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Featured SDA: Seventh Dilemma Adventism

Discussion in 'Unorthodox Doctrine Forum' started by epostle1, Jul 13, 2018.

  1. epostle1

    epostle1 Well-Known Member

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    This is not a SDA refutation thread. It is a SDA scholars refuting SDA thread.

    The "Great Controversy” Shackles Adventist Theology

    Since the 1911 edition over a 100 years ago, it has not been updated in any form. Thus, the book that historically had been the pace-setter for Adventist theology has become dormant, effectively freezing Adventist theology in its tracks. What this situation has fostered is a perpetuation, and in some instances codification, of many 19th and early 20th century EGW understandings of our world and our place in it which some believe should not be “disturbed.” Unfortunately, or maybe fortunately, the book’s subject and viewpoints beg for engagement, both inside and outside the church. There are several issues arising from the GC that have defied, and continue to defy, settlement within the church, periodically erupting into open conflicts.

    17 May 2018 - SPECTRUM - a Seventh Day Adventist publication
     
  2. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    This quote right here partly explains why I have stated that SDA theology is narrow-minded and short-sighted:

    "The risk to the GC’s credibility is not only that it is too vitriolic against Catholicism or too Euro and America-centric. The real risk is that it is too exclusionary in its focus. By telling a purported universal story and prophesying largely through the narrow prism of her known universe, EGW unwittingly 'otherizes' a big slice of the world, who may, in trying to read the book, promptly ignore it."

    In reality, it is not just "too vitriolic against Catholicism," it is so completely consumed with tunnel-vision as a reactionary movement against Catholicism that it is utterly dormant in its progressiveness. You can literally feel yourself regressing backwards a hundred years and more when reading SDA material.

    They will increasingly be left behind by the Spirit of God if they persist in this, and the scary part is that many will think they are still walking in tune with what the Spirit is saying to the churches, only to find out that they were deceived when all was said and done.
     
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  3. epostle1

    epostle1 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for the contribution.

    Dr. Samuele Bacchiocchi, perhaps the best Adventist scholar, wrote:

    The earliest documents mentioning Sunday worship go back to Barnabas in 135 and Justin Martyr in 150. Thus, it is evident that Sunday worship was already established by the middle of the second century. This means that to be historically accurate the term “centuries” should be changed to the singular “century.” This simple correction would enhance the credibility of The Great Controversy, because it is relatively easy to defend general Sabbath observance during the first century, but it is impossible to do it for the second century.
    http://shamelesspopery.com/answering-seventh-day-adventism/


    quote-i-believe-in-god-not-in-a-catholic-god-the.jpg
    Thus sayeth the anti-Christ, according to SDA doctrine.
     
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  4. Willie T

    Willie T Well-Known Member

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    I tried to attend an SDA church, Unfortunately, they were no different than the CoC (except that they met on a different day) that I left years before due to their dead attitude about Christ.
     
  5. Rollo Tamasi

    Rollo Tamasi Well-Known Member

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    What SDA doctrines will send them all to hell?
    I know several personally and they are filled with the Spirit of God, more so then most other Christians I know.
     
  6. Willie T

    Willie T Well-Known Member

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    I think, in general, their doctrines will simply make life a whole lot more miserable for them than God ever intended.
     
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  7. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    If I had the wisdom of all you guys I could post too. :D
    But I can't, as I know nothing....but I can 'read along' which is what I am doing.

    All churches have a blind spot..I believe God designed it that way...so that we would all need each other...it's called ....A Body.
     
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  8. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    Rollo, I don't hold the view that anyone who is SDA is automatically going to Hell, I simply get very concerned about the leadership. There are a considerable number of false doctrines they teach, and the word "vitriolic," used by one of their own authors regarding their opposition to Catholicism in particular in the OP, is at the heart of the problem (and I do mean at the heart). Their theology so vilifies Catholicism and Sunday worship in general as to render all who observe it on their way to being unsaved and going to Hell unless they repent of it, because it constitutes "taking the mark of the Beast." It FORCES those who believe them to either conform back to the law (i.e. of 7th day observance) or consider themselves damned and on the way to Hell. It is heresy of the highest order in this regard, forgoing all the other heretical teachings they put forward.

    Are they good people? Yes. I've found this to be the case, and that includes several of our SDA people here. But the Mormons are the same way. They are usually very personable, well-behaved and considerate. But they are unfortunately proselytizing people into a cult whose doctrines alienate others from true salvation in Christ, and true obedience to the Spirit of God.
     
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  9. Rollo Tamasi

    Rollo Tamasi Well-Known Member

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    Martin Luther called the pope the anti-christ.
    Do you feel the same about Lutherans?
     
  10. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    Yes, "ByGrace," it is supposed to be a body. :) This is why I gladly welcome anyone; believers of all different denominational backgrounds, holding out hope that they will enter into true fellowship. But as you'll notice, one prominent SDA member here joined and in very short order started attempting to get dictatorial by marathon-posting, showing little respect or regard for others in the community, and offending people whose answers he didn't like. That's not operating as a member of the body. That's operating as a virus that wants to take over the body and corrupt it.

