When is it right for Christians to take a stand against evil?

[Soverign Grace]

I read another horror story this morning about a man tortured in a restraint chair while cops laughed as he died. I can't understand that level of sickness:

WATCH: Cops Torture Mentally Ill Man in Restraint Chair for 2 Days, Laugh as He Dies in Front of Them

I tried to get my pastor and friend involved in contacting legislators over issues and they're disinterested. I asked the pastor at bible study and he said that's a copout. I'm seeing that some Christians believe that we're to do nothing - they have a fatalistic view that we're told things are going to get worse so they feel no need to take action.

Then there are others who believe that it is our duty to act.

Why do Christians feel so differently about this if we all have the Holy Spirit guiding us? Do you take action or not - and why or why not?

 

[aspen]

That type of cop is who we want protecting us. It is all great when they are torturing other people , I suppose.

we are a sick society

 

[Nancy]

I read another horror story this morning about a man tortured in a restraint chair while cops laughed as he died. I can't understand that level of sickness:

WATCH: Cops Torture Mentally Ill Man in Restraint Chair for 2 Days, Laugh as He Dies in Front of Them

I tried to get my pastor and friend involved in contacting legislators over issues and they're disinterested. I asked the pastor at bible study and he said that's a copout. I'm seeing that some Christians believe that we're to do nothing - they have a fatalistic view that we're told things are going to get worse so they feel no need to take action.

Then there are others who believe that it is our duty to act.

Why do Christians feel so differently about this if we all have the Holy Spirit guiding us? Do you take action or not - and why or why not?

How, the video is not available...wonder why?

 

[Giuliano]

I read another horror story this morning about a man tortured in a restraint chair while cops laughed as he died. I can't understand that level of sickness:

WATCH: Cops Torture Mentally Ill Man in Restraint Chair for 2 Days, Laugh as He Dies in Front of Them

I tried to get my pastor and friend involved in contacting legislators over issues and they're disinterested. I asked the pastor at bible study and he said that's a copout. I'm seeing that some Christians believe that we're to do nothing - they have a fatalistic view that we're told things are going to get wor


Then there are others who believe that it is our duty to act.
se so they feel no need to take action.
Why do Christians feel so differently about this if we all have the Holy Spirit guiding us? Do you take action or not - and why or why not?

That incident cost the police department $5 million to settle. That was a big motivation to change; and they are taking steps now to curb such horrible abuses.

https://www.sanluisobispo.com/news/local/article236408378.html

Crisis intervention training, as it’s known, is not new to California counties but was recently adopted in here as part of a long list of recent reforms related to the treatment of people with mental illness, especially those who find themselves in the criminal justice system.

Those reforms, which include rewritten Sheriff’s Office and Behavioral Health policies, newly formed Community Action Teams comprised of police officers and social workers, and new facilities to treat people in mental health crisis, have been implemented following a $5 million settlement to the family of Andrew Holland, a schizophrenic Atascadero man who died of an embolism due to being restrained in jail custody in January 2017.

The 40-hour course, which is also available to professionals in relevant fields outside of law enforcement, is now mandated for all sworn staff of the Sheriff’s Office.

Sharon Holland, Andrew’s mother, said on Thursday she’s encouraged to see the change in mental health awareness on the part of law enforcement since her son’s death.

Calling it “an amazing experience,” Sharon Holland has attended the week’s crisis intervention training on behalf of the nonprofit Andrew Holland Foundation, at the invitation of the Sheriff’s Office.

“The quality of the training, the depth and the overview, it really exposes all their officers, the patrol, the correctional guards, even the dispatchers — every one of them is getting this training,” she whispered during one of the presentations.

“It’s about empathy and compassion, and that’s very much needed for everyone’s safety,” she said.

 

[Willie T]

Just curious.... If you're one of a group of cops torturing someone to death, are you going to video yourself doing it? The obvious answer is, "No", so why do we think these guys would be so dumb as to not understand it is professional suicide to film themselves violating the law they work with everyday?
I have no doubt that the lawful performance of their duty might have been found wrong in a court of law...… But, did they actually violate the law as they were given it to perform? (I am not asking if they were sweet, compassionate people. Few cops are, given the element of society they deal with day in and day out.)

 

[ScottA]

I read another horror story this morning about a man tortured in a restraint chair while cops laughed as he died. I can't understand that level of sickness:

WATCH: Cops Torture Mentally Ill Man in Restraint Chair for 2 Days, Laugh as He Dies in Front of Them

I tried to get my pastor and friend involved in contacting legislators over issues and they're disinterested. I asked the pastor at bible study and he said that's a copout. I'm seeing that some Christians believe that we're to do nothing - they have a fatalistic view that we're told things are going to get worse so they feel no need to take action.

