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Featured Let's talk Vaccines, from a medical, scientific, historical, ethical and theological perspective.

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by ReChoired, Jan 9, 2020.

  1. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Let's talk Vaccines, from a medical, scientific, historical, ethical and theological perspective.

    I'll go first, with this testimony.



    More may be seen here:



    The word "Vaccine", or "Vaccination", comes etymologically from:

    "vaccination (n.)

    1800, used by British physician Edward Jenner (1749-1823) for the technique he devised of preventing smallpox by injecting people with the cowpox virus (variolae vaccinae), from vaccine (adj.) "pertaining to cows, from cows" (1798), from Latin vaccinus "from cows," from vacca "cow," a word of uncertain origin. "The use of the term for diseases other than smallpox is due to Pasteur" [OED]." - vaccination | Origin and meaning of vaccination by Online Etymology Dictionary

    [Thus the Spanish "Vaca" = English "cow", as in California, Vacaville = Cow-Town (and sure smells like it, one whiff, lungs will begin to bleed, and nasal passage burn ...)]
    Which brings to the next point about what has always been said about Vaccines, scientifically and medically, is that they are made from, and often carry, animal embryo, DNA, of either "bovine" (cow), monkey, dog, pig, or chicken (are the primary animals used), and even aborted human fetal (baby) tissue, along with all manner of other stabilizers, catalysts, suppressants, etc.

    You can see some of that here, from the CDC excipient list:

    https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/appendices/b/excipient-table-2.pdf

    Looking at this from a theological point of view, let us bring the subject back up to a higher plane, and speak spiritually.

    The Church, is likened unto a Body:

    Eph_5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

    Col_1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

    Col_1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:​

    And so, if we consider that a virus, is like a deadly foreign toxin that invades a "body", we can liken it unto evil or bad belief/doctrine/practice that corrupts the body and can even get the body to fight itself (auto-immune).

    The "body", the Church, has an immune system, the general outer body first, then leaders, like deacons and elders, pastors, etc that all heresies, error must get past first, before it can infect the whole, and a standard, the Bible, which all things are checked before admission into the body. For instance, a pervert, an adulterer, or someone like a known Jim Jones, etc, is not accepted into the Body, right?

    Would any healthy "body" seek to bypass the outer defenses, and inject straight into the pulpit, a known heretical professor of foreign belief (like atheism, occultism, etc), doctrine or practice and see how the church reacts from it? or allow such person, or multiple persons (like multiple vaccines) to teach for 6 months to the whole body? Would that be sanity or insanity? Healthy or unhealthy?

    What if we first weakened the person by blindfolding them, and then allowing them to preach from the pulpit or classroom for so long a time? Would that be any different?

    What if we placed such persons, with venomous doctrines, beliefs and practices (by passing the body) straight into the theological seminaries, where they could readily disseminate throughout the whole body their materials? Just like a vaccine does to a human body?

    What if we instead, or in addition, weakened all the deacons, elders, pastors, teachers in the church, by placing stoppers in their ears, and then allowed such foreign elements to come in and teach to the rest of the body, just as like weakening the immune system and white blood cells through aluminum and other adjuvants in the vaccines?

    I know of a Beast (Genesis 3:1) in the Bible that likes to inject poisons through a needle-like fang - the serpent.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2020
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  2. Webers_Home

    Webers_Home Well-Known Member

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    Jas 5:14 . . Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the
    church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of
    The Lord

    Religious fanatics here and there are allowing their underage children to
    suffer and even die from treatable medical conditions on the basis of that
    verse. Where do we draw the line with the so-called "freedom of religion"
    guaranteed in the US Constitution's first amendment? Answer: We draw the
    line at the child's inalienable right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of
    happiness; which, according to America's Declaration of Independence; are
    not only God-given rights, but also a self evident truth that men were
    created with those rights.

    The DOI goes on to say that all men are created equal. It doesn't say grown
    up men; it says all men, which means that women and children have just as
    much right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness as anybody else.
    Parents who deny the truth of those rights are nothing in the world but
    wicked despots; and in point of fact the very kinds of twisted monarchs the
    DOI targets.

