Revelation 15 Sign

[Heb 13:8]

I just wanted to share what I learned about Rev 15 sign. Some are saying this sign marks the end of the 70th week (2520 days). Very few are discussing it. Blessings, - Heb 13:8

Fisher Man.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf1GuiGlvk4
TheHumbleHorse.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4EUJMKm3jg
ecrusymphony.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0EaGIUod6k

Cup of wrath.. http://www.constellationsofwords.com/images/Pleiades.jpg

Matt 24:30 “Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.

Rev 14:10 they, too, will drink the wine of God's fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb.

Rev 15:1-8 I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed.

Rev 16:19 The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath.

"Since the Pleiades appears to be a cup shape, Robert Breaker suggests the Pleiades may represent the seven angels with seven vials. Robert Breaker also mentioned that there was some significance of 2,520 days from the Sign of the Woman on September 23, 2017. He did not indicate what event in the heavens the 2,520 days highlighted".. http://watchfortheday.org/rev15.html

"Now it's my understanding that if one continues to track Jupiter through the sky after it leaves Virgo that it will arrive in the constellation Taurus with Pleiades near by 2520 days later. How long is 2520 days?........7 years or the total span of the tribulation period. Wow!!!".. http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/march2017/johnb35-2.htm

 

[Mungo]

Robert Breaker also mentioned that there was some significance of 2,520 days from the Sign of the Woman on September 23, 2017.

In another thread you said about Sep 23 2017 - "This will be my only post about this date"

Just thought I would remind you.

 

[Heb 13:8]

In another thread you said about Sep 23 2017 - "This will be my only post about this date"

Just thought I would remind you.

The other thread is about Rev 12 Sign. This thread is about Rev 15 Sign. Two signs, two threads.

 

[Wormwood]

““No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left. “Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.” (Matthew 24:36–44, NIV84)

The only "sign" Jesus speaks of is the fact that there will be no sign. His coming will be like a thief. Last I checked, thieves do not go around leaving signs and clues that they are about to rob a person. The point is to always be ready because there will be no signs. In fact, Jesus specifically warns about those who go on about earthquakes, famines, wars and rumors of wars. The end is "not yet." The end is not brought about by such events, rather it comes unexpectedly, like the flood...which is why we are ALWAYS to be alert and ready for his coming. Noah didn't know exactly what day the rain would come until God told him to get in the boat. He prepared for years and years, not knowing the exact day..but building the boat in faith. The whole point of EVERY discussion Jesus gives on his second coming is that no one will know, but wise servants remain faithful because they do not know when their master will return. They do not want to be caught off guard.

 

[Mungo]

The other thread is about Rev 12 Sign. This thread is about Rev 15 Sign. Two signs, two threads.

Same date!

"This will be my only post about this date" is what you said.

 

[Heb 13:8]

His coming will be like a thief.

He's coming like a thief to nonbelievers, those who are not in Christ.

The woman is pregnant right now as we speak and will give birth in September of 2017.

1 Thess 5:1-5 Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. 4 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness.

The only "sign" Jesus speaks of is the fact that there will be no sign.

But there is a sign. There's actually two signs.

(1.) The first one is called a "great sign".

http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/23596-92317-rev-125-x-etc/

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/XXxVwpcXV0U/maxresdefault.jpg

Rev 12:1-5 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman (Israel) clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head. 2 She (Israel) was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth. 3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon (Satan) with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on its heads. 4 Its tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon (Satan) stood in front of the woman (Israel) who was about to give birth, so that it might devour her child (teknon the church) the moment he was born. 5 She gave birth to a son (huios Jesus Christ himself), a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.” And her child (teknon the church) was snatched up (harpazo) to God and to his throne.

