Two sets of a thousand years.

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Marty fox

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The reason that there is so much controversy and misunderstanding over Revelation chapter 20 is that most Christians don't understand that there are two sets of a thousand years one the reigning and one the binding. This is shown in Revelation chapter 20.

The binding ends in verse 7 when satan is released for his short season before he is cast into the lake of fire.

The reigning ends at the end of our world after satan is cast into the lake of fire as shown in verse 5 when the rest of the dead stand before the throne.

The key to understanding this is to realize that Jesus doesn't reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God.
 

Randy Kluth

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The problem with this, Marty, is that the passage does not teach two sets of a thousand years. It is purely a single set of a thousand years, characterized by Satan's binding.

Satan is released from bondage only *after* the thousand years. And his release is not going to last a thousand years. He is destroyed almost immediately, it seems?
 
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Davy

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That's Ludicrous.

The main reason for many being confused about Revelation 20, including yourself, is because of LACK OF REAL BIBLE STUDY in all of God's Word.

Anyone who had studied the Old Testament prophets about the 'end' of this world, and Christ's and His Apostle's warnings about it, should immediately perk up when they get to Revelation 20 about a time AFTER Jesus' future return, and when He REIGNS GLORIOUSLY IN JERUSALEM WITH HIS ELECT over all... nations, for 1,000 years. And then The JUDGMENT, and God's new heavens and a new earth event.
 

Randy Kluth

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That's Ludicrous.

The main reason for many being confused about Revelation 20, including yourself, is because of LACK OF REAL BIBLE STUDY in all of God's Word.

Anyone who had studied the Old Testament prophets about the 'end' of this world, and Christ's and His Apostle's warnings about it, should immediately perk up when they get to Revelation 20 about a time AFTER Jesus' future return, and when He REIGNS GLORIOUSLY IN JERUSALEM WITH HIS ELECT over all... nations, for 1,000 years. And then The JUDGMENT, and God's new heavens and a new earth event.
I don't agree with the personal remarks about Marty. He is pretty studied and doctrinally-orthodox, as well. But I agree with your characterization of our Millennial/Kingdom hope. :)
 
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Marty fox

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The problem with this, Marty, is that the passage does not teach two sets of a thousand years. It is purely a single set of a thousand years, characterized by Satan's binding.

Satan is released from bondage only *after* the thousand years. And his release is not going to last a thousand years. He is destroyed almost immediately, it seems?
This wasn’t my video that was posted if that’s what you mean

FYI I didn’t claim that his release is a thousand years

It has to be two sets of a thousand years satan is released for a short period and then defeated in verse 7.

Verse 5 tells us that the rest of the dead are raised on the judgement day which is after satan is released defeated and the end of our world

Does Jesus reign because satan is bound or because He is God? That will tell you if there are two sets of thousand years.
 

Ronald Nolette

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The reason that there is so much controversy and misunderstanding over Revelation chapter 20 is that most Christians don't understand that there are two sets of a thousand years one the reigning and one the binding. This is shown in Revelation chapter 20.

The binding ends in verse 7 when satan is released for his short season before he is cast into the lake of fire.

The reigning ends at the end of our world after satan is cast into the lake of fire as shown in verse 5 when the rest of the dead stand before the throne.

The key to understanding this is to realize that Jesus doesn't reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God.
Yes it is true that Jesus reigns because He is God. but Satan is also bound during the time of His reign here on earth.

There is no thousand years after Satan is loosed. when he is loosed, he gathers an army- is defeated and then Scripture shows us eternity begins:

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
 

Marty fox

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Yes it is true that Jesus reigns because He is God. but Satan is also bound during the time of His reign here on earth.

There is no thousand years after Satan is loosed. when he is loosed, he gathers an army- is defeated and then Scripture shows us eternity begins:

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
I didn't say that there is a thousand years after satan is released I said that the thousand year reign carries on after satan is released from his binding.

In verse 7 satan is released he then gathers him people is then defeated and cast into the lake of fire.

Verse 5 points to verse 11 when the rest of the dead are raised to stand before the judgment throne which after satans defeat and the end of our world
 
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rwb

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The reason that there is so much controversy and misunderstanding over Revelation chapter 20 is that most Christians don't understand that there are two sets of a thousand years one the reigning and one the binding. This is shown in Revelation chapter 20.

