was that ALL that was written on the tablets that moses brought down from the mountain............just 10 commandments?
TEN COMMANDMENTS?
- Thread starter sniper762
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
It may have been all that was on the tablets but God also had Moses write all the other laws which are contained within the first five books of the bible.
And the boards and the book of the law have anything to do with the Gentiles? We should save some commandment for justice and for life?
For what it is worth, the 10 commandments that Moses brought down from the mountain are not the only commandments contained in the Torah.
Anyway, Exodus 31:18 says the following:
Anyway, Exodus 31:18 says the following:
God spoke the 10 Commandments in the hearing of the mixed multitude, Jew and Gentile. This He also wrote in stone. It is for all peoples and is unchanging. All other instruction was given through Moses and written down by Moses primarily for the Jews although it has much to teach to any people group.
The Ten Commandments were part of the Law that went with the Sinai Covenant. They were never for Gentiles.
The Sinai Covenant ended at the cross. Christians are part of the New Covenant.
The Sinai Covenant ended at the cross. Christians are part of the New Covenant.
If only some Christians could get that through their heads...Mungo said:
Here is what I think was written on the stone tablets. Could two stone tablets that were light enough for Moses to carry held more than this?
Otherwise they would have had to have held the above plus this:
If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing. If he came in by himself, he shall go out by himself: if he were married, then his wife shall go out with him. If his master have given him a wife, and she have born him sons or daughters; the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out by himself. And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free: Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever. And if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the menservants do. If she please not her master, who hath betrothed her to himself, then shall he let her be redeemed: to sell her unto a strange nation he shall have no power, seeing he hath dealt deceitfully with her. And if he have betrothed her unto his son, he shall deal with her after the manner of daughters. If he take him another wife; her food, her raiment, and her duty of marriage, shall he not diminish. And if he do not these three unto her, then shall she go out free without money. He that smiteth a man, so that he die, shall be surely put to death. And if a man lie not in wait, but God deliver him into his hand; then I will appoint thee a place whither he shall flee. But if a man come presumptuously upon his neighbour, to slay him with guile; thou shalt take him from mine altar, that he may die. And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death. And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death. And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death. And if men strive together, and one smite another with a stone, or with his fist, and he die not, but keepeth his bed: If he rise again, and walk abroad upon his staff, then shall he that smote him be quit: only he shall pay for the loss of his time, and shall cause him to be thoroughly healed. And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished. Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money. If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, Burning for burning, wound for wound, stripe for stripe. And if a man smite the eye of his servant, or the eye of his maid, that it perish; he shall let him go free for his eye's sake. And if he smite out his manservant's tooth, or his maidservant's tooth; he shall let him go free for his tooth's sake. If an ox gore a man or a woman, that they die: then the ox shall be surely stoned, and his flesh shall not be eaten; but the owner of the ox shall be quit. But if the ox were wont to push with his horn in time past, and it hath been testified to his owner, and he hath not kept him in, but that he hath killed a man or a woman; the ox shall be stoned, and his owner also shall be put to death. If there be laid on him a sum of money, then he shall give for the ransom of his life whatsoever is laid upon him. Whether he have gored a son, or have gored a daughter, according to this judgment shall it be done unto him. If the ox shall push a manservant or a maidservant; he shall give unto their master thirty shekels of silver, and the ox shall be stoned. And if a man shall open a pit, or if a man shall dig a pit, and not cover it, and an ox or an ass fall therein; The owner of the pit shall make it good, and give money unto the owner of them; and the dead beast shall be his. And if one man's ox hurt another's, that he die; then they shall sell the live ox, and divide the money of it; and the dead ox also they shall divide. Or if it be known that the ox hath used to push in time past, and his owner hath not kept him in; he shall surely pay ox for ox; and the dead shall be his own. If a man shall steal an ox, or a sheep, and kill