The False Doctrines with OTHER key words

[CharismaticLady]

Besides "cover" there are other key phrases of the false doctrine which brings death of the Church age of Sardis in Revelation 3.

False Doctrine phrases

• Cover: the blood of Jesus covers our sin, and hides our sin from the Father who cannot look upon sin.

• Past, present and future sins are all forgiven

• Imputed righteousness, that covers your unrighteousness, but doesn't make you righteous.

• Jesus freed us from the law and the consequences of sin, so you can sin and remain saved.

• We will always sin until our bodies of flesh die and are changed.

Truth

• The blood of Jesus takes away our desire to sin 1 John 3:5; 2 Peter 1:4

• Past sins are cleansed. 2 Peter 1:9

• Our born again nature does righteousness, making us righteous. 1 John 3:7

• Jesus freed us from SIN. John 8:34-36

• We are not in the flesh (carnal nature), but in the Spirit (divine nature), if the Spirit of God dwells within. (Reason for Paul's command to not quench the Spirit)

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Besides "cover" there are other key phrases of the false doctrine which brings death of the Church age of Sardis in Revelation 3.

False Doctrine phrases
Cover: the blood of Jesus covers our sin, and hides our sin from the Father who cannot look upon sin.
Past, present and future sins are all forgiven
Imputed righteousness, that covers your unrighteousness, but doesn't make you righteous.
Jesus freed us from the law and the consequences of sin, so you can sin and remain saved.

Truth
The blood of Jesus takes away our desire to sin 1 John 3:5; 2 Peter 1:4
Past sins are cleansed. 2 Peter 1:9
Our born again nature does righteousness, making us righteous. 1 John 3:7
Jesus freed us from SIN. John 8:34-36

what of: I fail every day and every day His mercies are new in every way I fail. therefore when others fail or disappoint and I am inclined to be vengeful or bitter or unforgiving or impatient ...I am endlessly reminded of all the ways I fail, and reminded of His mercy and grace and forgiveness and patience towards me and remain patient, forgiving, and merciful as my Father has shown with me?

false?

 

[CharismaticLady]

what of: I fail every day and every day His mercies are new in every way I fail. therefore when others fail or disappoint and I am inclined to be vengeful or bitter or unforgiving or impatient ...I am endlessly reminded of all the ways I fail, and reminded of His mercy and grace and forgiveness and patience towards me and remain patient, forgiving, and merciful as my Father has shown with me?

false?

Thanks, I'll add that. Look back at what is the false doctrine.

 

[justbyfaith]

False Doctrine phrases

• Cover: the blood of Jesus covers our sin, and hides our sin from the Father who cannot look upon sin.

See Romans 4:7-8.

Past, present and future sins are all forgiven

See Romans 4:8 (the Lord shall not impute sin to the believer),

Romans 8:38-39 (things present and things to come (including sins) shall not separate us from the love of God), and

Hebrews 9:12 (Christ has obtained for us eternal redemption).

Imputed righteousness, that covers your unrighteousness, but doesn't make you righteous.

See Romans 4:5 (faith is counted for righteousness to the one who believes in Jesus, though they be ungodly),

Romans 4:6, (God imputes righteousness apart from works),

Romans 4:9 (faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness),

Romans 4:11 (righteousness will be imputed even to those who have not been spiritually circumcised), and

Romans 4:22 (Abraham's faith was imputed to him for righteousness) w/

Romans 4:23-25 (it is not only imputed to Abraham but to the one that believes in Jesus who rose Himself from the dead).

Jesus freed us from the law and the consequences of sin,

The question being what does forgiveness mean to you?

so you can sin and remain saved.

I think that even in your book the issue is not sin but willful and intentional sins; and not sins that are committed in ignorance.

We will always sin until our bodies of flesh die and are changed.

Here, I agree with you. I do believe that the doctrine of the inevitability of sin is a false doctrine and a heresy.

