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OT Life after death

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by David323, Mar 28, 2007.

  1. David323

    David323 New Member

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    In the OT did most people (that believed in God) expect to have life after this earth in Heaven? Also, was God's law not only given to Israel? Did people from other countries have any chance to not go to hell?
     
  2. betchevy

    betchevy New Member

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    Ecclesiastes 3:21Who knoweth the the spirit of man man that goeth upward.The book of Ecclesiastes was written by Soloman and is short and as so much beauty and wisdom in it... a great read for anyone.God did use the Israelites to give the law and the prophets to and through, but many believed and gained thereby access into Israel and its redemption from sin every year at Yom Kippurexamples: 1.the egyptians who left with the Israelites and went with them2.Ruth who was a Moabitess, but left her people to join Naomi3.Rahab who was not a harlot, but a dealer in flax and good at it, and along with Ruth is in the lineage of Christ 4. Nebbuchanzer who wrote Daniel 4. the whole chapter and it is a record of his conversion and is also a picture of the what happen just this past year with Saddam Hussein.. who was another king of Babylon. 5. the woman who housed Elijah when he fled the wrath of Jezzabelle6. the city of Ninevah, who God sent Jonah to preach to.I am sure there are others... maybe others can help us here and add to the list.
     
  3. HammerStone

    HammerStone Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    Think about Elijah and the chariot to give a common example. If there was no place to go after this life, where did Elijah go? Ecclesiastes 12:7Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it. The spirit here implies the obvious - forgive me for stating it, I'm not doing it to insult your intelligence, but just for the sake of all who read. The spirit (soul) goes on after the death of the body. What does that say about an afterlife? Bets gave some great examples to your second question above. The book of Jonah is an excellent read and a fairly short one. Jonah was going to preach to those who were not of Israel. Daniel 4 contains one of the most beautiful prayers I have ever heard at the ending of it by Nebuchadnezzar. Certainly the gentiles could be saved.
     
  4. kendal

    kendal New Member

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    The afterlife in the Old Testament is the same as the afterlife in the New Testament.You live, then you die, you return to the dust you were formed from, and the life, breath or spirit which God had given you, returns unto the Lord.At the second coming of Jesus, you are then raised from the dead. The righteous to everlasting happiness, the wicked who will be raised 1000 years later, to everlasting shame and contempt.The doctrine of the ressurection was denied by the Sadducees, and they often tried to philosiphy around it, this is the major reason the Pharasees and the Sadducees were at swords points.For example; Cain died about 5000-6000 years ago. To him when he is raised in the ressurection of the wicked, it would seem as if he died just yesterday, and closed his eyes for a few seconds and was alive again, much like you goto sleep, it doesn't feel like 8 hours does it!?If you would like examples of the ressurection in the Old and New Testaments, just say so i would be happy to provide you with some.God bless!!
     
  5. clong831

    clong831 New Member

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    Where did you get the it feels like it was only yesterday from??I'm not sayin that I couldn't have missed that somewhere but I've never seen it.
     
  6. betchevy

    betchevy New Member

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    IThessalonians 4:13But I would not have you ignorant , bretheren concerning them which are asleep(2837 strongs/be dead), that ye sorrow not even as others which have not hope.14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also shich sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.Luke 16:19-31 this is the parable told by Christ of the Lazarus, the beggar and the rich man.. The rich man was on the far side of the gulf and saw Lazarus with Abraham...Neither the soul either the good or the bad are asleep in the ground but both are in a place seperated by the gulf. Cain is in a spiritual body and he is awake and knowing of his seperated from God for all this time. Just as the rich man was in a spiritual body and aware of his seperation. Am I also missing your point ?
     
  7. kendal

    kendal New Member

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    You must read all scripture in context.The Bible says that "the dead know not anything" and that is what it says. If you start interpretting parables as literal you will be put onto the wrong track.For example, if we could interpret parables as literal, that means we could drink as much alcohol as we like because whatever goes into the belly is cast out into the draught, it also means that Jesus is a tree and not a man, it also means that the Bible is really a seed and if you plant it, it could bear fruit, it also means that trees can talk to eachother, it also means that bricks and wood can talk to eachother - do you see where i am going? There is no other real reference in the Bible to being conscience after death other then this parable, which contradicts all other scriptures "the dead cannot praise"But if we were, to take all literally (and unjust stewards get an eternal reward) that would mean every rich man is going to hell, every poor man is going to heaven, it means that when we goto this plane of existance, we can watch our loved ones in agony, and even have to listen to them screaming for help, Abrahams bosom would be large enough to carry every person who has died (even himself) i could go on but do you understand where i am going?may God bless you !!
     
  8. David323

    David323 New Member

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    These are great examples. But still what about the people(even today) that did not hear about God?
     
  9. Christina

    Christina New Member

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    If they have not heard or are mentally ill or the such they are not held accountable and will be taught in the millinium.hope that answers your question.
     