(2.) The second one is called "a great and marvelous sign".

http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/23604-revelation-15-sign/

Rev 15:1-8 I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed. 2 And I saw what looked like a sea of glass glowing with fire and, standing beside the sea, those who had been victorious over the beast and its image and over the number of its name. They held harps given them by God 3 and sang the song of God’s servant Moses and of the Lamb: “Great and marvelous are your deeds, Lord God Almighty. Just and true are your ways, King of the nations. 4 Who will not fear you, Lord, and bring glory to your name? For you alone are holy. All nations will come and worship before you, for your righteous acts have been revealed.” 5 After this I looked, and I saw in heaven the temple—that is, the tabernacle of the covenant law—and it was opened. 6 Out of the temple came the seven angels with the seven plagues. They were dressed in clean, shining linen and wore golden sashes around their chests. 7 Then one of the four living creatures gave to the seven angels seven golden bowls filled with the wrath of God, who lives for ever and ever. 8 And the temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God and from his power, and no one could enter the temple until the seven plagues of the seven angels were completed.

Same date!

"This will be my only post about this date" is what you said.

No, the Rev 12 sign comes to pass in September of 2017. The Rev 15 sign I believe comes to pass in May of 2024.

 

[Wormwood]

He's coming like a thief to nonbelievers, those who are not in Christ.

Um, no. Jesus was speaking to his disciples when he made those comments. Go read the text again.

The woman is pregnant right now as we speak and will give birth in September of 2017.

Im sure a lot of pregnant women will give birth in September of 2017.

“Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. But you, brothers, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. You are all sons of the light and sons of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us be alert and self-controlled. For those who sleep, sleep at night, and those who get drunk, get drunk at night. But since we belong to the day, let us be self-controlled, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. He died for us so that, whether we are awake or asleep, we may live together with him. Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.” (1 Thessalonians 5:1–11, NIV84)

Notice the point here, friend. The point is not that Paul is suggesting that there are "signs" for these believers to be aware of. No, he is saying, "That day wont surprise us because we live every day like today could be the day." That is the point. We live lives that are "self-controlled" and of "faith and love" and with "the hope of salvation." This is what keeps the believer from being caught off guard....not some goofy signs that tip them off about some nonsense of specific dates and times. Paul specifically says in verse 1 that "times and dates we do not need to write you, for you know very well that the Day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night." In other words, there is no point talking about dates and times because no one knows those things. We just live holy lives full of faith expecting any. day could be the day. Make sense?

(1.) The first one is called a "great sign".

Um, first, this "sign" John speaks of is recounting what he was seeing in a vision and signs and images he was looking at. Second, this "sign" is referring to the birth of Jesus...which is abundantly clear. So, I suppose if you believe this text is talking about a "sign" then I guess the "sign" is that Jesus would be born...mission accomplished.

(2.) The second one is called "a great and marvelous sign"

Good grief. Well, first of all, this is again, something John is recounting in his vision. He is not talking about some sign believers will see to know the end is near. He is talking about signs that appeared to him in heaven when he was having his vision. Second, the book of Revelation consists of several visions John has...7 letters, 7 seals, 7 trumpets, Woman & Dragon, 7 Plagues, etc... The signs he sees are in reference to these different visions. Finally, if you are so sure there are "signs" to see...how do we know you aren't being duped by false "signs" and leading people astray? After all, it seems John sees the beast doing a lot of "signs" as well.

The fact is, every prophecy guru wants to create their own timelines and events that depict some great "sign" or prophecy is coming to pass and they alone have the secrets to understand it. The reality is, none of this is what Revelation is about. It is a message that encourages faithfulness...not sign-seeking and fortune telling.

 

[Heb 13:8]

Um, no. Jesus was speaking to his disciples when he made those comments. Go read the text again.

Yeah, and he said to his disciples that you are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. Jesus is coming like a thief to nonbelievers. They won't and cannot understand this sign (1 Cor 2:14). But believers will (John 10:27).

1 Thess 5:1-5 Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. 4 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness.

Im sure a lot of pregnant women will give birth in September of 2017.

Israel is the woman and she will give birth to the church this September. This birth takes place in the heavens where the sun, moon, stars and planets reside.

not some goofy signs that tip them off about some nonsense of specific dates and times. Paul specifically says in verse 1 that "times and dates we do not need to write you, for you know very well that the Day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night." In other words, there is no point talking about dates and times because no one knows those things.

