Wrong Teaching on "God's Sovereignty"=Worst Doctrine in Church today!!

[GISMYS_7]

Wrong teaching on "God's sovereignty" the worst doctrine in the church today. The way sovereignty” is taught today is a real faith killer. The belief that God controls everything that happens to us is one of the devil’s biggest inroads into our lives. If this belief is true, then our actions are irrelevant, and our efforts are meaningless. What will be will be.

If we believe that God wills everything, good or bad, to happen to us, it gives us some temporary relief from confusion and condemnation, but in the long-term, it slanders God, hinders our trust in God, and leads to passiveness.

Religion has resulted in the invention of a new meaning for the word “sovereign,” which basically means God controls everything. Nothing can happen but what He wills or allows. However, there is nothing in the actual definition that states that. The dictionary defines “sovereign” as, “1. Paramount; supreme. 2. Having supreme rank or power. 3. Independent: a sovereign state. 4. Excellent.” None of these definitions means that God controls everything.
I believe this is the worst doctrine in the church today. The belief that God controls everything that happens to us is one of the devil’s biggest inroads into our lives. If this belief is true, then our actions are irrelevant, and our efforts are meaningless. What will be will be.

If we believe that God wills everything, good or bad, to happen to us, it gives us some temporary relief from confusion and condemnation, but in the long-term, it slanders God, hinders our trust in God, and leads to passiveness.

Religion has resulted in the invention of a new meaning for the word “sovereign,” which basically means God controls everything. Nothing can happen but what He wills or allows. However, there is nothing in the actual definition that states that. The dictionary defines “sovereign” as, “1. Paramount; supreme. 2. Having supreme rank or power. 3. Independent: a sovereign state. 4. Excellent.” None of these definitions means that God controls everything.
It is assumed that since God is paramount or supreme that nothing can happen without His approval. That is not what the Scriptures teach. In 2 Peter 3:9, Peter said, “The Lord is…not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.” This clearly states that it is not the Lord’s will for anyone to perish, but people are perishing. Jesus said, “Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat” (Matt. 7:13). Relatively few people are saved compared to the number that are lost. God’s will for people concerning salvation is not being accomplished.

This is because the Lord gave us the freedom to choose. He doesn’t will anyone into hell. He paid for the sins of the whole world (1 John 2:2; 1 Tim. 4:10), but we must choose to put our faith in Christ and receive His salvation. People are the ones choosing hell by not choosing Jesus as their Savior. It is the free will of man that damns them, not God.
awmi.net

 

[ScottA]

That is a natural and completely understandable reaction to being in a foxhole while the battle is raging all around. But the bigger picture does leave plenty of room to truthfully say that "God is in control of all things." Is that truth abused and wrongfully considered? Certainly, in more than a few cases.

But rather than categorically right off the idea that God is in complete control, it is good to understand the bigger picture:

First, we perceive all that happens in our life and times from one perspective, but God perceives them from a different perspective, an eternal or timeless perspective. Because we exist within the creation of time, we see things on a timeline that is aside from God. It is as though we exist in a fishbowl with a clock - but He is outside the fishbowl...and there is no clock. Therefore, the first question to ask and to understand, is: Whose reality, is really real...the one that is (God's), or the one that was created (ours)? God's, of course. Thus, the ultimate truth resides with God...or...as they say, God is in complete control...and all we can claim was created, in His words: out of nothing.

This is where the term "in the twinkling of an eye" comes from. Which is a way of describing the non-time truth of something we experience in time. But, if time doesn't exist with God, what would "all the time in the world" look like to Him? Same answer: In the twinkling of an eye. Or, more precisely, before, or after. Yes...there was a before the day of the Lord and all that His story (history) entails, and yes, there is an after. But during...that, He doesn't call truth...He calls it "today." Or..."in the twinkling of an eye."

How does that translate into freewill and all that we experience in this life? It translates, that although it all occurred (past tense) in the twinkling of an eye, we experience it on a timeline. Meaning, that what we experience in a lifetime, we willed...in the twinkling of an eye. And, this, this is us experiencing it and all the consequences unfolding before us...in what we would call "real time", which isn't, but rather is more like our life passing before our eyes...in a way only God can do.

