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Whirlwinds of the South

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by whirlwind, Jun 6, 2011.

  1. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    I watched the documentary.....Tornado Rampage 2011....and as a resident of the south...specifically Alabama....I was especially interested. It only covered the first of the whirlwinds of the south. The Joplin, Missouri tornado came after.


    They stated that there is a category [EF-5] tornado in the United States maybe once a year. That day there were four [EF-5] whirlwinds of the south! The [EF-5’s] came down in Alabama in Tuscaloosa, Birmingham, Hackleburg as well as Smithville, Mississippi on April 28-29. They were followed by the Joplin, Mo. [EF-5] on May 22, 2011



    The program was riveting as the footage of these storms was absolutely incredible. As I watched my mind kept going back to Biblical whirlwinds and…the four winds of the last days and…. signs:


    Revelation 7:1-4 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.


    Have His servants been sealed? Are all that were to be His…now His...and has the time arrived? Was the unprecedented event of the four [EF-5] tornadoes a sign that things were about to begin? A month or so ago there was a discussion about that very thought on another forum…that all that are going on the ark have boarded and, as Noah was shut in by the Lord…so are His servants today. What was the date Noah was shut in? The seventeenth day of the second month which is the Hebrew Lyar 17….our May 21. The Joplin [EF-5] was on May 22, 2011 [Gen.7:11]



    When asked by His disciples about the signs of the last days Jesus replied…. ​


    Luke 21: 7-11 And they asked Him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass? And He said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in My name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them. But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by. Then said He unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.


    There have been wars and rumors of wars throughout history but there comes a time when…it is time. Then, in the last days, we will see what we see today….all these things happening within a short time. 2011 has been a doozy for odd and fearful sights. ​


    21:20-22 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.


    21:25-28 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring; Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken. And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.




    On another forum a poster wrote....

    Truly the numbers given in scripture speak a language of their own, and when you begin to understand this language, then the law and the prophets come alive. This time frame of 1,980 years is shown over and over in scripture for those who understand the numbers. For instance if you take the total number of chapters in the 4 gospels; which is 89, and divide that 89 by the 4 gospels you will get 22.2. Now if you take 1,980 years and divide it by the 89 chapters you will also get 22.2. This is the sign of a season. ​


    In his book, Number in Scripture, E.W. Bullinger wrote…


    #2 affirms the difference, that there is another, a division as in Light/Dark, Good/Evil. God, the One dividing, did so on the 2nd day when He divided waters from waters. ​


    That is very interesting to me. The sign of the season – 222, and in the time of Noah it was in the 2nd month when waters flooded the earth, the 2nd day was when God separated the waters and….on 5/22/11 the [EF-5], destroyed on the 5th month of the 22nd day the city of Joplin.

    Joplin - English surname related to Job, meaning"the afflicted."


    Did the season begin, was the division in the waters 5/22/11? Biblical waters can be symbolic of words or people. Is the division of waters showing the division of a flood of truth vs a flood of deception, a division in a flood of people? One group follow The Father and the other follow their father.


    Concerning the four [EF-5] whirlwinds from the south....The biblical number four means…"Four is the number of creation, the elements, the four corners, four seasons,…the four winds and it also marks division."


    In April, the 4th month there were 4 whirlwinds. In May, the 5th month there was the 5th [EF-5] whirlwind. The Book of Zechariah teaches of the whirlwinds of the south....




    Zechariah 9:1 The burden of the word of the LORD in the land of Hadrach, and Damascus shall be the rest thereof: when the eyes of man, as of all the tribes of Israel, shall be toward the LORD.

    Hadrach means “dwelling.” The land of dwelling, when all look to the Lord is the promised land. That is our place of rest, our peace.​


    9: 6 And a bastard shall dwell in Ashdod, and I will cut off the pride of the Philistines.

    Ashdod means “stronghold,” which I believe refers to America. We presently have one of the above as the elected leader of our stronghold and he is “the pride of the Philistines.” ​

    9:9-10 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: He is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass. (10) And I will cut off the chariot from Ephraim, and the horse from Jerusalem, and the battle bow shall be cut off: and He shall speak peace unto the heathen: and His dominion shall be from sea even to sea, and from the river even to the ends of the earth.


    In verse nine we see the fulfilled prophecy of Christ riding into Jerusalem. In verse ten the King comes the second time…to judge and make war. This time on a white horse (His army clothed in white). The horse in Jerusalem is Satan’s locust army. The chariot In Ephraim speaks of Satan’s power in America. Both shall be...cut off!​

    9:13-14 When I have bent Judah for Me, filled the bow with Ephraim, and raised up thy sons, O Zion, against thy sons, O Greece, and made thee as the sword of a mighty man. And the LORD shall be seen over them, and His arrow shall go forth as the lightning: and the LORD God shall blow the trumpet, and shall go with whirlwinds of the south.