    Christ addressed this issue indirectly by means of his teachings on the
    seventh day Sabbath; which, in a nutshell, says that the seventh day was
    made for man, not the other way around. (Mark 2:27)

    Matt 12:11-12 . . And he said unto them, What man shall there be among
    you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day,
    will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out? How much then is a man better than
    a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do good on the sabbath days.

    The sanctity of human life trumps the sanctity of the Sabbath. So then,
    hospitals, doctors, nurses, firemen, law enforcement, soup kitchens, rescue
    missions, Red Cross, Haiti emergency workers, etc. who are busy on the
    Sabbath do not sin. Do they break the Sabbath? Yes; but the sanctity of the
    Sabbath is secondary to the sanctity of human life.

    So then, I would have to say, in accordance with Matt 12:11-12, that people
    who deny their children adequate medical care in the name of religion regard
    the value of their own flesh and blood as something less than that of a
    beast.

    It's okay to have elders pray for your child, and it's okay to anoint them with
    oil as per James 5:14. But after that, parents really should take their
    children to a doctor because the sanctity of human life is far more important
    than strict observance of one's religious rituals.

    There used to be an old saying going around in Christian circles that went
    something like this: When a farmer prays for a crop, he should say amen
    with a hoe. In other words, don't just sit back and wait for a miracle when
    it's in your power to take some action; and if you don't, then in my opinion,
    you deserve to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law when a child in
    your care dies from a treatable condition.

    1Tim 5:8 . . If any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his
    own house, he has denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
    _
     
  3. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Webers, you are off OP (sabbath is not the discussion, and you are in error there anyway about your examples, take it up elsewhere, thank you).

    Secondly, you put forth that which the OP doesn't take as a position, namely that the OP is somehow against all doctors. This is untrue. Luke was a physician, as is Jesus, the great physician, and others likewise in the scripture, see

    2Ki_20:7 And Isaiah said, Take a lump of figs. And they took and laid it on the boil, and he recovered.​

    I am for real medical health and healing, not witchcraft (pharmakeia; φαρμακεια), which is "science falsely so called" (1 Timothy 6:20).

    Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord [is] upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

    Luke 4:19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

    Matthew 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

    Exodus 15:26 And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I [am] the LORD that healeth thee.

    Jeremiah 30:17 For I will restore health unto thee, and I will heal thee of thy wounds, saith the LORD; because they called thee an Outcast, [saying], This [is] Zion, whom no man seeketh after.​

    Are the physicians we go to, Godly, knowing the ways of God and of His Health Laws, for body/flesh and spirit/mind/heart or do they teach the corrupt ways of the false gods, of the devil, in 'sorceries' [pharmakeia; Rev. 18:23]?

    Mark 5:26 And had suffered many things of many physicians, and had spent all that she had, and was nothing bettered, but rather grew worse,

    Luke 8:43 And a woman having an issue of blood twelve years, which had spent all her living upon physicians, neither could be healed of any, Is any ill, or sick, or tired, or depressed, or weak?

    John 5:6 When Jesus saw him lie, and knew that he had been now a long time [in that case], he saith unto him, Wilt thou be made whole?​

    God's word has the answers and points us to the True Physician.

    Matthew 9:12 But when Jesus heard [that], he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.

    Mark 2:17 When Jesus heard [it], he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

    Luke 4:23 And he said unto them, Ye will surely say unto me this proverb, Physician, heal thyself: whatsoever we have heard done in Capernaum, do also here in thy country.

    Luke 5:31 And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.​

    Jesus the Physician, also works with the Godly physicians upon this earth.

    Colossians 4:14 Luke, the beloved physician, and Demas, greet you.​

    What does sin have to do with illness, disease and death, in both physical and spiritual matters?

    Can we sin by what we eat or drink, or other, and bring upon ourselves sickness, and death?

    Can we bring disease to others also through such?

    Are we messengers {carriers} of life & mercy, or messengers of bondage & death?

    Does God's word, the Holy Scripture, have anything to teach us about the Laws of God in this matter? For, does not the word tell us that sin is the transgression of the Law, according to 1 John 3:4?

    Since, sin is the transgression of the Law, and death is the result of sin, then does it not follow that there must be Health Laws, that we are transgressing, bringing upon ourselves sickness, disease, decay, degeneration and death?