The binding ends in verse 7 when satan is released for his short season before he is cast into the lake of fire.

The reigning ends at the end of our world after satan is cast into the lake of fire as shown in verse 5 when the rest of the dead stand before the throne.

The key to understanding this is to realize that Jesus doesn't reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God.

Marty, this is a topic I too have recently been dwelling on. However, my understanding is in contrast to yours. I don't believe Rev 20 shows two sets of a thousand years. I believe John writes a/the thousand years to show TIME on this earth likened to a thousand years.

Satan is first bound a thousand years. During the same time likened a thousand years John sees martyred souls in heaven because in life they lived and reigned with Christ during this time of Satan's binding, a thousand years. I think the real mistake in understanding Rev 20 is ignoring the tenses. John writes in vs 4 "and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years". In other words, John sees faithful souls in heaven because in TIME (a thousand years) they were faithful unto death. They went to heaven after physical death as living (spirit) souls.

Then again in vs 6 John writes again of faithful saints called blessed and holy, have part in the first resurrection and have overcome the second death. These faithful saints are not listed among those martyred souls but they too "shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

A thousand years of Satan's binding, seeing the martyred souls in heaven, and those who shall reign with Christ all speak of the same TIME symbolized a thousand years given the Church to build the spiritual Kingdom of God in heaven as the Gospel is proclaimed unto all the earth.

John's prophecy begins from the cross of Christ when Satan was bound that he should deceive the nations no more. The beginning of the Gospel of Christ being preached through His faithful Church was a death sentence for Christ's chosen disciples. The only one from the original chosen disciples of Christ who was not martyred for faith was John. I believe these may be the faithful martyred souls John sees alive in heaven after having been killed in TIME (a thousand years) while living on the earth.

The others that "shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years", are also among the faithful who shall go to heaven a living (spirit) soul after death, but they were not among the martyred saints in the beginning, but are faithful saints nonetheless.

When the seventh angel begins to sound, this TIME likened to a thousand years given this earth shall be finished. Then Satan will be loosed for a "little season". Once Satan gathers together Gog (antichrists) and Magog (antichristians) from the four corners of the world, he surrounds the faithful left on the earth during his time. Then the saints will be called to meet the Lord in the air, and fire from God out of heaven will come down and utterly burn up everything and everyone upon the earth.
 
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Marty fox

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Marty, this is a topic I too have recently been dwelling on. However, my understanding is in contrast to yours. I don't believe Rev 20 shows two sets of a thousand years. I believe John writes a/the thousand years to show TIME on this earth likened to a thousand years.

Satan is first bound a thousand years. During the same time likened a thousand years John sees martyred souls in heaven because in life they lived and reigned with Christ during this time of Satan's binding, a thousand years. I think the real mistake in understanding Rev 20 is ignoring the tenses. John writes in vs 4 "and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years". In other words, John sees faithful souls in heaven because in TIME (a thousand years) they were faithful unto death. They went to heaven after physical death as living (spirit) souls.

Then again in vs 6 John writes again of faithful saints called blessed and holy, have part in the first resurrection and have overcome the second death. These faithful saints are not listed among those martyred souls but they too "shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

A thousand years of Satan's binding, seeing the martyred souls in heaven, and those who shall reign with Christ all speak of the same TIME symbolized a thousand years given the Church to build the spiritual Kingdom of God in heaven as the Gospel is proclaimed unto all the earth.

John's prophecy begins from the cross of Christ when Satan was bound that he should deceive the nations no more. The beginning of the Gospel of Christ being preached through His faithful Church was a death sentence for Christ's chosen disciples. The only one from the original chosen disciples of Christ who was not martyred for faith was John. I believe these may be the faithful martyred souls John sees alive in heaven after having been killed in TIME (a thousand years) while living on the earth.

The others that "shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years", are also among the faithful who shall go to heaven a living (spirit) soul after death, but they were not among the martyred saints in the beginning, but are faithful saints nonetheless.

