Judgement

[betchevy]

Writer said:As I have shown n my post, everyone, saved and unsaved, will one day give an account before God of their stewardships. The righteous at the Bema seat of Christ, and the unrighteous before th Great White Throne. I am saying that the wicked servant is and always has been unsaved in this passageB'mid bar added for meThe word "bema" comes from the Greek, and is a judgment seat or tribunal or a step. I know you can look it up in Strong's (968 I think): writer then added :This particular judgment is found within 1 Corinthians 3 and 2 Corinthians 5. 1And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. 2I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. 3For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? 4For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal? 5Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? 6I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. 7So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase. 8Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour. 9For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building. 10According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are. 18Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise. 19For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness. 20And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain. 21Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are your's; 22Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are your's; 23And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.2 Corinthians 5 (King James Version)King James Version (KJV)Public Domain 2 Corinthians 5 1For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: 3If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked. 4For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life. 5Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7(For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences. 12For we commend not ourselves again unto you, but give you occasion to glory on our behalf, that ye may have somewhat to answer them which glory in appearance, and not in heart. 13For whether we be beside ourselves, it is to God: or whether we be sober, it is for your cause. 14For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: 15And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again. 16Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more. 17Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. 18And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. 20Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. 21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.I ,like a lot of us here have much to do and I wanted to capture all of this in place to ponder. I too have heard of the Bema seat, but that was long ago before I began to study in depth it was one of the Sunday terms you heard from time to time... this really doesnt' fit with how I know things will happen.. I do see scripture,but ill try to use this place to decide if therereally are 2 separate judgemet" SEATS ">

 

[Christina]

One of the more frequently asked questions is of the 'Bema Seat Judgement' of Christians. This phrase has generally come to refer to the doctrine which teaches that Christians must stand before God and be judged, not for their sins, but in order to determine the nature of the rewards for their works. The proponents of this theology call this the 'Bema Seat Judgement' to distinguish it from what they term the, 'White Throne Judgement.' The latter they believe to be the judgement which God reserves for judicial verdict against the transgressions of the wicked. The truth, however, is a lot less complicated and convoluted. The Greek word [bema], which is translated seat, is from a root which means 'base' or the foot (and by implication, step). It is therefore used to designate a stepped seating area for judgement. Bema simply means the raised seating of a judge or a king. For example, the throne of a King is usually stepped seating. In other words, seating which is raised above the level of the surrounding area. Much the same as our courts today established for judgments. One must approach the raised judgement area called the bench. Likewise, the Bema seat is simply the raised seating of someone who is to judge. The problem is not really one of misunderstanding the Greek, it is an exegetical problem where some theologians are reading their own presuppositions 'into' the text. These people have formulated a doctrine which teaches that their is a judgment which is specifically to judge the value of the Christian's service to the Lord, and so they attempt to make the word 'Bema' conform to fit their doctrine. While this certainly cannot be proven Biblically, many of these theologians (using secular testimony) have gone to great lengths to justify the belief, even though it contradicts the Bible text itself. They claim that this particular seat was only used to reward, and was never used to punish. However, these secular ideas are not only contrary to all other doctrines of scripture concerning God's rewarding us for our work, but they are contradictory to the way the word [bema] itself is used in the scriptures. God's Word does not lend itself in support of such an Biblically indefensible conclusion. In fact, God clearly illustrates just the opposite. For example, Pilate sat on the judgement seat [bema] when Jesus was being accused of wrong doing. Clearly this makes these theories about it's purpose being for rewards, null and void...................................................................This was an article I found on the subject have not studied it myself

 

[Christina]

