Should Christians vote for candidates who embrace abortion no matter how much they may like them?
The Christian vote
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I just scratch my head sometimes when I go to church and see Obama bumper stickers on their cars. Our church teaches that abortion is wrong and is killing, yet they continue to come to church and vote the way they do.
Usually when you talk to these people they say, "But those in the GOP kill people in Iraq and such as well", to which I say, "Then don't vote for them either".
My guess is that most Christians don't really view abortion as murder. If they did, they would see that it is akin to voting for Nazis. Just because they may have good social programs, which they did have under Hitler, is no reason to vote "D"..
Usually when you talk to these people they say, "But those in the GOP kill people in Iraq and such as well", to which I say, "Then don't vote for them either".
My guess is that most Christians don't really view abortion as murder. If they did, they would see that it is akin to voting for Nazis. Just because they may have good social programs, which they did have under Hitler, is no reason to vote "D"..
Uh, there are pro-life Democrats, and the legality of abortion in the USA isn't something that President Obama is responsible for.
If you are going to complain about the legality of abortion in the USA, then you are going to have to aim your complaint at the SCOTUS Justices who were involved in the Roe v. Wade decision, and those people weren't elected.
If you are going to complain about the legality of abortion in the USA, then you are going to have to aim your complaint at the SCOTUS Justices who were involved in the Roe v. Wade decision, and those people weren't elected.
For me it is difficult to vote for or against a politician based on one issue. It is impossible to find a politician that agrees with everything I believe. As a Christian it is very difficult to vote for any politician that supports abortion, however, I am not a one issue voter but I am strongly pro-life.
What if said politician is pro-life but adamantly supports planned parenthood and would give them more of our tax money? Should I vote for them?
What if said politician is pro-life but adamantly supports planned parenthood and would give them more of our tax money? Should I vote for them?
Wrong. The President hand picks those on SCOTUS, and then Congress approves them.Dodo_David said:
Had you not noticed that a litmus test for being approved is their opinion of abortion?
SCOTUS is nothing more than a rubber stamp of the political establishment, much like the overlooked FDR sending innocent Japanese Americans to concentration camps during WW2.
The legality of abortion in the USA is the result of the Roe v. Wade decision of January 1973, and President Obama was still a kid at the time of that SCOTUS decision. Of the current SCOTUS members, five were appointed by Republican Presidents.
Let me put this another way, if they were Nazis whom embraced genocide, could you vote for them no matter if everything else you liked about them?tom55 said:
These types of responses tell me that Christians really don't believe abortion is murder.
Indeed. At the time the GOP embraced the decision.Dodo_David said:
Also, the GOP did a good job running up debt and passing massive entitlements via the Drugs for Seniors program.
So as we can see, there is little difference, if any, between the two parties. All we can do is take peoples word for it when they say that they are against abortion or that we can keep our health care etc.
I'm beginning to think that the JW's have the right attitude about voting. They don't.
There will never be a politician that aligns 100% with Christian belief's, worldly politics and Jesus have nothing in common.
Our government is permeated with the spirit of the anti-Christ, he is here to conquer and divide and he's done a great job in America with the 2 party system. Until people unite under the banner of Christ, instead of the banners of 'republicans' and 'democrats' - then we remain divided.
Our government is permeated with the spirit of the anti-Christ, he is here to conquer and divide and he's done a great job in America with the 2 party system. Until people unite under the banner of Christ, instead of the banners of 'republicans' and 'democrats' - then we remain divided.
You painted a very strong picture in my head with your Nazi analogy. Good job! As far as I know I have never voted for a politician that supports abortion (and never will) and I would never vote for a politician that supports genocide. However, I have probably voted for a politician that supports Planned Parenthood, which supports abortions. So I guess if the only politicians I had to choose from all supported abortion, I wouldn't vote. However, one of them will get into office so maybe I should vote for the one that I agree with on MOST issues? The lesser of two evils?iticus said:
Levi said:
I guess. But if I don't vote then what good am I doing? I guess I could spend my efforts and resources to campaign against all of them and never vote. This is a very perplexing situation.
The only reason I vote is to cast my vote for prolife.
it really upsets me to know there are only two on the supreme court who are not catholic and the supreme court could stop it any time they wanted to.. Catholics are suppose to stand up for little children and they easly have the majority in the supreme court .. why are they allowed to have communion when the priest's all know they could stop these murders any time they wanted to. the supreme court catholic majority all know the commandment says though shall not murder. yet they allow it. year after year proving they are unrepentant and they still allowed to
have the lord supper? both them and their priests should have been x communicated .
it really upsets me to know there are only two on the supreme court who are not catholic and the supreme court could stop it any time they wanted to.. Catholics are suppose to stand up for little children and they easly have the majority in the supreme court .. why are they allowed to have communion when the priest's all know they could stop these murders any time they wanted to. the supreme court catholic majority all know the commandment says though shall not murder. yet they allow it. year after year proving they are unrepentant and they still allowed to
have the lord supper? both them and their priests should have been x communicated .
Tom55 -
I'm in the camp the voting system is corrupt, so it doesn't really matter.