Rev 12:1-5 sign is goofy to you? ouch. No, Paul is telling us there is no point talking about dates and times because believers are not in darkness so that this day should surprise them like a thief. "Brothers and sisters" are referring to believers in Christ. They are the light of the day and do not belong to the darkness.

Um, first, this "sign" John speaks of is recounting what he was seeing in a vision and signs and images he was looking at. Second, this "sign" is referring to the birth of Jesus...which is abundantly clear. So, I suppose if you believe this text is talking about a "sign" then I guess the "sign" is that Jesus would be born...mission accomplished.

Right, and this vision he saw is coming to pass in the heavens on 9/23/17.

Right, it is referring to the birth of Jesus. This sign is connecting the head with the body. Jesus is the head of the church which came out of the womb 2,000 years ago, and the body (the church/born again christians) will be birthed in September of 2017.

Notice John is connecting the head with the body by using the words "huios" and "teknon". Jesus Christ, along with the church will rule and have authority over all the nations with an iron scepter.

Rev 2:26-27 To the one who is victorious and does my will to the end, I will give authority over the nations— 27that one ‘will rule them with an iron scepter and will dash them to pieces like pottery’ —just as I have received authority from my Father.

Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son (huios Jesus Christ himself), a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.” And her child (teknon the church) was snatched up (harpazo) to God and to his throne.

Good grief. Well, first of all, this is again, something John is recounting in his vision. He is not talking about some sign believers will see to know the end is near. He is talking about signs that appeared to him in heaven when he was having his vision. Second, the book of Revelation consists of several visions John has...7 letters, 7 seals, 7 trumpets, Woman & Dragon, 7 Plagues, etc... The signs he sees are in reference to these different visions. Finally, if you are so sure there are "signs" to see...how do we know you aren't being duped by false "signs" and leading people astray? After all, it seems John sees the beast doing a lot of "signs" as well.

Rev 15 is another vision he saw, and this sign will come to pass at the end of the 70th week when the bowl judgments are poured out. It is yet still future. I do believe this sign will come to pass in the heavens in 2024, 7 years later. The one thing that you're not getting is that these three signs take place in the heavens where the sun, moon, stars and planets reside....

Rev 12:1-3 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head. 2She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth. 3Then another sign appeared in heaven (Planet X): an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on its heads.

Rev 15:1 I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed.

The fact is, every prophecy guru wants to create their own timelines and events that depict some great "sign" or prophecy is coming to pass and they alone have the secrets to understand it. The reality is, none of this is what Revelation is about. It is a message that encourages faithfulness...not sign-seeking and fortune telling.

This is exactly what Revelation is about, future prophecy. Old Testament and New. This isn't fortune telling. These are literal signs from God, and He is using the sun, moon and stars to guide us to the blessed hope, rapture.

 

[Mungo]

No, the Rev 12 sign comes to pass in September of 2017. The Rev 15 sign I believe comes to pass in May of 2024.

9/23/17, Rev 12:5, X etc.. - post #1 (many times) 9/23/17


Then "This will be my only post about this date."


Revelation 15 Sign - post #1 "September 23, 2017"


They are the same date.

 

[Heb 13:8]

9/23/17, Rev 12:5, X etc.. - post #1 (many times) 9/23/17

Then "This will be my only post about this date."

Revelation 15 Sign - post #1 "September 23, 2017"

They are the same date.

No, they're not. Rev 12 and Rev 15 signs are seven years apart.

 

[Mungo]

No, they're not. Rev 12 and Rev 15 signs are seven years apart.

9/23/17 and September 23 2017 are 7 years apart?

Your maths is as strange as your post.

100 years apart I could accept if by 9/23/17 you meant September 9 1917 but not 7 years

 

[Heb 13:8]

9/23/17 and September 23 2017 are 7 years apart?

Rev 12 and Rev 15 signs are seven years apart.

 

[Wormwood]

Yeah, and he said to his disciples that you are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. Jesus is coming like a thief to nonbelievers. They won't and cannot understand this sign (1 Cor 2:14). But believers will (John 10:27).