it, or sell it; he shall restore five oxen for an ox, and four sheep for a sheep. If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him. If the sun be risen upon him, there shall be blood shed for him; for he should make full restitution; if he have nothing, then he shall be sold for his theft. If the theft be certainly found in his hand alive, whether it be ox, or ass, or sheep; he shall restore double. If a man shall cause a field or vineyard to be eaten, and shall put in his beast, and shall feed in another man's field; of the best of his own field, and of the best of his own vineyard, shall he make restitution. If fire break out, and catch in thorns, so that the stacks of corn, or the standing corn, or the field, be consumed therewith; he that kindled the fire shall surely make restitution. If a man shall deliver unto his neighbour money or stuff to keep, and it be stolen out of the man's house; if the thief be found, let him pay double. If the thief be not found, then the master of the house shall be brought unto the judges, to see whether he have put his hand unto his neighbour's goods. For all manner of trespass, whether it be for ox, for ass, for sheep, for raiment, or for any manner of lost thing, which another challengeth to be his, the cause of both parties shall come before the judges; and whom the judges shall condemn, he shall pay double unto his neighbour. If a man deliver unto his neighbour an ass, or an ox, or a sheep, or any beast, to keep; and it die, or be hurt, or driven away, no man seeing it: Then shall an oath of the LORD be between them both, that he hath not put his hand unto his neighbour's goods; and the owner of it shall accept thereof, and he shall not make it good. And if it be stolen from him, he shall make restitution unto the owner thereof. If it be torn in pieces, then let him bring it for witness, and he shall not make good that which was torn. And if a man borrow ought of his neighbour, and it be hurt, or die, the owner thereof being not with it, he shall surely make it good. But if the owner thereof be with it, he shall not make it good: if it be an hired thing, it came for his hire. And if a man entice a maid that is not betrothed, and lie with her, he shall surely endow her to be his wife. If her father utterly refuse to give her unto him, he shall pay money according to the dowry of virgins. Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live. Whosoever lieth with a beast shall surely be put to death. He that sacrificeth unto any god, save unto the LORD only, he shall be utterly destroyed. Thou shalt neither vex a stranger, nor oppress him: for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt. Ye shall not afflict any widow, or fatherless child. If thou afflict them in any wise, and they cry at all unto me, I will surely hear their cry; And my wrath shall wax hot, and I will kill you with the sword; and your wives shall be widows, and your children fatherless. If thou lend money to any of my people that is poor by thee, thou shalt not be to him as an usurer, neither shalt thou lay upon him usury. If thou at all take thy neighbour's raiment to pledge, thou shalt deliver it unto him by that the sun goeth down: For that is his covering only, it is his raiment for his skin: wherein shall he sleep? and it shall come to pass, when he crieth unto me, that I will hear; for I am gracious. Thou shalt not revile the gods, nor curse the ruler of thy people. Thou shalt not delay to offer the first of thy ripe fruits, and of thy liquors: the firstborn of thy sons shalt thou give unto me. Likewise shalt thou do with thine oxen, and with thy sheep: seven days it shall be with his dam; on the eighth day thou shalt give it me. And ye shall be holy men unto me: neither shall ye eat any flesh that is torn of beasts in the field; ye shall cast it to the dogs. Thou shalt not raise a false report: put not thine hand with the wicked to be an unrighteous witness. Thou shalt not follow a multitude to do evil; neither shalt thou speak in a cause to decline after many to wrest judgment: Neither shalt thou countenance a poor man in his cause. If thou meet thine enemy's ox or his ass going astray, thou shalt surely bring it back to him again. If thou see the ass of him that hateth thee lying under his burden, and wouldest forbear to help him, thou shalt surely help with him. Thou shalt not wrest the judgment of thy poor in his cause. Keep thee far from a false matter; and the innocent and righteous slay thou not: for I will not justify the wicked. And thou shalt take no gift: for the gift blindeth the wise, and perverteth the words of the righteous. Also thou shalt not oppress a stranger: for ye know the heart of a stranger, seeing ye were strangers in the land of Egypt. And six years thou shalt sow thy land, and shalt gather in the fruits thereof: But the seventh year thou shalt let it rest and lie still; that the poor of thy people may eat: and what they leave the beasts of the field shall eat. In like manner thou shalt deal with thy vineyard, and with thy oliveyard. Six days thou shalt do thy work, and on the seventh day thou shalt rest: that thine ox and thine ass may rest, and the son of thy handmaid, and the stranger, may be refreshed. And in all things that I have said unto you be circumspect: and make no mention of the name of other gods, neither let it be heard out of thy mouth. Three times thou shalt keep a feast unto me in the year. Thou shalt keep the feast of unleavened bread: (thou shalt eat unleavened bread seven days, as I commanded thee, in the time appointed of the month Abib; for in it thou camest out from Egypt: and none shall appear before me emptyAnd the feast of harvest, the firstfruits of thy labours, which thou hast sown in the field: and the feast of ingathering, which is in the end of the year, when thou hast gathered in thy labours out of the field. Three times in the year all thy males shall appear before the Lord GOD. