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Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by Netchaplain, Feb 5, 2019.

  1. Netchaplain

    Netchaplain Ordained Chaplain

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    Various could be the imaginations of what man’s life might have been without the fall, but I believe one concept may be fairly certain. Man would not have known, nor partaken of God’s Son and Spirit in the presently needed capacity. There would be no need of being one in spirit with the Trinity, for man would then have no need of such union; as a union being “in” one far surpasses merely being “with” one (Christianity – being in God: Judaism – being with God).

    Surely it cannot be disagreed that God’s purpose for creating was to glorify Himself, and too spacious are the scriptural passages attesting to this truth to include here. It’s my understanding that the greatest of that which glorifies God, after creation, is His attribute of holiness (then love, etc.). I believe Adam may not have been familiar with the meaning of right and wrong until they were “contrasted” with one another, via the commands of that which he may do (Gen 2:16) and that which he may not do (v 17). The same concerns the knowing of God’s holiness via the contrast of evil, similar to the learning of light via first the presence of darkness (and creation was dark before it was lighted – Gen 1:2, 3).

    My perception of “Our image, after Our likeness” in verse 26 of the Bible’s first Chapter is that “image” refers to what God looks like (head, eyes, ears, arms, hands, etc.); and “likeness” refers to God’s autonomy (thinking, reasoning, choosing, etc.). God desires us to choose Him (Deu 30:19; 1Tim 2:4; 2Pet 3:9), and in so doing He prepares the believer to trustingly endure the infirmities and difficulties which must be encountered via the sin nature, in order to teach us that which is of His holy nature.

    Therefore, I think this answers to the reason of His foreknowledge and use concerning the pair on the ground choosing to partake of the apple on the Tree (pun, assuming an apple), through their enlightenment concerning “good and evil.” They could not (even today) know of God’s holiness without comparing it to evil, and so the serpent (per usual) brings forth an admixture of truth and error in saying, “ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil”; which is close to the truth that “ye shall be as God, knowing good and evil (which is a likeness of Him).

    One cannot misunderstand that God foreknew man would partake of the Tree (in His omniscience), and the intent of this article is to assure believers that He’s using everything—from the beginning of the present heaven and earth—to the new heaven and earth, for glorifying Himself, especially in believers, “according to His good pleasure which He has purposed in Himself” (Eph 1:9). Believers are never left to themselves in anything (Jhn 14:6; Josh 1:5; Psa 37:25)!

    NC
     
  2. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    Hello there

    I see it a little differently :)
    I don't believe that God " looks like"....
    I believe He gave us verbal pictures in the bible because we can't even begin to comprehend His awesomeness, and He know man needs something visual , or man will create his own image of God!! ( which he has done!)

    So I believe man is still being "created" in God's image... There being only One man of God...Jesus the Head, and we the body...and the completeness wont be seen until we all come as said in Eph 4
    "Till we all come in the unity of the faith, ( @CoreIssue ) and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ.."
    That, is what I believe to be the "Let us make man in out image..."
    The Adam which was formed, was just the beginning....

    "...image and likeness..."
    The likeness I believe is the refection of God Himself in the earth..
    What is God? "God is love"... Jesus required it of us before He left..

    The likeness of God = His refection ( Love) via His people in the earth.
    By this they shall know ye are my disciples , because ye love one another... Love as He loved..

    Just my two cents...
    Bless you...
     
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  3. CoreIssue

    CoreIssue Well-Known Member

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    God appeared in the flaming Bush so does he look like fire?

    He appeared his three men to Abraham.

    Does the father look like this?

    Revelation 4:2-3 New International Version (NIV)
    2 At once I was in the Spirit, and there before me was a throne in heaven with someone sitting on it. 3 And the one who sat there had the appearance of jasper and ruby. A rainbow that shone like an emerald encircled the throne.

    God can look like anything he wants to look like. I do not believe he has a standard appearance. He sure does not need arms, legs, and no, a mouth, ears, etc.
     
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  4. Netchaplain

    Netchaplain Ordained Chaplain

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    Hi and thanks for your reply and comments! There's surely nothing in Scripture that states one should only perceive God as looking like man, but I find it most likely that since we look like Him (in His image; resemble Him), He looks like us. If you think "image" may not mean "looks like," what would you think may be meant by "His likeness"?

    I picture God looking like us but just vastly bigger, but in spirit from, not physical like Jesus now is. I believe some good passages relating to this is Exo 33:20-23. He tells Moses he is not allowed to see His face, so I would think His hand quite large to be able to completely block Moses view of His face, being in between mountainous rocks, so he could only see His backside while passing by Moses.

    Blessings!
     
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  5. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    I guess this big subject is all part of the wonder of the Incarnation (1 Timothy 3.16; John 1.14).
     
  6. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    Peter referred to the Transfiguation in his Second Epistle: 'eyewitnesses to His majesty'...(2 Peter 1.16)
     
  7. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    Many children in character and nature , are "like" their father ( or mother) but they not 'look like' them physically.

