1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Is it OK to blaspheme the Trinity?

Discussion in 'Community Member Helpdesk' started by Illuminator, Nov 12, 2020.

  1. Illuminator

    Illuminator Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,878
    Likes Received:
    660
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    Post #389 here. Invincible ignorance is what keeps the poster from committing the unpardonable sin.
    Would someone please explain to me why diabolical content like this is allowed (reports go ignored for 3 days)?
    Or is it only allowed when Catholics are relentlessly attacked by anti-trinitarians who disregard the rules?
    I await a relativistic excuse.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2020
    Taodeching likes this.
  2. lforrest

    lforrest Well-Known Member Staff Member Admin

    Messages:
    4,837
    Likes Received:
    5,744
    Faith:
    Christian
  3. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,135
    Likes Received:
    1,021
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    That would depend on what the minimum standard for the designation "Christian[ity]" is here.

    For most places that I visit, it is alignment with the Nicene Creed, which affirms Trinity.

    I have attended one Oneness church and their contention seems to be one of semantics over the decidedly unfathomable concept.
     
    MattMooradian likes this.
  4. Illuminator

    Illuminator Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,878
    Likes Received:
    660
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    The statement addresses disagreements and various levels of Christian maturity, I understand all that. But the statement does not address arrogant blasphemy, which should not be tolerated in a supposedly trinitarian forum. Blasphemy is not mere disagreement, it is not discussion, it is blasphemy and should not be tolerated. Period. Jesus and St. Paul would have DNB banned.

    It's not just DNB blaspheming the Trinity, the goading and harassing by the SDA cult members is endless, and reports go ignored. Appeals to have the thread closed go ignored. SDA is an anti-trinitarian hate cult, and they should not be exempt from the rules, but obviously they are. The responsibility for allowing anti-Christian hate speech (which further contributes to the decline of civilization) rests with you.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2020
    Taodeching and AlsoAnne like this.
  5. APAK

    APAK Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,784
    Likes Received:
    8,612
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    You have something against DNB I see. You are not the only one. What is it about you guys? You feel slighted and insecure in your faith so you immediately run to the 'law givers' and cry to lay charges. The charge of blasphemy is laid, wanting immediate prosecution, imprisonment or death - banned from this site permanently. How could he disturb your precious triad god you love, of your perfect religion? It amazes me.

    You reveal yourself as a hypocrite by your accusation. Where is your high ground, your love and compassion. You are most probably worst than he.

    You would gain more sincere attention if you actually took the dust of your trinity god and showed everyone how this idol serves you, and brings you closer to YHWH, our Father and his Son, who is our Savior. You might be the first to do so though. There has never been any takers.

    And can you guess why?

    Blessings,

    APAK
     
    Brakelite likes this.
  6. lforrest

    lforrest Well-Known Member Staff Member Admin

    Messages:
    4,837
    Likes Received:
    5,744
    Faith:
    Christian
    If someone insults the Trinity as they would a person, and I know they are blaspheming the Godhead. This would be met with a ban, most likely.

    However most people who attack the Trinity are referring to it as an impersonal doctrine. Strong condemnation of the Trinity doctrine is not allowed per the Trinity statement. But it would be viewed less severely than blasphemy against the Godhead.

    Mere disagreement with the Trinity doctrine is not against the rules.
     
  7. AlsoAnne

    AlsoAnne Member

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    45
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    The trinity is not a mere person and to be a Christian is to trust and believe in the doctrine of the the trinity. I am confused to see this blasphemy on a Christian board. As Christians we know the severity of this and is this not a board under the name "Christianity"? I am not trying to goad, this is just not making sense.
     
  8. Hemlock

    Hemlock Active Member

    Messages:
    198
    Likes Received:
    142
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    This board hangs in the balance - will it go the way of THEOLOGY FORUMS - which says flat out that they are a Theology board rather than a "Christian" board?

    theologyforums.com - "Heresy Hotel" - worldwide web headquarters of the non-trinnies and the Not-Godders who deny that Christ is God

    will this board become like it?
     
    Taodeching likes this.
  9. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,956
    Likes Received:
    8,714
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    Liberal? No, I wouldn't say they're that. More like tolerant, with the hope that one in error, if given a safe place to think, will see, shake their head clear, and make adjustments to how they see things. I think a little more is expected of me now than when I first got here last year. Which is good because I'm growing in love.
    As far as the trinity goes, I don't see how one could see it any other way. But instead of clubbing somebody over the head with truth, is there a wiser way of dealing with them? That would be more beneficial for them? Maybe they should start with this video. Lol
     
  10. APAK

    APAK Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,784
    Likes Received:
    8,612
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    The title of this thread has placed a theory on high as an idol, with many of its followers having thoughts of grandeur.

