problem related to praying in tongues

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The Learner

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problem related to praying in tongues

Matthew 6:6
But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

Matt 26:36
Then Jesus came with them to a garden called Gethsemane, and he said to his disciples: "Sit down here while I go and pray yonder."

Source: Search: "pray garden"

Praying like in Pentecostal / Charismatic Churches violates the teaching of Jesus above.
 
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Tommy Cool

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problem related to praying in tongues

Matthew 6:6
But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

Matt 26:36
Then Jesus came with them to a garden called Gethsemane, and he said to his disciples: "Sit down here while I go and pray yonder."

Source: Search: "pray garden"

Praying like in Pentecostal / Charismatic Churches violates the teaching of Jesus above.
And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites …

That is the context of what Jesus was referring to.

If you notice in 1Cor_14 people are instructed (mostly for the purpose of understanding) to pray in tongues silently unless they are interpreting in a group meeting.

There are a few thing that changed after Pentecost from the gospel teachings. ….Forgiveness is one.
Forgiveness is not determined by forgiving others as the “Lords prayer” states. Forgiveness in this administration of grace is…. even as


Col 3:13
Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye.

Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
 
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The Learner

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Those serverices are disorderly, God is of order, not chaos. friend. And, yes the verse does apply, we are to pray in private as Jesus's example.
 

Jim B

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problem related to praying in tongues

Matthew 6:6
But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

Matt 26:36
Then Jesus came with them to a garden called Gethsemane, and he said to his disciples: "Sit down here while I go and pray yonder."

Source: Search: "pray garden"

Praying like in Pentecostal / Charismatic Churches violates the teaching of Jesus above.
You have a very, very strange way of interpreting Scripture. Public prayer occurs throughout both Testaments.
 

Ritajanice

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problem related to praying in tongues

1 Corinthians 14

New Living Translation

Tongues and Prophecy​

14 Let love be your highest goal! But you should also desire the special abilities the Spirit gives—especially the ability to prophesy.2 For if you have the ability to speak in tongues,[a] you will be talking only to God, since people won’t be able to understand you. You will be speaking by the power of the Spirit,[b] but it will all be mysterious. 3 But one who prophesies strengthens others, encourages them, and comforts them. 4 A person who speaks in tongues is strengthened personally, but one who speaks a word of prophecy strengthens the entire church.
5 I wish you could all speak in tongues, but even more I wish you could all prophesy. For prophecy is greater than speaking in tongues, unless someone interprets what you are saying so that the whole church will be strengthened.
6 Dear brothers and sisters,[c] if I should come to you speaking in an unknown language,[d] how would that help you? But if I bring you a revelation or some special knowledge or prophecy or teaching, that will be helpful. 7 Even lifeless instruments like the flute or the harp must play the notes clearly, or no one will recognize the melody. 8 And if the bugler doesn’t sound a clear call, how will the soldiers know they are being called to battle?
9 It’s the same for you. If you speak to people in words they don’t understand, how will they know what you are saying? You might as well be talking into empty space.
10 There are many different languages in the world, and every language has meaning. 11 But if I don’t understand a language, I will be a foreigner to someone who speaks it, and the one who speaks it will be a foreigner to me. 12 And the same is true for you. Since you are so eager to have the special abilities the Spirit gives, seek those that will strengthen the whole church.
13 So anyone who speaks in tongues should pray also for the ability to interpret what has been said. 14 For if I pray in tongues, my spirit is praying, but I don’t understand what I am saying.
15 Well then, what shall I do? I will pray in the spirit,[e] and I will also pray in words I understand. I will sing in the spirit, and I will also sing in words I understand. 16 For if you praise God only in the spirit, how can those who don’t understand you praise God along with you? How can they join you in giving thanks when they don’t understand what you are saying? 17 You will be giving thanks very well, but it won’t strengthen the people who hear you.
18 I thank God that I speak in tongues more than any of you. 19 But in a church meeting I would rather speak five understandable words to help others than ten thousand words in an unknown language.
20 Dear brothers and sisters, don’t be childish in your understanding of these things. Be innocent as babies when it comes to evil, but be mature in understanding matters of this kind.21 It is written in the Scriptures[f]:
“I will speak to my own people
through strange languages
and through the lips of foreigners.
But even then, they will not listen to me,”[g]
says the Lord.
22 So you see that speaking in tongues is a sign, not for believers, but for unbelievers. Prophecy, however, is for the benefit of believers, not unbelievers. 23 Even so, if unbelievers or people who don’t understand these things come into your church meeting and hear everyone speaking in an unknown language, they will think you are crazy. 24 But if all of you are prophesying, and unbelievers or people who don’t understand these things come into your meeting, they will be convicted of sin and judged by what you say.25 As they listen, their secret thoughts will be exposed, and they will fall to their knees and worship God, declaring, “God is truly here among you.”

