what do you see wrong with this ?

[Ezra]

When people claim that we are saved by grace alone, and by nothing else, they are really saying that keeping the commandments of God is not necessary to salvation. But what does the scripture say? i been doing a study on grace on the net ran across this.. the page was good up to this point . paul wrote in ephesian 2 by grace are ye saved through faith

 

[Episkopos]

When people claim that we are saved by grace alone, and by nothing else, they are really saying that keeping the commandments of God is not necessary to salvation. But what does the scripture say? i been doing a study on grace on the net ran across this.. the page was good up to this point . paul wrote in ephesian 2 by grace are ye saved through faith

We begin our walk by a salvation through grace...but that continued walk bears a spiritual fruit...if the grace is real...and if we are faithful. We will not be judged easier for the grace we have received...but harder. To whom much is given more is required. But many claim an imaginary grace that has no power over sin. So they are just the same as they always were...but with a religious notion that now they are automatically forgiven for ongoing sins. Diabolical. One feels defiled just thinking about it.

 

[Stumpmaster]

When people claim that we are saved by grace alone, and by nothing else, they are really saying that keeping the commandments of God is not necessary to salvation. But what does the scripture say? i been doing a study on grace on the net ran across this.. the page was good up to this point . paul wrote in ephesian 2 by grace are ye saved through faith

Hi Ezra. When people claim we are saved by grace alone they are in harmony with what the Bible teaches. However it is important for us to appreciate that without faith there is no conduit for God's grace to be conveyed to us. Either you believe Ephesians 2:8-10 and Hebrews 12:2 or you don't.
Eph 2:8-10
(8) For by grace are you saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.
(10) For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them.

Hebrews 12:2 reinforces the truth that our faith was initiated by Christ and is completed by Him, so we cannot claim our standing and status in Christ is of our own doing. Abiding in Christ and producing fruit comes as a result of salvation but is not the cause of it.
Heb 12:1-2
(1) Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which does so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,
(2) Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

 

[Invisibilis]

Faith is unconditional.
To be unconditional means, to no longer trust self, but trust God.
To no longer trust self means, to be absolutely honest (truthful).

So, to be unconditionally honest invites God's Grace.

So, Paul was speaking honestly.
It is only our conditional self which is dishonest.

 

[Ezra]

good post ALL very Biblical..hopefully more will reply

 

[Enoch111]

When people claim that we are saved by grace alone, and by nothing else, they are really saying that keeping the commandments of God is not necessary to salvation.

You need to go back and study Romans 4.

1. ABRAHAM WAS NOT JUSTIFIED BY WORKS (KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS)
1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? 2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

2. ABRAHAM'S FAITH WAS COUNTED OR RECKONED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS: THAT IS PURELY BY GOD'S GRACE
3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

3. ALL WHO BELIEVE ARE DEEMED TO BE RIGHTEOUS BEFORE GOD
4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

4. FORGIVENESS OF SINS IS BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH
6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, 7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. 8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

5. GENTILES ARE INCLUDED IN JUSTIFICATION BY GRACE
9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

6. GOD IMPUTES RIGHTEOUSNESS TO THOSE WHO BELIEVE
11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also: 12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

7. THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF FAITH DOES NOT COME FROM THE COMMANDMENTS BEING OBEYED
13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

8. GRACE REQUIRES COMPLETE FAITH JUST LIKE ABRAHAM'S
16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all, 17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were. 18 Who against hope believed in hope, that he might become the father of many nations, according to that which was spoken, So shall thy seed be. 19 And being not weak in faith, he considered not his own body now dead, when he was about an hundred years old, neither yet the deadness of Sara's womb:20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God; 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

9. WHAT WAS SAID OF ABRAHAM APPLIES TO ALL BELIEVERS
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

10. CHRIST ROSE FROM THE DEAD SO THAT WE MIGHT BE JUSTIFIED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

 

[Ezra]

You need to go back and study Romans 4.

i know the doctrine saved by grace through faith romans 5 paul introduces Grace . this what to get a discussion going . been a good one

 

[RogerDC]

When people claim that we are saved by grace alone, and by nothing else, they are really saying that keeping the commandments of God is not necessary to salvation. But what does the scripture say? i been doing a study on grace on the net ran across this.. the page was good up to this point . paul wrote in ephesian 2 by grace are ye saved through faith

My understanding is, we initially gain access to God's grace through faith (Eph 2:8), but then we must abide in Christ by keeping his commandments (John 14:15, 1John 2:3).
James 2:24 says "a man is justified by works and not by faith alone" - "works" is keeping Christ's commandments, which of course includes repentance.

