What Makes Us Fit For The Kingdom?

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Hidden In Him

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Greetings all! Just checking in, and thought I would post on a passage I was studying today and present it as food for thought.

The passage is in Colossians, Chapter 1:

From the day in which we heard we do not cease praying for you, and asking that you may be filled with the recognition of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding to walk worthily of the Lord unto all acceptability, bearing fruit in every good work and growing in the recognition of God, being empowered with all [supernatural] empowerment by virtue of the dominion of His glory to manifest all endurance and long-suffering with joy, giving thanks to the Father, the One having made you fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in light. (Colossians 1:9-12)

What was Paul saying made them fit for a share of the heavenly inheritance here? The context is that these were Gentile believers coming to Christ, and many were not yet fully familiar with the standards of conduct expected by the Jewish God as opposed to the pagan ones, or the social standards of the pagan society they grew up in. This was especially true of sexual standards, which is why Paul told the Thessalonians:

You know what commandments we gave you through the Lord Jesus... You are to abstain from sexual immorality. Each of you is to know to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor - not in the passion of lust as the Gentiles do, who do not know God - so as not to trespass and become [sexually] covetous in one's brother's affairs, because the Lord is an Avenger concerning all such things, even as we told you before and testified. For God has not called us unto uncleanness, but sanctification. (1 Thessalonians 4:2-7)

Here again, Paul was highlighting that character change needed to take place, and that the lifestyle of the Gentile societies they lived in was not at all acceptable with God. But was not he insinuating that such conduct change (on numerous issues) would be needed to make them fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in Heaven?

God bless to all who respond.
Hidden
 
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CharismaticLady

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I like what Peter says in 2 Peter 1.

5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; 11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
 

Hidden In Him

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I like what Peter says in 2 Peter 1.

5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; 11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

Me, too. Entrance into the kingdom is at issue there as well. (v.11).

How are you these days, sister? Doing well?
 

Episkopos

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What I see lacking in so many believers of today..

Honesty: Indoctrination into all the "sweet" sounding verses while denying the truth that sounds hard.

Humility: So much arrogance these days among the "saved". These think that humility is for Hindus or other religions.

Honour: People today only respect themselves..and consider themselves very highly...others...not so much.

The fear of the Lord: Modern believers have fully embraced foolishness at the expense of wisdom...which is seen as being more Old Testament.

Faith: People no longer believe that with God anything is possible.

And I'm just getting started... ;)

Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:1 Peter 5:6(KJV)
 

Hidden In Him

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What I see lacking in so many believers of today..

Honesty: Indoctrination into all the "sweet" sounding verses while denying the truth that sounds hard.

Humility: So much arrogance these days among the "saved". These think that humility is for Hindus or other religions.

Honour: People today only respect themselves..and consider themselves very highly...others...not so much.

The fear of the Lord: Modern believers have fully embraced foolishness at the expense of wisdom...which is seen as being more Old Testament.

Faith: People no longer believe that with God anything is possible.

And I'm just getting started... ;)

I think 1,2,3 and 5 all tend to depend on the individual, but #4 applies almost to the entire church these days. Most explain away the necessity to still fear the Lord, and this corrupts the rest of their theology, including if not especially what we're talking about in the OP verses.

I do believe the fear of the Lord is eventually going to return, however. He will not stay distant forever, and when He returns to greater intimacy with congregations, His judgments will be returning again as well. Then they will learn the discipline of the Lord, and that He really doesn't "overlook" sin as easily as many think he does, and never has.

God bless, and hope you are blessed.

How's the music thing going, btw?
 

Episkopos

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I think 1,2,3 and 5 all tend to depend on the individual, but #4 applies almost to the entire church these days. Most explain away the necessity to still fear the Lord, and this corrupts the rest of their theology, including if not especially what we're talking about in the OP verses.

I do believe the fear of the Lord is eventually going to return, however. He will not stay distant forever, and when He returns to greater intimacy with congregations, His judgments will be returning again as well. Then they will learn the discipline of the Lord, and that He really doesn't "overlook" sin as easily as many think he does, and never has.

