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Featured Trinity vs. Tritheism

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by justbyfaith, Jan 8, 2019.

  1. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member

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    You deny Christ's deity.
     
  2. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    Disagree.

    Disagree.

    Glory to God,
    Taken
     
  3. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    I know a man who was MADE captain.
    I know a female who was MADE CEO.
    I know a woman who was MADE a wife.
    I know an adopted boy who was MADE a son.

    They Became a captain, CEO, husband, son...
    While REMAINING what they ALWAYS were...
    A man, a female, a woman, a boy.

    God was MADE a son of a woman...
    While REMAINING what He ALWAYS was...
    God.

    According to the FLESH...
    What IS according to the FLESH?

    A babe is in the WOMB of a woman, 9 months.

    After 9 months, the babe is Revealed, ACCORDING TO THE FLESH, coming forth out from a Woman's WOMB.

    According to the FLESH, is about How God Revealed Himself to the World,

    You attempt to make God being revealed to the WORLD about the VIRGINS EGG.

    A VIRGIN WOMAN'S EGG, HAS NOT BEEN FERTILIZED!

    A WOMAN'S EGG IS NOT FERTILIZED IN THE WOMB.

    According to the FLESH, a woman is (conceived) Pregnant IN THE WOMB.

    NOTHING in Scripture teaches a VIRGIN woman's EGG was Fertilized by the SEED of God.

    Scripture EXPRESSLY teaches, the SEED of God is PLANTED within a persons PURE "VESSEL"....and MIXED with NOTHING.

    The SEED of God, (which IS Christ) was PLANTED in a VIRGIN (pure) woman's WOMB, and according to the FLESH, remained there 9 Months, and then according to the FLESH, was revealed.

    The SEED of God, (which IS Christ), is DAILY PLANTED in CIRCUMSIZED new (pure) Hearts of men, which reveals a man with Gods TRUTH and POWER within the man.

    And EVERY man WHO HAS Received, a circumsized new pure Heart, "IS" also, OF the SEED of David, Jacob, Isaac, Abraham...

    Abraham was GLAD the DAY he received the blessing of the SEED of God.

    John 8
    [56] Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

    As was I glad, the day I received the SEED of God.That is the day, I was "MADE" a son of God...(just like Jesus was) BY Gods POWER ..(who IS Christ) ...and "MADE" a son of Abraham (just like Jesus was), THROUGH the PROMISE (Abraham a father of many nations) of God, that ALL MEN "ON" EARTH, with the SEED of God, will be "MADE" a son of Abraham.

    Your "EGG" theory is not supported by Scripture.

    God is Spirit. Angels are created spirits.
    Angels WHO FERTILIZED human female eggs were Cast off the Earth for their Behavior.

    Gods Word teaches MARRIAGE, "THEN" reproducing children.

    Your theory has Gods SEED fertilizing a woman egg, reproducing a child.....but never marrying her.

    Glory to God,
    Taken
     
  4. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    If that is the case, then scripture denies that Jesus is God, for it says plainly that Jesus was "made of the seed of David according to the flesh" (Romans 1:3) and that the LORD has a Maker (Isaiah 45:11).

    But I don't think that the scripture does deny that Jesus is God; and neither am I denying Christ's Deity. For I am saying that Jesus is fully God in the hypostatic union. His human aspect is created, in His Deity He is uncreated and preexistent.

    The only way you can say this is by putting words in my mouth, @Dave L. Nothing I have said in any way denies the Deity of Christ. For I believe in it; and out of the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks: therefore it is impossible that I could have said anything that is in denial of the Deity of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Also, I will repeat that satan is the accuser of the brethren. he even goes so far as to accuse me (through you) of not believing in something that I do believe in, even with all of my heart.
     
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  5. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    @Taken,

    You may have to read between the lines of Luke 1:35 and Matthew 1:18-20 to come up with the true concept that the Holy Ghost became one with the egg in the womb of the virgin Mary; but is is a biblical doctrine.