Yes, and notice that in 1 These 5 he gives no "signs" but rather tells them to live continually as those who are in the light and ready for Christ's return. According to you, the author was mistaken, because there was nothing for them to prepare for because those "signs" weren't coming for 2000 more years. This is sheer nonsense. Every single prophetic utterance Jesus gives about his second coming speaks only of being ready every day because no one knows the day. He NEVER says, "Well, if you are a really clever believer, you will see the codes and can narrow it down to within a month or so."


“So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.” (Matthew 24:44, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of the servants in his household to give them their food at the proper time? It will be good for that servant whose master finds him doing so when he returns.” (Matthew 24:45–46, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day or the hour.” (Matthew 25:13, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““His master replied, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master’s happiness!’” (Matthew 25:21, NIV84) (notice he doesn't say, "you figured out the key signs of my return so you knew when I would arrive"). The point is faithfulness, not predictive capabilities.

““The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.’” (Matthew 25:40, NIV84)

Notice ALL these illustrations: Noah's flood, the unmerciful servant, the 10 virgins, the parable of the talents and the sheep and goats have ONE common theme. They didn't know when it was coming, but the faithful and wise servant was ALWAYS ready because they lived every day like it was the day. Noah prepared his boat even though he didn't know when the flood was coming. The faithful servant gave out food and discharged his duties properly so he wasn't caught off guard like the wicked servant. The wise virgins brought enough oil to be ready whenever the bridegroom would arrive, the smart servants worked diligently with the master's talents expecting him to return any time and the sheep were those who feed, clothed and cared for the least of these continually in Jesus' absence. NOTHING in these passages speaks of predicting signs or foretelling events. Rather, the focus is to be faithful every day and you wont get surprised like those who arent looking for the sudden coming of Christ. You a terribly misusing scripture and obscuring the clear meaning of the text to turn it into some kind of silly Tom Hanks mystery code story.

Right, it is referring to the birth of Jesus. This sign is connecting the head with the body. Jesus is the head of the church which came out of the womb 2,000 years ago, and the body (the church/born again christians) will be birthed in September of 2017

wow...thats a slow birth. The head popped out 2000 years before the body? So you are suggesting that only Jesus, not the church, has been in existence the past 2000 years. The church wont come into existence until September 2017. Lemme guess, that is when you start your first church?

Sorry, I am done discussing these ideas. Even conversing about them gives them more credence then they are due.

 

[Heb 13:8]

Yes, and notice that in 1 These 5 he gives no "signs" but rather tells them to live continually as those who are in the light and ready for Christ's return. According to you, the author was mistaken, because there was nothing for them to prepare for because those "signs" weren't coming for 2000 more years. This is sheer nonsense. Every single prophetic utterance Jesus gives about his second coming speaks only of being ready every day because no one knows the day. He NEVER says, "Well, if you are a really clever believer, you will see the codes and can narrow it down to within a month or so."


“So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.” (Matthew 24:44, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of the servants in his household to give them their food at the proper time? It will be good for that servant whose master finds him doing so when he returns.” (Matthew 24:45–46, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day or the hour.” (Matthew 25:13, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““His master replied, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master’s happiness!’” (Matthew 25:21, NIV84) (notice he doesn't say, "you figured out the key signs of my return so you knew when I would arrive"). The point is faithfulness, not predictive capabilities.

““The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.’” (Matthew 25:40, NIV84)

Notice ALL these illustrations: Noah's flood, the unmerciful servant, the 10 virgins, the parable of the talents and the sheep and goats have ONE common theme. They didn't know when it was coming, but the faithful and wise servant was ALWAYS ready because they lived every day like it was the day. Noah prepared his boat even though he didn't know when the flood was coming. The faithful servant gave out food and discharged his duties properly so he wasn't caught off guard like the wicked servant. The wise virgins brought enough oil to be ready whenever the bridegroom would arrive, the smart servants worked diligently with the master's talents expecting him to return any time and the sheep were those who feed, clothed and cared for the least of these continually in Jesus' absence. NOTHING in these passages speaks of predicting signs or foretelling events. Rather, the focus is to be faithful every day and you wont get surprised like those who arent looking for the sudden coming of Christ. You a terribly misusing scripture and obscuring the clear meaning of the text to turn it into some kind of silly Tom Hanks mystery code story.