 

[Stumpmaster]

My understanding is, we initially gain access to God's grace through faith (Eph 2:8), but then we must abide in Christ by keeping his commandments (John 14:15, 1John 2:3).
James 2:24 says "a man is justified by works and not by faith alone" - "works" is keeping Christ's commandments, which of course includes repentance.

Good point, RogerDC. Faith without works is dead, and unable to provide a conduit or channel for God's grace to flow through, but on the flip side there is such a thing as dead works, repentance from which Hebrews 6:1 mentions as the first of six foundational commitments to move on from once laid. In context as per the previous chapter, reliance upon keeping the law instead of accepting God's grace for salvation equals dead works, and by analogy anything that is done to earn salvation in disregard or rejection of it being a free gift from God is also a dead work
Heb 6:1-3
(1) Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
(2) Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
(3) And this will we do, if God permit.

 

[Deborah_]

We are justified by grace alone, through faith.

But... there's more to our salvation than just justification. True believers (who have been justified) also undergo sanctification - which does involve obedience to commandments.

Confusion arises because the word 'salvation' can be used to mean simply 'justification' or to cover the whole process.

 

[Waiting on him]

John 6:28-29 KJV
[28] Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? [29] Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

What I see wright with this is, it doesn’t say place faith in yourself.
Tecarta Bible

 

[Ezra]

My understanding is, we initially gain access to God's grace through faith (Eph 2:8), but then we must abide in Christ by keeping his commandments (John 14:15, 1John 2:3).
James 2:24 says "a man is justified by works and not by faith alone" - "works" is keeping Christ's commandments, which of course includes repentance.

so all we have to do to be saved is just obey God commandments nothing else?

 

[Ezra]

so what we are getting here is confusion. paul introduces Grace in romans 5
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. 20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound: God grace conquers ANY sin , sort of like a chess game checkmate .i am not a chess player .but When Christ said it was finished. he paid the finial payment for sin . then when he was resurrected he made a way for us to have the new life in HIM . works follows salvation .the article i posted

When people claim that we are saved by grace alone, and by nothing else, they are really saying that keeping the commandments of God is not necessary to salvation.

noah was saved man before the flood not after . his physical being and his family was saved. they had to enter the door the ark represents Jesus

 

[Ezra]

We are justified by grace alone, through faith.

But... there's more to our salvation than just justification. True believers (who have been justified) also undergo sanctification - which does involve obedience to commandments.

Confusion arises because the word 'salvation' can be used to mean simply 'justification' or to cover the whole process.

this is true but justification is being declared not guilty just as if we had never sinned .it is also part of our sanctification.. he justifies us setsus a part to be made Holy . three step process positional progressive and finial . as long as we are in this earthy body we are all a W. I.P work in progress much like the potter and the clay

 

[Ezra]

we initially gain access to God's grace through faith

at what point do we gain access to his GRACE ?

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

When people claim that we are saved by grace alone, and by nothing else, they are really saying that keeping the commandments of God is not necessary to salvation. But what does the scripture say? i been doing a study on grace on the net ran across this.. the page was good up to this point . paul wrote in ephesian 2 by grace are ye saved through faith

Romans 6:1-2 Paul's point here being that even though the Christian is saved by grace does not give the Christian the right to live in sin (transgress God's law) for the Christian is one who has died to sin. Therefore salvation is a combination of God's grace and man's faithful obedience to the will of God.

Paul points out in Romans 6:16 we are all going to be saved or lost, lost by serving "sin unto death" or saved by serving "obedience unto righteousness". "Obedience" means keeping God's NT law, doing God's will. Therefore 'obedience unto righteousness' means obedience to God's NT law leads one to being righteous before God. No such thing as 'disobedience unto righteousness', such does not make sense. Continuing impenitently in wrong doing (transgressing God's law) does not make one right doing in God's eyes.

Of course the Christian's obedience will not be perfectly sinless nor has God ever thought it would be, so God gave the Christian the avenue of repentance in order to be forgiven, (1 John 1:7-10)...have all his sins continually washed away, forgiven by continuing to walk in the light, continuing to repent and confess sins.

God's grace AND man's obedience to God's will (which includes repenting and confessing of sins) = salvation.