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leavened bread; neither shall the fat of my sacrifice remain until the morning. The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring into the house of the LORD thy God. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in his mother's milk. Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him. But if thou shalt indeed obey his voice, and do all that I speak; then I will be an enemy unto thine enemies, and an adversary unto thine adversaries. For mine Angel shall go before thee, and bring thee in unto the Amorites, and the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Canaanites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites: and I will cut them off. Thou shalt not bow down to their gods, nor serve them, nor do after their works: but thou shalt utterly overthrow them, and quite break down their images. And ye shall serve the LORD your God, and he shall bless thy bread, and thy water; and I will take sickness away from the midst of thee. There shall nothing cast their young, nor be barren, in thy land: the number of thy days I will fulfil. I will send my fear before thee, and will destroy all the people to whom thou shalt come, and I will make all thine enemies turn their backs unto thee. And I will send hornets before thee, which shall drive out the Hivite, the Canaanite, and the Hittite, from before thee. I will not drive them out from before thee in one year; lest the land become desolate, and the beast of the field multiply against thee. By little and little I will drive them out from before thee, until thou be increased, and inherit the land. And I will set thy bounds from the Red sea even unto the sea of the Philistines, and from the desert unto the river: for I will deliver the inhabitants of the land into your hand; and thou shalt drive them out before thee. Thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor with their gods. They shall not dwell in thy land, lest they make thee sin against me: for if thou serve their gods, it will surely be a snare unto thee. Exodus 21:2-23:33
If the Ten Commandments did not exist before Sinai and ended at the cross, under what law did God punish Cain for the murder of Abel?, and what was the basis Paul used when writing to his Gentile converts to give up the worship of other gods?
day said:
ChristRoseFromTheDead has given you the basic answer. I'd like to add a bit.
God has moral laws that exist from the beginning and will always exist. Murder is one of those. That is why Cain was wrong to murder Abel.
However the Ten Commandments were an implementation, or codification, of God's moral laws (and at least on law that is not a moral law - Saturday Sabbath keeping) for the Jews as part of the Sinai Covenant.
I live in England. If I murder someone I am convicted under English Law. If I go to France and muder someone I will be convicted under French law. English law is not applicable in France and French Law is not applicable in England.
We need to understand which implementation of God's law we are under. If we are Christians we are in the New Covenant and under New Covenant Laws not Old Covenant Laws..
satan loves the law, it is so easy for him to keep those who never had it , under it, he doesnt have to try hard, the flesh loves to prove itself and so he uses the law to keep the flesh we he wants it, but that takes us from grace to the law, and under the law there is no salvation, it is based on works, our works, grace is based on His works that what Jesus did, so i can never say." hey look at me I did it myself", God forbid, no Jesus deserves all teh glory not our pathetic flesh.
in all His Love
Nice posts mungo crfd
in all His Love
Nice posts mungo crfd
The ten commandments written in THE STONE(who is called the Stone? JESUS is the stone they keep rejecting) are the same yesterday, today and forever for the Word of God he never changes and being Stone they are immovable.
The reason that they had to be written down for the Hebrews is because once WE come out of Egypt(beastly nature) we must be taught a new way of life to become a child of God for fallen man is FAR from the Word of truth since the tree of life was hidden from man once Adam died to the Spirit and then Cain who was of an unclean spirit of the Wicked One having his image(attributes of his father the devil) went out into the created nations and corrupted them as well.