However, I do also see that in Galatians 6:13, even those who are sticklers for the law do not keep it. And since sin is the transgression of the law, it would indicate that all do continue to be sinners in the present day; since none can keep the law perfectly according to Galatians 6:13.

 

[justbyfaith]

I know that I may have seemed to have contradicted myself in my last statement.

I reconcile it by saying that those who trust in their law-keeping (their abstention from sinning) to save them will find that they are required to keep the whole law from conception into eternity (Galatians 3:10, James 2:10, Matthew 5:48).

But those who place their faith in Christ have been delivered from the law in order that they might be obedient according to the spirit of the law rather than being bound to the letter (Romans 7:6, 2 Corinthians 3:6).

And therefore, sin is not inevitable even though the law remains as a standard that declares that all have sinned and presently come short of the glory of the Lord.

In the scripture in question (Romans 3:23), the words "come short" are in the present passive indicative; which indicates that if someone is active, rather than passive, in seeking first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, that they do not have to sin.

But sin being defined as a violation of the principles of love and faith rather than as the transgression of specific commandments in the law, such as the wearing of tzitzit and tallit and tefilin, or blowing the trumpet at the new moon (Romans 7:6).

Therefore Galatians 6:13 is not saying that sin is inevitable if you are in Christ (are forgiven so that you are delivered from the law), and the definition of sin is according to the spirit rather than the letter.

But if you are trusting in your own personal holiness to save you, Galatians 6:13 w/ Galatians 3:10, James 2:10, and Matthew 5:48 are saying that you must be absolutely perfect according to the letter of the law if you are going to enter in on that basis; and that you are going to miserably fall short of that standard.

 

[CharismaticLady]

See Romans 4:7-8.

The blood of bulls and goats "covered" sins, but Jesus takes it away. I will say this up front of all your references to Romans 4. Romans 4 is about the LAW and the Old Covenant. It is not a stand alone chapter, but is only a small set-up chapter for the conclusion, the New Covenant in chapter 8 - the law of the Spirit.

See Romans 4:8 (the Lord shall not impute sin to the believer), Romans 8:38-39 (things present and things to come (including sins) shall not separate us from the love of God), and Hebrews 9:12 (Christ has obtained for us eternal redemption).

Romans 4 - see above.
Romans 8:38-39 everything external, EXCEPT sins which are internal. This is another passage commonly used in error.
Hebrews 9:12 I agree.

See Romans 4:5 (faith is counted for righteousness to the one who believes in Jesus, though they be ungodly),

Romans 4:6, (God imputes righteousness apart from works),

Romans 4:9 (faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness),

Romans 4:11 (righteousness will be imputed even to those who have not been spiritually circumcised), and

Romans 4:22 (Abraham's faith was imputed to him for righteousness) w/

Romans 4:23-25 (it is not only imputed to Abraham but to the one that believes in Jesus who rose Himself from the dead).

Romans 4:5-6 justification of the ungodly, making them godly. We do not have to be godly on our own first, in order to be justified.

Romans 4:9 Abraham believed God, and obeyed Him. It was counted as righteousness.

Romans 4:23-25 I agree.

The question being what does forgiveness mean to you?

The false doctrine is that Jesus freed us from the law and the consequences of sin, and not for the taking away our our desire to sin. Sin now has no consequences for those who have faith in Christ - false. Romans 6 - if you choose to sin, you have chosen a different master and the wages of sin is death.

However, I do also see that in Galatians 6:13, even those who are sticklers for the law do not keep it. And since sin is the transgression of the law, it would indicate that all do continue to be sinners in the present day; since none can keep the law perfectly according to Galatians 6:13.

If we are filled with the Spirit and walk in the Spirit we are not under the law, because we establish the law Romans 3:25, not break it. Those who keep the commandments of Jesus by His Spirit abide in Him, and He in us. 1 John 3:21-24. They are children of God 1 John 3:1, not sinners, 1 John 1:9.