A Call to Orderly Worship​

26 Well, my brothers and sisters, let’s summarize. When you meet together, one will sing, another will teach, another will tell some special revelation God has given, one will speak in tongues, and another will interpret what is said. But everything that is done must strengthen all of you.
27 No more than two or three should speak in tongues. They must speak one at a time, and someone must interpret what they say.28 But if no one is present who can interpret, they must be silent in your church meeting and speak in tongues to God privately.
29 Let two or three people prophesy, and let the others evaluate what is said. 30 But if someone is prophesying and another person receives a revelation from the Lord, the one who is speaking must stop. 31 In this way, all who prophesy will have a turn to speak, one after the other, so that everyone will learn and be encouraged.32 Remember that people who prophesy are in control of their spirit and can take turns. 33 For God is not a God of disorder but of peace, as in all the meetings of God’s holy people.[h]
34 Women should be silent during the church meetings. It is not proper for them to speak. They should be submissive, just as the law says. 35 If they have any questions, they should ask their husbands at home, for it is improper for women to speak in church meetings.[i]
36 Or do you think God’s word originated with you Corinthians? Are you the only ones to whom it was given? 37 If you claim to be a prophet or think you are spiritual, you should recognize that what I am saying is a command from the Lord himself. 38 But if you do not recognize this, you yourself will not be recognized.[j]
39 So, my dear brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and don’t forbid speaking in tongues. 40 But be sure that everything is done properly and in order.
 

Pierac

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Yea.... You need to read this... And... No I did not come up with this all by myself as if that matters ... I for got. It's some time back in the day when there were thousands of christian web sites....


How The Ekklesia Should Work:


“But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believes not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all: And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth. How is it then, brethren? when you come together, every one of you has a psalm, has a doctrine, has a tongue, has a revelation, has an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.” 1 Corinthians 14:24–26

Paul is talking to the whole ekklesia here: “therefore the whole church [ekklesia] be come together” (verse 23). He is talking about layman, everyone coming together. He does not distinguish laymen from ministers, does he? In most churches that I have been in contact with, only the ministers have a right to bring a doctrine, to bring a song, to speak a language or to have a revelation. Paul did not teach that. He said when the whole ekklesia comes together, let it be done decently. By that he means let it “be done unto edifying” and in order.

Verse 27, If any man speak in an unknown tongue …” (It could be Greek or a reading of Hebrew). “… let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.” That is exactly what we have in every synagogue. You had a maethurgeman there who would listen to one language being said, and he would repeat back in the language of the people so they could understand it, and hear the message all for the edifying of the ekklesia. There is no use speaking to Greeks in Hebrew when they do not understand Hebrew. So when you read from the Old Testament, in Hebrew, you better have someone who can interpret.

They had an interpreter because the one who gave the reading from the Bible could not be the same one to interpret. There had to be another man over listening so that he could, in the same tone of voice, repeat what the other man said. If he did not say it exactly, this man would be right there to watch and to correct him. And the other man would watch the first. It was checks and balances because they did not have the Scripture like today when you can check whether or not I am quoting scripture correctly. He says, let them be “by course.”

Verse 28, “But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church [ekklesia]; and let him speak to himself, and to God.” A man can read Hebrew or give any message in Hebrew, but do it to himself, because the others cannot understand. If they cannot understand, then it is not helping, it is not “edifying.”

Verse 29, “Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other [others, plural in Greek] judge.” The practice was to let all types of people speak. Paul says two or three prophets. By prophets he does not mean people, who foretell events. A prophet was one who “forth-told” that is tells forth things, like a preacher. This is one of the classical meanings of “prophet.”