No natural births had been born before Adam fell from his former estate and was now given SKIN of a beastly nature to reproduce children in Her body and in PAIN as a punishment to Eve for her being deceived. And God did not kill an animal and cut out a fur coat for them as many erroneously believe, He MADE them coverings of flesh with genitals. Their shame or nakedness was their sin being a lack of being clothed in the Word, not body parts. Even Abel did not kill an animal as a sacrifice to God as erroneously believed. Killing began with Cain, not Abel and only until Noah's flood did we begin to kill and eat of the animals, not before.
God created Adam he was not birthed in the natural way and God divided Adam who was made in the image of God both of male and female attributes, into two to give Adam a help meet for companionship that is why the two become one flesh, better half, soul mate etc.... Adam could not find a SUITABLE help meet from the BEASTLY nature unlike we see today where men consider their animals more precious than their family members.
Gen 3:21-4:2
21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God MAKE coats of skins, and clothed them.
22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
23 Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
Genesis 4
4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.
2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
KJV
Isa 24:1-6
24:1 Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof.
2 And it shall be, as with the people, so with the priest; as with the servant, so with his master; as with the maid, so with her mistress; as with the buyer, so with the seller; as with the lender, so with the borrower; as with the taker of usury, so with the giver of usury to him.
3 The land shall be utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled: for the LORD hath spoken this word.
4 The earth mourneth and fadeth away, the world languisheth and fadeth away, the haughty people of the earth do languish.
5 The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant.
6 Therefore hath the curse devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left.
KJV
When we throw out the 10 commandments of God which are the foundational laws of God being the LIGHT of the world, then the world becomes darker and darker in which every evil thing lives and the world is in void, darkness, chaos and dies.
If they were no more then Paul would not have said this:
Rom 13:8-10
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
KJV
The reason that they had to be written down for the Hebrews is because once WE come out of Egypt(beastly nature) we must be taught a new way of life to become a child of God for fallen man is FAR from the Word of truth since the tree of life was hidden from man once Adam died to the Spirit and then Cain who was of an unclean spirit of the Wicked One having his image(attributes of his father the devil) went out into the created nations and corrupted them as well.
No natural births had been born before Adam fell from his former estate and was now given SKIN of a beastly nature to reproduce children in Her body and in PAIN as a punishment to Eve for her being deceived. And God did not kill an animal and cut out a fur coat for them as many erroneously believe, He MADE them coverings of flesh with genitals. Their shame or nakedness was their sin being a lack of being clothed in the Word, not body parts. Even Abel did not kill an animal as a sacrifice to God as erroneously believed. Killing began with Cain, not Abel and only until Noah's flood did we begin to kill and eat of the animals, not before.
God created Adam he was not birthed in the natural way and God divided Adam who was made in the image of God both of male and female attributes, into two to give Adam a help meet for companionship that is why the two become one flesh, better half, soul mate etc.... Adam could not find a SUITABLE help meet from the BEASTLY nature unlike we see today where men consider their animals more precious than their family members.
Gen 3:21-4:2
21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God MAKE coats of skins, and clothed them.
22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
23 Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
Genesis 4
4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.
2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
KJV
God is the God of the whole earth Jew and Gentile from the beginning of it's creation. The people have been turned over to reprobate minds because they forget God and take credit for all they are or do for themselves. And if you realize that Abraham was a Gentile before God chose him. Jews are citizens of Jerusalem the City of Peace for all who inherit HER shall be those who keep God's Word. God seems to believe that He is in covenant with them as well, even though most are Cain's/CAN but won't, by choice and few are ABLE/ABEL'S.Mungo said:
Isa 24:1-6
24:1 Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof.
2 And it shall be, as with the people, so with the priest; as with the servant, so with his master; as with the maid, so with her mistress; as with the buyer, so with the seller; as with the lender, so with the borrower; as with the taker of usury, so with the giver of usury to him.
3 The land shall be utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled: for the LORD hath spoken this word.
4 The earth mourneth and fadeth away, the world languisheth and fadeth away, the haughty people of the earth do languish.
5 The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant.
6 Therefore hath the curse devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left.
KJV
When we throw out the 10 commandments of God which are the foundational laws of God being the LIGHT of the world, then the world becomes darker and darker in which every evil thing lives and the world is in void, darkness, chaos and dies.
