Was Judas Saved Or Not Saved?
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How can we know if God has not revealed it to us? Is the judgement given to us to make?
"Judge not, that ye be not judged.
For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again." Matt 7:1-2
historyb
Well-Known Member
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Judas is lost, the scripture is clear on that but what matters for you is your Salvation. Don't allow the distractions of wether others are saved or not to occupy your thoughts. Pray for the ability to stand when Jesus appears in the clouds....pray that you are kept from and strengthened against sin....pray that a love for righteousness is born in your heart and for an understanding of the forgiveness of your great debt.
Mark 14:21 (NKJV)
21 The Son of Man indeed goes just as it is written of Him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been good for that man if he had never been born."
21 The Son of Man indeed goes just as it is written of Him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been good for that man if he had never been born."
mailmandan
Well-Known Member
Judas was an unbelieving, unclean devil who betrayed Jesus. (John 6:64-71: 13:10-11) Judas was also referred to as the son of perdition. (John 17:12) Doesn’t sound like saved to me.
Nancy
Well-Known Member
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
Judas is a bit of an enigma. As one of Jesus' hand-picked apostles he was
fully aware, fully trained, and fully convinced, that his master was valid.
● John 17:6-8 . . I have revealed ou to those whom you gave me out of the
world. They were yours; you gave them to me and they have obeyed your
word. Now they know that everything you have given me comes from you.
For I gave them the words you gave me and they accepted them. They knew
with certainty that I came from you, and they believed that you sent me.
Yet, the man turned out to be a traitor.
● John 17:12 . . While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe
by that name you gave me. None has been lost except the one doomed to
destruction.
Judas sort of reminds me of Rachel's dad Laban. He was privileged with a
close encounter of a third kind with God, yet remained an idolater. People
like Judas and Laban are hard to figure. But they should be a warning to
people who spend years active on Christian forums discussing the Bible and
posting and reading hundreds of messages, that they are just as likely to
end up facing the sum of all fears as people who've never read the Bible
even once in their entire lives.
_
Judas is a bit of an enigma. As one of Jesus' hand-picked apostles he was
fully aware, fully trained, and fully convinced, that his master was valid.
● John 17:6-8 . . I have revealed ou to those whom you gave me out of the
world. They were yours; you gave them to me and they have obeyed your
word. Now they know that everything you have given me comes from you.
For I gave them the words you gave me and they accepted them. They knew
with certainty that I came from you, and they believed that you sent me.
Yet, the man turned out to be a traitor.
● John 17:12 . . While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe
by that name you gave me. None has been lost except the one doomed to
destruction.
Judas sort of reminds me of Rachel's dad Laban. He was privileged with a
close encounter of a third kind with God, yet remained an idolater. People
like Judas and Laban are hard to figure. But they should be a warning to
people who spend years active on Christian forums discussing the Bible and
posting and reading hundreds of messages, that they are just as likely to
end up facing the sum of all fears as people who've never read the Bible
even once in their entire lives.
_
Mark 14:21 (NKJV)
21 The Son of Man indeed goes just as it is written of Him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been good for that man if he had never been born."
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
We can't use our life to pay for even a single one of our sins because it's
earmarked to pay for Adam's.
_
We can't use our life to pay for even a single one of our sins because it's
earmarked to pay for Adam's.
_
This is from John Fletcher's Checks to Antinomianism concerning Judas. I always thought that he dealt with the issue well.
I hope nobody will charge me with blasphemy, for saying that our Lord called Judas with the same sincerity with which he called his other disciples. Heaven forbid that any Christian should suppose the Lamb of God called Iscariot to get him into the pit of perdition, as the fowler does an unhappy bird which he wants to get into a decoy. Judas readily answered the call, and undoubtedly believed in Christ as well as the rest of the apostles; for St. John says, “This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory, and his disciples [of whom Judas was one] believed in him.” His faith was true so far as it went; for he was one of “the little flock to whom it was God’s good pleasure to give the kingdom,” Luke xii, 32. Our Lord pronounced him “blessed,” with the rest of his disciples, Matt. xiii, 16, and conditionally promised him one of the twelve apostolic crowns in his glory, Matt. xix, 28.