Bema as used in Acts the same word is used in 2 cor. 5Acts 25:5-7 "Let them therefore, said he, which among you are able, go down with me, and accuse this man, if there be any wickedness in him. And when he had tarried among them more than ten days, he went down unto Caesarea; and the next day sitting on the judgment seat commanded Paul to be brought. And when he was come, the Jews which came down from Jerusalem stood round about, and laid many and grievous complaints against Paul, which they could not prove." Clearly we see from the context that this word 'Bema' is used in the sense of judgement in a trial, where Paul is accused of the Jews of some crime which they ultimately could not prove. We can say without fear of 'rational' contradiction, that this was a seat where a judgment of law was to be pronounced against or for Paul. It was most certainly not a judgement for rewards, nor an award ceremony. And for these theologians to make such claims about the phrase 'Bema judgement' is pure fabrication. A personal or private interpretation which most certainly is not evidenced by the scripture. As stated, the scriptures themselves testify 'against' such an understanding of it. Explicitly we learn that the Bema seat was not used merely to hand out rewards, but as a place for judgement in a tribunal. Moreover, is the doctrine of a 'Bema Seat' judgement to be the believer's motivation to work? Are we motivated by future rewards (above and beyond the Children's inheritance of Salvation in Christ) in the kingdom of heaven? The answer is no. And to have a doctrine which postulates our possible loss of rewards if our works on earth are not up to standards, is downright bridging on the heretical. Rather than have the Christian be motivated to persevere, this doctrine actually seems to threaten his future reward at the Bema seat based upon good, or not so good works. Despite objections, this is a doctrine which promotes 'merit' rather than 'grace,' and it makes a total mockery of the passages (divinely inspired of God) which clearly demonstrate that 'our work' cannot be both by Grace of God, and by our own merit. Our labor is gracious only as it is by the work of Christ. For there is agreement in God's Grace and of human responsibility, but there is no agreement in personal merit of reward based upon 'our own' works, apart from Christ. Neither should our responsibility be confused with human merit. But that is exactly what these theologians have done. Responsibility does not mean that Christians must in any way cooperate in their own perseverance in works. Nor does God motivate us to work through diverse crowns or rewards based on effort. Those who misinterpret the scriptures exhorting work do not truly understand why the Christian wills or does. For a scripture out of context, is a pretext.With all of this evidence of reward in Christ, one may then ask, 'why is there this belief by some Christians in a multiple judgement?' The answer is twofold. One, man in his pride and vanity wants credit for what he thinks he has done of his own (alleged) free will. And two, premillennial (and particularly dispensational) theologians, of necessity must create more than one judgement because they have Christ returning more than once. If Christ returns only once (at the last day), their need for multiple judgments disappear. Their eschatology of a thousand year reign of Christ on earth necessitates a double judgement. For they have some judged for rewards before the thousand years, and some judged after the thousand years. This is problematic if there is a pretribulation rapture and no Bema seat judgement.

 

[betchevy]

My understanding of the return of Christ is this... He will be in the presence of all the earth and with that will bring the "fire of God", the cleansing fire, that will dissolve all of the "rudiments".. the evil in and on the earth... this includes the flesh of men...the hay ,stubble burnt up... and what will be left is the good works and the spritual bodies housed within the flesh. Ezekiel 22, Amos 2. We will meet Him in the air ,really is ,we will be in the spirit as He is...I Thessalonians 4:17 No flesh will remain...in the whole earth... and we will be as we were and will know the things we knew... then when all knees shall bow Philippians 2:10 because they will know who He is and what His authority is... we'll know the WORD.. and the TRUTH and those who believe themselves only in need of faith will find themslves rather naked and uncovered without any linen robe...Revelation 19:8 Those who God has given the true mysteries of the earth and heaven will be divided from those who have studied and kept the foolish traditions of men...Ezekiel 47:5 One to love with Christ and become a part of him and the rest to be separated until they can become trained in discipline...for the 1000 years... Ezekiel 44:23...until Satan can be released to tempt them and some will still be so stupid as to fall for the lies of Satan once more and attempt to come against the HOLY GOD. the only true Judgment will take place after this. Revelation 20:4..only to finally and for all be destroyed, cast into the flame with their smoke ascending up forever.Revelation 19:3.. I expect some blind person to try to prove this all wrong because they have been tought the traditionso of men and they will try to teach you and I , by those traditions.. but the REAL truth is here for those who have eyes to see....ONE Judgement

 

[Christina]

I agree with you Bet the truth behind this false teaching is in the last paragraph Posted below: One, man in his pride and vanity wants credit for what he thinks he has done of his own (alleged) free will. And two, premillennial (and particularly dispensational) theologians, of necessity must create more than one judgement because they have Christ returning more than once. If Christ returns only once (at the last day), their need for multiple judgments disappear. An attempt by men to explain rapture theroy of Christ coming twiceone false doctrine too defend/explain another false doctrine.