Trinity vs. Tritheism: Understanding the Trinity.

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justbyfaith

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Also, the Holy Ghost is also a Spirit per John 7:39...and the Bible teaches that there is one Spirit, in Ephesians 4:4.
 

justbyfaith

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I do not think it is core to salvation itself either. I just see the "trinity" as one God working as three. He's God, He could use 4 or 5 if He wishes but...they are all God...IMHO. :)
I understand the Trinity as being faithful doctrine because of the necessity of the incarnation.

If God hadn't needed to die for us, there would have never been any need for God the Father to become God the Son...essentially a distinct Person from Himself.
 
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Dave L

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@Dave L, it seems to me that you have said that the whole Trinity dwells in the human body of Jesus Christ, per Colossians 2:9.

Doesn't this make Jesus triphrenic?

But if Jesus is spirit and soul and body, which member of the Trinity is His Spirit?

God the Father is a Spirit, not a soul, John 4:23-24.

Which part of Jesus is the Holy Ghost, spirit or soul or body?

Which part of Jesus is the Son, spirit or soul or body?

Since the Father is a Spirit, that takes up the position of Jesus' spirit.

Which part of Jesus' tripartite nature is the Holy Ghost? The Father has taken the position of spirit in Jesus.

In saying these things, I am not declaring sound doctrine per se, but am attempting to speak those things which will become sound doctrine, Titus 2:1.

I'm attempting to make you think about the Triune nature of the Son, as you have said you believe in.
God is One, not three gods. The one God is indivisible having three persons. The Father who eternally begets (generates) the Son, both from whom the Holy Spirit proceeds. Jesus Christ = YAHWEH who became incarnate in the Son of Man also called Jesus Christ.

“For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.” (Colossians 2:9) To baptize in the Name of Jesus Christ is to baptize in the name of YAHWEH, the triune God, AKA as Jesus Christ in the NT.
 

justbyfaith

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The Father who eternally begets (generates) the Son, both from whom the Holy Spirit proceeds.
There is one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4), the Father (John 4:23-24).

The Holy Ghost is the Spirit (John 7:39).

Yes, the Holy Ghost proceeds from the Father and the Son; but they are the same Spirit; for there is only one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4).

Now we know that Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 12:3). And that the Lord is that Spirit (2 Corinthians 3:17).

Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are the same Spirit. That Jesus is a Spirit should be evident from Colossians 1:27 and 1 John 5:12.

And there is one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4).

There is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6); and that Lord is the Father (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21).

Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 12:3). No one can say this except by the power of the Holy Ghost.
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Now as for when the Son was begotten, I believe that it took place in Luke 1:35 and Matthew 1:18-20.

When Jesus ascended, He ascended to inhabit eternity once again. If the eternally begotten Son descended and then ascended, then there are two eternally begotten Sons inhabiting eternity.

But my point is that even in the scenario that I have presented, Jesus exists eternally with the Father, next to Him in eternity.

What I am saying is that we do not have a 2nd God descending to become a Man; and neither do we have 1/3 of God descending to become a Man.

We have God descending to become a Man. The 2nd Person of the Trinity will not descend from eternity; He has already descended and ascended. The 1st Person of the Trinity will descend to that place in history that we revere as our means of redemption, from my understanding of Isaiah 9:6.
 
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Dave L

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There is one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4), the Father (John 4:23-24).

The Holy Ghost is the Spirit (John 7:39).

Yes, the Holy Ghost proceeds from the Father and the Son; but they are the same Spirit; for there is only one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4).

Now we know that Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 12:3). And that the Lord is that Spirit (2 Corinthians 3:17).

Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are the same Spirit. That Jesus is a Spirit should be evident from Colossians 1:27 and 1 John 5:12.

And there is one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4).

There is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5, 1 Corinthians 8:6); and that Lord is the Father (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21).

Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 12:3). No one can say this except by the power of the Holy Ghost.

Now as for when the Son was begotten, I believe that it took place in Luke 1:35 and Matthew 1:18-20.

When Jesus ascended, He ascended to inhabit eternity once again. If the eternally begotten Son descended and then ascended, then there are two eternally begotten Sons inhabiting eternity.

But my point is that even in the scenario that I have presented, Jesus exists eternally with the Father, next to Him in eternity.

What I am saying is that we do not have a 2nd God descending to become a Man; and neither do we have 1/3 of God descending to become a Man.

We have God descending to become a Man. The 2nd Person of the Trinity will not descend; He has already descended and ascended. The 1st Person of the Trinity will descend to that place in history that we revere as our means of redemption, from my understanding of Isaiah 9:6.
Here's how it works. God is one Spirit extending forever in every direction, without beginning or end. In God there are three persons of that same single Spirit. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
 

101G

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Here's how it works. God is one Spirit extending forever in every direction, without beginning or end. In God there are three persons of that same single Spirit. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
God is "a" Spirit, Father is a title of JESUS, Son is a Title of JESUS. the bible is clear as day.
Isaiah 46:9 "Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me".
"I", and "Me" are single designations, this is clear as day.

now, if anyone is earnest, Isaiah 46:9 clearly reprove any trinity. it make no difference if one say this is not the core of salvation, to know or not know if the trinity is true. we disagree, for titles are not persons, it is God word that saves, and he has spoke.

for if one have the Holy Spirit in them it will convict your heart of Isaiah 46:9 as to God being one person.

if he don't convict your heart, why worry about anything from now on. for one cannot believe until the Holy Spirit allow them to believe. scripture, John 10:25 "Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
John 10:26 "But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
John 10:27 "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
John 10:28 "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
John 10:29 "My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
John 10:30 "I and my Father are one.