What we're doing in America isn't working anymore, a revamp would be helpful, but that isn't going to happen. I do believe the US is in a downward spiral with no hopes of an upward swing. I believe there will be a one world gov't and Obama is a puppet in its advancement, just as all major world leaders.
I'm in the camp the voting system is corrupt, so it doesn't really matter.
What we're doing in America isn't working anymore, a revamp would be helpful, but that isn't going to happen. I do believe the US is in a downward spiral with no hopes of an upward swing. I believe there will be a one world gov't and Obama is a puppet in its advancement, just as all major world leaders.
horsecamp said:
Murder is any intentional killing of a person that doesn't have the approval of the state.
Abortion is permitted in the USA because it isn't defined as as murder.
Anyway, SCOTUS Justices are to determine if something violates the U.S. Constitution, not to determine if something violates a religious standard.
James Forthwright
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http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/dubiousquotes/a/stalin_quote.htmLevi said:
Update: A historical source has been found for one variant of this quote. The source is Boris Bazhanov's Memoirs of Stalin's Former Secretary, published in 1992 and only available, so far as I know, in Russian. The pertinent passage, which appears near the end of chapter five, reads as follows (loosely translated with the help of Google):
"You know, comrades," says Stalin, "that I think in regard to this: I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this — who will count the votes, and how."
No, Christians should not vote for candidates that embrace abortion no matter how much they may like them.
Very, very simple.
Very, very simple.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
This conversation shows just how powerful abortion is as a wedge issue. It is really the only sure way for politicians to keep their office - gay marriage is crumbling.....immigration is really not as polarizing as politicians have tried to make it......but abortion? Pure golden for politicians.
Yep. Politicians can get away with anything they want to if they remind their sheep that they are on one side of the issue or the other and if they are not provided the votes they need for reelection, abortion rights will cease or abortions will be mandatory for everyone - depending on which side of they isle the politician resides.
Poll numbers falling? Fear not! Just target a few district abortion centers for defunding........then sit back and watch the libs.freak out over a procedure that is already legal and cons rally behind their own politicians who are brave enough to bend the law.
And we are, once again, dancing on strings........
Jesus didn't accidentally refer to us as sheep - politicians have been taking advantage of this tendency throughout our history.
I think it is important to remember that Hitler was elected. He will not be the last monster elected. The path to Hell is no longer paved with good intentions.....wedge issues are much more efficient pathways.
Yep. Politicians can get away with anything they want to if they remind their sheep that they are on one side of the issue or the other and if they are not provided the votes they need for reelection, abortion rights will cease or abortions will be mandatory for everyone - depending on which side of they isle the politician resides.
Poll numbers falling? Fear not! Just target a few district abortion centers for defunding........then sit back and watch the libs.freak out over a procedure that is already legal and cons rally behind their own politicians who are brave enough to bend the law.
And we are, once again, dancing on strings........
Jesus didn't accidentally refer to us as sheep - politicians have been taking advantage of this tendency throughout our history.
I think it is important to remember that Hitler was elected. He will not be the last monster elected. The path to Hell is no longer paved with good intentions.....wedge issues are much more efficient pathways.
The Australian system is different from in the US....it is illegal NOT to vote here...you get fined. So you end up having to vote one way or the other. Sometimes one party has clear standards above the others, and then sometimes its not so clear.....
This past election was not difficult, however. The labour government is full of criminals (yes...many of them have been officially busted and are facing court and jail time), and is led by either a narcistic idiot, or someone who has never had a relationship with a single man (they were all married at the time). And the internal politics had the PM seat jumping back and forward....nope...not a hard choice.
But it did raise a question for me. We have friends who are Christian and voted labour. I was pretty shocked, to be honest. Labour supported gay marriage, decisions about abortion were potentially in the hands of a woman who has never had children, only taken fathers away from thier kids. The morals that were displayed in the labour party were appalling....and our christian friends voted for them!! I don't understand it, and I don't think it's right.
There were no clear abortion policies help up at election, so it is hard to comment as to this specific topic...but I do believe that the bible states pretty clearly......those who mistreat widows and small children....hell is waiting. Sounds harsh...but clearly God has a heart for children. I wouldn't support a pro abortion government even if it did get me fined!
This past election was not difficult, however. The labour government is full of criminals (yes...many of them have been officially busted and are facing court and jail time), and is led by either a narcistic idiot, or someone who has never had a relationship with a single man (they were all married at the time). And the internal politics had the PM seat jumping back and forward....nope...not a hard choice.
But it did raise a question for me. We have friends who are Christian and voted labour. I was pretty shocked, to be honest. Labour supported gay marriage, decisions about abortion were potentially in the hands of a woman who has never had children, only taken fathers away from thier kids. The morals that were displayed in the labour party were appalling....and our christian friends voted for them!! I don't understand it, and I don't think it's right.
There were no clear abortion policies help up at election, so it is hard to comment as to this specific topic...but I do believe that the bible states pretty clearly......those who mistreat widows and small children....hell is waiting. Sounds harsh...but clearly God has a heart for children. I wouldn't support a pro abortion government even if it did get me fined!
I believe that God is fully capable of setting things straight, even if we never see it while we remain on this side of eternity.
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