If they were no more then Paul would not have said this:
Rom 13:8-10
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
KJV
Jesus is the new stone, called the cornerstone OF THE NEW COVENANT!!. The tablets were, as others have shared, given as the cornerstone of the old covenant. The very meat of understanding that liberates us from bondage is that we are not under the law of commandments that were given at Mount Sinai. Mixing the two covenants together is what brings about double mindedness and has been referred to as leaven.afaithfulone4u said:
It falls short of God's plan to relate ourselves with the fallen state of man. If anyone is in Christ he is a new creation. God is no longer in the business of making sinners behave themselves better. That was a temporary measure until the Seed should come and deliver us from the bondage of our fallen nature. His solution to fallen man is to do away with the species altogether. We are in transition from the old man to the new man. This will be completed at the resurrection. Until then we have this treasure (the new man, which is spirit) in earthen vessels (the old man of flesh) (2Cor.4:7). In the resurrection we will receive a new vessel which is incorruptible and will not have the influences of sinfulness that the present body of flesh possesses. However, the present body of flesh is considered by God to be dead, crucified with Christ. Therefore the penalty of law has been satisfied in us. We are no longer under the penalty of death, as Jesus promised in John 5:24.
All of this can be understood from the bible and can and can be taught or shared if necessary. However, these truths have been shared from scripture over and over on this website with ongoing opposition and objection. People still stumble. Instead of tripping over the rock, they should try tripping about Him. ^_^
Williemac, you need to understand that the Word of God is a Two-edged sWord and that there is a carnal understanding and a spiritual understanding which Jesus warned us that those without eyes to see will not understand.williemac said:
We are not under law, we are under construction being living stones in the building aka temple not built with mans hands but by God's Hand and who is God's Hand? The answer is Jesus is the Hand of God for God created everything by His Word and Jesus is the Word that you claim we do not need to know. Even the Hebrews drank of this water from THE ROCK who is Christ and ate manna or ANGELS bread.
1 Cor 10:1-5
10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
KJV
You do understand that the SEED is Christ and Christ is the Word of life that the Spirit nourishes us with that transforms us into a child of God right?
The Word became flesh to take away( not only to keep covering up) but take away the sins of the world little by little as they remain in the Word becoming PERFECT just as our Father in heaven is perfect.
We have been made righteous in Christ Jesus so that God was able to give us His Spirit to indwell us to TEACH us how to obey His Voice/Word as it is being written upon our hearts to no longer be just a hearer of the Word but a doer of the Word.
James 1:21-25
21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
KJV
Our new covenant is to do unto others as you would have them do to you causing them no harm or loss and to do that, thou shalt not lie, thou shalt not steal, thou shalt not covet etc...
The law to just look at it changes no one it only brings death and carnal man without God's Spirit can not KEEP THE LAW... But if you are being led willfully by the Spirit then you will not sin for the Spirit of God would never lead you to do such a thing. The Spirit is to be teaching us HOW to do right in the sight of God so that we don't need laws piled up on top of others due to continued disobedience just as we see happening in our world now that is taking away all of our freedoms and tightening down the hatch..
It is not the law abiding citizen's who need the law exalted over them, but the LAW BREAKERS who cause them to be put in action. The sad thing is that LAW BREAKER'S don't obey none of them, they just get piled on the law abiding citizens who don't need to be told what to do. God removed those accumulated laws of the LAW BREAKER'S for His children for we have the Spirit to guide us into all truth if you are willfully being led of the Spirit and not your flesh. The 10 in the Stone are still in operation but we should not need to see them if you confess to walk in Christ for the Seed of God is His Word that you claim to love, honor and obey~
In other words, you are saying that penalty of the the law does not apply to they who are obeying it? How does that even make sense in light of the statement that we are not under the law?afaithfulone4u said:
This is like saying you get no fine for speeding if you obey the speed limit. You don't go to jail if you don't commit crime.
What we know is that these things apply to they who are under the law. The law only says what it says to those who are under it.
But if you understood my post, you would know that I was speaking of the penalty of law. The wages of sin is death. This penalty was fulfilled in the body of Christ, on our behalf. When we accepted His sacrifice for our sin, we became also dead in Him. Our body of sin is declared dead, crucified with Him.