    What did Adam, and Eve do that brought death into the world?

    How was it that what they did, affect their relationship and standing to and before God, and also in their relationship and standing to one another, and later also with their children?

    God's word speaks to us plainly of things we ought never to eat, nor to drink, and things we ought not do with our eyes, our ears, or with these bodies, the Temple of the Everliving God, or with our spirit/minds/hearts.

    Let us consider them.

    Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

    3 John 1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.

    1 Corinthians 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.​

    G.O.D.S. P.L.A.N. & N.E.W. S.T.A.R.T.

    G. God's Sunshine
    O. Open Air
    D. Daily Exercise
    S. Simple Trust in God


    P. Proper Rest
    L. Lots of Water
    A. Always Temperate
    N. Nutrition


    &

    N. Nutrition
    E. Exercise
    W. Water


    S. Sunshine
    T. Temperance
    A. Air
    R. Rest
    T. Trust in God
     
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  4. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    "Chapter 8 - The Physician, An Educator

    The true physician is an educator. He recognizes his responsibility, not only to the sick who are under his direct care, but also to the community in which he lives. He stands as a guardian of both physical and moral health. It is his endeavor not only to teach right methods for the treatment of the sick, but to encourage right habits of living, and to spread a knowledge of right principles.

    Need of Education in Health Principles

    Education in health principles was never more needed than now. Notwithstanding the wonderful progress in so many lines relating to the comforts and conveniences of life, even to sanitary matters and to the treatment of disease, the decline in physical vigor and power of endurance is alarming. It demands the attention of all who have at heart the well-being of their fellow men.

    Our artificial civilization is encouraging evils destructive of sound principles. Custom and fashion are at war with nature. The practices they enjoin, and the indulgences they foster, are steadily lessening both physical and mental strength, {pg 125 > 126} and bringing upon the race an intolerable burden. Intemperance and crime, disease and wretchedness, are everywhere.

    Many transgress the laws of health through ignorance, and they need instruction. But the greater number know better than they do. They need to be impressed with the importance of making their knowledge a guide of life. The physician has many opportunities both of imparting a knowledge of health principles and of showing the importance of putting them in practice. By right instruction he can do much to correct evils that are working untold harm.

    A practice that is laying the foundation of a vast amount of disease and of even more serious evils is the free use of poisonous drugs. When attacked by disease, many will not take the trouble to search out the cause of their illness. Their chief anxiety is to rid themselves of pain and inconvenience. So they resort to patent nostrums, of whose real properties they know little, or they apply to a physician for some remedy to counteract the result of their misdoing, but with no thought of making a change in their unhealthful habits. If immediate benefit is not realized, another medicine is tried, and then another. Thus the evil continues.

    People need to be taught that drugs do not cure disease. It is true that they sometimes afford present relief, and the patient appears to recover as the result of their use; this is because nature has sufficient vital force to expel the poison and to correct the conditions that caused the disease. Health is recovered in spite of the drug. But in most cases the drug only changes the form and location of the disease. Often the effect of the poison seems to be overcome for a time, but the results remain in the system and work great harm at some later period.

    By the use of poisonous drugs, many bring upon themselves lifelong illness, and many lives are lost that might be {pg 126 > 127} saved by the use of natural methods of healing. The poisons contained in many so-called remedies create habits and appetites that mean ruin to both soul and body. Many of the popular nostrums called patent medicines, and even some of the drugs dispensed by physicians, act a part in laying the foundation of the liquor habit, the opium habit, the morphine habit, that are so terrible a curse to society.

    The only hope of better things is in the education of the people in right principles. Let physicians teach the people that restorative power is not in drugs, but in nature. Disease is an effort of nature to free the system from conditions that result from a violation of the laws of health. In case of sickness, the cause should be ascertained. Unhealthful conditions should be changed, wrong habits corrected. Then nature is to be assisted in her effort to expel impurities and to re-establish right conditions in the system.

    Natural Remedies

    Pure air, sunlight, abstemiousness, rest, exercise, proper diet, the use of water, trust in divine power—these are the true remedies. Every person should have a knowledge of nature’s remedial agencies and how to apply them. It is essential both to understand the principles involved in the treatment of the sick and to have a practical training that will enable one rightly to use this knowledge.