    "Bent Judah and filled the bow with Ephraim"…. the tribes of Israel, the two houses, are sealed and the man child (Zion) is raised. The four winds can now blow. Was their release marked by the four whirlwinds of the south? ​


    9:15-17 The LORD of hosts shall defend them; and they shall devour, and subdue with sling stones; and they shall drink, and make a noise as through wine; and they shall be filled like bowls, and as the corners of the altar. And the LORD their God shall save them in that day as the flock of His people: for they shall be as the stones of a crown, lifted up as an ensign upon His land. For how great is His goodness, and how great is His beauty! corn shall make the young men cheerful, and new wine the maids.



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  2. Tehilah BaAretz

    Tehilah BaAretz New Member

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    That was fun!
    However, I have questions.
    OK, so I live in Jerusalem and I have a second home in the Galilee. That gives me two choices. If I am in Jerusalem and I see the armies coming, how do I go about fleeing to the mountains. Jerusalem is on the top of a mountain range, after all. Do I flee down to the Dead Sea and then back up to the mountains on the other side of the Jordan? (That would takes hours of travel by car and I'd have to cross an international border.) Do I flee north into the region of Samaria? (That is, into the Palestinian Authority.) If I flee south I will be in the Judean Wilderness but maybe I can pass through the wilderness on my way to the desert of southern Israel.
    On the other hand, maybe I'll be in my home in the Galilee. That might mean that the armies will be going past my home on their way to Jerusalem. That's scary! Should I stock the freezer with several months worth of foods?
    Oh, well, perhaps the pre-trib folks have it right and I don't have anything to worry about. Still, I have friends that might need some advice. Practical stuff. Like, what do we do when there is an earthquake that kills over a million people? How do we go about cleaning up the bodies of millions of dead soldiers when God defeats the armies who attack us?
     
  3. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    I see you're having fun with the New Testament my Jewish brother. :(


    You should ask for understanding and maybe then you'll see "practical stuff." Perhaps then your spiritual eyes will be open and you will understand what is being taught.



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  4. Tehilah BaAretz

    Tehilah BaAretz New Member

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    That's not an answer! It is also incorrect in several ways. And besides, since when is God not practical?
     
  5. avoice

    avoice Member

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    Well I think Whirlwind is just a little ahead of things
    when the four winds are loosed its upon the earth to hurt the earth ..not middle america ..we will all see it.
    and its my understanding the first thing that occurs after they are loosed is the first 4 trumps which are against the earth ... So I dont apply the verse's used here. ..

    I wouldnt worry to much Tehilah BaAretz my understanding is Jerusalem is the apple of Gods eye .You may have some tough times ahead ...But God has his eye on you and will do great works in Jerusalem ..
     
  6. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    It isn't that the whirlwinds were the four winds but are a sign of the beginning of that time. You won't literally see four winds at the four corners of the earth literally blowing.

    They are released at the sixth trump...the first five trumps have already happened.



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  7. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    Stocking up for emergencies is something everyone should do no matter where we live or in what type of worldly situations we find ourselves. It is just practical. :) What did God tell Noah?



    Genesis 6:21-22 And take thou unto thee of all food that is eaten, and thou shalt gather it to thee; and it shall be for food for thee, and for them. Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he.


    As He instructed Noah...He instructs us. We are to prepare for the flood of the last days, a flood of deception and ungodly people. We are to take the food for us, our families, our friends, etc. and that is both literal and spiritual food, aboard our ark. Food for our body and soul. The length of time? Five months, one hundred and fifty days....as it was for Noah...it will be for us.


    As for fleeing Judea.....​


    Matthew 24:15-16 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:



    (I am guessing with this one) To me, when someone sees/understands the abomination of desolation they are seeing their own carnal nature. God awakens us to truly see ourselves and...crucify our old man. When that happens we are a new man.


    If someone is "in Judaea" then they are not "in Christ." Also, Judaea, in that use, is Palestine. Is this speaking of the Palestinians? So, those which be in Judaea/Palestine should flee....seek safety, escape...into the mountains. Biblical mountains are symbolic of nations. Is it saying they should get out of Dodge....as Lot was instructed to get out of Sodom before the destruction? I don't know, as I said...a guess..​


    24:17- 18 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.