It is a straw man argument to claim obedience to the will of God is an attempt to earn/merit God's grace. Again, no one's obedience will be sinlessly perfect and how can imperfect obedience merit salvation? It cannot. But God has made obedience to His will a necessary condition to receive His free gift of grace. Putting conditions upon a free gift does not in anyway take away from the freeness of the gift. If salvation were totally UNcondtional then all men would UNconditionally be saved (Titus 2:11) but there is no such thing as Universalism taught in the Bible. Hence receiving grace is conditional upon having faith, (not faith only) but a faith that is obedient to the will of God. And again, that obedience is necessary to keep one from serving "sin unto death" (Romans 6:16) and being lost.

Again, Paul says the Christian is one who is 'dead to sin'. One cannot be 'dead to sin' while at the same time be continually living impenitently in transgression to God's will.

Ephesians 2:8 saved by grace through faith. Paul did NOT say saved by grace alone through faith alone. Men add the word 'alone' and totally change what Paul said.
The faith Paul speaks about in Romans INCLUDES obedience to the will of God else if one is not being "obedient unto righteousness" he is serving "sin unto death". Faith alone lacks obedience. Ask those who follow Luther's faith onlyism which master of Romans 6:16 they serve "obedience unto righteousness" or are they serving "sin unto death"? (Prepare not to be answered or for them to rewrite verse 16 by either adding an option not given or change one of the two options that are given.)

 

[bbyrd009]

i been doing a study on grace on the net ran across this.. the page was good up to this point

"this?" what page, Ezra? did you mean to include a link here? ty

 

[Ezra]

Romans 6:1-2 Paul's point here being that even though the Christian is saved by grace does not give the Christian the right to live in sin (transgress God's law) for the Christian is one who has died to sin. Therefore salvation is a combination of God's grace and man's faithful obedience to the will of God.

Paul points out in Romans 6:16 we are all going to be saved or lost, lost by serving "sin unto death" or saved by serving "obedience unto righteousness". "Obedience" means keeping God's NT law, doing God's will. Therefore 'obedience unto righteousness' means obedience to God's NT law leads one to being righteous before God. No such thing as 'disobedience unto righteousness', such does not make sense. Continuing impenitently in wrong doing (transgressing God's law) does not make one right doing in God's eyes.

Of course the Christian's obedience will not be perfectly sinless nor has God ever thought it would be, so God gave the Christian the avenue of repentance in order to be forgiven, (1 John 1:7-10)...have all his sins continually washed away, forgiven by continuing to walk in the light, continuing to repent and confess sins.

God's grace AND man's obedience to God's will (which includes repenting and confessing of sins) = salvation.

It is a straw man argument to claim obedience to the will of God is an attempt to earn/merit God's grace. Again, no one's obedience will be sinlessly perfect and how can imperfect obedience merit salvation? It cannot. But God has made obedience to His will a necessary condition to receive His free gift of grace. Putting conditions upon a free gift does not in anyway take away from the freeness of the gift. If salvation were totally UNcondtional then all men would UNconditionally be saved (Titus 2:11) but there is no such thing as Universalism taught in the Bible. Hence receiving grace is conditional upon having faith, (not faith only) but a faith that is obedient to the will of God. And again, that obedience is necessary to keep one from serving "sin unto death" (Romans 6:16) and being lost.

Again, Paul says the Christian is one who is 'dead to sin'. One cannot be 'dead to sin' while at the same time be continually living impenitently in transgression to God's will.

Ephesians 2:8 saved by grace through faith. Paul did NOT say saved by grace alone through faith alone. Men add the word 'alone' and totally change what Paul said.
The faith Paul speaks about in Romans INCLUDES obedience to the will of God else if one is not being "obedient unto righteousness" he is serving "sin unto death". Faith alone lacks obedience. Ask those who follow Luther's faith onlyism which master of Romans 6:16 they serve "obedience unto righteousness" or are they serving "sin unto death"? (Prepare not to be answered or for them to rewrite verse 16 by either adding an option not given or change one of the two options that are given.)

i like this

 

[Ezra]

"this?" what page, Ezra? did you mean to include a link here? ty

because the page in it self has nothing to do with the subject.it was the one quote .but no i had no need to give the link

 

[bbyrd009]

i been doing a study on grace on the net ran across this.. the page was good up to this point .

does that refer to this?

"paul wrote in ephesian 2 by grace are ye saved through faith"