    The use of natural remedies requires an amount of care and effort that many are not willing to give. Nature’s process of healing and upbuilding is gradual, and to the impatient it seems slow. The surrender of hurtful indulgences requires sacrifice. But in the end it will be found that nature, untrammeled, does her work wisely and well. Those who persevere in obedience to her laws will reap the reward in health of body and health of mind. {pg 127 > 128}

    Too little attention is generally given to the preservation of health. It is far better to prevent disease than to know how to treat it when contracted. It is the duty of every person, for his own sake, and for the sake of humanity, to inform himself in regard to the laws of life and conscientiously to obey them. All need to become acquainted with that most wonderful of all organisms, the human body. They should understand the functions of the various organs and the dependence of one upon another for the healthy action of all. They should study the influence of the mind upon the body, and of the body upon the mind, and the laws by which they are governed. ..."
     
  5. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    "... Training for Life's Conflict

    We cannot be too often reminded that health does not depend on chance. It is a result of obedience to law. This is recognized by the contestants in athletic games and trials of strength. These men make the most careful preparation. They submit to thorough training and strict discipline. Every physical habit is carefully regulated. They know that neglect, excess, or carelessness, which weakens or cripples any organ or function of the body, would ensure defeat.

    How much more important is such carefulness to ensure success in the conflict of life. It is not mimic battles in which we are engaged. We are waging a warfare upon which hang eternal results. We have unseen enemies to meet. Evil angels are striving for the dominion of every human being. Whatever injures the health, not only lessens physical vigor, but tends to weaken the mental and moral powers. Indulgence in any unhealthful practice makes it more difficult for one to discriminate between right and wrong, and hence more difficult to resist evil. It increases the danger of failure and defeat. {pg 128 > 129}

    “They which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize.” 1 Corinthians 9:24. In the warfare in which we are engaged, all may win who will discipline themselves by obedience to right principles. The practice of these principles in the details of life is too often looked upon as unimportant—a matter too trivial to demand attention. But in view of the issues at stake, nothing with which we have to do is small. Every act casts its weight into the scale that determines life’s victory or defeat. The scripture bids us, “So run, that ye may obtain.” Verse 24.

    With our first parents, intemperate desire resulted in the loss of Eden. Temperance in all things has more to do with our restoration to Eden than men realize.

    Pointing to the self-denial practiced by the contestants in the ancient Greek games, the apostle Paul writes: “Every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: but I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.” Verses 25-27.

    The progress of reform depends upon a clear recognition of fundamental truth. While, on the one hand, danger lurks in a narrow philosophy and a hard, cold orthodoxy, on the other hand there is great danger in a careless liberalism. The foundation of all enduring reform is the law of God. We are to present in clear, distinct lines the need of obeying this law. Its principles must be kept before the people. They are as everlasting and inexorable as God Himself.

    One of the most deplorable effects of the original apostasy was the loss of man’s power of self-control. Only as this power is regained can there be real progress. {pg 129 > 130} ..."

    "... {pg 130} The body is the only medium through which the mind and the soul are developed for the upbuilding of character. Hence it is that the adversary of souls directs his temptations to the enfeebling and degrading of the physical powers. His success here means the surrender to evil of the whole being. The tendencies of our physical nature, unless under the dominion of a higher power, will surely work ruin and death.

    The body is to be brought into subjection. The higher powers of the being are to rule. The passions are to be controlled by the will, which is itself to be under the control of God. The kingly power of reason, sanctified by divine grace, is to bear sway in our lives.

    The requirements of God must be brought home to the conscience. Men and women must be awakened to the duty of self-mastery, the need of purity, freedom from every depraving appetite and defiling habit. They need to be impressed with the fact that all their powers of mind and body are the gift of God, and are to be preserved in the best possible condition for His service.

    In that ancient ritual which was the gospel in symbol, no blemished offering could be brought to God’s altar. The sacrifice that was to represent Christ must be spotless. The word of God points to this as an illustration of what His children are to be—“a living sacrifice,” “holy and without blemish,” “well-pleasing to God.” Romans 12:1 R.V., margin; Ephesians 5:27.