    Maybe jump over to Genesis 3:15 and/or Isaiah 7:14 to gain added insight.
     
  6. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member

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    You have two major errors in your scheme. First you make Jesus created in the womb by the Holy Spirit. God is not created so you deny his divinity. Secondly, you deny the two natures of Christ making them physical which is pantheism. Both of these remove you from Christ and hopefully not salvation.
     
  7. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    The Lord did not come from a created woman's egg.

    The Lord came forth out from God.

    John 1
    [1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

    [3] All things were "made" by him; and without him was not any thing made that was "made."

    [9] That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

    [13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
     
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  8. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Certainly (in context) those who are born of God are not born of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, but of God.

    Jesus also, in that Mary was overshadowed by the Holy Ghost and that Jesus who was conceived in her womb is both the Son of God and the Son of man.
     
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  9. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    You can keep lying about what I believe in, but just remember that you will be held accountable by Revelation 21:8.

    Jesus, In His Deity, was not created in the womb by the Holy Spirit. He was the Holy Spirit (even the Father) before He took on an added nature of human flesh.

    Also, did I not just mention to you that the hypostatic union as a doctrine is my answer to your contentions about my faith? Therefore the two natures of Christ is a major part of my belief system; and therefore you are grasping at straws and creating straw men in your attempts to discredit my theology.

    You should really consider what is written in the following verses:

    2Pe 2:12, But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

    Jde 1:10, But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

    Because you do not understand what I am preaching you speak evil of it.

    If you did understand it you would see that it is viable theology, and scriptural to boot.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2019
  10. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member

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    You teach pantheism and deny Christ's divinity when you make the Holy Spirit his creator in the womb. You need to join the rest of the Church and let the teachers explain all of the intricacies involved in Christology.
     
  11. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    #1, the Holy Spirit is not Christ's creator in the womb. He took on an added human nature in the conception of Christ and became the Son of God and the Son of man.

    Secondly, if you are going to charge me with pantheism, I think you had better bring forth your strong logical reasons as to why you think it is so.

    Because I simply do not see it.

    And therefore if you have any kind of godly love for me, you will open my eyes as to how I am teaching pantheism by bringing forth your strong logical reasons as to why you think that that is my theology.
     
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  12. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Heading off to church, and will be back in a little while.
     
  13. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    IN CONTEXT, the Scripture is about JESUS, not human men.

    And WHO IS the Holy Ghost? Power of God.

    And WHO IS the Power of God? Christ

    Mary WAS conceived in her womb, which is simply saying, Mary was pregnant (conceived) in her womb.

    You attempt to expand Scripture to say Gods SEED FERTILIZED A VIRGINS EGG, which is Conception...and does not occur in the womb.

    You are essentially teaching a SPIRIT SEED Fertalized a HUMAN EGG and REPRODUCED a cross between a SPIRIT and HUMAN...

    Which is exactly what a FEW spirit angels did, and....WHAT? Made God so pleased He chained them in Hell...and then Himself DID the same thing.....but didnt' marry her...?

    Oh right, she was already engaged to another.....So by your account, God caused Mary to commit adultry....?

    Since by Jewish custom, a women engaged (betrothed) is accounted as a woman married.

    Why is Jesus the Son of God?
    Why is Jesus the Son of man?

    Taken
     
  14. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    You mention "you" eight times, but give no clue to whom "you" are speaking.
     
  15. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    And...?

    "I believe in God, the Father almighty,
    creator of heaven and earth.

    I believe in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord,
    who was conceived by the Holy Spirit
    and born of the virgin Mary.
    He suffered under Pontius Pilate,
    was crucified, died, and was buried;
    he descended to hell.
    The third day he rose again from the dead.
    He ascended to heaven
    and is seated at the right hand of God the Father almighty.
    From there he will come to judge the living and the dead.

    I believe in the Holy Spirit,
    the holy catholic* church,
    the communion of saints,
    the forgiveness of sins,
    the resurrection of the body,
    and the life everlasting. Amen. "

    *universal Church ..God blood washed, and called to be saints...
     
