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Behold

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What is the end result of your Salvation supposed to exist as....= what is it supposed to look like, to become.....while you are on the earth?

Saint, God saved you, out of Mercy. Out of His great love for you, God became one of us to offer "the Gift of Salvation" to all of us.
If you are born again, its because of God's great mercy that He has extended to you, as the Blood of Jesus and Death of Christ..
We didnt deserve it, and we didn't earn it, and you can't keep it of yourself as Salvation is all of God, through Christ's redemptive Blood that is = charged to you, imputed to you, given to you as a GIFT. = "The GIFT of Salvation".
Philippians 1:6
God did not give you His Grace, so that you can now get on some self righteous mental Track and run around it like a worried pony, hoping you can stay in the race and barely make it into heaven.
So, if that is how you believe, the i have good news for you.
You are ALREADY in Heaven, "in Christ" and you are simply waiting for the day you arrive when you get your new body.
That's the reality for all the born again, as all the born again are "seated in heavenly places, in Christ".

Now...Here are 2 things you must BELIEVE about God's Gift of Mercy, "the Gift of Salvation"

1. You can't lose it.
2. It has nothing to do with you earning it or keeping it.

So what does this mean?
It means that despite you, God saved you anyway, and despite your behavior after you are saved, God's Mercy for you still endures forever. And that is because God's Blood is always greater than your Sin. And why? Because Jesus became your sin, 2000 ago. "It is Finished".

"Where sin abounds, GRACE more abounds".
Saint, i have an update for you....... Its this..... The day God saved you He already knew about every carnal deed, every wrong thought, every SIN you would commit after He saved you, and GOD saved you anyway...
So the next time you are investing yourself into some carnal deed, just remember that God, on the day you were saved......knew you would do it....and He saved you anyway.
Its important that you realize this.....


Paraphrase : No matter how awful you were before God saved you, God saved you anyway. And no matter how often you fall after you are saved, you are still born and and will go to heaven.
Take comfort in that Truth. As that is the Mercy of God, that saves you and keeps you saved.
Saint, God did not save you because you are good enough....He saved you because Jesus's shed BLOOD made it eternally possible for you to be accepted by God, and kept by God.
Thats the bottom line..

Welcome to Salvation.

--------------------------------------------------------


Now having said all that......lets us now dig deeper..
You are become a disciple of Christ if you are born again, and you should understand that the goal of working out your salvation, does have a completed place.
Not many born again even get close to it, but, you are suppose to end up somewhere, spiritually speaking....on this earth.
You are supposed to ARRIVE somewhere....while you are alive....after you are born again that is THE place of full spiritual development.

Paul calls this..>"as many as Be perfect".

Now, what is going to stunt your spiritual growth?
What is going to hinder it, drag it down, and stop it if possible.?
That would be the Devil and His gospel and you believing it.
Saint....Satan's Gospel, is mainly designed and delivered = to get your self righteousness developed instead of your Christ-likeness.
So, what he wants you to do is BELIEVE you have to continue to work for your salvation, and strive to be at peace with God, by sinning and confessing and keeping commandments and doing doing doing doing works.
If that is what you are doing, then you have been blinded and are now a slave to a Satanic Gospel of Works.

Listen....I could literally take 100,000 believers, world wide, from any denomination, and ask them if they are sinning and confessing, and then ask them why.
And their answer will be...>"well, i was told that i would sin, and then i would need to confess, so, ive been doing what i was told all my Christian LIFE", as this is what im supposed to be doing.....ISNT IT ?????

And who told you that?
The Devil's minister.
See...."The Devil comes as an angel of Light and his MINISTERS = as ministers of RIGHTEOUSNESS".
In other words they are FAKES. Counterfeits. CON Jobs.
And so, sinning and confessing Saints per 100,000 worldwide are found doing what the Devil told them to do that he said......"all christians do it".
Most Christians believe they are supposed to be sinning and confessing.
However, that is not what Paul Teaches, and certainly the Blood of Jesus has all power to keep YOU from living the same sinning LIFESTYLE as an unbeliever, with the only difference being the unbeliever does not feel guilty and confess....as the only difference between the 2 groups.