    You treat the trinity as though it is another name for the actual Spirit of God, and it is not at all. And then to add in blasphemy against a theory is going too far. Where does it speak to the trinity let alone blaspheming it in the scripture? I hope you don't think that verses like Matt 12:3, Mark 3:28-30; Luke 12:10; Heb 10:29 that does address blaspheming the Holy Spirit is somehow speaking to a Trinity as well? That's a wild idea and always needs to be confronted.

    APAK
     
    amadeus likes this.
  11. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,956
    Likes Received:
    8,714
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
     
  12. Wrangler

    Wrangler Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,036
    Likes Received:
    2,351
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    Beyond your doctrinal beliefs, I'm not sure what is diabolical about the referenced post. In terms of explicit teachings of the Bible, please direct me to that verse that says something to the effect that The nature of God is a trinity - consisting of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit - and if you do not believe this, you cannot be saved. Thanks!

    Again, I'm not looking for multiple verses than merely 'support' the doctrine. I'm looking for an explicit teaching in Scripture in a single verse (akin to man being created on the 6th day). Also, if you don't mind, please clarify what blasphemy and heresy mean when you use these terms?

    As I understand blasphemy, it is merely attributing characteristics to God. So, for instance, when Jesus said God was good, that constitutes blasphemy. Others use the term to attack one presuming God-like attributes. There is a famous movie with Alec Baldwin where in the opening scene, he spelled out his surgical credentials, ending with the claim that he is God. Perhaps you mean that opposing the doctrine of the trinity is heresy?

    Pastor Steve Cioccolanti advised Christians to reserve the term heresy to only a teaching that prevents one from being saved. Thoughts?
     
  13. tsr

    tsr Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    255
    Likes Received:
    332
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    All Christians believe the doctrine of the Trinity. If you do not believe this—that is, if you have come to a settled conclusion that the doctrine of the Trinity is not true—you are not a Christian at all. You are in fact a heretic. Those words may sound harsh, but they represent the judgment of the Christian church across the centuries. What is the Trinity? Christians in every land unite in proclaiming that our God eternally exists as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Those who deny that truth place themselves outside the pale of Christian orthodoxy.

    Having said that, I admit that no one fully understands it. It is a mystery and a paradox. Yet I believe it is true.

    I can think of at least 4 reasons for believing in the Trinity:

    1. The Bible teaches doctrine.
    2. Christians everywhere have always believed it.
    3. No other explanation makes sense.
    4. Someone has said it this way: If you try to explain the Trinity, you will lose your mind. But if you deny it, you will lose your soul.
     
    Mjh29, Taodeching and Illuminator like this.
  14. Brakelite

    Brakelite Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,137
    Likes Received:
    5,484
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    Here below are the examples of the endless goading, harassing, by this "cult" member. Remember, the thread discussion was about Apostolic councils. I thought, and still do, that my comments were worthy of discussion. But it seems this Catholic fundamental extremist, illuminator, has gone back to Catholic type and like APAK said, quote....
    You feel slighted and insecure in your faith so you immediately run to the 'law givers' and cry to lay charges. The charge of blasphemy is laid, wanting immediate prosecution, imprisonment or death - banned from this site permanently. How could he disturb your precious triad god you love, of your perfect religion? It amazes me.

     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 24, 2021
  15. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,956
    Likes Received:
    8,714
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    For me, promoting that God is one is truth. Opposing that He is also three is, to me, arguing with Him. I try not to argue with Him anymore. :)
     
  16. APAK

    APAK Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,784
    Likes Received:
    8,612
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    Those four listed reasons of yours you believe in, are false. And it is these lies that keep folks from understanding the love and the word of God, and more importantly, from many more from being saved. It keep them at 'arms length' from their Lord and Savior.

    These are Pharisaic thoughts, the same as those Christ scolded and despised, for enticing folks into reaching heaven as a carrot on a stick and then denying them entry with all their extra dead spiritual doctrinal weights to bear and believe in.

