When Christians do Satan's Work

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Soverign Grace

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My husband and I have watched Christians do Satan's work in every church we've been in and at times we've seen each other do it. This isn't a pleasant topic but one that affects all of us at one point or another in our Christian walk.

Some of the best vessels for Satan to do his work, in my opinion, are Christians. What better way to lead others astray than to operate in one generally above reproach? We were in a church one time where the leadership claimed that "God" had put them in their positions and therefore their word was to be obeyed (sacrosanct). But they used their positions to hurt others and puff themselves up. They hurt people, including my family. Members of my family still won't go to an independent bible church today because of them. And the worst part about it is that they just didn't care. We left the church and within a short time the pastor was pushed out.

I think that Christians need to be aware that we are all targets for destruction by the enemy. Not only individually but as a group. I think that Satan wants to destroy unity among believers because we're weaker. We know that Satan attacks us but what I never hear talked about is that Satan sometimes uses other believers.

The Bible says a perverse man sows strife (Prov. 16:28); and that death and life are in the power of the tongue (Prov. 18:21); and despite the fact that God warns us not to circulate a false report (Ex. 23:1) we can’t resist the temptation to gossip—especially when slander is involved on here and in church.

Slander is not pretty. It means "to defame someone; to harm their reputation; to disgrace; or to accuse." Slander is a tool of the accuser of the brethren (Rev. 12:10). Consider this: the word slanderer in 1 Timothy 3:11 is the same word for “devil.” When we slander someone, we are acting like devils. We are mirroring the character of Satan. We can’t claim to be Christians and mirror the character of Satan at the same time.

I think this is something we should be on guard against; we're supposed to be on one side or the other. We have an enemy and a world that is very anti-Christian and seems to be growing more so as we draw nearer to the end. For those who claim to be Christians sometimes we seem to look more like the world.
 

Soverign Grace

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I doubt they are Christians.

I have seen people who claimed to be Christians do wrong so I know what you mean - that some people are Christian in name only, but I have also seen people who I knew were most likely Christians do much evil. Look at David - he committed adultery and murder. I'm unsure if "carnal Christians" is scriptural but it's a term we've heard used.

I believe the leadership of the church we attended were true believers. I think they got puffed up with pride. We're told that 'judgement will begin with the House of God' so that implies sinning believers I think.
 

CoreIssue

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I have seen people who claimed to be Christians do wrong so I know what you mean - that some people are Christian in name only, but I have also seen people who I knew were most likely Christians do much evil. Look at David - he committed adultery and murder. I'm unsure if "carnal Christians" is scriptural but it's a term we've heard used.

I believe the leadership of the church we attended were true believers. I think they got puffed up with pride. We're told that 'judgement will begin with the House of God' so that implies sinning believers I think.

David was OT.
 
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CoreIssue

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You believe that the old testament holds no relevance?

What about Peter's sin - he denied Christ three times?

The Old Testament relationship with God is not the same as the new.

They were not born again and could walk away from righteousness. We are born again.

We have the Holy Spirit in us. They did not.

Peter when he did those things was still under the Old Testament.

The Old Testament is very valuable to us. But do not treat it the same as the new testament.
 

amadeus

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@Soverign Grace

Consider that some truly are goats on his left hand...

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matt 7:21-23


"And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left." Matt 25:32-33


"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
For I was an hungered, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungered, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me."

Matt 25:41-45

Let us pray to be always rather His faithful sheep!
 
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CoreIssue

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David had the Spirit of God as Scripture tells us plainly. So did many OT saints. The big difference is the outpouring of the Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost. But we must not MISREPRESENT the truth.

The difference in the OT is the Holy Spirit fell on them, he did not indwell them.

Without the blood the Holy Spirit could not baptize them.
 
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Stranger

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I have seen people who claimed to be Christians do wrong so I know what you mean - that some people are Christian in name only, but I have also seen people who I knew were most likely Christians do much evil. Look at David - he committed adultery and murder. I'm unsure if "carnal Christians" is scriptural but it's a term we've heard used.

I believe the leadership of the church we attended were true believers. I think they got puffed up with pride. We're told that 'judgement will begin with the House of God' so that implies sinning believers I think.

Sorry to hear of your experiences with the church. And yes, it is all to common in our day. Believers in the Church can be used by satan and not be aware of it. (Matt. 16:23)

And of course it almost always involves the leadership. As you say, they become affected with pride in their positions. Power can corrupt no matter where it be found. Church or State.

Yes, there is such a thing as 'carnal Christians'. (1 Cor. 3:1-3) This speaks to their immaturity. And as to their being 'spiritual' it really doesn't matter. They can be spiritual and still be immature and guilty of pride. Thus the warning against a novice being set up in a leadership role. (1 Tim. 3:6)

And worse, today you have unbelievers posing as believers and due to their position in the community obtain position in the church. Thus they will sit in judgement of a real believer when he comes along. And immediately they are threatened. Sort of like the Pharisees and their attention to Christ.