Then there are others who believe that it is our duty to act.

Why do Christians feel so differently about this if we all have the Holy Spirit guiding us? Do you take action or not - and why or why not?

First of all...we don't all have the Holy Spirit. That is a dangerous assumption. Jesus promised to send the Holy Spirit, but not in contradiction to the Father saying He would pour out His spirit upon "all" fresh, meaning upon both the wheat and the tares. Which means that some are actually under a spirit of antichrist and delusion...but both by the power of God.

If you have to ask...all you should do is take it to the Lord in prayer, knowing that we do not fight against flesh and blood.

 

[Soverign Grace]

That type of cop is who we want protecting us. It is all great when they are torturing other people , I suppose.

we are a sick society

Our society has become sick. One after another after another of these incidents is happening across America. I can't believe it.

 

[Soverign Grace]

How, the video is not available...wonder why?

I don't know - the article said it was a video but they didn't show it. These incidents are becoming more and more common. It's almost every day when you read the news. I can almost not read it - the evil against another human is so bad.

 

[Soverign Grace]

That incident cost the police department $5 million to settle. That was a big motivation to change; and they are taking steps now to curb such horrible abuses.

https://www.sanluisobispo.com/news/local/article236408378.html

Crisis intervention training, as it’s known, is not new to California counties but was recently adopted in here as part of a long list of recent reforms related to the treatment of people with mental illness, especially those who find themselves in the criminal justice system.

Those reforms, which include rewritten Sheriff’s Office and Behavioral Health policies, newly formed Community Action Teams comprised of police officers and social workers, and new facilities to treat people in mental health crisis, have been implemented following a $5 million settlement to the family of Andrew Holland, a schizophrenic Atascadero man who died of an embolism due to being restrained in jail custody in January 2017.

The 40-hour course, which is also available to professionals in relevant fields outside of law enforcement, is now mandated for all sworn staff of the Sheriff’s Office.

Sharon Holland, Andrew’s mother, said on Thursday she’s encouraged to see the change in mental health awareness on the part of law enforcement since her son’s death.

Calling it “an amazing experience,” Sharon Holland has attended the week’s crisis intervention training on behalf of the nonprofit Andrew Holland Foundation, at the invitation of the Sheriff’s Office.

“The quality of the training, the depth and the overview, it really exposes all their officers, the patrol, the correctional guards, even the dispatchers — every one of them is getting this training,” she whispered during one of the presentations.

“It’s about empathy and compassion, and that’s very much needed for everyone’s safety,” she said.

That's really good news. I hope that better training is implemented across America. But it really isn't training - it's really evil. We should call it what it is.

 

[Soverign Grace]

First of all...we don't all have the Holy Spirit. That is a dangerous assumption. Jesus promised to send the Holy Spirit, but not in contradiction to the Father saying He would pour out His spirit upon "all" fresh, meaning upon both the wheat and the tares. Which means that some are actually under a spirit of antichrist and delusion...but both by the power of God.

If you have to ask...all you should do is take it to the Lord in pray, knowing that we do not fight against flesh and blood.

Yes but I have a friend who I'm sure is another believer and she doesn't think Christians should get involved and email legislators or try to change anything. I'm the opposite - I step in and act. So why do two believers - both with the Holy Spirit - think so differently?

I know that we're not fighting against flesh and blood - and that's a good point - we should use the "weapons of our warfare."

 

[Heavenbound]

If a believer sees wrong they should work and try to right it. If believers don’t work who else is going to be a restraining power ?

 

[Heavenbound]

Just curious.... If you're one of a group of cops torturing someone to death, are you going to video yourself doing it? The obvious answer is, "No", so why do we think these guys would be so dumb as to not understand it is professional suicide to film themselves violating the law they work with everyday?
I have no doubt that the lawful performance of their duty might have been found wrong in a court of law...… But, did they actually violate the law as they were given it to perform? (I am not asking if they were sweet, compassionate people. Few cops are, given the element of society they deal with day in and day out.)

Dude the ‘element of society’ ARE the cops themselves

Some are good but the job attracts an ‘element of society’ that’s not good

 

[ScottA]

Yes but I have a friend who I'm sure is another believer and she doesn't think Christians should get involved and email legislators or try to change anything. I'm the opposite - I step in and act. So why do two believers - both with the Holy Spirit - think so differently?

I know that we're not fighting against flesh and blood - and that's a good point - we should use the "weapons of our warfare."

That is a different matter. I was addressing those who do have the Holy Spirit compared with those who do not.