    I'm on firmer ground with this one. Once one has crucified their carnal nature, when they are a new man in Christ then they are watchmen. They are on the housetop where the Spirit teaches them and they in turn teach others. They are not to go back into the house and "take anything" meaning....they are not to go back to the teaching of man. Those in the field (in the world) should not go back for clothes....they should be wearing their linen garments all the time!​

    24:19-21 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.


    This refers to those that fall into apostasy in "those days." They are impregnated with deception, believing Satan's lies. Those that "give suck" are those nurture Satan's false religion. If your flight is in the winter it means you are taken out of season, you didn't wait for the true Savior but followed the fake.​


    24:22-23 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.


    The days were shortened to five months [Rev.9:5,10] which is the 150 days of the flood of end times, just as the days of Noah. During that time of the great tribulation which is great deception the false Christ and his ministers will be deceiving many. Believe it not! The true Christ arrives after the great tribulation of Satan, after his time of pretending to be Jesus.​





    There is no pre-trib rapture. We are all here...some safe in the ark, some not...but all here.


    You needn't worry about dead bodies needing to be disposed of. All of us are changed. All of us step out of our flesh bodies.....


    1 Corinthians 15:51-52 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.​


    The millennium begins.



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  8. avoice

    avoice Member

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    I see where you at now dont agree..but understand your post better

    Sense that time of the four wind preparing to blow is mentioned in the seals not the trumps God then Sends and angel saying stop wait do not let the four winds harm the earth until we have sealed the 144,000 Elect.
    Prayers are offered up and 7 angels given the 7 trumpets ... The first four trumpets do hurt the earth so obviously the four winds, which also represent four directions, have been losed as the earth is being harmed ...

    Being in the 5th trump is an opinion not a fact ... and one I dont happen to share as the first hasnt even sounded but no sense debating opinon vs opinon ...
    there is zero evidence except how one interpts scripture as to literal or spirtual more often than not its both so arguments either or are often mute.
     
  9. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    The "four winds" of Rev.7 are related to the "last trump" event of 1 Cor.15, the change at the twinkling of an eye, the time of Christ's coming on the day of The Lord...

    Mark 13:26-27
    26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
    27 And then shall He send His angels, and shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
    (KJV)

    That 7th Trumpet timing.

    Christ only gave 7 signs in His Olivet Discourse, not 21. The seven seals, trumpets, and vials are all about 7 specific signs of the end.

    Call it opinion if you want, but the signs in the world today show we are already in the 3rd sign our Lord Jesus gave, which parallels the 3rd seal.

    The specific time of tribulation He mentioned is what the last 3 trumpets and vials are about. The 6th trumpet will be the height of tribulation time.


     
  10. Cooter

    Cooter New Member

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    It is my historical understanding that when the people of God (especially Judea) who lived in Jesus' day saw the army of Agrippa II (and a month later the army of Cestius.) They fled to the mountains. Are you saying that all or parts of Matt 24 will happen again in our day?
     
  11. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    I agree that the seventh trumpet is the end...but it sounds for days. When it sounds He gathers His elect "from the four winds," so the four winds were already blowing when He gathers us (no rapture :lol: )


    Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as He hath declared to His servants the prophets.





    Consider that He "comes as a thief in the night." Few will know it is the time, few will know it is the tribulation, few will know they are enveloped in darkness and being inundated by the flood. :(



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  12. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    The final or "last trump" won't blow until the ending of the second woe period. It's blowing is what brings the third woe period of Christ's coming and our gathering to Him. We're told in the "same hour" when God's two witnesses are resurrected, a great earthquake will happen in Jerusalem, and the third woe comes quickly right after that. There's no sounding of that trump for days mentioned there.

    Rev 11:15-18
    15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of His Christ; and He shall reign for ever and ever.
    16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
    17 Saying, We give Thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, Which art, and wast, and art to come; because Thou hast taken to Thee Thy great power, and hast reigned.
    18 And the nations were angry, and Thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that Thou shouldest give reward unto Thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear Thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
    (KJV)

    When that 7th trumpet sounds, at that moment Christ's thousand years reign will begin, taking direct control over all the earth. It is also when God's cup of wrath will be poured out upon the wicked. It is also when the rewards will be handed out to His saints who reign with Him. All those events will occur very rapidly within a short space of time.

    That "days" is an expression for a certain 'day'. It's hemera in the Greek with a certain time like an hour implied per 5610 (see Strong's no. 2250). The context is about a certain time, like with Rev.9:15. Likewise with "he shall begin", it's simply pointing to that time when the 7th trumpet will sound. Not until that last trumpet sounds will the mystery of God be finished. And when it does sound, this present world will end with those events of Rev.11.