When the seventh angel begins to sound, this TIME likened to a thousand years given this earth shall be finished. Then Satan will be loosed for a "little season". Once Satan gathers together Gog (antichrists) and Magog (antichristians) from the four corners of the world, he surrounds the faithful left on the earth during his time. Then the saints will be called to meet the Lord in the air, and fire from God out of heaven will come down and utterly burn up everything and everyone upon the earth.
Yes I agree that is my belief too and to clarify I believe that the term a thousand years is symbolic for the church age.

My point of this post is to show that the scriptures in Revelation chapter 20 shows that the binding ends before the reigning thus there are two separate sets of a thousand years one the reigning one the binding.

Verse 5 shows that the reigning doesn’t end until the end of our world in verse 11-12 at the judgement day.

5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection

11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books.

The binding ends in verse 7 when satan is released before the final events at the end of our world. Thus Jesus doesn‘t reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God.

7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison

Now the unanswered question is how does satan get released? Amils need to know the answer to this to spread the truth of the thousand years.
 
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rwb

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Yes I agree that is my belief too and to clarify I believe that the term a thousand years is symbolic for the church age.

My point of this post is to show that the scriptures in Revelation chapter 20 shows that the binding ends before the reigning thus there are two separate sets of a thousand years one the reigning one the binding.

Verse 5 shows that the reigning doesn’t end until the end of our world in verse 11-12 at the judgement day.

5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection

11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books.

The binding ends in verse 7 when satan is released before the final events at the end of our world. Thus Jesus doesn‘t reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God.

7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison

Now the unanswered question is how does satan get released?

Marty, I don't believe the binding of Satan must end before the reigning begins. John sees the dead in heaven, alive after death because in life they were martyred for their faith. Then in vs 5 John says the rest of the dead will not live again until the thousand years were finished. It seems John is saying these dead saints are not the only physically dead people, because the rest of the dead (people who had already died) have not lived again and will not live again until the thousand years were finished. John is showing us two types of the dead, those who were faithful unto death, whom he sees alive in heaven, and the rest of the dead who are not alive in heaven with the faithful saints but they have already died in unbelief, and will not live again until the thousand years have ended.

"This is the first resurrection" only makes sense when read with vs 6. The rest of the dead are in opposition to those of vs 4 who have lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years (TIME). And also in opposition to those who shall reign with Christ a thousand years. Since they shall not live again until the thousand years are finished, they have to be "the dead" of vs 12 who are raised to life again to stand before the GWTJ after the thousand years. Therefore the first resurrection are the blessed and holy, have part in the first resurrection, have no fear of the second death. Only the faithful live and reign with Christ in TIME, likened to a thousand years, on earth before they die.

Revelation 20:5-6 (KJV) But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
 
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Marty fox

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Marty, I don't believe the binding of Satan must end before the reigning begins. John sees the dead in heaven, alive after death because in life they were martyred for their faith. Then in vs 5 John says the rest of the dead will not live again until the thousand years were finished. It seems John is saying these dead saints are not the only physically dead people, because the rest of the dead (people who had already died) have not lived again and will not live again until the thousand years were finished. John is showing us two types of the dead, those who were faithful unto death, whom he sees alive in heaven, and the rest of the dead who are not alive in heaven with the faithful saints but they have already died in unbelief, and will not live again until the thousand years have ended.

"This is the first resurrection" only makes sense when read with vs 6. The rest of the dead are in opposition to those of vs 4 who have lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years (TIME). And also in opposition to those who shall reign with Christ a thousand years. Since they shall not live again until the thousand years are finished, they have to be "the dead" of vs 12 who are raised to life again to stand before the GWTJ after the thousand years. Therefore the first resurrection are the blessed and holy, have part in the first resurrection, have no fear of the second death. Only the faithful live and reign with Christ in TIME, likened to a thousand years, on earth before they die.

Revelation 20:5-6 (KJV) But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
I think that we are say the same thing and to clarify I never said that the binding of satan ends before the reigning begins it doesn’t. The reigning and binding start at the same time they just don’t end at the same time. Satan is bound because Jesus reigns but Jesus doesn’t reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God and concurred death. He reigns until the end of our world.

5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.

The rest of the dead which is written in the brackets in verse 4 are the unsaved who rise at the end of our world on the judgement day. The part in verse 5 not written in the brackets reverts back to the ones John mentions in verse 4 who come to life.