    APAK
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2021
    amadeus likes this.
  17. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,956
    Likes Received:
    8,714
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    Hi from Brantford, Hamilton. :)
     
  18. Brakelite

    Brakelite Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,137
    Likes Received:
    5,484
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Australia
    So you have decided that anyone who doesn't accept your assumptions regarding the Godhead are condemned. (and assumptions they are because as you said yourself, it cannot be explained or proven and therefore must be taken in faith) .
    To quote myself from last year...
    If one was to take from scripture only what scripture reveals and no assumptions added, one would still end up with three Divine persons... That one would call those three a Trinity is one of those assumptions,I prefer Godhead.... That those three Divine persons somehow comprise the one God is also scriptural, for each one is clearly Divine yet we are told there is but one God.
    The problem we have is not with the above apparent contradiction, but with our finite feeble sin affected fallen minds attempting to define what God has not revealed. We try to explain how those three can be one... And we cannot explain it. No-one can. And God doesn't expect us to.
    "The first step of apostasy is to get up a creed, telling us what we shall believe. The second is, to make that creed a test of fellowship. The third is to try members by that creed. The fourth to denounce as heretics those who do not believe that creed. And fifth, to commence persecution against such.”
     
    amadeus likes this.
  19. amadeus

    amadeus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    20,567
    Likes Received:
    27,970
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    United States
    Is it because you have said that these things are right or is it because you believe that the majority of those bearing the label of Christian would agree with them that anyone any where else in their walk with God should agree with them as well?

    Should my faith simply be patterned precisely after yours or should it be in accord with what the majority supports? Is the Truth to be decided by you or by a democratic majority? Do you know all of the Truth with no shadows or blurry places? Do you already see God 'face to face' rather than still 'darkly' as did the Apostle Paul?

    Suppose we allow all of those who clearly do not believe in God to vote as well? Would it be possible then to vote God out of the Kingdom?
     
    Brakelite likes this.
  20. Illuminator

    Illuminator Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,878
    Likes Received:
    660
    Faith:
    Christian
    Country:
    Canada
    How would you interpret this comment:
    "In terms of explicit teachings of the Bible, please direct me to that verse that says something to the effect that The nature of God is a trinity - consisting of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit -[/quote]
    Matthew 28:19
    Salvation is determined by how one lives their life, and God is the judge, not judged by one verse theologians.
    You nailed but are unaware.
    In seeking to understand the traditional family, Christians should keep in mind that not only are individual persons created in the image of God, but so is the family itself. The human family is the closest analogy that mankind will ever come to concretely understanding the Blessed Trinity.

    The creeds teach that while there is one God, He exists in three distinct persons. The bible, on the other hand, reveals that man is made in the 'image of God'.
    Genesis 1:26
    From these two truths, therefore, we can acknowledge that the complete image of God is found in the Triune understanding of Him.

    This understanding of His Triune nature is reflected by the human family whose personal relationships approach the likeness of the Trinity.

    There are multiple demonstrations of this truth.

    Consider the unity of the Trinity which is reflected in the unity of the family. Or the "family of persons" which is found in both. The persons of the Trinity share the 'same substance ' while a human family becomes one flesh: wife with husband and parents with children.

    There is also another element in the Trinity that lends itself to human likeness. The Nicene Creed professes this about the Trinity: "We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life who proceeds from the Father and the Son."

    In Catholic theology, the Holy Spirit is said to proceed from the will of both the Father and the Son, or in other words, through the activity which they engage in, otherwise known as "love".

    The Holy Spirit is poured forth through the exchange of love between the Father and the Son. This is why perhaps Jesus says to the Apostles: "Unless I go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you." (John 16:7)

    In the eternal economy of the Trinity, therefore, a person 'proceeds' from the love between two other persons. And so, the Holy Spirit is love 'proceeding' or 'coming from' the first two persons of the Blessed Trinity.

    The human family has a rather striking parallel to this dynamic. The ultimate act of intimacy in a marriage mirrors the eternal exchange of love between the first two persons of the Trinity.

    And like the eternal or continual procession of the Holy Spirit in the Trinity, the act of love between a man and a woman causes a 'procession' of another human person (i.e. the birth of a child).

    Thus, it is precisely because the homosexual sex act is not ordered to the procession of another person, that it can never be a Trinitarian reflection of the divine essence.

    Indeed, the sexual act itself, which is supposed to be a reflection of the Trinitarian relationship, becomes, through the homosexual act, a blasphemy against God since it ends up distorting the Trinitarian image of Him.

    The human sexual act either affirms God's image or it distorts it. This is why all forms of contraceptive sex, including the homosexual act, are serious sins: they seek to create God in another image. It is anti-Trinitarian.
     
    Cachalot likes this.
Loading...