This is how I deal with such matters. They did it to Christ, then they will surely do it to me also. Though it is hurtful and at times humiliating, I would rather be the one being wronged and be with Christ, then the one doing the wrong, with the false air of justice around them, and be opposed to Him.

Stranger
 
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Soverign Grace

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The Old Testament relationship with God is not the same as the new.

They were not born again and could walk away from righteousness. We are born again.

We have the Holy Spirit in us. They did not.

Peter when he did those things was still under the Old Testament.

The Old Testament is very valuable to us. But do not treat it the same as the new testament.

I realize now - Peter didn't have the Holy Spirit until Christ died even though it was NT. I do believe that the Pastor and other leadership in that church were true believers but they were sinning believers.
 
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Soverign Grace

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Thank you. Have you seen this too? I think it's one of Satan's most clever ploys and Christians don't realize that they're being used by him. No one really talks about it, but I've seen Christians do so much damage - and God forbid I hope I see it when I do it. Leadership is where it does the most damage. We went to a strict Presbyterian church one time. The Pastor was one of the best preachers I've ever heard but the church was so legalistic it was uncomfortable. I recall they would bicker because a member of the congregation went to McDonalds on Sunday and they weren't supposed to make someone work. My husband pulled us out. We later heard that the Pastor's wife committed suicide. It was heartbreaking - she left 7 kids. But I could see why she did it. If I was forced into that environment every day of people breathing down your neck, inspecting you to see if you committed some small sin I would find a way out too. The sad thing is, I don't think those people changed; they probably dismissed the Pastor's wife as having hidden depression or something.
 
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Soverign Grace

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Consider that some truly are goats on his left hand...

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matt 7:21-23


"And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left." Matt 25:32-33


"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
For I was an hungered, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungered, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me."
Matt 25:41-45

Let us pray to be always rather His faithful sheep!

That's a fitting Scripture. Sometimes it's very hard to tell who are God's and who aren't. But I do think that there are unwitting true believers who Satan still finds a way to use.
 
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Soverign Grace

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David had the Spirit of God as Scripture tells us plainly. So did many OT saints. The big difference is the outpouring of the Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost. But we must not MISREPRESENT the truth.

I'm unsure what you mean?
 

Soverign Grace

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Sorry to hear of your experiences with the church. And yes, it is all to common in our day. Believers in the Church can be used by satan and not be aware of it. (Matt. 16:23)

And of course it almost always involves the leadership. As you say, they become affected with pride in their positions. Power can corrupt no matter where it be found. Church or State.

Yes, there is such a thing as 'carnal Christians'. (1 Cor. 3:1-3) This speaks to their immaturity. And as to their being 'spiritual' it really doesn't matter. They can be spiritual and still be immature and guilty of pride. Thus the warning against a novice being set up in a leadership role. (1 Tim. 3:6)

And worse, today you have unbelievers posing as believers and due to their position in the community obtain position in the church. Thus they will sit in judgement of a real believer when he comes along. And immediately they are threatened. Sort of like the Pharisees and their attention to Christ.

This is how I deal with such matters. They did it to Christ, then they will surely do it to me also. Though it is hurtful and at times humiliating, I would rather be the one being wronged and be with Christ, then the one doing the wrong, with the false air of justice around them, and be opposed to Him.

Stranger
Sorry to hear of your experiences with the church. And yes, it is all to common in our day. Believers in the Church can be used by satan and not be aware of it. (Matt. 16:23)

And of course it almost always involves the leadership. As you say, they become affected with pride in their positions. Power can corrupt no matter where it be found. Church or State.

Yes, there is such a thing as 'carnal Christians'. (1 Cor. 3:1-3) This speaks to their immaturity. And as to their being 'spiritual' it really doesn't matter. They can be spiritual and still be immature and guilty of pride. Thus the warning against a novice being set up in a leadership role. (1 Tim. 3:6)

And worse, today you have unbelievers posing as believers and due to their position in the community obtain position in the church. Thus they will sit in judgement of a real believer when he comes along. And immediately they are threatened. Sort of like the Pharisees and their attention to Christ.

This is how I deal with such matters. They did it to Christ, then they will surely do it to me also. Though it is hurtful and at times humiliating, I would rather be the one being wronged and be with Christ, then the one doing the wrong, with the false air of justice around them, and be opposed to Him.

Stranger

I'm glad that you see it too because it's not talked about and yet it's an area that I think that Satan has done his most fruitful work. Take the leadership in that one church we went to - they had a lifelong effect on my family. They didn't even care - I think that was what hurt the worst. And they were supposed to be Christians and didn't even follow the basic tenets of the Christian faith. We went to another church where a corrupt family owned the church. The pastor finally left and called us over his house to talk. He told us that the family caused so much trouble in the former church where they went that there are people who refuse to step foot in a church today. That same family went on to wreak havoc wherever they went and harmed a lot of people. I wonder why this isn't talked about more.