So, is God in complete control? Yes. Do we have free will? Yes. Can we change who we are throughout our lifetime? Yes. Do we really have a lifetime? It depends on who you ask. If you ask the person next to you, the answer is yes. If you ask God, the answer is...theses things were true...before the foundation of the world, and this is just you being you - your life flashing before your eyes.

Thy will be done.

 

[GISMYS_7]

God is the Alpha and Omega=the beginning and the end=God is outside time. Time was created for mankind!!! But just because God has already seen and knows all of our life events does not change the truth that we choose to do or not do, believe or not believe and we cannot then try to blame God by saying it is God controlling us and all events and we had no choice or blame or guilt!!!

 

[FHII]

Love what ScottA had to say! I disagree with some minor points... Namely i am not one to believe in free will. I don't necessarily believe we are robots. I only say that because someone's bound to say that sooner or later. But we are sheep. Sheep can wonder off. They can eat on the north side of the field or south side... They can be dumb and wander into the wolves... But Jesus is the shepherd.

Eph 1 says God works ALL things after the council of his own will. How can God work all things if we can work something? So yes. I do believe he is in complete control.

That doesn't make it easy on us. Its comforting to know. But it doesn't mean we wont have our trials. It just means that God will work it out for his sheep. The "us-ward" spoken of in 2 Peter (it wasn't everyone).

 

[DPMartin]

This is because the Lord gave us the freedom to choose. He doesn’t will anyone into hell. He paid for the sins of the whole world (1 John 2:2; 1 Tim. 4:10), but we must choose to put our faith in Christ and receive His salvation. People are the ones choosing hell by not choosing Jesus as their Savior. It is the free will of man that damns them, not God.
awmi.net

nope the life one has is chosen for them, they just receive it when they come into the world. the Life Adam received was given him, he didn't exist before hand. so the life given him was to be son of God, that life was lost by God's choice of the result of eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. it wasn't Adam's choice to make the tree nor his choice of what was the result of it. God spoke those things before hand.

actuality, God's choice is faith and trust in Him through His Word, and it wasn't there in Adam or Eve was it? so how is that a "choice" on Adam or Eve's part? they are what they are. therefore they by God's choice were to remain in the flesh a life of dust to dust and ashes to ashes. so Noah became God's choice for, and Abraham became God's choice for, so on and so forth.

now if you choose coke over pepsi, so what, that isn't freewill in the context of God and man. rabbits get the same choices between lettuce and carrots also, and they most likely were made, like the other animals in day six, before man.

so now salvation is by God's choice, through His Beloved Son, the Word of God made flesh. actually nothing has changed other than the proximity between man and God.

so if the faith/trust is there, there is a chosen of God. and rabbits are not required to believe or trust the Word of God. the Power of God makes them and makes them do, just as you would pick up a hammer and hit a nail with it. and if you've notice to live a life in the flesh as most wanton do, trust and belief in the Word of God isn't required, is it?


oh yea, a little something on the subject of God's sovereignty, God's Judgement (choices if you prefer) is good for all of His creation and the creatures therein, no exceptions. note that at the end of some of the days and the end of creation that He saw that is that its good. saw back when KJV was being translated meant either a blade as in saw blade or to declare hence God declared it good. that would be God's Judgement (choices if you prefer). therefore the end result is God's choice, to God's satisfaction. no other factors involved.


and if you are looking to the devil on this one forget it where the devil is, is a result of God's choice for him, and the Lord likes to use him for proving, that something is there or not. if a orange tree is a orange tree then it should bear fruit accordingly, but if its not, that will be apparent also.

 

[GISMYS_7]

Typical little sin loving men make the choice to live in sin and then try to blame God. It is not God's will that men live in sin but we are free to choose to!!!

 

[Helen]

Very good @ScottA well said.

 

[ScottA]

God is the Alpha and Omega=the beginning and the end=God is outside time. Time was created for mankind!!! But just because God has already seen and knows all of our life events does not change the truth that we choose to do or not do, believe or not believe and we cannot then try to blame God by saying it is God controlling us and all events and we had no choice or blame or guilt!!!

Certainly, God is without blame.