    Christ coming "as a thief in the night" is about those "last trump" (7th trumpet) events. Not until that moment will the deceived realize they fell away to a pseudo-Christ. It is why the deceived will then say this...

    Rev 6:15-17
    15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
    16 And said to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us, and hide us from the face of Him That sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
    17 For the great day of His wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"
    (KJV)


     
  13. avoice

    avoice Member

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    1. Jer 49:36 And upon Elam will I bring the four winds from the four quarters of heaven, and will scatter them toward all those winds; and there shall be no nation whither the outcasts of Elam shall not come.
    2. Eze 37:9 Then said he unto me, Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live.
    3. Dan 7:2 Daniel spake and said, I saw in my vision by night, and, behold, the four winds of the heaven strove upon the great sea.
    4. Dan 8:8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.
    5. Dan 11:4 And when he shall stand up, his kingdom shall be broken, and shall be divided toward the four winds of heaven; and not to his posterity, nor according to his dominion which he ruled: for his kingdom shall be plucked up, even for others beside those.
    6. Zec 2:6 Ho, ho, come forth, and flee from the land of the north, saith the LORD: for I have spread you abroad as the four winds of the heaven, saith the LORD.
    7. Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
    8. Mar 13:27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
    9. Rev 7:1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.

    Four winds is used 9 times in both old and new testament

    It isnt just associated with the seventh trump
    four is the four quaters/directions of earth / heaven
    i.e all directions.
    Wind, breath spirit being called from all directions or it can be one direction i.e the North wind

    God is simply saying in Mat. 24 he gathers his elect from where they are in all directions

    North, South, east or west all directions its not limited to only being used to refer to the 7th trump ..

    There is an Angel in each direction holding back the wind... You cant just asign the wind spirit coming from a direction or all directions to a single event.

    Here the winds, spirits blow upon the sea
    four winds of heaven churning up the great sea.(Dan. 7: 2,3)

    Ancient Hebrew literature recognizes only four winds-north, south, east, and west, having no names for those from intermediate points, so that such a designation as "north" has a wide range of application. The dwelling-places of the winds were in the four corners of the earth ("ḳeẓot haareẓ"); there they were confined in storehouses, from which Yhwh sent them forth (Jer. x. 13, xlix. 36, li. 16; B. B. vi. 7). According to Rev. vii. 1, these storehouses were guarded by four angels, who restrained the winds, as they continually strove to break loose

    Read more: http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=200&letter=W&search=four winds#ixzz1Q3xwcMuu


    Even today its said one wind brings rain another the hot wind
     
  14. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    My understanding is.....As He comes "as a thief in the night," then the third woe begins during the night, during Satan's time. The seventh trump sounds "for days" and "begins" in the night. I agree that at that time the kingdoms of the world are His and He shall reign forever but that fact has no bearing on the seventh trump sounding for days.

    As for the great earthquake in Jerusalem......

    Revelation 16:17-19 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done. And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great. And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of His wrath.


    The great earthquake is in the great city Babylon, not Jerusalem. Babylon is symbolic of the world. Will it be a literal earthquake or spiritual?





    I greatly respect your teaching Veteran but on this point....I believe you are mistaken. Days is plural for a reason and is underlined when "begin to sound" is added.





    Please consider that the above passage is shown happening in the sixth seal events. The seventh seal has yet to be opened. He comes as a thief in the night. During Satan's "hour" of darkness.



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  15. veteran

    veteran New Member

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    I just don't get that last trump continuing to blow for a number of days, but on a certain day, at a certain hour. Look at Zech.14 about that great earthquake for where it will happen. I believe the whole earth will tremble, but there's a great earthquake associated with the spot where Christ returns per Zech.14. That spot is the Mount of Olives east of Jerusalem. That will be the harlot city for the tribulation, and is the "great city" of Revelation.

    I'm aware 'some' of the sixth seal events occur with the seventh trumpet and seventh vial. The giving of the seven seals is mainly about the revealing of information about the seven signs of the end, for we're not told which number seal that rider on the white horse comes on, but we can be pretty sure that rider won't be the first sign to occur. We're given that sign first because it's one of the most important signs. Thus we cannot depend on the order of the seven seals. But we can with the order given of the seven trumpets.
     
  16. avoice

    avoice Member

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    I think people put way to much emphasis on this "as a theif in the night" ... Its called the Lords Day period
    never the night of the Lord you adding to scripture IMO ..As a theif in the night is a figure of speech an idiom that means when you least expect it. Theres a whole parable about it.
    The fact the day starts in the evening then of corse it may be dark but thats as far as it goes.