 

[justbyfaith]

I will say this up front of all your references to Romans 4. Romans 4 is about the LAW and the Old Covenant.

Romans 4 is about justification by faith, primarily.

It is not a stand alone chapter,

I am of the opinion that every chapter and every verse can be used as a stand alone chapter or stand alone verse.

The context of any given scripture never nullifies the plain meaning of that scripture. This is a first rule of hermeneutics; because we know that the scriptures do not contradict themselves.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Romans 4 is about justification by faith, primarily.

Yes, but those of the false doctrine believe that not only are their past sins forgiven, but their present and future sins as well. Those who truly have faith in Christ, abide in Him. He is not just their ticket to heaven, and they needn't obey Him. Without holiness, no man shall see God. But it is not holiness by our own will, but by our new Spirit-filled nature.

Good night.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I am of the opinion that every chapter and every verse can be used as a stand alone chapter or stand alone verse.

Paul's teaching is eight chapters long and must be read and understood in that context. I've seen some of the most ridiculous doctrines out there by doing it your way.

 

[justbyfaith]

Yes, but those of the false doctrine believe that not only are their past sins forgiven, but their present and future sins as well.

If I commit a sin in the future, and then confess it, are you saying that it is not forgiven?

Because it is a future sin.

If future sins are not forgiven, then the sin that I commit in the future will not be forgiven even though I may confess it.

Paul's teaching is eight chapters long

Paul's teaching is actually 16 chapters long. And if you want to be real about it, it also includes many more chapters that he wrote in his other epistles.

So then, if you want to know Paul's teaching, you had better not take it in little chunks. You have to understand it as a whole from the very start, or you do not understand it at all.

I do believe that we can glean doctrine out of Romans 4 without associating it with the rest of the 8 chapters that you are referring to in the epistle of Paul to the Romans...the Holy Spirit is able to minister to us out of that chapter if it were the only chapter that we ever read ("red").

 

[justbyfaith]

The question being what does forgiveness mean to you?

The false doctrine is that Jesus freed us from the law and the consequences of sin, and not for the taking away our our desire to sin. Sin now has no consequences for those who have faith in Christ - false. Romans 6 - if you choose to sin, you have chosen a different master and the wages of sin is death.

You didn't answer the question.

 

[justbyfaith]

Good night.

Good night.

 

[CharismaticLady]

If I commit a sin in the future, and then confess it, are you saying that it is not forgiven?

Because it is a future sin.

If future sins are not forgiven, then the sin that I commit in the future will not be forgiven even though I may confess it.

I'll answer with a person experience I had in counseling a girlfriend.

A woman that has an abortion before she is saved is obeying her carnal survival instincts that are purely selfish. But a woman who is filled with the Spirit and is so lonely that she finally has a date and succumbs to the closeness of sex in a moment of weakness and gets pregnant, having an abortion would be unthinkable. She would be mocking God if she were to say, well, I'll kill this baby and ask forgiveness later..." which is what she said. I wouldn't let her. To answer your question, there is such a thing as God "allowing" repentance of a willful sin after being filled with the Spirit, which begs the alternative that in some cases He doesn't allow repentance. It is totally up to God, but I would not for a moment think that I could trick God into forgiving me just because I ask for forgiveness for a heinous act of murder when I knew exactly what I was doing and planned to ask later. God won't be manipulated. It would be a false repentance.

Paul's teaching is actually 16 chapters long.

No, there are sections. The first eight are on sin and the law and how sin is dealt with before and after Jesus. Justification by faith, the power of grace, becoming dead to sin, and finally the Spirit. The next three chapters are on Israel. I'm sure you can figure out the rest, but it is not one teaching, there are different subjects.