  10. n2thelight

    n2thelight Well-Known Member

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    KendalAre the Dead Sleeping?That is in essence what you are saying,but the below verses of Revelation clearly disproves that theoryRevelation 6:9-17 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled. KJV These were Cleary people who had died, and they certainly were not unconscious nor sleeping; for, they were speaking to God, praying to Him, if you would. And they were answered with a direct and informative sentence.
     
  11. kendal

    kendal New Member

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    (David323;8308)
    These are great examples. But still what about the people(even today) that did not hear about God?
    We can't change the rulesAct 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.Matthew 1:21 and John 1:29 will tell you what we are saved from.As for the Revelation question, we must look at all of scripture, otherwise we will have warped views.That text answers your question for one, that they should rest for a little season. But i will argue the same point, if you want to interpret prophecy as literal then so be it, but even olive tree branches speak if that is so. The Bible declares that the dead know not anything, and they will not receive a reward untill the ressurection. That is because they must be judged beforehand.Every religion believes in a counterfit after life, it is only the Bible which talks of a bodily ressurection. Every other religion believes your soul goes somewhere, or goes inside another living thing or something similiar (correct me if i am wrong, maybe not all religions, but atleast all i have come acrross). But back to the text, if your thoughts perish when you die, then how can you speak? this text in Revelation 6 is talking about all the Martyrs of Jesus, it also talks of a coming judgment. If this was to be taken literally, then i would choose to give up faith in the Bible when it's principles are contradicting eachother. God bless!!
     
  12. n2thelight

    n2thelight Well-Known Member

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    KendalQuote"....... But i will argue the same point, if you want to interpret prophecy as literal ........."ReplyProphecy is literal,how else would it be prophecy?Example,it was prophesied that Christ would die on the cross,now was that literal or not?Think I will post a study on parables and prophecy,I think it will help you
     
  13. David323

    David323 New Member

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    [quote name='kendal;8377]We can't change the rulesAct 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men' date=' whereby we [b']must[/b] be saved.You are saying the mentally ill, un-informed, etc. will all burn in hell for eternity as thier punishment for being that way? It's hard to believe our fair and just God would do that.
     
  14. Christina

    Christina New Member

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    David 323Kendall is mistaken, Prophecy is not always literal it can be literal or figurative (read Rev. for example) and parables are never literal there are also types which can be forms of prophecy that are not clear till they happen for instance many think King Nebuchadnezzar was a type of Saddam Husein thus if you read of the things that happened to Nebuchadnezzar it is a veiled prophecy of what may happen again.There are much better examples of type teaching but this comes to mind.The bible says There is nothing new under the sun. I have foretold you all things.And mentally ill people and people who never heard about God will be taught in the millenium not judged Mark 16:15-16 (Jesus speaking)15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. (KJV)It says neither baptisim (of the heart) nor damnation befalls those that did not or can not hearKendall knows/preaches what his church says its not always what the bible says/teaches.
     
  15. Joseph77

    Joseph77 Well-Known Member

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    Christina was a false teacher in this thread.... hopefully not so much so in 10,900 other posts.....
    ============================================================

    Where did kendal go , member 227 so long ago ? He has some wisdom from God and God's Word:

    QUOTE="kendal, post: 8746, member: 227"]You must read all scripture in context.The Bible says that "the dead know not anything" and that is what it says. If you start interpretting parables as literal you will be put onto the wrong track.For example, if we could interpret parables as literal, that means we could drink as much alcohol as we like because whatever goes into the belly is cast out into the draught, it also means that Jesus is a tree and not a man, it also means that the Bible is really a seed and if you plant it, it could bear fruit, it also means that trees can talk to eachother, it also means that bricks and wood can talk to eachother - do you see where i am going? There is no other real reference in the Bible to being conscience after death other then this parable, which contradicts all other scriptures "the dead cannot praise"But if we were, to take all literally (and unjust stewards get an eternal reward) that would mean every rich man is going to hell, every poor man is going to heaven, it means that when we goto this plane of existance, we can watch our loved ones in agony, and even have to listen to them screaming for help, Abrahams bosom would be large enough to carry every person who has died (even himself) i could go on but do you understand where i am going?may God bless you !![/QUOTE
     
  16. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    Job 19:23 "Oh that my words were now written! oh that they were printed in a book!"
    Job 19:24 "That they were graven with an iron pen and lead in the rock for ever!"
    Job 19:25 "For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:"
    Job 19:26 "And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:"
    Job 19:27 "Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me."
    Job 19:28 "But ye should say, Why persecute we him, seeing the root of the matter is found in me?"
    Job 19:29 "Be ye afraid of the sword: for wrath bringeth the punishments of the sword, that ye may know there is a judgment."
    Romans 2:11 "For there is no respect of persons with God."
    Romans 2:12 "For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;"
    Romans 2:13 "(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified."

    what is one to "do?"
    Micah 6:8 "He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?" BINGO.

    PICJAG.
     
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