If you say, that “he was always a traitor and a hypocrite,” you run into endless difficulties; for, (1.) You make Christ countenance, by his example, all bishops, who knowingly ordain wicked men all patrons, who give them livings and all kings, who prefer ungodly men to high dignities in the Church. (2.) You suppose that Christ, who would not receive an occasional testimony from an evil spirit, not only sent a devil to preach and baptize in his name, but at his return encouraged him in his horrid dissimulation, by bidding him “rejoice that his name was written in heaven.” (3.) You believe,” that the faithful and true Witness,” in whose mouth no guile was ever found, gave this absurd, hypocritical charge to a goat, an arch hypocrite, a devil: “Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves; but fear not, the hairs of your head are all numbered. A sparrow shall not fall to the ground without your Father, and ye are of more value than many sparrows. Do not premeditate, it shall be given you what you shall speak: for it is not you that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.”
When our Lord spoke thus to Judas, he was a sheep, i.e. “he heard Christ’s voice, and followed him.” But, alas! he was afterward taken by the bright shining of silver and gold, as David was by the striking beauty of Uriah’s wife. And when he had admitted the base temptation, our Lord, with the honesty of a Master, and tenderness of a Saviour, said, “Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?” He has let the tempter into his heart. This severe, though indirect reproof, reclaimed Judas for a time; as a similar rebuke checked Peter on another occasion. Nor was it, probably, till near the end of our Lord’s ministry that he began to be “unfaithful in the mammon of unrighteousness:” and even then Christ kindly warned, without exposing him. - Works Vol. 1, pages 244-245.
I hope nobody will charge me with blasphemy, for saying that our Lord called Judas with the same sincerity with which he called his other disciples. Heaven forbid that any Christian should suppose the Lamb of God called Iscariot to get him into the pit of perdition, as the fowler does an unhappy bird which he wants to get into a decoy. Judas readily answered the call, and undoubtedly believed in Christ as well as the rest of the apostles; for St. John says, “This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory, and his disciples [of whom Judas was one] believed in him.” His faith was true so far as it went; for he was one of “the little flock to whom it was God’s good pleasure to give the kingdom,” Luke xii, 32. Our Lord pronounced him “blessed,” with the rest of his disciples, Matt. xiii, 16, and conditionally promised him one of the twelve apostolic crowns in his glory, Matt. xix, 28.
If you say, that “he was always a traitor and a hypocrite,” you run into endless difficulties; for, (1.) You make Christ countenance, by his example, all bishops, who knowingly ordain wicked men all patrons, who give them livings and all kings, who prefer ungodly men to high dignities in the Church. (2.) You suppose that Christ, who would not receive an occasional testimony from an evil spirit, not only sent a devil to preach and baptize in his name, but at his return encouraged him in his horrid dissimulation, by bidding him “rejoice that his name was written in heaven.” (3.) You believe,” that the faithful and true Witness,” in whose mouth no guile was ever found, gave this absurd, hypocritical charge to a goat, an arch hypocrite, a devil: “Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves; but fear not, the hairs of your head are all numbered. A sparrow shall not fall to the ground without your Father, and ye are of more value than many sparrows. Do not premeditate, it shall be given you what you shall speak: for it is not you that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.”
When our Lord spoke thus to Judas, he was a sheep, i.e. “he heard Christ’s voice, and followed him.” But, alas! he was afterward taken by the bright shining of silver and gold, as David was by the striking beauty of Uriah’s wife. And when he had admitted the base temptation, our Lord, with the honesty of a Master, and tenderness of a Saviour, said, “Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?” He has let the tempter into his heart. This severe, though indirect reproof, reclaimed Judas for a time; as a similar rebuke checked Peter on another occasion. Nor was it, probably, till near the end of our Lord’s ministry that he began to be “unfaithful in the mammon of unrighteousness:” and even then Christ kindly warned, without exposing him. - Works Vol. 1, pages 244-245.
