

On Bible translations and interpretations, the worst of the former can be used by God to bring home the truth to someone is hungry and thirsty for God's righteousness, whereas the worst of the latter may be derived from the very best of the former.

Aha but them one is likely to ask which translation is the best one? Perhaps it would be the one that Jesus was reading when he walked as a man among men about 2000 years ago.
 
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Angelina

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Simply put, that the problem with a translation is in it's Interpretation given to it. There are many good translations of the Bible out, but also there are a lot of bad Interpretations with in many of them. And this is where the danger lies. here is an example, maybe not a good one but here it is. We are told in the Bible (KJV) that the scriptures were written by Holy men of God, this is the right Interpretation but in some of the other translations it says that men of God wrote the scriptures this is a wrong Interpretation.

I'm not sure what has happened to you but thanks for sharing. I agree with you.
 

bbyrd009

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I'm not sure what has happened to you but thanks for sharing. I agree with you.
it is posited as a problem, but i suggest that it is also a solution for dividing a man, joints from marrow, laying them open that they may be seen. People reveal where their heart is at in their interpretation of Scripture iow
 

Angelina

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it is posited as a problem, but i suggest that it is also a solution for dividing a man, joints from marrow, laying them open that they may be seen. People reveal where their heart is at in their interpretation of Scripture iow

said like a true Berean ;)
 

bbyrd009

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said like a true Berean ;)
actually i am more interested in trying to understand the...anti-Berean? pov here, and that search is not returning any precisely relevant hits, to my eye anyway. I thought the concept was self-evident (lol); could you briefly describe its antithesis? ty
 

Angelina

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A Berean will compare what has been said [by a preacher, teacher, prophet etc] with what has been written in scripture to find out if what has been said is actually true based on scripture. What do YOU think the opposite of that would be?
 

bbyrd009

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A Berean will compare what has been said [by a preacher, teacher, prophet etc] with what has been written in scripture to find out if what has been said is actually true based on scripture. What do YOU think the opposite of that would be?
i can't even envision it tbh, that seems like the only way to me