    Apart from divine power, no genuine reform can be effected. Human barriers against natural and cultivated tendencies are but as the sandbank against the torrent. Not until the life of Christ becomes a vitalizing power in our lives can we resist the temptations that assail us from within and from without.

    Christ came to this world and lived the law of God, that man might have perfect mastery over the natural inclinations which corrupt the soul. The Physician of soul and body, {pg 130 > 131} He gives victory over warring lusts. He has provided every facility, that man may possess completeness of character.

    When one surrenders to Christ, the mind is brought under the control of the law; but it is the royal law, which proclaims liberty to every captive. By becoming one with Christ, man is made free. Subjection to the will of Christ means restoration to perfect manhood.

    Obedience to God is liberty from the thralldom of sin, deliverance from human passion and impulse. Man may stand conqueror of himself, conqueror of his own inclinations, conqueror of principalities and powers, and of “the rulers of the darkness of this world,” and of “spiritual wickedness in high places.” Ephesians 6:12.

    In no place is such instruction as this more needed, and nowhere will it be productive of greater good, than in the home. Parents have to do with the very foundation of habit and character. The reformatory movement must begin in presenting to them the principles of the law of God as bearing upon both physical and moral health. Show that obedience to God’s word is our only safeguard against the evils that are sweeping the world to destruction. Make plain the responsibility of parents, not only for themselves, but for their children. They are giving to their children an example either of obedience or of transgression. By their example and teaching, the destiny of their households is decided. The children will be what their parents make them.

    If parents could be led to trace the result of their action, and could see how, by their example and teaching, they perpetuate and increase the power of sin or the power of righteousness, a change would certainly be made. Many would turn away from tradition and custom, and accept the divine principles of life. ..." - The Ministry of Healing; pages 125-131
     
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  6. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Some think that there are 'some' "risks". Ok, then what are they?, can those who think that there are merely 'some "risks" list those specifically please.

    Many think that there are marvelous "benefits". Ok, then, what are they, can those who think so, list those please.

    I would like to share personal experience, wherein the first reported deaths, came from the administering of measles vaccine in American Samoa (children died):



    I would also like your personal feedback on this logic about vaccination:



    From this perspective, and what was stated in OP on a theological level, I am on the opposite spectrum, wherein I think that the "risks" are staggering, and the benefits, merely vaporous, or imaginary.

    Risk of sudden death at the top of the list, from shock, toxicity poisoning, brain damage, etc, etc, to long term lifestyle disabilities, autism, mental retardation, loss of speech (dumb spirits), loss of motor function, auto-immune (the body attacks itself, until it destroys itself), to life long 'medication' (further poisons) to try to undo the first, and so on.

    Benefits? I see none, especially when it needs to be forced, mandated by law, even with fines and prison time (people were jailed in Samoa for speaking against the program and mass vaccination, or even refusing to go along with it), and without real recourse to damages in a legal manner, except through some serious hoops (by which the vaccinated are paying, not the manufacturers, doctors).
     
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  7. Helen

    Helen Well-Known Member

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    ..didn't watch the video's ( as I usually don't anyway) ..because I already agreed with what you wrote. Good posts ...

    Because I am in my late 70's and my hubby early 80's we are often being told that we must "take the flu shot". :rolleyes:

    I am not a religious fanatic where it comes to health...I do have to take some meds..but I do try to look after 'this temple' to the best of my ability.

    (Don't worry about Webbers_Home ... he never talks to anyone anyway, just posts at us. )
     
  8. Webers_Home

    Webers_Home Well-Known Member

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    This comment is off-topic, but I seriously think it's something that needs
    saying from time to time.

    Internet forums have given many of Christ's obscure followers a convenient
    venue for sharing their time-won knowledge and experience with a
    worldwide audience. For the world's sake, I highly recommend making an
    effort to compose legible posts; neatly arranged, sensible, coherent, and
    tidy.

    Excessive bolding and italics, lack of adequate paragraphing, twitter spelling,
    unnecessary emogies, wordy dissertations that just seem to go on and on
    forever, horrible grammar, confusing mixtures of fonts and colors, and/or
    shouting with caps and oversize letters, makes for tiresome clutter and
    annoying graffiti that leave a bad impression.