God bless, and hope you are blessed.

How's the music thing going, btw?


Am blessed TY! :) Music on hold...doing a lot of studying and seeking of late. But plan to get back to doing some jazz soon... more recordings.
 
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Hidden In Him

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Am blessed TY! :) Music on hold...doing a lot of studying and seeking of late. But plan to get back to doing some jazz soon... more recordings.

Sounds fun. I'm in the process of turning the garage into a music studio and video recording studio. The stud wall is already up and I took all the panelling off, so next step is to Fiberglass everything with some good thick R-30, put the panelling back up and add two sheets of 5/8" drywall with Green Glue applied between them. That's supposed to provide the best soundproofing for the money (it will end up costing about two grand total).

Anyway, something I have to do, because I like worshipping at volume and I have a strong voice, so if I don't have any soundproofing at all someone down the street is going to be complaining for sure, LoL.
 

Episkopos

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Sounds fun. I'm in the process of turning the garage into a music studio and video recording studio. The stud wall is already up and I took all the panelling off, so next step is to Fiberglass everything with some good thick R-30, put the panelling back up and add two sheets of 5/8" drywall with Green Glue applied between them. That's supposed to provide the best soundproofing for the money (it will end up costing about two grand total).

Anyway, something I have to do, because I like worshipping at volume and I have a strong voice, so if I don't have any soundproofing at all someone down the street is going to be complaining for sure, LoL.


Make some room for the clouds of witnesses! :) Be blessed.
 
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CharismaticLady

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Honesty: Indoctrination into all the "sweet" sounding verses while denying the truth that sounds hard.

For itching ears. This started in the early part of the Reformation. "Sin boldly with no punishment." Turning the grace of God into licentiousness. Jude 1:4

Humility: So much arrogance these days among the "saved". These think that humility is for Hindus or other religions.

This sometimes gets accused as pride. When we've proved that the Word of God is true by our own testimony, some accuse our testimony as pride, especially when the testimony proving the Word of God is true comes in the form of a miracle. Many scoff at the supernatural nature of God.

Honour: People today only respect themselves..and consider themselves very highly...others...not so much.

There is no honor shown when people would rather believe the false doctrines for itching ears that contradict Scripture.

The fear of the Lord: Modern believers have fully embraced foolishness at the expense of wisdom...which is seen as being more Old Testament.
The definitions of different levels of sins, and the nature of God is taught in the Old Testament, our schoolmaster. To disregard the OT as only law and we are not under the law, they throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Faith: People no longer believe that with God anything is possible.

We are not to sit in the seats with scoffers. Especially when they attribute something of God to the devil.
 
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Hidden In Him

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Make some room for the clouds of witnesses! :) Be blessed.

LoL. With all seriousness I do intend on angels being there with me at times. Now that I'm getting back to music, I miss being on full worship teams where the presence of God would manifest in the midst of congregations. But I'm being called to worship Him daily at this stage of my life, so I will have to pray for company of a different sort now : )

God bless! And thanks for responding to the thread.
 

Enoch111

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But was not he insinuating that such conduct change (on numerous issues) would be needed to make them fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in Heaven?
Before you go too far with this line of thought, what made the beggar Lazarus fit for the Kingdom of God? And what made the criminal on the cross beside Jesus fit for Paradise and the Kingdom of God?

You are postulating that the conduct of Christians after they are saved makes them fit for the inheritance of the saints. But that is NOT what Scripture says. That eternal inheritance reserved in Heaven is GIFT of God's grace, just as salvation is a GIFT of God's grace, and the Holy Spirit is a GIFT of God's grace. And just as Christ is also a GIFT of God's grace to the sinner who repents and believes on Him.

Neither sinners nor saints can earn or merit anything from God. It is purely on the merits of the Lord Jesus Christ and His finished work of redemption that God gives all these GIFTS to wretched and undeserving sinners. And that it why it is called AMAZING GRACE.