So, Saint, can you see that something is wrong with the Sinning and Confessing deceit gospel?
Listen, if you are living that lie, that lifestyle, then how can you ever make it to the end result stage of Real Christianity?
A.) You can't and you never will.

Now, lets solve this blindness, lets get you out of a mental stronghold and onto the main course toward you becoming what you are born again to become on this EARTH.

Q.) What is the end result of your earthly Christianity supposed to be?

1.A) You are to BECOME "The Fullness of the Stature of Christ".... on Earth. "As many as be PERFECTED".

And how does Paul explain this ?
He says...."as many as be PERFECT"...
Notice...he says....as BE.....Perfect......not becoming, or striving to be, or on the way, or, nearly there.
He is showing you that you can, on this earth, become PERFECT, regarding your Christianity, which manifests as perfected discipleship.

So, here is the thing... Spiritual Perfection, is not about dealing with Temptation or trying to imitate Christ.
See, Jesus was tempted just like you, but without sin.
In His case, there was no redeemer and there was no eternal payment for His Sin, had he ever committed one, which He did not.
But in our case, we have eternal purging of ALL sin, through Christ's CROSS... and we have an eternal advocate in Heaven who is our redeemer who Himself on the Cross became our sin.
Christ has resolved the judgment due us, by receiving the full "CUP" of God's wrath poured out on HIM, so that we will never be judged in eternity for them,= because Christ has ALREADY been judged on EARTH for them ALL.
ALL.
ALL.
ALL.
So, for each of us who is born again,= the "sin" issue was resolved on the Cross 2000 yrs ago....> as evidenced by the Risen Christ who is now INSIDE YOU.
Make sure you see this, clearly.
And make certain you understand that God is literally found where no sin is found, and that is in 2 places.
1. Heaven
2. Inside your Born Again Spirit

So, what is the Perfected place that is the end result of what is expected of us down here?

A.) Right Understanding of Who you have become as a New Creation in Christ.

We are all to have the SAME MIND, all operating together in the Mind of Christ, in total unity, = PERFECTED in our FAITH.
We are all to reach this position, and when we are found sinning and confessing as our belief system, then real discipleship has not even started yet.

Saint, sinning and confessing does not do anything for you, except that it helps with your guilt trip.
Confessing your sin, does not cause Jesus to go back to the Cross and bleed all over again......now does it?
Confessing your sin does not cause to to be re-born again, now does it.?
No.
God as Christ on the Cross died ONCE, and His Blood & Death is the only redemption that was given to humanity long before you showed up and believed in Jesus, and had this Blood Atonement applied to all your sin by God.

Now finally....
What is the Mind of a person who is walking in the Light, in the mind of Christ, which is to have your salvation worked out, = which finds your spiritual life governed by the knowledge of the Truth.?
See, its in this place, that you will operate Spiritually, as the "fullness of the Stature of Christ".

Here is what Paul says. "when we WALK IN THE SPIRIT (the right mind) (the mind of Christ) then we will not fulfill works of the flesh".
Saint, to fulfill the works of the Flesh, is to be owned and operated by your carnal desires, having no ability to stop, which leads you to confessing and repenting as a totally ruined discipleship.
Is that you?

See, its not by striving to stop sinning that you stop.....This only activates your sin consciousness,...= sin becomes more alive, more lustful.. and completely impossible to resist.
So, to stop, .....to have control over your own carnality,.... is not to resist it, but its to put it away, as DEAD.....and to do that, you have to live in the place of peace with God, where you have stopped trying to PERFORM to be accepted, and have fully and completely rested in the "finished work of Jesus" within your UNDERSTANDING = as WHY God took you and WHY God Keeps you, forever.
When you FULLY ARRIVE THERE, in your BELIEF SYSTEM, then your FAITH is now developed, and you are come into the place where perfected discipleship exits.
You are here : Hebrews 13:9

When you get there, you are now living in the Light of the Knowledge of the Truth, and you have discovered the most important KEY towards becoming perfected,within your Discipleship.
Saint...
Christian Discipleship, perfected, starts and stands with exiting in the renewed mind that is the understanding of who you have become, as a new creation, as you literally exist Spiritually AS "the righteousness of God in Christ"..
 