    Some people's posts resemble the obnoxious placards of worked-up
    protesters and political activists; yelling, shrieking, and sometimes even
    spraying spittle. They are beyond reason and objectivity in their desperation
    to be taken seriously. Apparently they assume that if only they shout loud
    enough, make themselves annoying enough, and hold out long enough;
    maybe they'll get their point across and somebody will finally listen.

    I rather suspect that some people regard forums as a canvas for painting
    their comments instead of composing them. Well; that might be okay for
    outsiders, they can be as messy as they want because their comments don't
    matter anyway. But for those of us who honestly believe ourselves to be
    representing God's son; it's unacceptable because it reflects on Christ and
    makes him look like his followers are kooks.

    Phil 1:27 . . Conduct yourselves in a manner worthy of the gospel of
    Christ.
    _
     
  9. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Fa'afetai lava tuafafine.

    At least try the first video. It's really good. If not that is ok, but I think you will have missed a most moving testimony. You like testimonies don't you? :) Had to try one last time. :)

    If you did, it would probably kill you. Satan, like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour, loves to go after the young and unprotected, and the elderly. It is very cowardly of him.

    Glad to hear that, even though you could probably even be rid of the 'meds' with natural foods, if studied out carefully, but I do not pressure you here. Just leave some things to think about, for there are foods that reduce high blood pressure, foods that better increase circulation for neuropathy, etc.

    I did notice that, and also notice that they do not respond to points counter to their own, but post on as if nothing was stated. They must be lonely to spend all that time online in so many forums, posting the same stuff, thinking that views equals living viewers, when most of the time it is counting crawler bots.
     
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  10. Helen

    Helen Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the post.

    Just saying, I did try the heath food and herbs for high blood pressure , but to no avail..because my problem was caused by too much aldosterone ( I think that is what the specialist said ..) so I am on an aldosterone suppressant ...which I have never found in herb form ;)
     
  11. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Active Member

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    I have benefited from vaccines, generally, so I advocate for them, as a method. But they are produced by fallible people, so not every vaccine is a winner. My children have had a bad reaction to two or three of them that were changed in the early 1980s, so we avoid that family of vaccines. They are great when they are safe, ethical and work like they are supposed to.
     
  12. ReChoired

    ReChoired Active Member

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    Oh sure thing.

    Aldosterone - interesting - Hyperaldosteronism: Symptoms, Causes, Diagnosis, and Treatment

    Adrenal gland issue (aka Conn's syndrome) [have you been tested for tumors on the glands?, not to scare you, just asking], or possibly liver, etc. Once that is fixed, then the high blood pressure will go away. What happens is that there comes to be an imbalance in the blood stream of Potassium, Sodium (salt) and water. The Aldosterone if produced too much, cases potassium to be lost, and increase in sodium.

    So, while a 'suppressant' is a temporary fix (and may be a necessary one), it really isn't addressing the underlying issue. It would be like constantly filling up a tire with air that has a small pinprick in it, or constantly letting out air if too much in the heat. The tire will keep, so long as it is done, though it does place extra wear and tear on it, as it cannot maintain constant pressure.

    Hmm, you might desire to check with a specialist, and see if they can even reduce that med, but it is up to you. You might consider checking with Dr. Agatha Thrash at the Uchee Pines Health institute (free) - Counseling Sheets - Uchee Pines They also have a contact page, just in case you are interested, as not many I know like spending money on pills, or even taking such things, but just meant as an help, again no pressure (no high blood pressure either ... :) )

    .Well, anyway, if you already knew that, and you probably did, just know that I share with love, and true concern. So, if you are squeezed by a big kind hug, I wouldn't want you to 'pop' from too much pressure and deflate on me. :)
     
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  13. brakelite

    brakelite Well-Known Member

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    You were right, that first video very moving.
     
  14. Windmillcharge

    Windmillcharge Well-Known Member

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    Yes vaccinations are made/prepared by sinners, as are cars, prepared meals, aircraft and flown by them as well as maintained by sinners.
    There isn't anything that isn't made by sinners. So Christians potential are at risk from there actions.