He also gives the supernatural New Birth to those who believe on Christ. And those new creatures in Christ have a new direction in life and a new code of conduct through the power of the indwelling Holy Spirit. But that is not what makes them fit for Heaven. It is God Himself who will perfect every child of God and make him or her fit for Heaven. In the meantime Christians are commanded to depart from iniquity.
 

bbyrd009

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work to make your calling and election sure

for all must come before the judgement seat to be judged for their works done while in the body, whether for good or for evil

so be very skeptical of anyone trying to sell you Death More Abundantly in heaven tomorrow, imo
 

Hidden In Him

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Before you go too far with this line of thought, what made the beggar Lazarus fit for the Kingdom of God? And what made the criminal on the cross beside Jesus fit for Paradise and the Kingdom of God?

You are postulating that the conduct of Christians after they are saved makes them fit for the inheritance of the saints. But that is NOT what Scripture says. That eternal inheritance reserved in Heaven is GIFT of God's grace, just as salvation is a GIFT of God's grace, and the Holy Spirit is a GIFT of God's grace. And just as Christ is also a GIFT of God's grace to the sinner who repents and believes on Him.

Neither sinners nor saints can earn or merit anything from God. It is purely on the merits of the Lord Jesus Christ and His finished work of redemption that God gives all these GIFTS to wretched and undeserving sinners. And that it why it is called AMAZING GRACE.

He also gives the supernatural New Birth to those who believe on Christ. And those new creatures in Christ have a new direction in life and a new code of conduct through the power of the indwelling Holy Spirit. But that is not what makes them fit for Heaven. It is God Himself who will perfect every child of God and make him or her fit for Heaven. In the meantime Christians are commanded to depart from iniquity.

I knew there were others who take this position, so I was asking for a response to the questions in the OP. Too much getting around passages and questions about them and then presenting an alternative interpretation instead these days.

So before I respond to yours about the thief and Lazarus, let me have your response to the OP first : )

[Edit: Yeah, don't worry about all that. I saw something this morning that has me changing my interp on it now. See next post].
 
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Hidden In Him

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Hmmm... to all who responded, in looking at this passage again this morning, I think I may have to reverse my initial position on the interpretation. I'm not backing off my conviction that faith without works is dead, but the question in this passage is this: Does "being made fit" for the kingdom relate backwards to "being empowered to walk in endurance and walk worthily of the Lord," or does it point forward to "[thru Him] who has delivered us from the kingdom of darkness," in which case it would be a reference to Christ's work of deliverance. The full phrase is "the One having made you fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in light, who has delivered us from the kingdom of darkness."

Those last two words suggest he was actually pointing forwards rather than backwards, so I think I'll reverse my position.

55 years old, and still hashing things out, LoL.

God bless, and good talking to everyone again! Hopefully I can check in again next week.
Until then, keep walking with Him!
Hidden
 
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Giuliano

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Neither sinners nor saints can earn or merit anything from God. It is purely on the merits of the Lord Jesus Christ and His finished work of redemption that God gives all these GIFTS to wretched and undeserving sinners. And that it why it is called AMAZING GRACE.
Ah, but we are expected to work and to give what we can. Don't complain if everything is required in the end. We can't be like Ananias and Sapphira who wanted to take but didn't want to give.

Matthew 13:45 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:
46 Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.


Those who find this pearl (ah, by the grace of God) want to have it; and Jesus isn't going to give it to them for nothing.

Is Jesus going to save trash that is not worth saving? Or must we allow the Spirit to transform trash into treasure which is worth saving -- yes, again by the grace of God who knows how to transform trash into treasure.

We must try to get a vision of Jesus on the cross, giving his all out of love. Seek to be conformed to his likeness. It is not enough to say Jesus gave to us freely. We must also willing to give freely. The clearer our vision, the more we can become like him. Quench not the Spirit then.

We should not be like the lazy servant who hid his talent in the earth. Jesus did give us gifts (again by grace), and he may be angry with us if we don't use them the way he wishes.