Among those who do have the Holy Spirit...in the body of Christ the thumb opposes the fingers, etc.--by design.

 

[amadeus]

Why do Christians feel so differently about this if we all have the Holy Spirit guiding us? Do you take action or not - and why or why not?

The correct thing to do always is to follow the lead of the Holy Spirit. As @ScottA has already indicated not every one has the Holy Spirit to follow. Also many who do have become deaf or have learned to disregard the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Then they presumptuously declare that because they have the Holy Spirit they are being led by God. Apostle Paul warned us:

"Quench not the spirit" I Thess 5:19... but what we do see happening in most, or even in all, church settings is men teaching people to quench the Spirit with their pre-set programs which leave little maneuvering room for a person wanting to be led by the Holy Spirit. Often, probably the result is that the person who is really seeking to follow the Spirit ends up leaving such a place...

 

[ScottA]

The correct thing to do always is to follow the lead of the Holy Spirit. As @ScottA has already indicated not every one has the Holy Spirit to follow. Also many who do have become deaf or have learned to disregard the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Then they presumptuously declare that because they have the Holy Spirit they are being led by God. Apostle Paul warned us:

"Quench not the spirit" I Thess 5:19... but what we do see happening in most, or even in all, church settings is men teaching people to quench the Spirit with their pre-set programs which leave little maneuvering room for a person wanting to be led by the Holy Spirit. Often, probably the result is that the person who is really seeking to follow the Spirit ends up leaving such a place...

Yes, this is perhaps the worst thing about organized religion. As Jesus told the Pharisees, "Those who were entering in, you hindered. "

 

[Soverign Grace]

That is a different matter. I was addressing those who do have the Holy Spirit compared with those who do not.

Among those who do have the Holy Spirit...in the body of Christ the thumb opposes the fingers, etc.--by design.

Yes I recall you saying before about the body having different parts. I tend to think that passive Christians end up doing harm. For instance - if my friend, pastor, and other believers in our area spoke out then some of the radical ideas being pushed by the left wouldn't take root. My friend has a fatalistic viewpoint: it's going to get worse; we're told so in Scripture. Yet I look at things entirely different: that we're called soldiers and are to do God's work on earth.

I just wonder why truly born again Christians read/ interpret the Bible so differently if we both have the Holy Spirit.

 

[Soverign Grace]

The correct thing to do always is to follow the lead of the Holy Spirit. As @ScottA has already indicated not every one has the Holy Spirit to follow. Also many who do have become deaf or have learned to disregard the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Then they presumptuously declare that because they have the Holy Spirit they are being led by God. Apostle Paul warned us:

"Quench not the spirit" I Thess 5:19... but what we do see happening in most, or even in all, church settings is men teaching people to quench the Spirit with their pre-set programs which leave little maneuvering room for a person wanting to be led by the Holy Spirit. Often, probably the result is that the person who is really seeking to follow the Spirit ends up leaving such a place...

I think you may have hit on the answer. There may be true believers who have become deaf or learned to disregard the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

 

[bbyrd009]

Why do Christians feel so differently about this if we all h

my guess would be bc we are all diff body parts, mostly posting to come read later

 

[ScottA]

Yes I recall you saying before about the body having different parts. I tend to think that passive Christians end up doing harm. For instance - if my friend, pastor, and other believers in our area spoke out then some of the radical ideas being pushed by the left wouldn't take root. My friend has a fatalistic viewpoint: it's going to get worse; we're told so in Scripture. Yet I look at things entirely different: that we're called soldiers and are to do God's work on earth.

I just wonder why truly born again Christians read/ interpret the Bible so differently if we both have the Holy Spirit.

Yes, the sky is not falling. Worry not.

The reading and different interpretations of the Bible, are because of the two reason I mentioned: 1) All do not actually have the Holy Spirit, and 2) we are different for a reason, by design.

The reason God allows the negative interpretations, is also by design: Just as a type of sleep was placed upon Israel until the time of the gentiles (other peoples) is fulfilled, so too is it for much of the church during these times. That is...if not for the slumber of many, the end would have come before the chosen of these many generations were born. Not that we should encourage evil, but God has intended that evil even within the church would be for good for those who love Him.

Meanwhile, seek His peace until the end.

 

[amadeus]

I think you may have hit on the answer. There may be true believers who have become deaf or learned to disregard the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

There will come a point, as I believe it, that if a person quenches the Spirit too often under the presumption that God will always forgive him and take him back one more time, that God will not. Consider the Israelites of old, the natural children of Jacob, who rebelled against God and repented... until God cut them off from their Promised Land. Ten times it was and 40 years in the desert until death came to them. Sound like anything we see today?