I think you're right - power does corrupt - even in Christians. But we should know better because that's how Satan fell - pride. I read that's what happened to Rick Warren - he was invited to be on the CFR - and he must have been flattered; now he's espousing mixing Christianity with other religions and that's expressly forbidden in Scripture. I just wonder how a believer can be so deceived or blinded by the evil one. I know before we're saved we're blinded but it seems that even after being saved Satan is able to blind believers at times so that they do his work. I'm unsure whether it's sin or Satan tempting them to sin.

I do believe that there are definitely people who are not regenerated who are posing as Christians. I don't know what their motives would be however. I also believe that there are true believers who do engage in deep sin - I've seen it. I wish that this was taught more because I think that Satan is using some people - whether saved or unsaved - and causing a lot of harm, and they don't realize who is behind it.

That's a healthy viewpoint. Yes it does hurt when one is wronged but ultimately we know that Christ will deal with such matters. He did say that a servant is not above his master - if they persecuted Him they'll persecute us.
 

Lady Crosstalk

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My husband and I have watched Christians do Satan's work in every church we've been in and at times we've seen each other do it. This isn't a pleasant topic but one that affects all of us at one point or another in our Christian walk. Some of the best vessels for Satan to do his work, in my opinion, are Christians. What better way to lead others astray than to operate in one generally above reproach? We were in a church one time where the leadership claimed that "God" had put them in their positions and therefore their word was to be obeyed (sacrosanct). But they used their positions to hurt others and puff themselves up. They hurt people, including my family. Members of my family still won't go to an independent bible church today because of them. And the worst part about it is that they just didn't care. We left the church and within a short time the pastor was pushed out.

Yes, I once heard a pastor say that Christians need to "wrap their heads around the idea that the devil wants to destroy every Christian, every Christian home, and every Christian church." The Bible says it this way: 1 Peter 5:8--> "Stay alert! Watch out for your great enemy, the devil. He prowls around like a roaring lion, looking for someone to devour." The operative phrase is "stay alert"--to watch out for his schemes. Satan's greatest success comes from convincing the world that he doesn't exist--just because we don't see him with our physical eyes. We need always to pray that the Spirit of God open our eyes.


Slander is not pretty. It means "to defame someone; to harm their reputation; to disgrace; or to accuse." Slander is a tool of the accuser of the brethren (Rev. 12:10). Consider this: the word slanderer in 1 Timothy 3:11 is the same word for “devil.” When we slander someone, we are acting like devils. We are mirroring the character of Satan. We can’t claim to be Christians and mirror the character of Satan at the same time.
One wonders it this isn't perhaps the reason why Judas was characterized as a "devil" (John 6:70)? He was obviously a slanderer--we can see it right in the Scripture. (John 12:4-6)

I think this is something we should be on guard against; we're supposed to be on one side or the other. We have an enemy and a world that is very anti-Christian and seems to be growing more so as we draw nearer to the end. For those who claim to be Christians sometimes we seem to look more like the world.

This is a significant problem in the Church. We spend nearly all of our waking hours among unbelievers. Pastors often lament that they are able to get their parishioners out to church for one hour a week, where they are duty-bound to concentrate on Jesus Christ, and then the rest of the week, they live as if He didn't exist. Here is a video comprised of clips from three pastors, John MacArthur, Paul Washer and Carter Conlon (who took over Times Square Church after the death of David Wilkerson) who express this frustration quite well:
 
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Jane_Doe22

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Thank you. Have you seen this too? I think it's one of Satan's most clever ploys and Christians don't realize that they're being used by him. No one really talks about it, but I've seen Christians do so much damage - and God forbid I hope I see it when I do it. Leadership is where it does the most damage. We went to a strict Presbyterian church one time. The Pastor was one of the best preachers I've ever heard but the church was so legalistic it was uncomfortable. I recall they would bicker because a member of the congregation went to McDonalds on Sunday and they weren't supposed to make someone work. My husband pulled us out. We later heard that the Pastor's wife committed suicide. It was heartbreaking - she left 7 kids. But I could see why she did it. If I was forced into that environment every day of people breathing down your neck, inspecting you to see if you committed some small sin I would find a way out too. The sad thing is, I don't think those people changed; they probably dismissed the Pastor's wife as having hidden depression or something.
I'll phrase it this way; every single person on this earth struggles with sin until the day they die. Some come to Christ and do repent, but that doesn't mean the struggle & errors don't still happen.
We only kid ourselves when we pretend otherwise.
 

CoreIssue

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I'll phrase it this way; every single person on this earth struggles with sin until the day they die. Some come to Christ and do repent, but that doesn't mean the struggle & errors don't still happen.
We only kid ourselves when we pretend otherwise.

And those in Cults deceive themselves thinking they are following Christ and are saved.
 
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