    I still am distinguishing between someone like that and someone who is simply trying to contribute from the SDA perspective without trying to assume control. These are two different things.
     
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  11. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    Excellent post.
    And a good and gracious balance.
     
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  12. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    The answer is yes for me. He was not a nice man. Yes he did what he did...but he only knew what he knew and did his part...I dare to say that he knew next to nothing about the Father heart of God.
    But, back then, in those hard and harsh times...I don't believe many of them did.

    All these stupid people telling each other who is going to hell and who isn't ...is all garbage. They have no divine authority for that...no man does.

    And they cannot know or see clearly...they are so caught up in "being right".

    Lord help us!!!
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2018
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  13. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    I'm not as impressed with Luther as most Protestants are, although I am most certainly a Protestant (Charismatic, Pentecostal are both for more descriptive terms). But as for Lutherans, I don't see them as being nearly as anti-Catholic today as the SDAs. In fact, they seem to be almost amenable by comparison (maybe not the best word. Maybe ameliorating is better).

    So no, I do not feel the same about Lutherans, at least not the Lutherans of today. Now I have no problem with anyone taking issue with Catholic doctrines. I myself actually do hold to the interpretations about Revelations 17 & 18 that Catholics associate with SDA theology, but it is not combined with this business about Sunday worship being the mark of the Beast and those who do not repent of it are going to Hell. I only hold that the ecumenical movement that will arise during the end-times of many denominations coming together (not just Catholicism but many Protestant denominations with them as well) will eventually be turned to darkness, and persecute the true saints and prophets of God to the death. But I'm no anti-Catholic. That day is still a long ways off, IMO, and I appreciate Catholics as genuine believers in Christ who usually have a great deal to offer. So I regard them as brothers and sisters in Christ who are worthy of my respect and who truly have much to contribute to doctrinal discussions on many matters. Our friend Epostle here is a good example.
     
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  14. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    Oh and I agree...there are always religious spirits at work on every christian Site. Maybe some people are slow to discern religious spirit and muddle them up with the person themselves...( personality) but when the person themselves gives themselves over to these spirit ..then we see the messiah spirit at work.=
    "I must get my special message out at all costs, ( even if I have to flood the whole site) as I am here to save all you stupid people. "
    Yep , it happens.

    God will yet have Hs glorious Body..one way or the other ...
     
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  15. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    LoL!

    Ya know, I've noticed that it is often those who really feel they have a message to preach that stick around at the forums. You ever notice that? It's what keeps them from folding up like a tent when they face opposition. The problem is, as the scripture says, "There is a way that seems right to a man, but the end thereof is destruction," so it's a little sad.
     
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  16. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    The thing is a person never knows that they are being manipulated and driven by a religious spirit.. " And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of."
    Being manipulated by them and giving yourself over to them is two different things ...pride is the trap-door to giving oneself over to. Then they use you and you are 'driven' by it. ( as we can see)

    We were in a cult for a full decade, in the 70's. We were full of zeal...and plenty of pride too. After all "we had the truth." o_O
    Not until we came out could we look back and see the pitfalls.
    I believe every step in our life is a learning curve, and God will show and teach us if we stay teachable and not too proud in believing that we already know it all.
     
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  17. Truth

    Truth Well-Known Member

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    Sad Truth is that Denationalization is in fact what keeps the body in pieces, as one of the Catholic's on this Forum said ! splintered. I say shattered, we as believers need to come together, and begin to be whole again! How do we do this, stop finding the differences, and begin to search for the apparent likenesses in our faith's!
     
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  18. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    I don't think we can do it. I think only the Spirit of God can do it, and even then there will have to come a separation. I think the move of God will eventually become so strong that many may leave denominational Christendom altogether. But that's again talking about something that IMO is still a long ways off yet. For now, the key is that those governed by the Spirit of God will not let denominational differences hinder their ability to fellowship with one another in a Spirit of love.
     
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  19. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    Experience life with a light touch.

    Fundamentalism, zealotry, anarchists on the left are all overeactions.

    Ever ride a rollercoaster, while fightening the experience? Miserable.....yet, many Christains are ‘white knuckling it’ through this life. If we are going to fulfill our commandment from Jesus to love outwardly, we have to loosen our grip on being sure/being right. Faith and certainty are opposites - the devil wants us to believe they are the same. Many Christians think being sure/right about doctrine and the Bible and Christian culture makes them people of faith.....

    People of faith suspend their opinion long enough to evaluate and learn......people who are faithless are certain of their own opinion and learn nothing.

    The Devil is sure of himself on every subject.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2018
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  20. Truth

    Truth Well-Known Member

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    That was well said, I am not an educated person but that was said so that I could understand, I have certain foundation points I stand on, but I entered this forum to gain a better understanding over all! I am not white knuckling, all though I am looking for better brick"s to build up a clearer understanding. Yes we all have our opinion's, Butt we all have our backside's to sit on, LOL nothing new under the sun!
    Again well said, Thank's
     
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