“If any thing be revealed to another that sits by, let the first hold his peace. For you may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.” Corinthians 14:30–31

Everyone could “prophesy,” one by one, in the congregation, but not all at once. The whole problem in Judaism was for everyone to speak at once. If you have ever been to a synagogue service after the reading of the Law and the Prophets (where everyone is very, very careful), it gets pretty festive at times.

“And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches [ekklesias] of the saints.” Corinthians 14:32–33

All the ekklesias of the saints are to be in the fashion of order. That is how our Lord spoke in the synagogues, and that is how Paul and the others spoke. That is how the Gospel was shared. When anybody can speak and express their opinion as in 1 Corinthians 14, you have checks and balances. If you have a hierarchical system, you will be taught what one man believes. If he is wrong, then everyone will be wrong. However, if everyone can speak in the church service, with order and balance, then one person may say one thing another person does not agree with the other person then has a chance to respond for everyone to hear it. A checks and balances exists with this type of system. The Gospel thrived, though they had error and heresy, but with this method, there was far greater protection than you can possibly imagine under a hierarchical system.

Yea.... There ain't no special language given only to you by God... Sorry!!!
Paul
 

amadeus

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Those serverices are disorderly, God is of order, not chaos. friend. And, yes the verse does apply, we are to pray in private as Jesus's example.
Disorderly perhaps to one who does not understand, but consider what Jesus said here in response to a question about speaking in parables:


Mt 13:10And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
Mt 13:11He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
Mt 13:12For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
Mt 13:13Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
Mt 13:14And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
Mt 13:15For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
Do all speaking parables? Do all speak in tongues?

1co 14:39Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.
 

Jim B

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Disorderly perhaps to one who does not understand, but consider what Jesus said here in response to a question about speaking in parables:


Mt 13:10And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
Mt 13:11He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
Mt 13:12For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
Mt 13:13Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
Mt 13:14And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
Mt 13:15For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
Do all speaking parables? Do all speak in tongues?

1co 14:39Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.
I agree in principle with the above, however...

Jesus was a rural carpenter who spoke Aramaic. Englyshe such as the above is a distortion of the plain language that Jesus spoke. Here is a far more accurate translation...

His disciples came and asked him, “Why do you use parables when you talk to the people?”

He replied, “You are permitted to understand the secrets of the Kingdom of Heaven, but others are not. To those who listen to my teaching, more understanding will be given, and they will have an abundance of knowledge. But for those who are not listening, even what little understanding they have will be taken away from them. That is why I use these parables,

For they look, but they don’t really see.
They hear, but they don’t really listen or understand.
This fulfills the prophecy of Isaiah that says,

‘When you hear what I say,
you will not understand.
When you see what I do,
you will not comprehend.
For the hearts of these people are hardened,
and their ears cannot hear,
and they have closed their eyes—
so their eyes cannot see,
and their ears cannot hear,
and their hearts cannot understand,
and they cannot turn to me
and let me heal them.’ (Matthew 13:10-15)

"So, my dear brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and don’t forbid speaking in tongues. But be sure that everything is done properly and in order." (1 Corinthians 14:39-40)

From the New Living Translation
 

Pierac

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I agree in principle with the above, however...

Jesus was a rural carpenter who spoke Aramaic. Englyshe such as the above is a distortion of the plain language that Jesus spoke. Here is a far more accurate translation...

His disciples came and asked him, “Why do you use parables when you talk to the people?”

He replied, “You are permitted to understand the secrets of the Kingdom of Heaven, but others are not. To those who listen to my teaching, more understanding will be given, and they will have an abundance of knowledge. But for those who are not listening, even what little understanding they have will be taken away from them. That is why I use these parables,

For they look, but they don’t really see.
They hear, but they don’t really listen or understand.
This fulfills the prophecy of Isaiah that says,

‘When you hear what I say,
you will not understand.
When you see what I do,
you will not comprehend.
For the hearts of these people are hardened,
and their ears cannot hear,
and they have closed their eyes—
so their eyes cannot see,
and their ears cannot hear,
and their hearts cannot understand,
and they cannot turn to me
and let me heal them.’ (Matthew 13:10-15)

"So, my dear brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and don’t forbid speaking in tongues. But be sure that everything is done properly and in order." (1 Corinthians 14:39-40)

From the New Living Translation
Yea.... Matthew was kind of a spiritual sissy.... Mark is the one to tell you the truth just FLAT OUT...