    Yet we don't hide away. It is the same with vaccinations. They save lives.
    What for many of us were childhood illnesses are not seen today, because ofvacinations.
    Yet those same illnesses in there natural state are killers.

    Read about the affect of western civilization upon native tribes unused to our illnesses.

    If you are protesting against vaccination then you ought also to protest against modern antibiotics because they are totally unnatural, not made from plants but constructed from chemicals.

    Be warned without vaccination and without modern medicine all you have is herbs and nursing, oh and illnes with a death rate of a third of those infected.
    Higher for those already weakened by another illness.
     
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  15. David Taylor

    David Taylor Well-Known Member

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    So either you plagarized or you are also on Baptist Board. When this was posted there I stated the following and still agree:


    Are you really trying to make a theological point about heresies and false teachings in the church by comparing them to vaccines? This is nonsense.
     
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  16. Helen

    Helen Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes...thats what the specialist said.

    They did a scan and saw nothing...but he said we need to go in with the little camera thing and take a look. Sometimes they find something, sometimes they don't .

    So I said -- Okay, so you go in and take a look and fine something...
    Does the surgery cure it 100%
    I'm 77 and don't have surgery for a hobby :)
    My son-in-law is a surgeon ( he's ready for retirement now) he said anyone over 60 should only have surgery on a life and death issue, because it is always a risk over 60.

    Anyway this specialist said his patients were 50 /50 ...some had surgery and never needed to use medication again..some had the surgery and were still on BP medication after ...so taking out the tumours didn't solve their .
    So I declined his odds :D

    This was all in 2000 , 19 years ago now...
     
  17. David Taylor

    David Taylor Well-Known Member

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    If I have a brain tumor and I need surgery, I'm not going to be worried about whether or not the surgeon is theologically correct. I just want to know my brain is not the first one he has worked on and that he has the ability to take care of my medical needs.

    This whole thread is beyond stupid.
     
  18. Helen

    Helen Well-Known Member

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    Whichever way we cut it...everything comes down to faith.

    Whichever we do we must trust God with the number of our days.

    If we don't take anything...we must do that in faith.
    If we do take medication or herbs , we do that in faith.

    Each man must be persuaded in his own heart and mind. ( Rom 14)
    Neither one is the more spiritual...in both cases , some live, but some still die.
    "Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him."
    "Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
    And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin."

    For myself, up until I was 60 and had high blood pressure , I was a "dyed in the wool- "stand in faith" person.
    I even was for two years after the high BP ...but I had a couple of issues which caused my family to take me to the hospital.

    Then my adult children and husband said .."Well you may have the faith to not take the meds, but we were not prepared to see you die yet, do it for us."

    Well I did so, and have seen two of my grandkids married...and another one became a nurse and yet another one get into Medical school.
    So, no regrets either way. :)

    Those evil diseases you mentioned which have been eliminated ...it was a reprieve, some of them are showing up once again!

    Quote - < It’s hard to believe, but the Black Death isn’t just one for the history books or far-flung places. It's shown up recently in New Mexico, California, and Colorado, though it’s still rare.

    Syphilis was almost gone from the U.S., but it's back at its highest rate
    Scarlet Fever - more people are getting this because the bacteria has changed just enough that antibiotics don’t work as well against it. >

    Take a Google and you will find that the world is not free of all these and many many more...

    On that happy thought...bless you :D
     
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  19. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    And therein lies the problem. It may have been true several decades back that vaccines were being used ethically. But not any more.

    There is a sinister agenda behind today's vaccinations and it may be tied to the UN's Agenda 21 -- a nefarious plot by the Globalist Elites to control the world and its population. When you see the words *sustainable* and *sustainability* they are code words for control in the hands of a few for the destruction of many. The Climate Change Hoax and the abuse of vaccines are tied together.
     
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  20. Helen

    Helen Well-Known Member

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    David ...
    No you are not a "bad guy" ;)

    But why must you always have 'an edge ' in your voice when you post?
    This is just a discussion...and that is what Forums are for . :)

    Come down a little from your high perch and get to know us all a bit...
    you may like some of us ...
    You say that this thread is "beyond stupid"....but in saying that, you are telling us all that we who are engaged in posting here are stupid for doing so!o_O
    Ouch!!

    Bless you my friend .
     
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