2 Thessalonians 2:13 (NKJV)
13 God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,
13 God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,
Ezekiel 18:19 Yet say ye, Why? doth not the son bear the iniquity of the father? When the son hath done that which is lawful and right, and hath kept all my statutes, and hath done them, he shall surely live.
20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
Yan
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Amusingly, the more religious people become, the more they want to know all the fate of mankind. Who are humans to decide whether to go to heaven or hell, what is our advantage by wanting to know that ?
Has the fate of mankind been made a gamble by the world?
Has the fate of mankind been made a gamble by the world?
He was lost temporarily. God is not through with him yet.
Romans 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
Nowhere in scripture does it say that Judas was saved or possessed eternal life. In fact it declares just the opposite. The bible teaches that Judas was the son of perdition from the beginning. He was created for the very purpose and role as the traitor who would betray Jesus. Jesus said of Judas it would of been better off for him to not even been born than to betray the Son of Man.
John 6:63-65
The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life. 64 Yet there are some of you who do not believe." For Jesus had known from the beginning which of them did not believe and who would betray Him. 65 He went on to say, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him."
John 6:70-71
Then Jesus replied, "Have I not chosen you, the Twelve? Yet one of you is a devil!" 71 (He meant Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot, who, though one of the Twelve, was later to betray Him.)
John 12:4-6
But one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, who was later to betray Him, objected, 5 "Why wasn't this perfume sold and the money given to the poor? It was worth a year's wages." 6 He did not say this because he cared about the poor but because he was a thief; as keeper of the money bag, he used to help himself to what was put into it.
John 13:10-11
10 Jesus answered, "A person who has had a bath needs only to wash his feet; his whole body is clean. And you are clean, though not every one of you." 11 For He knew who was going to betray Him, and that was why He said not every one was clean.
John 17:12
12 While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe by that name you gave me. None has been lost except the one doomed to destruction so that Scripture would be fulfilled.
Matt 26:23-25
23 Jesus replied, "The one who has dipped his hand into the bowl with me will betray me. 24 The Son of Man will go just as it is written about him. But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him if he had not been born."
25 Then Judas, the one who would betray him, said, "Surely not I, Rabbi?"
Jesus answered, "Yes, it is you."
Acts 1:16-19
16 and said, "Brothers, the Scripture had to be fulfilled which the Holy Spirit spoke long ago through the mouth of David concerning Judas, who served as guide for those who arrested Jesus— 17 he was one of our number and shared in this ministry."
18 (With the reward he got for his wickedness, Judas bought a field; there he fell headlong, his body burst open and all his intestines spilled out. 19 Everyone in Jerusalem heard about this, so they called that field in their language Akeldama, that is, Field of Blood.)
Acts 1:24-26
Show us which of these two you have chosen 25 to take over this apostolic ministry, which Judas left to go where he belongs." 26 Then they cast lots, and the lot fell to Matthias; so he was added to the eleven apostles.
Ps 109:4-8
In return for my friendship they accuse me,
but I am a man of prayer.
5 They repay me evil for good,
and hatred for my friendship.
6 Appoint an evil man to oppose him;
let an accuser stand at his right hand.
7 When he is tried, let him be found guilty,
and may his prayers condemn him.
8 May his days be few;
may another take his place of leadership.
hope this helps!!!
quietthinker
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Sabertooth
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Looking at Peter's rebuke of Jesus' prophesied death [Matthew 16:21-23] and his later denial of Jesus [Matthew 26:69-75], I would say that all of the disciples were primarily moving in the flesh prior to the Pentecost.
Other examples,
Christians can turn away now, too, but I don't think that it is an easy process.
Other examples,
- James & John wanted to call down fire on the Samaritans [Luke 9:51-56],
- Their mother sought to have their thrones set up on either side of Jesus [Matthew 20:20-23].
Christians can turn away now, too, but I don't think that it is an easy process.
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