NASB Mar 4:11 And he said to them, "To you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God, but for those outside everything is in parables, 12 so that indeed see but not perceive, and may indeed hear but not understand, lest they should turn and be forgiven."

Let's add Paul to the comments...
Rom 11:7 What then? Israel failed to obtain what it was seeking. The elect obtained it, but the rest were hardened, 8 as it is written, "God gave them a spirit of stupor, eyes that would not see and ears that would not hear, down to this very day."

Let ACTs tell us the truth....
NASB Act 13:48 When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.

John is on target...

NASB Joh 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws ("greek" Drags) him; and I will raise him up on the last day.

NASB Joh 6:65 And He was saying, "For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him from the Father."

NASB Joh 17:2 even as You gave Him authority over all flesh, that to all whom You have given Him, He may give eternal life.

I'm only 10% into your post.....
Paul
 

amadeus

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I agree in principle with the above, however...

Jesus was a rural carpenter who spoke Aramaic. Englyshe such as the above is a distortion of the plain language that Jesus spoke. Here is a far more accurate translation...

His disciples came and asked him, “Why do you use parables when you talk to the people?”

He replied, “You are permitted to understand the secrets of the Kingdom of Heaven, but others are not. To those who listen to my teaching, more understanding will be given, and they will have an abundance of knowledge. But for those who are not listening, even what little understanding they have will be taken away from them. That is why I use these parables,

For they look, but they don’t really see.
They hear, but they don’t really listen or understand.
This fulfills the prophecy of Isaiah that says,

‘When you hear what I say,
you will not understand.
When you see what I do,
you will not comprehend.
For the hearts of these people are hardened,
and their ears cannot hear,
and they have closed their eyes—
so their eyes cannot see,
and their ears cannot hear,
and their hearts cannot understand,
and they cannot turn to me
and let me heal them.’ (Matthew 13:10-15)

"So, my dear brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and don’t forbid speaking in tongues. But be sure that everything is done properly and in order." (1 Corinthians 14:39-40)

From the New Living Translation
If the Holy Spirit/Ghost is leading us into the Truth and we are following, how important is the translation? Is God hindered by the languages of men?
 

Jim B

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If the Holy Spirit/Ghost is leading us into the Truth and we are following, how important is the translation? Is God hindered by the languages of men?
Yes, God is hindered by the languages of men. The Bible is considered by most to be God's word, i.e., His communication to people via the inspired authors. Because the source documents were written by men who wrote in different languages and to a different audience, their writings must be clearly and accurately translated into the languages of the readers. The most obvious solution is to use the language most clearly understood by the readers (or hearers). If the Truth is not clearly communicated, then God will be misunderstood.

That is the case, unfortunately, with the King James Bible, the Geneva Bible, Young's Literal Translation, and some other translations that are still being used. They are not written in the English language that is used today, leading to two problems: a) the words used are misunderstood, i.e., not understood in the same way that the original hearers understood them, and b) they are often reinterpreted by the readers/speakers to mean something different than what was written.

In my mind, the best translation for any person is the translation that they understand most clearly, i.e., the one that most accurately communicates the words and meanings of the earliest and best documents to the reader's mind in her/his own language.
 

David in NJ

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Yea.... You need to read this... And... No I did not come up with this all by myself as if that matters ... I for got. It's some time back in the day when there were thousands of christian web sites....


How The Ekklesia Should Work:


“But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believes not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all: And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth. How is it then, brethren? when you come together, every one of you has a psalm, has a doctrine, has a tongue, has a revelation, has an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.” 1 Corinthians 14:24–26

Paul is talking to the whole ekklesia here: “therefore the whole church [ekklesia] be come together” (verse 23). He is talking about layman, everyone coming together. He does not distinguish laymen from ministers, does he? In most churches that I have been in contact with, only the ministers have a right to bring a doctrine, to bring a song, to speak a language or to have a revelation. Paul did not teach that. He said when the whole ekklesia comes together, let it be done decently. By that he means let it “be done unto edifying” and in order.