If you want to continue to visualize true doctrines in Romans 4, that is up to you. But chapters 4 and 5 are the two chapters that are the most common to get twisted into unholy doctrines of demons. If you believe God is holy and sent His Son to make unholy people holy to live eternally in a righteous and holy state, Revelation 22:11, then read it in context. But please don't believe that God is not holy and is capable of winking at sin, the one error of Adam He sent His Son to correct, then twist chapters 4 and 5 into lasciviousness like Martin Luther did in the Reformation. Believe me or not, besides the worship of Mary, most of the dead doctrines of demons came out of the Reformation until John Wesley and others wouldn't succumb to the blasphemous teachings that were spreading all over the place. Wesley and others went back to teaching holiness and the awe of the Lord.

“To the angel of the church in Sardis write:

He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: ‘I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead. 2 Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God. 3 So remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you. 4 But you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their garments; and they will walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. 5 He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. 6 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.’

 

[ChristisGod]

I'll answer with a person experience I had in counseling a girlfriend.

A woman that has an abortion before she is saved is obeying her carnal survival instincts that are purely selfish. But a woman who is filled with the Spirit and is so lonely that she finally has a date and succumbs to the closeness of sex in a moment of weakness and gets pregnant, having an abortion would be unthinkable. She would be mocking God if she were to say, well, I'll kill this baby and ask forgiveness later..." which is what she said. I wouldn't let her. To answer your question, there is such a thing as God "allowing" repentance of a willful sin after being filled with the Spirit, which begs the alternative that in some cases He doesn't allow repentance. It is totally up to God, but I would not for a moment think that I could trick God into forgiving me just because I ask for forgiveness for a heinous act of murder when I knew exactly what I was doing and planned to ask later. God won't be manipulated. It would be a false repentance.



No, there are sections. The first eight are on sin and the law and how sin is dealt with before and after Jesus. Justification by faith, the power of grace, becoming dead to sin, and finally the Spirit. The next three chapters are on Israel. I'm sure you can figure out the rest, but it is not one teaching, there are different subjects.

If you want to continue to visualize true doctrines in Romans 4, that is up to you. But chapters 4 and 5 are the two chapters that are the most common to get twisted into unholy doctrines of demons. If you believe God is holy and sent His Son to make unholy people holy to live eternally in a righteous and holy state, Revelation 22:11, then read it in context. But please don't believe that God is not holy and is capable of winking at sin, the one error of Adam He sent His Son to correct, then twist chapters 4 and 5 into lasciviousness like Martin Luther did in the Reformation. Believe me or not, besides the worship of Mary, most of the dead doctrines of demons came out of the Reformation until John Wesley and others wouldn't succumb to the blasphemous teachings that were spreading all over the place. Wesley and others went back to teaching holiness and the awe of the Lord.

“To the angel of the church in Sardis write:

He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: ‘I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead. 2 Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God. 3 So remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you. 4 But you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their garments; and they will walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. 5 He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. 6 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.’

Actually there are " no sections" in any of the epistle's. There are no chapters and verses in the original Greek. Man put those there not God. There is no Romans chapter 1,2,3,4,5,15 etc........................ There is no Romans 3:23, 5:5, 6:23, 10:13 etc......



hope this helps !!!

 

[ChristisGod]

Why Is the Bible Divided into Chapters and Verses?
Today, when we want to find a passage of Scripture, we look it up under its chapter and verse. Where did these divisions come from? Are they found in the original writings? If not, who decided how the sacred writings should be divided? There are a number of important points that need to be made:

1. There Were No Chapter or Verse Divisions in the Original
   When the books of the Bible were originally written, there were no such things as chapters or verses. Each book was written without any breaks from the beginning to the end. Consequently, there are a number of important observations that need to be made about the present chapter and verse divisions that we find in Scripture.
   
   
2. The Books Have Been Divided into Chapters and Verses for Convenience
   The chapter and verse divisions were added to the Bible for the sake of convenience. There is no authoritative basis for the divisions we now find. For the greater part of human history, there have been no chapter or verse divisions in Scripture.
   