  16. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    I believe in those things, as mentioned in Scripture...."excepting the catholic and universal part".

    Do you also believe the Lord Himself, or the SavED will be on earth while the Lamb is unleashing His Wrath upon the earth or when God is unleashing His Wrath upon the earth and His Revenge upon the people remaining upon the earth?
     
  17. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member

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    Here's where you miss it. “Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:” (Hebrews 10:5) (KJV 1900) Babies do not speak yet.

    You make Jesus a human person which = pantheism. And you also deny his deity making him created. Your position, no matter what you say, makes him nothing more than a sinless prophet the Father speaks through. When Scripture teaches he is God the eternal SON without a human person, speaking through a human soul and body.
    The Chalcedonian Creed;

    "We, then, following the holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach men to confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in Godhead and also perfect in manhood; truly God and truly man, of a reasonable soul and body; consubstantial with us according to the manhood; in all things like unto us, without sin; begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the virgin Mary, the mother of God, according to the manhood; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, Only-begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, inconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably; the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union, but rather the property of each nature being preserved, and concurring in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God the Word, the Lord Jesus Christ, as the prophets from the beginning have declared concerning him, and the Lord Jesus Christ himself taught us, and the Creed of the holy Fathers has handed down to us."
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2019
  18. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Jhn 1:11, He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
    Jhn 1:12, But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
    Jhn 1:13, Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.


    Sorry; I was talking to @Dave L at that point.

    Making Jesus a human being means I do not have the spirit of antichrist. If you do not hold Him as being a human being, that would make your spirit the spirit of antichrist. Therefore my view is the biblical one.

    1Jo 4:1, Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
    1Jo 4:2, Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
    1Jo 4:3, And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

    2Jo 1:7, For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.


    But by all means, explain how holding Jesus to be human means that I hold to a pantheistic view of the Lord. I still don't see it, you are going to have to go into detail as to why you think this is. You do love me with the love of Christ? Therefore if I am in error, you will shew it to me:

    Jas 5:19, Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
    Jas 5:20, Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2019
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  19. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing, (thing, here means flesh), which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God". notice shall be called, not named, but called Son of God, (flesh is born), Son of God means flesh on earth. go back to Isaiah. 9:6, "unto us a child is born". so Son of God means, flesh in nature, a nature that will suffer the cross.
    note also the word overshadow, it's the Greek word G1982 ἐπισκιάζω episkiazo (ep-ee-skee-ad'-zo) v.
    1. to cast a shade upon
    2. (by analogy) to envelop in a haze of brilliancy
    3. (figuratively) to invest with preternatural influence

    take note of the 3rd. reference. "to invest with preternatural influence", what do preternatural means. It means, "out of the ordinary course of nature; exceptional or abnormal". the meaning here, not in the natural way of conception between a man and a women. this body as I have said before, God conceived or God made, and “formed” in Mary’s womb. Did he not formed Jeremiah body in his mothers womb before he was born, or brought forth? . Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations".as the scripture states, "prepare me a body"', Hebrews 10:5. notice it said prepare, not create a body. because God always existed, and by making or preparing a body as he did Adam's with preexisting material, earth. God, with his pre-existence, the first law of thermodynamic is not violated, and as he did with the heaven, as well with the earth, he can make, perpare anything he wants. so that body/flesh was prepared/made from the invisible, made he it visible. The flesh/body was made visible to enclosed the spirit, or the Share, or the diversified state of himself that was to come. the Word simply means the expression of thought made manifested, John 1:1 what do this mean, it is the abstract of the concrete/God/Spirit, in flesh, or the expression of God’s thoughts made known in a body of Flesh. in layman terms, a way for God/Spirit to make his thought known unto man, meaning manifesting his thoughts in a concrete fashion.

    PICJAG.
     
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  20. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Really? So it wasn't Christ who was speaking there? Give your biblical strong reasons why you believe that this passage in Hebrews is not speaking of Christ.
     
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