Verse 27, If any man speak in an unknown tongue …” (It could be Greek or a reading of Hebrew). “… let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.” That is exactly what we have in every synagogue. You had a maethurgeman there who would listen to one language being said, and he would repeat back in the language of the people so they could understand it, and hear the message all for the edifying of the ekklesia. There is no use speaking to Greeks in Hebrew when they do not understand Hebrew. So when you read from the Old Testament, in Hebrew, you better have someone who can interpret.

They had an interpreter because the one who gave the reading from the Bible could not be the same one to interpret. There had to be another man over listening so that he could, in the same tone of voice, repeat what the other man said. If he did not say it exactly, this man would be right there to watch and to correct him. And the other man would watch the first. It was checks and balances because they did not have the Scripture like today when you can check whether or not I am quoting scripture correctly. He says, let them be “by course.”

Verse 28, “But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church [ekklesia]; and let him speak to himself, and to God.” A man can read Hebrew or give any message in Hebrew, but do it to himself, because the others cannot understand. If they cannot understand, then it is not helping, it is not “edifying.”

Verse 29, “Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other [others, plural in Greek] judge.” The practice was to let all types of people speak. Paul says two or three prophets. By prophets he does not mean people, who foretell events. A prophet was one who “forth-told” that is tells forth things, like a preacher. This is one of the classical meanings of “prophet.”

“If any thing be revealed to another that sits by, let the first hold his peace. For you may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.” Corinthians 14:30–31

Everyone could “prophesy,” one by one, in the congregation, but not all at once. The whole problem in Judaism was for everyone to speak at once. If you have ever been to a synagogue service after the reading of the Law and the Prophets (where everyone is very, very careful), it gets pretty festive at times.

“And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches [ekklesias] of the saints.” Corinthians 14:32–33

All the ekklesias of the saints are to be in the fashion of order. That is how our Lord spoke in the synagogues, and that is how Paul and the others spoke. That is how the Gospel was shared. When anybody can speak and express their opinion as in 1 Corinthians 14, you have checks and balances. If you have a hierarchical system, you will be taught what one man believes. If he is wrong, then everyone will be wrong. However, if everyone can speak in the church service, with order and balance, then one person may say one thing another person does not agree with the other person then has a chance to respond for everyone to hear it. A checks and balances exists with this type of system. The Gospel thrived, though they had error and heresy, but with this method, there was far greater protection than you can possibly imagine under a hierarchical system.

Yea.... There ain't no special language given only to you by God... Sorry!!!
Paul
You are ALWAYS wrong when you deny TRUTH

1 Cor 13:1 "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels,"

1 Cor 14:1 - "Pursue love, and desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.
For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God, for no one understands him; however, in the spirit he speaks mysteries."

1 Cor 14:4 - "He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church. 5I wish you all spoke with tongues, but even more that you prophesied;"

Believe the Truth and you will know the Truth.
 

Pearl

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Those serverices are disorderly, God is of order, not chaos. friend. And, yes the verse does apply, we are to pray in private as Jesus's example.
I need to tell you that genuine praying in tongues is not disorderly. People do not need to pray loudly to pray in tongues and there is a certain buzz when the whole congregation join together to pray in the Spirit.
 

amadeus

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Yes, God is hindered by the languages of men.
God, I believe, is limited by men following their own wills instead of God's will. Men choose to sin and by that they limit God. They can do that until they run out of time.
The Bible is considered by most to be God's word, i.e.,
If the words written are not quickened within us by the Holy Spirit how are they different than these words from Deuteronomy spoken by satan to Jesus?

Mt 4:6And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.
Yes, cannot words be quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit within a person without regard as to which human language [if any] is being used?
His communication to people via the inspired authors. Because the source documents were written by men who wrote in different languages and to a different audience, their writings must be clearly and accurately translated into the languages of the readers. The most obvious solution is to use the language most clearly understood by the readers (or hearers). If the Truth is not clearly communicated, then God will be misunderstood.
Does not clear communication from God come to man by the Holy Spirit rather than by a man's diligent study and logical thinking? Men limit God by their ways which may or may not be connected to the human language involved.