Robert Gwin

Well-Known Member
Mar 19, 2021
6,888
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Central Il
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-
What is the end result of your Salvation supposed to exist as....= what is it supposed to look like, to become.....while you are on the earth?

Saint, God saved you, out of Mercy. Out of His great love for you, God became one of us to offer "the Gift of Salvation" to all of us.
If you are born again, its because of God's great mercy that He has extended to you, as the Blood of Jesus and Death of Christ..
We didnt deserve it, and we didn't earn it, and you can't keep it of yourself as Salvation is all of God, through Christ's redemptive Blood that is = charged to you, imputed to you, given to you as a GIFT. = "The GIFT of Salvation".
Philippians 1:6
God did not give you His Grace, so that you can now get on some self righteous mental Track and run around it like a worried pony, hoping you can stay in the race and barely make it into heaven.
So, if that is how you believe, the i have good news for you.
You are ALREADY in Heaven, "in Christ" and you are simply waiting for the day you arrive when you get your new body.
That's the reality for all the born again, as all the born again are "seated in heavenly places, in Christ".

Now...Here are 2 things you must BELIEVE about God's Gift of Mercy, "the Gift of Salvation"

1. You can't lose it.
2. It has nothing to do with you earning it or keeping it.

So what does this mean?
It means that despite you, God saved you anyway, and despite your behavior after you are saved, God's Mercy for you still endures forever. And that is because God's Blood is always greater than your Sin. And why? Because Jesus became your sin, 2000 ago. "It is Finished".

"Where sin abounds, GRACE more abounds".
Saint, i have an update for you....... Its this..... The day God saved you He already knew about every carnal deed, every wrong thought, every SIN you would commit after He saved you, and GOD saved you anyway...
So the next time you are investing yourself into some carnal deed, just remember that God, on the day you were saved......knew you would do it....and He saved you anyway.
Its important that you realize this.....


Paraphrase : No matter how awful you were before God saved you, God saved you anyway. And no matter how often you fall after you are saved, you are still born and and will go to heaven.
Take comfort in that Truth. As that is the Mercy of God, that saves you and keeps you saved.
Saint, God did not save you because you are good enough....He saved you because Jesus's shed BLOOD made it eternally possible for you to be accepted by God, and kept by God.
Thats the bottom line..

Welcome to Salvation.

--------------------------------------------------------


Now having said all that......lets us now dig deeper..
You are become a disciple of Christ if you are born again, and you should understand that the goal of working out your salvation, does have a completed place.
Not many born again even get close to it, but, you are suppose to end up somewhere, spiritually speaking....on this earth.
You are supposed to ARRIVE somewhere....while you are alive....after you are born again that is THE place of full spiritual development.

Paul calls this..>"as many as Be perfect".

Now, what is going to stunt your spiritual growth?
What is going to hinder it, drag it down, and stop it if possible.?
That would be the Devil and His gospel and you believing it.
Saint....Satan's Gospel, is mainly designed and delivered = to get your self righteousness developed instead of your Christ-likeness.
So, what he wants you to do is BELIEVE you have to continue to work for your salvation, and strive to be at peace with God, by sinning and confessing and keeping commandments and doing doing doing doing works.
If that is what you are doing, then you have been blinded and are now a slave to a Satanic Gospel of Works.

Listen....I could literally take 100,000 believers, world wide, from any denomination, and ask them if they are sinning and confessing, and then ask them why.
And their answer will be...>"well, i was told that i would sin, and then i would need to confess, so, ive been doing what i was told all my Christian LIFE", as this is what im supposed to be doing.....ISNT IT ?????

And who told you that?
The Devil's minister.
See...."The Devil comes as an angel of Light and his MINISTERS = as ministers of RIGHTEOUSNESS".
In other words they are FAKES. Counterfeits. CON Jobs.
And so, sinning and confessing Saints per 100,000 worldwide are found doing what the Devil told them to do that he said......"all christians do it".
Most Christians believe they are supposed to be sinning and confessing.
However, that is not what Paul Teaches, and certainly the Blood of Jesus has all power to keep YOU from living the same sinning LIFESTYLE as an unbeliever, with the only difference being the unbeliever does not feel guilty and confess....as the only difference between the 2 groups.