   
3. The Origin of Chapter Divisions
   The divisions of individual books of Scripture into smaller sections began as early as the fourth century A.D. Codex Vaticanus, a fourth century Greek manuscript, used paragraph divisions. These were comparable to what we find in manuscripts of the Hebrew Bible.
   
   In the fifth century, the biblical translator Jerome divided Scripture into short potions, or passages, called pericopes. The word is still used today to refer to a self-contained unit of Scripture. His work proceeded the dividing of Scripture into chapters.
   
   The actual chapter division took place much later. A man named Stephen Langton divided the Bible into chapters in the year A.D. 1227. The Bible he used was the Latin Vulgate. Langton was a professor at the University of Paris at the time. Later, he became the Archbishop of Canterbury.
   
   These chapter divisions were later transferred to the Hebrew text in the fourteenth century by a man named Salomon ben Ishmael. There seems to have been certain changes made by Salomon ben Ishmael because the chapter divisions in the Hebrew text do not line up exactly with the English Bible.
   
   
4. The Origin of Verse Divisions
   The modern Old Testament division into verses was standardized by the Ben Asher family around A.D. 900. However, the practice of dividing the Old Testament books into verses goes back centuries earlier.
   
   Modern verse division for the New Testament was the work of Robert Stephanus (Stephens), a French printer. He divided the Greek text into verses for his Greek New Testament published in 1551.
   
   The first entire Bible, in which these chapter and verse divisions were used, was Stephen’s edition of the Latin Vulgate (1555).
   
   The first English Bible to have both chapter and verse divisions was the Geneva Bible (1560).Why Is the Bible Divided into Chapters and Verses? by Don Stewart
   

hope this helps !!!

 

[CharismaticLady]

Actually there are " no sections" in any of the epistle's. There are no chapters and verses in the original Greek. Man put those there not God. There is no Romans chapter 1,2,3,4,5,15 etc........................ There is no Romans 3:23, 5:5, 6:23, 10:13 etc......



hope this helps !!!

That is true, however you can tell by CONTEXT, CONTEXT, CONTEXT. That is something a few people on the forum fight against, especially in Romans and 1 John.

 

[justbyfaith]

No, there are sections.

Therefore, Romans 4 is a section in and of itself.

But please don't believe that God is not holy and is capable of winking at sin,

God is certainly, "capable" of winking at sin. Because that is exactly what He did for many centuries.

Act 17:30, And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

And, that He now commands all men everywhere to repent, does not preclude that His forgiveness does not avail for the one who "messes up" "blows it", falters, fails, or faints.

I will say that even those who have presumed upon God that He would forgive them later can later be forgiven. It only speaks of the fact that those who presume upon God to forgive them later are not born again in the present moment.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Therefore, Romans 4 is a section in and of itself.

No it is part of the 8 chapter section, but is NOT a section in itself out of context.

 

[justbyfaith]

No it is part of the 8 chapter section, but is NOT a section in itself out of context.

I disagree with you. I believe that it contains a specific teaching that is distinct from the whole of the eight chapters that you are referring to.

The subject matter is different than in Romans chapter 8 for example.

In Romans 4, the subject matter is justification by faith; whereas in Romans 8, we have a subject matter of sanctification by the Spirit.

 

[CharismaticLady]

God is certainly, "capable" of winking at sin. Because that is exactly what He did for many centuries.

Act 17:30, And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

I like that verse in Acts 17:30. Thanks. I'll write this ref. in my Bible at Romans 3:25 where it is better explained there. I have written these parallels all over my Bible. I like to see new ones. :

Romans 3:
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; 25 whom God displayed publicly as a propitiation in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; 26 for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Even with the Law of Moses, and kept perfectly, the Law did not remove the sin nature. It was a constant battle of law vs. sin nature. Romans 7:13. The battle is depicted in Romans 7:14-23. That is before Christ who changes the problem - our nature (born again).

Galatians 3:
Why the Law then? It was added because of transgressions, having been ordained through angels by the agency of a mediator, until the Seed (Jesus) would come to whom the promise had been made.