(rant;24515)
I would rather present this as further evidence for a Pre Trib Rapture of the Church. To show that there is plenty of Scriptural support for the Rapture of the Church coming before the Seven year Tribulation.
There is no 7 year tribulation. There is no rapture of the church before or after the tribulation.....there is no rapture. When Christ comes at His 2nd Advent everyone will be changed but He is coming here.
The Book of Revelation in chapters 4 & 5 have some very enlightening verses in them as it concerns, the Rapture of the Church, the Heavenly scene, and the Judgment that follows. Most bible commentaries would agree that chapter 3 closes out the Church age, as it is seen in history. Then to start chapter 4, it says, "AFTER THIS (or after the Church age) I looked, and, behold, a DOOR opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a TRUMPET TALKING with me; which said, COME UP hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter". So after the Church age, it is (John the Beloved) who sees what will happen after the Church is caught up!
John and John only, was taken IN THE SPIRIT to heaven to be shown what would happen in the end of days. This IS NOT THE CHURCH. The trumpet talking was not one of the 7 trumpets of God. It was a voice that sounded like a trumpet...it was NOT one of the seven trumpets!Please do not take the word of man....read it for yourself. There is no reason for me or Kriss or Jag to continue to argue with you about this....we have done what is required of us. We have planted the seed of truth. We continue because others reading this may be influenced by what you are saying.
In Rev 4:1 John the Beloved, sees a DOOR opened in Heaven. In the Gospel of John 10:1 Jesus talks about the DOOR into the Sheepfold...then in verse 9, Jesus says, He is the DOOR, and in verse 11, Jesus says he is the Good Shepard. It is interesting that it is the same Greek word for, DOOR (yura thura) that is used in Rev 4:1 as John used for the Door into the sheepfold in John 10:1. John is caught up through the DOOR into the Sheepfold, and John sees everything as a Type of the Church in Chapter 4. In John 10:3 Jesus says,.."and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out"...for the sheep know his voice. John is caught up through the Sheepfold Door as he hears a voice of a Trumpet. This is a beautiful picture of the Rapture of the church as it is shown in, 1 Cor 15:51-52, 1 Thess 4:16-18 and Heb 12:18-23, Rev 1:10-11.
Gosh, I hate to say this but what a bunch of tripe! A door is a door, whether it is to heaven, or a sheepfold or to Christ. It is the way to God. It has nothing to do with rapture. John DOES NOT SEE EVERYTHING AS A TYPE OF CHURCH. He is, as explained by GOD, taken in the spirit so he can see what will be, write of it and hopefully save those who love Christ in the end of days with his warnings. A church was not mentioned. Rapture was not mentioned. You are being deceived by a man.Of course His sheep hear His voice but that has NOTHING to do with rapture. It is not a "beautiful picture of the Rapture of the church." Where in the world did the writer get that idea? 1 Corinthians 15:52 is NOT rapture. Paul is describing what will happen when Christ returns at His 2nd Advent. Please read it yourself!1 Thessalonians 4:16 is NOT rapture. Paul is talking about where the dead are. His next letter completely negates any idea about it being a rapture. Please read it yourself!Hebrew 12:18-23 is NOT about rapture. Please read it yourself!Revelation 1:10-11 Please read it yourself! There is nothing there about rapture.
The word, Church or Churches, mysteriously disappears from the Revelation after 3:22 and is not mentioned again until Rev 22:16 and then, it only references back to what the Angel was going to tell John in the first 3 chapters concerning "these things in the Churches". Too many people are trying to put the Church into all of Revelations when the fact is the Church is NOT mentioned or seen on earth during the Seven Seals of Judgment. Don Mills
Not only does the word Church "mysteriously disappear" but the word rapture, "mysteriously" NEVER APPEARS. Mysteriously Christ NEVER MENTIONS ANY SEMBLANCE OF A RAPTURE - NEVER! His disciples ask Him about the end of days and He goes into great detail about what is expected and no where in three gospels does He mention that anyone, including a whole group of folks calling themselves.....The Church, are going to fly away. Instead he tells them what will happen to them...........Please read it and stop listening to men!When the apostles asked Him about the end of days He began by saying:Matthew 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them. "Take heed that no man deceive you.Mark 13:5 And Jesus answering them began to say, "Take heed lest any man deceive you:Luke 21:8 And He said, "Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in My name, saying, 'I am Christ,' and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.He began all three gospels with that warning and you are taking the word of a man peddling a pack of lies. Please read those three chapters yourself....all of the chapter, for in them He tells you what is expected of you in the end of days. Do you think He would have left something like the rapture out of that?.........Whirlwind