So, Saint, can you see that something is wrong with the Sinning and Confessing deceit gospel?
Listen, if you are living that lie, that lifestyle, then how can you ever make it to the end result stage of Real Christianity?
A.) You can't and you never will.

Now, lets solve this blindness, lets get you out of a mental stronghold and onto the main course toward you becoming what you are born again to become on this EARTH.

Q.) What is the end result of your earthly Christianity supposed to be?

1.A) You are to BECOME "The Fullness of the Stature of Christ".... on Earth. "As many as be PERFECTED".

And how does Paul explain this ?
He says...."as many as be PERFECT"...
Notice...he says....as BE.....Perfect......not becoming, or striving to be, or on the way, or, nearly there.
He is showing you that you can, on this earth, become PERFECT, regarding your Christianity, which manifests as perfected discipleship.

So, here is the thing... Spiritual Perfection, is not about dealing with Temptation or trying to imitate Christ.
See, Jesus was tempted just like you, but without sin.
In His case, there was no redeemer and there was no eternal payment for His Sin, had he ever committed one, which He did not.
But in our case, we have eternal purging of ALL sin, through Christ's CROSS... and we have an eternal advocate in Heaven who is our redeemer who Himself on the Cross became our sin.
Christ has resolved the judgment due us, by receiving the full "CUP" of God's wrath poured out on HIM, so that we will never be judged in eternity for them,= because Christ has ALREADY been judged on EARTH for them ALL.
ALL.
ALL.
ALL.
So, for each of us who is born again,= the "sin" issue was resolved on the Cross 2000 yrs ago....> as evidenced by the Risen Christ who is now INSIDE YOU.
Make sure you see this, clearly.
And make certain you understand that God is literally found where no sin is found, and that is in 2 places.
1. Heaven
2. Inside your Born Again Spirit

So, what is the Perfected place that is the end result of what is expected of us down here?

A.) Right Understanding of Who you have become as a New Creation in Christ.

We are all to have the SAME MIND, all operating together in the Mind of Christ, in total unity, = PERFECTED in our FAITH.
We are all to reach this position, and when we are found sinning and confessing as our belief system, then real discipleship has not even started yet.

Saint, sinning and confessing does not do anything for you, except that it helps with your guilt trip.
Confessing your sin, does not cause Jesus to go back to the Cross and bleed all over again......now does it?
Confessing your sin does not cause to to be re-born again, now does it.?
No.
God as Christ on the Cross died ONCE, and His Blood & Death is the only redemption that was given to humanity long before you showed up and believed in Jesus, and had this Blood Atonement applied to all your sin by God.

Now finally....
What is the Mind of a person who is walking in the Light, in the mind of Christ, which is to have your salvation worked out, = which finds your spiritual life governed by the knowledge of the Truth.?
See, its in this place, that you will operate Spiritually, as the "fullness of the Stature of Christ".

Here is what Paul says. "when we WALK IN THE SPIRIT (the right mind) (the mind of Christ) then we will not fulfill works of the flesh".
Saint, to fulfill the works of the Flesh, is to be owned and operated by your carnal desires, having no ability to stop, which leads you to confessing and repenting as a totally ruined discipleship.
Is that you?

See, its not by striving to stop sinning that you stop.....This only activates your sin consciousness,...= sin becomes more alive, more lustful.. and completely impossible to resist.
So, to stop, .....to have control over your own carnality,.... is not to resist it, but its to put it away, as DEAD.....and to do that, you have to live in the place of peace with God, where you have stopped trying to PERFORM to be accepted, and have fully and completely rested in the "finished work of Jesus" within your UNDERSTANDING = as WHY God took you and WHY God Keeps you, forever.
When you FULLY ARRIVE THERE, in your BELIEF SYSTEM, then your FAITH is now developed, and you are come into the place where perfected discipleship exits.
You are here : Hebrews 13:9

When you get there, you are now living in the Light of the Knowledge of the Truth, and you have discovered the most important KEY towards becoming perfected,within your Discipleship.
Saint...
Christian Discipleship, perfected, starts and stands with exiting in the renewed mind that is the understanding of who you have become, as a new creation, as you literally exist Spiritually AS "the righteousness of God in Christ"..