    As you can tell...I do not believe that everything said in the bible is literal...but God, because He is almighty and know all things...is loving enough to 'paint word pictures for us' to help us understand. They are not literal.
    Everything has a spiritual meaning... God shows us that.. Jesus Himself so often said "blah blah blah is likened unto.." Then He would lay out his story , as in The Sower. Then He goes on at the end telling us "the seed" is the word of God. The 'ground' is the hearts of men.

    He 'likens' fish as men...."make you fishers of men. " and so on.
    We must see beyond the words into the spiritual meanings.

    Thats my experience anyway. :)
     
  8. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Actually God (His glory) does look like fire when necessary, and so does Christ's glory. He is also called "a consuming fire".

    And the sight of the glory of the LORD was like devouring [consuming] fire on the top of the mount in the eyes of the children of Israel. (Exodus 24:17)

    Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear: For our God is a consuming fire. (Heb 12:28,29)
     
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  9. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    We see God described as *the Ancient of Day* -- having the appearance of man -- before whom *one like the Son of Man* (Christ) appears:

    I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days [God] did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire. A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened...
    [Note: This also resembles in the appearance of Christ in Revelation 1]

    I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man [Christ] came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days [God], and they brought him [Christ] near before him [God]. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. (Dan 7:9,10,13,14)
     
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  10. CoreIssue

    CoreIssue Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure what your point is here as regards what I said.

    I said:

    God appeared in the flaming Bush so does he look like fire?

    He appeared his three men to Abraham.

    Does the father look like this?

    Revelation 4:2-3 New International Version (NIV)
    2 At once I was in the Spirit, and there before me was a throne in heaven with someone sitting on it. 3 And the one who sat there had the appearance of jasper and ruby. A rainbow that shone like an emerald encircled the throne.

    God can look like anything he wants to look like. I do not believe he has a standard appearance. He sure does not need arms, legs, and no, a mouth, ears, etc.
     
  11. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Right. And you got your answer from Scripture. A word of thanks would have been in order.
     
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  12. CoreIssue

    CoreIssue Well-Known Member

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    I said a lot more then looking just like fire.

    Nor did I ask a question for you to answer.

    Seems like you have some other motive.
     
  13. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    People sometimes speak of 'theophanies': Old Testament manifestations of the Second Person of the Trinity.
     
  14. CoreIssue

    CoreIssue Well-Known Member

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    The Angel of God and once when God appeared to Abraham as three men.

    Never as Jesus Christ.
     
  15. Netchaplain

    Netchaplain Ordained Chaplain

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    Myself, I think the Bible is about 30% symbolic, which is mostly expressed by hyperbolic language, esp. concerning spiritual growth truths within the Pauline Epistles; and I think they are for requiring us to seek God more for the understanding.
     
  16. Dave L

    Dave L Guest

    Had Adam not sinned, as our representative according to Romans 5, we would have only his finite human righteousness. Since Jesus, the second Adam is God, we now have God's very own eternal righteousness worthy of all that God himself is worthy of! Forever!!
     
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  17. Netchaplain

    Netchaplain Ordained Chaplain

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    Hi, and thanks for your applicable replies! I think both man and angel have God's appearance for the sake of it being part of what glorifies (manifests) Him.

    Blessings!
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2019
  18. Netchaplain

    Netchaplain Ordained Chaplain

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    Hi Brother, and thanks for your input! Yes, there can be no comparing godliness to humanity. Just a couple mentions, godliness for the believer in the new heaven will not require anything for the new body to eternally exist, and of course the most significant is being in the Trinity, and the Trinity in us, which has been God's plan from everlasting (Eph 1:4).

    Blessings!
     
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  19. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    Addressing the OP.

    we are in God's Image both physically and spiritually.

    Spiritually, we're his "Sons" in his Image/character, or his characteristics, hence the autonomy (thinking, reasoning, choosing, etc.). and christ is our example in this, Hebrews 1:3 "Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high".

    physically, we will have flesh and bone, but as to how we will look? 1 John 3:2 "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is."

    so untill then.

    PICJAG
     
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  20. Netchaplain

    Netchaplain Ordained Chaplain

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    Hi and thanks for your reply and input! I agree, if you're referring to the spiritual man, who is a believer in Christ. The natural man is never referred to as a child of God. Those who continue to choose not to believe (which has always been the majority of mankind - Mat 7:13, 14) are just part of His creatures.

    Yes, for "There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body" (1Cor 15:44). Some are of the notion that natural means physical and spiritual means non-physical or just spirit. But Scripture is clear that both are physical, as our Lord reveals in Luke 24:39. The natural body is temporally physical, but the spiritual body is eternal, even for those who will "resurrect unto damnation" (Jhn 5:28, 29).

    Concerning "what we shall be" I think refers to all that will be involved which is not presently revealed in God's Word.
    "What is fully involved in this is not made known" - Albert Barnes

    Blessings!



    but as to how we will look? 1 John 3:2 "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is."[/QUOTE]
     
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