PICJAG.
 
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Dave L

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God is "a" Spirit, Father is a title of JESUS, Son is a Title of JESUS. the bible is clear as day.
Isaiah 46:9 "Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me".
"I", and "Me" are single designations, this is clear as day.

now, if anyone is earnest, Isaiah 46:9 clearly reprove any trinity. it make no difference if one say this is not the core of salvation, to know or not know if the trinity is true. we disagree, for titles are not persons, it is God word that saves, and he has spoke.

for if one have the Holy Spirit in them it will convict your heart of Isaiah 46:9 as to God being one person.

if he don't convict your heart, why worry about anything from now on. for one cannot believe until the Holy Spirit allow them to believe. scripture, John 10:25 "Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
John 10:26 "But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
John 10:27 "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
John 10:28 "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
John 10:29 "My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
John 10:30 "I and my Father are one.

PICJAG.
Your biggest mistake is in thinking God is ONE PERSON. God is three persons as ONE SPIRIT BEING.
 

101G

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Your biggest mistake is in thinking God is ONE PERSON. God is three persons as ONE SPIRIT BEING.
No mistake, but bible fact. the offspring is the diversity of the Root, which God is. one person shaired.
this is supported by the First and the Last who is the one and the same person. listen,

Isaiah 44:6 "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God". AGAIN God said he is one PERSON, "I".

Isaiah 41:4 "Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he". STOP, this is the same language use in John 1:1, "WITH". here it's the First "WITH" the Last. in John 1:1. it is the Word "WITH" God indicating another, not a seperate person but the same person "SHARED" in flesh. why do we say this? because in John 1:1c it says "the WORD was GOD". so John 1:1 is a clear as day "Diversity" Scripture, right in front of peoples faces. now the last one,

Isaiah 48:12 "Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last. HERE, clear as day we have the "I" a single pereson saying that he is the the First and "ALSO" the Last . the same PERSON, not two separate person, but the same one person.

someone has to be dishonest not to see and understand these scriptures. the bible is full of these type of scriptures. right in front of your eyes and yet people still not understand.

PICJAG.
 
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Dave L

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No mistake, but bible fact. the offspring is the diversity of the Root, which God is. one person shaired.
this is supported by the First and the Last who is the one and the same person. listen,

Isaiah 44:6 "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God". AGAIN God said he is one PERSON, "I".

Isaiah 41:4 "Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he". STOP, this is the same language use in John 1:1, "WITH". here it's the First "WITH" the Last. in John 1:1. it is the Word "WITH" God indicating another, not a seperate person but the same person "SHARED" in flesh. why do we say this? because in John 1:1c it says "the WORD was GOD". so John 1:1 is a clear as day "Diversity" Scripture, right in front of peoples faces. now the last one,

Isaiah 48:12 "Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last. HERE, clear as day we have the "I" a single pereson saying that he is the the First and "ALSO" the Last . the same PERSON, not two separate person, but the same one person.

someone has to be dishonest not to see and understand these scriptures. the bible is full of these type of scriptures. right in front of your eyes and yet people still not understand.

PICJAG.
You still confuse "person" with "being". Until you get this straight, you will not understand the revelation of God he provides us with.
 
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Dave L

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we know, because you can't give any.....

PICJAG.

ps Just remember "Diversity".
"Diversity" according to you is "crazy" is normal, "split personality" = "Diversity" Try telling any mental health your description of "god" and they would want to chase him down with a butterfly net.
 

101G

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"Diversity" according to you is "crazy" is normal, "split personality" = "Diversity" Try telling any mental health your description of "god" and they would want to chase him down with a butterfly net.
LOL, LOL, LOL, One being, ONE PERSON, JESUS is Lord, and he's that Spirit, 2 Corinthians 3:17 "Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty".

we are free men, in the Liberty of Christ. "crazy", "split personality", mental health, butterfly net, all these things come from the "FLESH". Romans 8:6 "For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8:7 "Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Romans 8:8 "So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God".

so bye, bye, dave........... (smile).

PICJAG.
 
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Dave L

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LOL, LOL, LOL, One being, ONE PERSON, JESUS is Lord, and he's that Spirit, 2 Corinthians 3:17 "Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty".

we are free men, in the Liberty of Christ. "crazy", "split personality", mental health, butterfly net, all these things come from the "FLESH". Romans 8:6 "For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8:7 "Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Romans 8:8 "So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God".

so bye, bye, dave........... (smile).

PICJAG.
You need to study the historic teachers in the church on this matter, not the hicks at Azusa st. who probably knew less about Acts than the average Sunday school kid.
 

justbyfaith

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You need to study the historic teachers in the church on this matter, not the hicks at Azusa st. who probably knew less about Acts than the average Sunday school kid.
If I'm not mistaken, the people at Azusa Street majored on the book of Acts. They wanted to be "Luke-hot"!