All saints come to life spiritually when they are saved verse 4 is just showing that even though they die for Jesus physically they still live and reign with Jesus spiritually in heaven.

Remember Jesus told the thief on the cross that he would be in paradise with Jesus that same day they were on their crosses and he didn’t die for Jesus he died because of his own actions.
 
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rwb

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I think that we are say the same thing and to clarify I never said that the binding of satan ends before the reigning begins it doesn’t. The reigning and binding start at the same time they just don’t end at the same time. Satan is bound because Jesus reigns but Jesus doesn’t reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God and concurred death. He reigns until the end of our world.

5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.

The rest of the dead which is written in the brackets in verse 4 are the unsaved who rise at the end of our world on the judgement day. The part in verse 5 not written in the brackets reverts back to the ones John mentions in verse 4 who come to life.

All saints come to life spiritually when they are saved verse 4 is just showing that even though they die for Jesus physically they still live and reign with Jesus spiritually in heaven.

Remember Jesus told the thief on the cross that he would be in paradise with Jesus that same day they were on their crosses and he didn’t die for Jesus he died because of his own actions.

I agree Marty! Satan didn't need to be bound for Christ to reign!
 
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ScottA

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The reason that there is so much controversy and misunderstanding over Revelation chapter 20 is that most Christians don't understand that there are two sets of a thousand years one the reigning and one the binding. This is shown in Revelation chapter 20.

The binding ends in verse 7 when satan is released for his short season before he is cast into the lake of fire.

The reigning ends at the end of our world after satan is cast into the lake of fire as shown in verse 5 when the rest of the dead stand before the throne.

The key to understanding this is to realize that Jesus doesn't reign because satan is bound Jesus reigns because He is God.
Hi Marty,

The two references to a thousand year period actually occur at the same time. The reign of Christ began when all power and authority in heaven and earth were given to Him 2,000+ years ago. Which is also when Satan was bound regarding Israel because "It is finished" for that house (that fold} which Jesus had initially come for, but also the time Satan is loosed for a short season upon the other fold of the Gentiles. All of which is not actually a thousand years (or a year with God), but is Spirit-speak for the fulness thereof. A thousand is a derivative or multiple of 10 which is a grand indication of fulness or completeness.

The mistake that is commonly made, is to assume that the thousand years is "future" while the scriptures clearly state that Jesus was given all power and authority 2,000+ years ago.
 
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Jay Ross

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Hi Marty,

The two references to a thousand year period actually occur at the same time. The reign of Christ began when all power and authority in heaven and earth were given to Him 2,000+ years ago. Which is also when Satan was bound regarding Israel because "It is finished" for that house (that fold} which Jesus had initially come for, but also the time Satan is loosed for a short season upon the other fold of the Gentiles. All of which is not actually a thousand years (or a year with God), but is Spirit-speak for the fulness thereof. A thousand is a derivative or multiple of 10 which is a grand indication of fulness or completeness.

The mistake that is commonly made, is to assume that the thousand years is "future" while the scriptures clearly state that Jesus was given all power and authority 2,000+ years ago.

Something seems out of sorts here in the above post.
 

ScottA

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Something seems out of sorts here in the above post.
Yes, of course. We live in the realm of time but are trying to rationalize what is not of this world with what is, by the same terms that we are accustom to, and it doesn't work, nor should it. The need here, is what Paul referred to as "the renewing of your mind"--that is, to view things from Gods (timeless) perspective while we remain within the book of times and revelations. John the Baptist also eluded to the need for us to "decrease", while the ways of God and Christ "increase." The time and the fulness thereof for such things to be revealed was foretold as the time of "the sounding of the seventh angel." This is that time.
 

Jay Ross

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Yes, of course. We live in the realm of time but are trying to rationalize what is not of this world with what is, by the same terms that we are accustom to, and it doesn't work, nor should it. The need here, is what Paul referred to as "the renewing of your mind"--that is, to view things from Gods (timeless) perspective while we remain within the book of times and revelations. John the Baptist also eluded to the need for us to "decrease", while the ways of God and Christ "increase." The time and the fulness thereof for such things to be revealed was foretold as the time of "the sounding of the seventh angel." This is that time.

Your response has not changed my position on your posts at all. Something is off with your understanding on the time frame of the end time events.