Lots of words Be, the end result is this sir:
(Romans 6:23) . . .the wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord.
 

Behold

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Lots of words Be, the end result is this sir:
(Romans 6:23) . . .the wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord.

You are stating salvation, by faith in Christ.

My Thread is teaching how to exist in perfected discipleship, after you have received God's Gift of Redemption.
 

Robert Gwin

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Mar 19, 2021
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You are stating salvation, by faith in Christ.

My Thread is teaching how to exist in perfected discipleship, after you have received God's Gift of Redemption.

Jesus disciples become perfect at the end of his millennial reign Be. We will be equal to Adam when satan is released for our test. Sadly many will side with him Rev 20:8
 

Behold

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Jesus disciples become perfect at the end of his millennial reign

Paul teaches this... regarding the Believer in Yeshua, in the "time of the Gentiles".

We are to become "the fullness of the Stature of Christ", and we learn also how to exist as this... Paul teaches..."as many as be PERFECT".

We are to learn to do this while we are on earth, before we die.
This is to "work out your Salvation".
 

Robert Gwin

Well-Known Member
Mar 19, 2021
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Central Il
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Paul teaches this... regarding the Believer in Yeshua, in the "time of the Gentiles".

We are to become "the fullness of the Stature of Christ", and we learn also how to exist as this... Paul teaches..."as many as be PERFECT".

We are to learn to do this while we are on earth, before we die.
This is to "work out your Salvation".

Very true sir, all of us Christians are working toward perfection, working out our salvation, no most of us will not be able to achieve this before we die, but we do hope to endure to that point in our service to God.
 

Behold

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Apr 11, 2020
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Very true sir, all of us Christians are working toward perfection, working out our salvation, no most of us will not be able to achieve this before we die, but we do hope to endure to that point in our service to God.

When i was a new believer i was always trying to perform for God in my flesh, because i had no knowledge or revelation, yet.

He said,..... when you do it like that, you are this..."apart from me, you can do NOTHING".
And i was doing nothing and working so very hard.

He said..>"rest from all that, i have done the work for you on the Cross"....."take this Gift, and rest in it, and thereby find my power in you to live the holy life.... in the Grace i give that is your rest, that is the power and victory...=its found there".

"when you work, i rest"... "when you REST IN MY GRACE...I work through you".
 
Last edited:

Behold

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Yes you can.

Jesus is Salvation.
He is in you, if you are born again, and not just water baptized and pretending to be a Christian, yet hellbound.
So, Christ, who is Salvation, Redemption, Eternal life, has Joined His Spirit to the Spirit of the Born again.
There is no losing that.

Let me show you something.
The born again, exist, already, in Heaven.....the born again are "seated in Heavenly Places, in Christ".
This means that the born again are In God, and God is in the Born again.
What does that mean? regarding the lie you've been taught about "losing it".....it means that if a born again Christian went to hell, then God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit who are SEALED in them, in eternal spiritual union... would go to Hell with them.

A person who has been deceived into the idea that Salvation can be lost, does not understand salvation., and in my many years of experience, they dont want to know about it, as this robs them of the joy so many of them feel when they try to deceive real believers with the idea that salvation can be lost.
These deceived heretics ENJOY trying to ruin a real believer's faith in Christ.
Its a CARNAL THRILL for them.......to try to cause it with a Thread or a post on a forum, or using a sermon from a Pulpit. And their commentaries are LEGION.
 
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Robert Gwin

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Mar 19, 2021
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I use to work at it like a dog.
Striving, failing, worrying, no peace, feeling condemned.
I was a new believer then, and was trying to perform for God in my flesh, because i had no knowledge or revelation, yet.

He said,..... when you do it like that, you are this..."apart from me, you can do NOTHING".
And i was doing nothing and working so very hard.

He said..>"rest from all that, i have done the work for you on the Cross"....."take this Gift, and rest in it, and thereby find my power in you to live the holy life.... in the Grace i give that is your rest, that is the power and victory...=its found there".

"when you work, i rest"... "when you REST IN MY GRACE...I work through you".

Yes sir, most of us are very zealous when we first start our friendship with God, and then we cool a bit. We just want to make sure we do not cool off too much Heb 5:11-14