Who said that makes it correct? Why do we assume the early church knew it all? I don't believe they were any more enlightened than the rest of us and were still trying to figure out some things for themselves.
Skepticism versus gullibility
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Who said that makes it correct? Why do we assume the early church knew it all? I don't believe they were any more enlightened than the rest of us and were still trying to figure out some things for themselves.
Ya think?
Still, moving closer to the beginning is moving closer to the fire. It was the forced consolidation of beliefs that became Christianity's wet blanket.
Which of the three biblical doctrines of the final judgement do you align yourself with?
1) Damnationism
2) Annihilationism
3) Universalism
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Zao is life
Well-Known Member
How many is "many"? All individuals? Or many individuals?
How many is "many" in these verses?:
And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate. -- Daniel 9:27
For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. -- Matthew 26:28
And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many. -- Mark 14:24
How many is "whosoever" in this verse, and what is everlasting life?:
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16
How many is "all" in these verses?:
Thus says the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, says the LORD. -- Jeremiah 31:37
Not as though the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel. -- Romans 9:6.
Is it "all", or "many" that Jesus said will receive everlasting life?
It is indeed meant for all:
Romans 5:18-19 NIV
Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people,
so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. -- John 3:16.
So will all individuals receive this (by believing God), or will many receive this (by believing God)?:
He that believes on him is not condemned: but he that believes not is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. -- John 3:18.
From what I can see, God meant it for all and means it for all, and many reach out with their hand of faith to receive from the hand of God what he offers to all - but some will not, and for those who will not,
"I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes unto the Father, but by me." -- John 14:6.
It makes no difference to the truth about Universalism whether or not you understood or believed Universalism before you came to the forum, IMO (sorry but I'm being honest
). Likewise it makes no difference to the truth about Universalism whether I believe it or not. I have not spent enough time following all the arguments for Universalism yet to know whether or not I would agree with the reasoning behind it. What you have seen me doing in this thread and in this post is sticking to the scriptures and expressing how I understand them.
I have gained some knowledge from some at Christians forums that has helped me understand what is written a little better, and reading the posts of others and how they link different passages of scripture together (whether or not they link scriptures together that actually belong together) nevertheless does help to remember where certain key themes may be repeated.
When my views are challenged it's because I've seen things in scripture that I never saw before due to overlooking stuff, and sometimes this has been helped by someone at these forums mentioning something and my realizing that I had overlooked whatever it was. But don't ask me for examples now because I do not keep records of when this occurs, because at the end of the day it's scripture changing my view and not what anyone else believes scripture to be teaching.
That's a great question, thanks.
It actually says "the many", not just many. It is the SAME "the many" that "were made sinners".
How many is that? We know that "the many" who were made sinners is ALL of humankind.
Therefore, "the many" that will be MADE righteous is also ALL of humankind.
Romans 5:18-19 NIV
Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people,
so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.
19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners,
so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.
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Zao is life
Well-Known Member
IMO that doesn't sufficiently answer this:
How many is "whosoever" in this verse, and what is everlasting life?:
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16
We need to consider the NT Greek for the word eternal. Aionios. What does it mean?
Aionios mistranslated as "eternal" or "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46.
All these verses below use the same NT Greek word, "aionios", the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" or "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46. See bold below. This shows that "aionios" cannot mean eternal or everlasting.
Matthew 13:22
The seed falling among the thorns refers to someone who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, making it unfruitful.
Romans 12:2
Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.
1 Corinthians 1:20
Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?
1 Corinthians 2:8
None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
Ephesians 2:2
in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.
Galatians 1:4-5 KJV
Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.
Luke 18:29-30
“Truly I tell you,” Jesus said to them, “no one who has left home or wife or brothers or sisters or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30 will fail to receive many times as much in this age, and in the age to come eternal life.”
Compare: Matthew 12:32; Mark 10:30; Luke 18:30; Luke 20:35; Ephesians 1:21
Aionios, the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" and "everlasting" in the Bible (eternal hell?)
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Zao is life
Well-Known Member
IMO that doesn't sufficiently answer this:
How many is "whosoever" in this verse?:
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish.
Does "whosoever believes in Him should not perish" mean "God so loved the world so that no one will perish"?
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