I would disagree. God fulfilled the first four feasts down to the day, and He will do so at rapture also. The word for "feast" in Hebrew is translated "moed" which means appointed time or place. The Feast of Trumpets is the next feast to be fulfilled, which is rapture. The rapture is not on some random day on the Gregorian calender. God has an appointed time for everything He does.

wow...thats a slow birth. The head popped out 2000 years before the body? So you are suggesting that only Jesus, not the church, has been in existence the past 2000 years. The church wont come into existence until September 2017. Lemme guess, that is when you start your first church?

Sorry, I am done discussing these ideas. Even conversing about them gives them more credence then they are due.

No Wormwood, the church has been in gestation for 2,000 years. The birthing of the church at Pentecost 2,000 years ago resulted in being born again John 3:3. The birthing of the church in September 2017 will result in our newly resurrected bodies at rapture. We will change from corruptible to incorruptible in the twinkling of an eye 1 Cor 15:50-54.

If you study the birth of the church you will see Virgo giving birth to Jupiter in September of 2017. Jupiter is the king planet which represents Christ and also the body (the church) that is in Christ. When you become saved the Holy Spirit indwells you, and you become one with the body of Christ. God is using a birthing metaphor to describe the conception of the church 2,000 years ago, and He is also using a birthing metaphor in the end times by using the sun, moon, stars and planets. The conception of the church began at Pentecost 2,000 years ago and has been in gestation for 2,000 years up until now. Jesus Christ is the head of the church, and born again Christians are the body. The head came out of the womb when Jesus was resurrected and ascended to heaven 2,000 years ago.

When you study a natural birth of a baby being born the head comes out first, then the body. The body of Jesus Christ which is the church (Jupiter) entered Virgo's womb in November of 2016 and is in a gestation period right now. The church will be birthed in September of 2017 which will be 42 weeks in the womb (a normal gestation period for a natural birth).

 

[ezekiel]

Revelations 15. To really understand it you will need to understand the building of the temple in Ezekiel 40. As the brass man builds it. Again in Ezekiel 8 as these stars also builds it. John is looking at these stars as they are moving, note sea of glass mingled with fire. Its not the first time they came because they sing the song of Moses. The three dwarf stars plus our star are hear and will build the new heavens. Now you have herd of warming of earth. Now hear the real story. Look close at the vials only, I have put the in correct order. What will you see nothing but a increase of heat. Planets will be hitting each other and new orbits of the stars coming rather hear now. Again now you can understand Revelations 15 the truth.

 

[ezekiel]

Read Isaiah 30. I will explain going down into Egypt. What God is saying is that you will take of others thinking and not seek God for yourself. Also don't hear the ones that are right. Your prophecy will fall apart.

2 That walk to go down into Egypt, and have not asked at my mouth; to strengthen themselves in the strength of Pharaoh, and to trust in the shadow of Egypt!

 

[ezekiel]

Moreover just some things to discern. listen closely. When God speaks of Jerusalem is it on earth in heaven or another earth, the text will describe it.When God describes a sea is it a ocean, people or the waters the planets travel thru. Again the text reveals it. Trees now when Christ healed the bind man he seen men as trees, this is simple put mud in your eyes that you see like men or get the mud out of you eyes so that you see as God sees that you may understand. See as that great Spirit sees. Now the angel that stands on the earth and one foot also on the sea he is talking to people, but yet in Revelations 15 its the waters, rather the sea the planets travel in. Now the temple is it in heaven or earth the text again shows you that also. Another thing none knows that its not 666 know one. God say count that number but you don't, in Hebrew count that number, but don't forget and, and, and, and, and, and, and. I can not say it more so that you know that it separates that number.