Ps 78:41Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.

In my mind, the best translation for any person is the translation that they understand most clearly, i.e., the one that most accurately communicates the words and meanings of the earliest and best documents to the reader's mind in her/his own language.

Perhaps the translation a person understands most clearly is best for him. Should we be deciding which is, or is not, the most clear one for someone else?

In my own case the one that has been clear is the KJV which I have been reading daily along with Spanish and German translations for more than 45 years. In the lowest room God has often used those words I have read to accomplish His purpose in me. I would not however expect anyone else to change what they read or study because of me or my experience. Let them follow God as they are led by the Holy Spirit.
 

JunChosen

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problem related to praying in tongues​


Why is it that Christians who has no idea about the the things of God, come to the market place of the world, and tries to sell their goods (knowledge) to others NOT really knowing what they are selling? Case in point, the Tongues Phenomenon?

Actually, this tongues phenomenon is summed up in 1 Corinthians Chapters 12, 13, 14. But do your diligence!!! This tongues phenomenon is summed up in 1 Corinthians Chapter 14. Verse 21 below literally happened to National Israel, which reads:
21 In the law it is written, With [men of] other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.
22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying [serveth] not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.
23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in [those that are] unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?
24 But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or [one] unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:
25 And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on [his] face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth.

Jesus said in John 14:14-18:

14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do [it].
15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
17 [Even] the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

The above is just a guideline of the Tongues Phenomenon. If there be questions I will respond to the best of my ability as the Holy Spirit moves me.

To God Be The Glory
 
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Jim B

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God, I believe, is limited by men following their own wills instead of God's will. Men choose to sin and by that they limit God. They can do that until they run out of time.

If the words written are not quickened within us by the Holy Spirit how are they different than these words from Deuteronomy spoken by satan to Jesus?

Mt 4:6And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.
Yes, cannot words be quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit within a person without regard as to which human language [if any] is being used?

Does not clear communication from God come to man by the Holy Spirit rather than by a man's diligent study and logical thinking? Men limit God by their ways which may or may not be connected to the human language involved.

Ps 78:41Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.



Perhaps the translation a person understands most clearly is best for him. Should we be deciding which is, or is not, the most clear one for someone else?

In my own case the one that has been clear is the KJV which I have been reading daily along with Spanish and German translations for more than 45 years. In the lowest room God has often used those words I have read to accomplish His purpose in me. I would not however expect anyone else to change what they read or study because of me or my experience. Let them follow God as they are led by the Holy Spirit.
Why are you repeatedly changing the subject?

I wrote "Yes, God is hindered by the languages of men."
You responded "God, I believe, is limited by men following their own wills instead of God's will. Men choose to sin and by that they limit God. They can do that until they run out of time." Change of subject.

I wrote "The Bible is considered by most to be God's word"
You responded "If the words written are not quickened within us by the Holy Spirit how are they different than these words from Deuteronomy spoken by satan to Jesus?" and "Yes, cannot words be quickened [brought to Life] by the Holy Spirit within a person without regard as to which human language [if any] is being used?"

I wrote "His communication to people via the inspired authors. Because the source documents were written by men who wrote in different languages and to a different audience, their writings must be clearly and accurately translated into the languages of the readers. The most obvious solution is to use the language most clearly understood by the readers (or hearers). If the Truth is not clearly communicated, then God will be misunderstood."

You responded "Does not clear communication from God come to man by the Holy Spirit rather than by a man's diligent study and logical thinking? Men limit God by their ways which may or may not be connected to the human language involved."

You finished your post with "In my own case the one that has been clear is the KJV which I have been reading daily along with Spanish and German translations for more than 45 years. In the lowest room God has often used those words I have read to accomplish His purpose in me. I would not however expect anyone else to change what they read or study because of me or my experience. Let them follow God as they are led by the Holy Spirit."

Where is "the lowest room"? If you're referring to Luke 14, "lowest room" is a mistranslation. Banquets were held in one room; a correct translation of "lowest room" is "lowest place" or "least important place". I suggest that you read a more modern, more accurate translation then the KJV.