The mystery that alludes many from the revelation given in Rom.7&8 is that walking in the spirit is a mindset. Rom.8:1 uses the word "therefore". It is a conclusion from the previous passages. In them, Paul explained that because in his mind he was in agreement with the law, delighting in it (7:22) Therefore when he sinned, it as he said "..is no longer I who do it but sin that dwells in me" (vs.17).
Paul's teaching is that because we have the mindset that agrees with the law, we are no longer identified with the sin that is still present with us. And make no mistake, sin is still present with us.
Can we walk in purity of sinlessness 24/7, 365? Not a chance. Therefore it is the sacrifice of Jesus that perpetually keeps us in good standing with God in relation to the righteousness that is required for justification of life. (1John2:1)
The conclusion: we are not required to walk in righteousness in order to be saved. The law is not given to accomplish this end. The requirement to keep the law in order to have eternal life is what is referred to as being "under" law. One cannot in one breath agree that we are not under law and then take the stance that we must keep law in order to be saved. But this is what I read in your posts. You say that we must by the Spirit, keep the law for everlasting life.
But according to Rom.7&8, it is rather our mindset that God is looking for above our actions or deeds. There are many unbelievers that behave themselves as good as any Christian. Therefore there is another category that is applied for salvation to life. If it was merely about behavior, then the problem is that no one has the kind of behavior that fulfills the law. You are in delusion if you think that by the Spirit we can walk in perfect behavior all the time. But that is what the law requires. It is relentless and it is unforgiving. What it demands is the exact nature of God....all the time. There is no room for failure or imperfection. This is what we are not under. As long as we have this treasure in this earthen vessel, this body of flesh, this body of sin (2Cor.4:7) , we are dependent upon the one sacrifice that was made at Calvary.
The Galatians were they who had the Spirit. But in attempting to be justified by law, Paul said they were fallen from grace. Let us not kid ourselves. They had the Spirit. It was by the Spirit that they were walking in the law.
It is not a problem to exhort people to good works or to a sinless walk. In fact this exhortation is not to be opposed, but rather supported. I am not in opposition to the law. But as soon as one brings justification into the arena, I will take the stand that the bible takes.
The cross is our justification for life. It is not acceptable to add man's works to the precious work that Jesus accomplished in His life on earth and in His death for sin.
It is not sin that insults the Spirit of grace, but rather...works. God went to a lot of trouble to remove our sin. This is not our job. Ours is to accept His role and to remain humble. God gives grace to the humble.
There is a fork in the road to justification. Grace and law do not exist on the same road. It is one or the other. IT IS NOT BOTH!
williemac said:
We are saved by faith in Jesus Christ and the accomplishment that he paid on the cross. Yet faith in just the name Jesus Christ does not save us, for even the demons knew his name yet they as we are told shall be eternally in HOT WATER with God.
Every time the WHOLE (613 ordinances) law is warned about keeping is when one thinks that if they are circumcised of their flesh that it makes them a people of God, but as we know that it is not circumcision of the flesh that is what pleases God, but a circumcised heart having the Word of God written in ones heart to be not just a hearer of the Word but a doer.
Gal 5:3
3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
KJV
Those of the fleshly circumcision could not keep the law because they had not been taught how for the Spirit of God who is our teacher and helper, was not given unto them as the promise we have in Christ who is our New covenant Word. The Spirit of a true believer is evident in a person who can truly say that Jesus has come in the flesh... not that he came as a man in the flesh for even the demons again know this and recognized the Word when they saw him and they BOWED to move out of his way. It means that you will be able to test a man to see if the Word is alive in his flesh... for those who do not have the Spirit of God can not receive Christ to indwell them and call the Word their authority to follow after.
1 John 4:2-4
2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
KJV
The true body of Christ will be reborn of the Spirit in the IMAGE OF CHRIST without spot or wrinkle for their actions will be the Brides beautiful white gown and those tried as gold and silver, will be her jewels.
Saved and The Elect of God are not the same things. Salvation to live again is by faith in the Word is who he said he was... but many are called and few are chosen to rule and reign over the saved nations with Christ as their head in whose head is the Father.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Moses was probably verbally given the regulations on how the statutes and ordinances are to be carried out including various sin offerings.sniper762 said:
Similar threads