 

[tabletalk]

Yes, and notice that in 1 These 5 he gives no "signs" but rather tells them to live continually as those who are in the light and ready for Christ's return. According to you, the author was mistaken, because there was nothing for them to prepare for because those "signs" weren't coming for 2000 more years. This is sheer nonsense. Every single prophetic utterance Jesus gives about his second coming speaks only of being ready every day because no one knows the day. He NEVER says, "Well, if you are a really clever believer, you will see the codes and can narrow it down to within a month or so."


“So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.” (Matthew 24:44, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of the servants in his household to give them their food at the proper time? It will be good for that servant whose master finds him doing so when he returns.” (Matthew 24:45–46, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day or the hour.” (Matthew 25:13, NIV84) SPOKEN TO HIS DISCIPLES

““His master replied, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master’s happiness!’” (Matthew 25:21, NIV84) (notice he doesn't say, "you figured out the key signs of my return so you knew when I would arrive"). The point is faithfulness, not predictive capabilities.

““The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.’” (Matthew 25:40, NIV84)

Notice ALL these illustrations: Noah's flood, the unmerciful servant, the 10 virgins, the parable of the talents and the sheep and goats have ONE common theme. They didn't know when it was coming, but the faithful and wise servant was ALWAYS ready because they lived every day like it was the day. Noah prepared his boat even though he didn't know when the flood was coming. The faithful servant gave out food and discharged his duties properly so he wasn't caught off guard like the wicked servant. The wise virgins brought enough oil to be ready whenever the bridegroom would arrive, the smart servants worked diligently with the master's talents expecting him to return any time and the sheep were those who feed, clothed and cared for the least of these continually in Jesus' absence. NOTHING in these passages speaks of predicting signs or foretelling events. Rather, the focus is to be faithful every day and you wont get surprised like those who arent looking for the sudden coming of Christ. You a terribly misusing scripture and obscuring the clear meaning of the text to turn it into some kind of silly Tom Hanks mystery code story.


wow...thats a slow birth. The head popped out 2000 years before the body? So you are suggesting that only Jesus, not the church, has been in existence the past 2000 years. The church wont come into existence until September 2017. Lemme guess, that is when you start your first church?

Sorry, I am done discussing these ideas. Even conversing about them gives them more credence then they are due.

A quote from Jeremiah 23 about false prophets might be appropriate here:

"15 “Therefore thus says the Lord of hosts concerning the prophets:

‘Behold, I will feed them with wormwood,
And make them drink the water of gall;
For from the prophets of Jerusalem
Profaneness has gone out into all the land.’”

 

[Heb 13:8]

A quote from Jeremiah 23 about false prophets might be appropriate here:

"15 “Therefore thus says the Lord of hosts concerning the prophets:

‘Behold, I will feed them with wormwood,
And make them drink the water of gall;
For from the prophets of Jerusalem
Profaneness has gone out into all the land.’”

Hi tabletalk,

Jesus will actually come like a thief to nonbelievers. He commands us to wake up and look for His soon return.

1 Thess 5:4-11 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. 6So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us be awake and sober. 7For those who sleep, sleep at night, and those who get drunk, get drunk at night. 8But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. 9For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. 10He died for us so that, whether we are awake or asleep, we may live together with him. 11Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.

Rev 3:3 Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; hold it fast, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you.

 

[ezekiel]

Look even closer. We look up at the cosmos the waters below. If being in the waters above you will be looking down on the cosmos.
And above the cosmos are even larger realm.

Genesis 1:6
And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.


Psalm 148:4
Praise him, ye heavens of heavens, and ye waters that be above the heavens.

And even more so the heavens above that and again above that again a larger realm.


Psalm 148:4
Praise him, ye heavens of heavens, and ye waters that be above the heavens.



Ezekiel 41:7
And there was an enlarging, and a winding about still upward to the side chambers: for the winding about of the house went still upward round about the house: therefore the breadth of the house was still upward, and so increased from the lowest chamber to the highest by the midst.

Now do you see Revelations 15.

2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: