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What is marriage?

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by verzanumi24, Sep 1, 2007.

  1. butxifxnot

    butxifxnot New Member

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    (verzanumi24;17462)
    Sorry to contradict you but no one who is truly in Christ will practice same sex marriage. A Christian may sin because of weakness, or succumb to temptation, but if he/she is a Christian they will not practice sin.
    (verzanumi24;17465)
    Yes this is another hot potato that most pastors will not touch with a ten foot pole...and yes I believe that marriage to a non believer is being unequally yoked...however if the believer has a mate whom they married before conversion, and that mate is not a believer it is fine in that case.
    Doot-de-doo! *points* [​IMG]
     
  2. verzanumi24

    verzanumi24 Advanced Member

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    (butxifxnot;18495)
    Holy crud, that's a long OP. o.oThe Scriptures make absolutely no distinction between marriage and who you have intercourse with. Marriage is a huband and wife being together as one (flesh), according to the Bible. Paul teaches that a man who has sex with a prostitute "becomes one flesh" with her. Sex and marriage should come hand in hand: both are one in the same of two becoming one. ...so far as I understand it.As far as you (generic "you") living with a significant other... look at it this way:according to you, you two are married. However, when you do your taxes, you are, to the government, not married.This government recognizes the Biblical institution of marriage (...at least, right now it still does), so to say that you can live with your spouse before being officially married...is lying to the government.*shrug* On top of the fact that you don't know if you'll follow through without real commitment. If you are really committed to each other...why aren't you getting married?
    No offence intended but I am not interested in what the government thinks or believes....I am interested in what the Bible says. The government is not the author of my or a Christian's salvation;I only abide by the laws set up by the government if I see that it does not violates God’s word, and if and when it does, I simply disregard that law, because in truth my citizen is in heaven, and I am an ambassador of the kingdom of God here.As far as the Bible is concern, it does not tells us that in order for an intimate relationship to be valid, a Pastor for example have to sanction the relationship. In fact there are some marriages conducted by a Pastor which in God's eye is not legitimate. A man and a woman who loves each other and desires to come together as man and wife has the right and authority to do so without the need to hire a Pastor. The problem is in our modern society, rather then help to empower each other, or at least respect and recognize the rights of others; we set up officials in office who takes away ones God given rights and in some cases exempt them selves from these imposed rules/laws. I am not saying that it is wrong to have a traditional marriage, what I am saying is if the law does not prevents/prohibit common law marriage (in some countries this kind of relationship is recognized), then the couple have not sinned, because the Bible does not sanction one over the other….they are both legitimate options in God’s eyes. One does not have to have a wedding in order to be commited, and there are people who went through the traditional mariage who are not commited to the relationship.
     
  3. butxifxnot

    butxifxnot New Member

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    No offence intended but I am not interested in what the government thinks or believes....I am interested in what the Bible says. The government is not the author of my or a Christian's salvation;I only abide by the laws set up by the government if I see that it does not violates God’s word, and if and when it does, I simply disregard that law, because in truth my citizen is in heaven, and I am an ambassador of the kingdom of God here.
    Well said. [​IMG]
    As far as the Bible is concern, it does not tells us that in order for an intimate relationship to be valid, a Pastor for example have to sanction the relationship.
    That is correct. But there is always a marriage in the Bible before two become one: as a public testament to the commitment of marriage, ie two people becoming one.
    In fact there are some marriages conducted by a Pastor which in God's eye is not legitimate. A man and a woman who loves each other and desires to come together as man and wife has the right and authority to do so without the need to hire a Pastor. The problem is in our modern society, rather then help to empower each other, or at least respect and recognize the rights of others; we set up officials in office who takes away ones God given rights and in some cases exempt them selves from these imposed rules/laws. I am not saying that it is wrong to have a traditional marriage, what I am saying is if the law does not prevents/prohibit common law marriage (in some countries this kind of relationship is recognized), then the couple have not sinned, because the Bible does not sanction one over the other….they are both legitimate options in God’s eyes. One does not have to have a wedding in order to be commited, and there are people who went through the traditional mariage who are not commited to the relationship.
    *nods* I agree. I'm talking about America, though. Two people living together in George Orwell's 1984 is different than two people living together in America.
     
  4. tim_from_pa

    tim_from_pa New Member

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    The divorced person who marries someone else has committed adultery and the one who marries' a divorce person commits adultery with that person. Of course we know that God forgives all our sins, when we ask Him, and if we repent. However, we should not practice sin/make it a habit, then Go to God for forgiveness, because we know He is forgiving. This kind of behavior will cause Jesus to say to that person if they continue this behavior to the end of there life, "depart from me you are a worker of iniquity."
    I agree. I think that male pastors that go thru divorce, (unless its the wife at fault in which case he should remain unmarried), should otherwise step down from the pulpit. But to be remarried, divorced, remarried again is what I sarcastically call the "marry-go-round".Humanly speaking, I am getting a tad softer these days knowing the frailty of people and realistically divorce and remarriage happens. However, although I do not shun such people, I am officially in agreement with what God says in His Word and I definitely am not comfortable with the idea---- especially for myself.If something ever happened with my marriage, and I hope to God not, I would just remain single. There would be no sin in that---- as long as I do not remarry until my spouse dies and by then I won't be interested any longer anyway! [​IMG]
     
  5. tim_from_pa

    tim_from_pa New Member

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    That is correct. But there is always a marriage in the Bible before two become one: as a public testament to the commitment of marriage, ie two people becoming one.
    And there is a physical counterpart to that. A couple's offspring is truly where two became one flesh. The child is now a combined genesis from that couple. And he/she is every bit like them and indeed is them.This has a deeper spiritual truth when we as children of God become like Him and of the same class of "species" if you will higher than the angels---- as Paul stated we will one day judge the angels. Someone may say, "I thought only God could do that!" Well, I'm not arguing that point.
     
  6. verzanumi24

    verzanumi24 Advanced Member

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    This has a deeper spiritual truth when we as children of God become like Him and of the same class of "species" if you will higher than the angels---- as Paul stated we will one day judge the angels. Someone may say, "I thought only God could do that!" Well, I'm not arguing that point.
    This is our awesome destiny; God made us (human beings) to rule.....we were made in God's image. In glory all the fullness of God will be in us, as it was and is with Jesus. Remember, Jesus is our elder brother. The Bible says we will be like Jesus, because we will see Him as He is. And we all know that Jesus is God. So to put it another way, we will be like God...we will possess all the power of God; nothing will be impossible for us to do. We will do what Jesus has been doing since the day He created all things.
     
  7. E Nomine

    E Nomine New Member

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    Although like God in appearance, I doub't we will be as gods ourselves. Seeing as he's jealous and all of other gods.
     
  8. verzanumi24

    verzanumi24 Advanced Member

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    (E Nomine;18547)
    Although like God in appearance, I doub't we will be as gods ourselves. Seeing as he's jealous and all of other gods.
    We will be like Jesus1 John 3:2 (KJV) 2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. The fullness of God was in JesusColossians 2:9 (KJV) 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. The fullness of God will be in usEphesians 3:19 (KJV) 19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.Nations will come and worship before that feet Jesus/God. Psalms 86:8-9 (KJV) 8 Among the gods there is none like unto thee, O Lord; neither are there any works like unto thy works. 9 All nations whom thou hast made shall come and worship before thee, O Lord; and shall glorify thy name. Nations will come and worship before the feet of the saintsRevelation 3:9 (KJV) 9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. All things are possible with GodMatthew 19:26 (KJV) 26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible. All things are possible to the one who believesMark 9:23 (KJV) 23 Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth. In our gloried state we will not be plague with doughts in our minds as so many of us are now. In glory we will be liberated from the physical bondage that our bodies and mind is under.Romans 8:21 (KJV) 21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. We will share in the divine nature of God2 Peter 1:4 (KJV) 4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. Many of us are very familiar with these scriptures; we fail to see what God is telling us through these men who spoke these words. You see we will not be separate from God, like one person from another. We will be one being with God, just as Jesus was one being with God. Jesus said to the disciples when they asked Him to show them the Father, and He said, "if you see me you see the Father...so it will be with us. We will have the nature and character of the Father because the Father will be in us, and we will be in the Father. In fact Jesus, the Holy Spirit and the Father will be in us and we will be in them....we will be one.
     
  9. tim_from_pa

    tim_from_pa New Member

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    verzanumi24:I agree 100% with what you say about we becoming as God and one with Him. I noticed you have the wcg website in your signature. The only regret I have about that church there is they abandoned the lost tribes of Israel teaching. I even emailed someone there and wanted to know why they abandoned it (what was the new ideas?) and respectfully point blank asked them about the supporting verses about it. Basically he was at a loss of words. He could not answer me. In that respect, I can't help but to lament that they gave a up critical key to understanding 7/8's of the bible to jump the mainline evangelical bandwagon. I never felt the mainliners were too swift on a lot of things and "just did not get it".However, the people from the wcg otherwise are very nice and have good teaching.
     
  10. verzanumi24

    verzanumi24 Advanced Member

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    verzanumi24:I agree 100% with what you say about we becoming as God and one with Him. I noticed you have the wcg website in your signature. The only regret I have about that church there is they abandoned the lost tribes of Israel teaching. I even emailed someone there and wanted to know why they abandoned it (what was the new ideas?) and respectfully point blank asked them about the supporting verses about it. Basically he was at a loss of words. He could not answer me. In that respect, I can't help but to lament that they gave a up critical key to understanding 7/8's of the bible to jump the mainline evangelical bandwagon. I never felt the mainliners were too swift on a lot of things and "just did not get it".However, the people from the wcg otherwise are very nice and have good teaching.
    The Church has made many changes in its teachings and for the most part I am in agreement with them. But as far as in the aria of the lost tribe of Israel, I found there explanation not credible enough. In the past they(Mr. Armstrong) gave scriptures and history to support why America and Britten are one of the members of lost 12 tribes house of Israel. When those changes were announced, they simply just said that the teaching gives to some the idea that the Church is racist, and that this is a belief that some people held in American history, but cannot be supported by most history books. They did not then explain what all those scripture that they once used to identify Ephraim and Manasseh, what are there understanding of them in the light of these new changes. Until they are able to explain what those scriptures now mean, I will stick to my previous belief. I know longer believe every and anything that the Church teaches; I examine it with the scriptures, and if I see that it cannot be supported in scriptures, I will reject it. I will not however, stirr up discontent or cause division in the Church, because this God hates, and ones salvation is not baste on knowing whom the lost house of Israel are.I am not the only one who still maintain this belief; I personally know a deacon in the Church (not in the USA) who agrees with me.
     
  11. tim_from_pa

    tim_from_pa New Member

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    Until they are able to explain what those scriptures now mean, I will stick to my previous belief.
    You hit the nail on the head. This is exactly the same trouble I encountered. Many people like to call BI teaching as "racist" because they are caught up in the politically correct mantra and are too afraid to oppose the "Canaanites" who are secretly jealous that they are not God's chosen people. So we must all drop the idea of God's choosing just so we do not offend anyone when in fact, if the critics knew what they were talking about, the term "chosen" always meant a responsibility, not superiority. Just the fact that the critics think this shows they are secretly self-righteous. In addition, they do not know about the "fowl of every wing; in the shadow of the branches" prophecy which one of the marks of Israel is a racially diverse setting of people within their nations.As to what the scriptures mean, that is exactly my argument. I often retort, well, just what do the scriptures mean then, about Ephraim becoming many nations and Manasseh a people? The passages are often dodged faster than a kid playing dodge ball and quickly swept under the rug. Some will at least try to interpret these passages as "spiritual blessings" but that is not difficult to prove that God meant actual nations of people, not just spiritual.
     
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