Matthew 25:26 His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
 
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Giuliano

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Greetings all! Just checking in, and thought I would post on a passage I was studying today and present it as food for thought.

The passage is in Colossians, Chapter 1:

From the day in which we heard we do not cease praying for you, and asking that you may be filled with the recognition of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding to walk worthily of the Lord unto all acceptability, bearing fruit in every good work and growing in the recognition of God, being empowered with all [supernatural] empowerment by virtue of the dominion of His glory to manifest all endurance and long-suffering with joy, giving thanks to the Father, the One having made you fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in light. (Colossians 1:9-12)

What was Paul saying made them fit for a share of the heavenly inheritance here? The context is that these were Gentile believers coming to Christ, and many were not yet fully familiar with the standards of conduct expected by the Jewish God as opposed to the pagan ones, or the social standards of the pagan society they grew up in. This was especially true of sexual standards, which is why Paul told the Thessalonians:

You know what commandments we gave you through the Lord Jesus... You are to abstain from sexual immorality. Each of you is to know to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor - not in the passion of lust as the Gentiles do, who do not know God - so as not to trespass and become [sexually] covetous in one's brother's affairs, because the Lord is an Avenger concerning all such things, even as we told you before and testified. For God has not called us unto uncleanness, but sanctification. (1 Thessalonians 4:2-7)

Here again, Paul was highlighting that character change needed to take place, and that the lifestyle of the Gentile societies they lived in was not at all acceptable with God. But was not he insinuating that such conduct change (on numerous issues) would be needed to make them fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in Heaven?

God bless to all who respond.
Hidden
I think everything out of line with the Spirit of Christ must be given up when the Spirit wants to correct us. We must come into obedience to the Law of Love whenever the Spirit reveals a shortcoming to us.

Matthew 12:35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
 
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DPMartin

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Greetings all! Just checking in, and thought I would post on a passage I was studying today and present it as food for thought.

The passage is in Colossians, Chapter 1:

From the day in which we heard we do not cease praying for you, and asking that you may be filled with the recognition of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding to walk worthily of the Lord unto all acceptability, bearing fruit in every good work and growing in the recognition of God, being empowered with all [supernatural] empowerment by virtue of the dominion of His glory to manifest all endurance and long-suffering with joy, giving thanks to the Father, the One having made you fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in light. (Colossians 1:9-12)

What was Paul saying made them fit for a share of the heavenly inheritance here? The context is that these were Gentile believers coming to Christ, and many were not yet fully familiar with the standards of conduct expected by the Jewish God as opposed to the pagan ones, or the social standards of the pagan society they grew up in. This was especially true of sexual standards, which is why Paul told the Thessalonians:

You know what commandments we gave you through the Lord Jesus... You are to abstain from sexual immorality. Each of you is to know to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor - not in the passion of lust as the Gentiles do, who do not know God - so as not to trespass and become [sexually] covetous in one's brother's affairs, because the Lord is an Avenger concerning all such things, even as we told you before and testified. For God has not called us unto uncleanness, but sanctification. (1 Thessalonians 4:2-7)

Here again, Paul was highlighting that character change needed to take place, and that the lifestyle of the Gentile societies they lived in was not at all acceptable with God. But was not he insinuating that such conduct change (on numerous issues) would be needed to make them fit for a share of the inheritance of the saints in Heaven?

God bless to all who respond.
Hidden


this is KJV

1Th 4:2 For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus.
1Th 4:3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:
1Th 4:4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;
1Th 4:5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:
1Th 4:6 That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.
1Th 4:7 For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.

this is what the American version OX says fornication means: sexual intercourse between people not married to each other.

this is what the OED says fornication meant when the bible was translated to English:
Voluntary sexual intercourse between a man (in restricted use, an unmarried man) and an unmarried woman.

so two unmarried people.

so why do you want to talk about people having sex? isn't God the judge of who shall enter the Kingdom of God? since when is your sins less of an infraction, that disqualifies you to be fit for God's Kingdom than another's?

are you telling us that King David isn't fit for the Kingdom of God in your judgement?