    The 7th Trump sounds it is done the Lords day begins as Veteran said above ..Therefore all things that take place in the first 6 trumps and seals are of this age.... and are done and over when the 7th trump blows ....

    We are now In the Lords Day all things change from this point .. As soon as the 7 trumpt blows we see in Rev 10 angel making a proclamation. We are then told
    Rev 10:7 God told his secret plans to his servants the prophets, and it will all happen by the time the seventh angel sounds his trumpet."

    This means its all done except what will occur from that point on.
    From here we need to follow the time line the tribulation of first 6 trumps is done ...

    Whats the very first thing we see happing

    Mat 24:29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    So we see Christ gathering his 144,000 Elect from every direction and anyplace they maybe
    on earth or in heaven. The time line then leads us to The next time we see Christ it is in Rev 14

    all other thing written in book of Rev that occur before Christs return are finished. We pick up in Rev 14

    Rev 14:1And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty [and] four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

    He is about to do the reaping of the Multitudes the Elect 144,000 have already been gathered/reaped ..Some will be reaped by Christ himself this is the church/bride first resurrected we see them in the second vision of Rev.7 ........

    However others another angel NOT CHRIST will reap into Gods wrath .....which has not yet occured ....

    We are not appointed to Gods wrath which is the very last things to occur.

    Gods wrath is the last 7 vials ......and they will not be poured out until after he has finished the reaping.

    Following the time line we then see Rev 15 about to occur

    Rev 15:1And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.
     
  17. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    Zechariah 14:3-4 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. And His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.




    We are really in disagreement about this Veteran. First, there is no mention of an earthquake in that passage. Also, from the above we see that the feet of Christ stand on the mount of Olives. Those "feet" are us, those He walks in.....

    2 Corinthians 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.​

    Who is the mount of Olives on which His feet/some of us stand?

    Romans 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;​

    The wild olive trees grafted into the natural olive trees are Israel and Gentiles. The mount of Olives is God's holy nation....His mountain/nation of olive trees. All are believers but, as taught in the parable of the ten virgins....they all love the Lord but not all have truth. Some will be with Him while others are on the other side. The mount of Olives, as the virgins will be divided due to the apostasy and between those that fall away and those that stay true there is a great valley....

    Luke 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.​

    I think that great valley, great gulf, is the valley of the shadow of death. On one side are those of the first resurrection while on the other are those that will be taught during the millennium.







    There is only one harlot city...and that isn't Jerusalem. He tells us specifically that the great city is Babylon.





    I think we can depend on the order given Veteran. It is written, second, third, etc. for a reason. And, also for a reason the one we first read of is shown as.....


    Revelation 6:1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.​


    It isn't numbered for a reason but is shown as "one of the seals."



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  18. avoice

    avoice Member

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    follow the time line I laid out above Whirlwind
    you can not mix things of this age in the first 6 trumps/seals with the things of the Lords Day /7th trump
    this age ends with the blowing of the 7th trump therefore all things before that of this age are done.
     
  19. whirlwind

    whirlwind New Member

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    I place emphasis on the phrase as they are the words of the Lord telling us when He comes. :) He arrives "in the night." I'm not adding to Scripture as I didn't write the words. ;)





    The evening and the morning is day, not night.....

    Genesis 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.





    When the 7th trump BEGINS TO SOUND, which is during the night......

    Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as He hath declared to His servants the prophets.​


    But, when he has FINISHED sounding, then.....

    Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.


    He sounded (past tense) so then the kingdoms of this world are His.





    When the seventh angel "begins to sound" the mystery should already "be finished" if we are indeed His prophets. What is that mystery?

    A few days ago I wrote a thread on this topic....I just posted it here The Mystery Should Be Finished



    I'll have to reply to the rest of your post later.




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  20. avoice

    avoice Member

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    Suit yourself "As a thief in the night" is a type, a how ....not a time ..
    Its a figure of speech meaning when least expected or least ready or watching thats why God gave a parable describing it.

    The 7th trump starts the Lords day its a day of darkness not a night of darkness

    Amo 5:18Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end [is] it for you? the day of the LORD [is] darkness, and not light.

    Amo 5:20[Shall] not the day of the LORD [be] darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?

    Isa 13:9Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.His wrath is the 7 last vials they are not poured until in his day the Lords Day the 7th trump

    Eze 30:3 For the day [is] near, even the day of the LORD [is] near, a cloudy day; it shall be the time of the heathen.


    Joe 1:15Alas for the day! for the day of the LORD [is] at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.
     
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