But it is not just that God has already seen and knows all of our life, but rather that just as the Lamb of God was slain before the foundation of the world, we too did everything we are now experiencing before the foundation of the world. What we are experiencing now is the evidence for and against us for the judgement, being heard by all. But as I said, it is all happening in what would be like God's real time...except that He doesn't actually have time, so this is just us experiencing what otherwise occurred in the twinkling of an eye.

So, again, how does that translate into us having freewill and the ability to change or believe? We absolutely do have that ability. But that too, happened before the foundation of the world. That makes all of this our will according to our will, both before time and within time.

As bizarre and abstract as this all sounds...that is the nature of our God, the very nature we should be learning and coming accustom to.

 

[GISMYS_7]

God says,"choose today who you will serve". God knowing what we have done and will do does not change the Truth =we had and have choice!!

 

[ScottA]

Love what ScottA had to say! I disagree with some minor points... Namely i am not one to believe in free will. I don't necessarily believe we are robots. I only say that because someone's bound to say that sooner or later. But we are sheep. Sheep can wonder off. They can eat on the north side of the field or south side... They can be dumb and wander into the wolves... But Jesus is the shepherd.

Eph 1 says God works ALL things after the council of his own will. How can God work all things if we can work something? So yes. I do believe he is in complete control.

That doesn't make it easy on us. Its comforting to know. But it doesn't mean we wont have our trials. It just means that God will work it out for his sheep. The "us-ward" spoken of in 2 Peter (it wasn't everyone).

The confusion comes from our perspective of all things in time. Time is a created illusion. The root and source of all truth does not reside in time. As such, what is actually true of our timeline experience, occurred before the foundation of the world, where we made our split-second decision on all things...then lived it, as we do now, according to our own [free]will.

God did let us decide our own fate, but that does not take away any bit of control from Him. He has predestine our freewill according to His will, then - BAM! - History (His story) came into existence and began to unfold...just as it is written.

 

[GISMYS_7]

We all sin each day and sin is not God's will for us!!! Pray for some wisdom and understanding!!!

 

[ScottA]

We all sin each day and sin is not God's will for us!!! Pray for some wisdom and understanding!!!

For some reason you are on a campaign against the idea of God's sovereignty. But what I have been trying to explain and impress upon you...is that "each day" (as you define it), is either spent within the blinding darkness of the old idea of a worldly timeline prison and created illusion, or within the light of the greater kingdom of God, free from such bondage, in the presence of all truth. Either way, the end is the same...the illusion ends.

This is the Jordan of life. We either cross it now, or circle in the desert until the end.

If we do cross over now, or "enter in" as God would have it...we walk with God. But He has put before us life and death...and we must choose.

 

[GISMYS_7]

YES!! ...we walk with God. But He has put before us life and death...and we must choose. And we can't try to blame God. God's will is that none perish but millions do perish each day because man has choice to believe or reject God.

 

[FHII]

what is actually true of our timeline experience, occurred before the foundation of the world, where we made our split-second decision on all things...then lived it, as we do now, according to our own [free]wil

Interesting thought... How do you figure this to be so?

 

[ScottA]

Interesting thought... How do you figure this to be so?

According to the word of God, these things are true of the Lamb. If we are in Christ...it is true of us also.

 

[FHII]

According to the word of God, these things are true of the Lamb. If we are in Christ...it is true of us also.

Ok great... I was looking for something a little more specific. A verse or chapter....

 

[ScottA]

Ok great... I was looking for something a little more specific. A verse or chapter....

What is better than the word inspired by the Spirit, is the Spirit. These are the times we live in. What is now spoken in spirit, is indeed written, but yet to be fully recorded within the minds of men unto all truth.

 

[GISMYS_7]

◄ Psalm 33:4 ►

For the word of the LORD is right and true; he is faithful in all he does.

Test the Spirits. 4 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. 1 John 4:1-2

 

[Rev20]

The way sovereignty” is taught today is a real faith killer. The belief that God controls everything that happens to us is one of the devil’s biggest inroads into our lives. If this belief is true, then our actions are irrelevant, and our efforts are meaningless. What will be will be.

If we believe that God wills everything, good or bad, to happen to us, it gives us some temporary relief from confusion and condemnation, but in the long-term, it slanders God, hinders our trust in God, and leads to passiveness.

I agree. God is the benevolent ruler of living, breathing beings made in his image, not a glorified computer programmer of a bunch of robots.

Rev

 

[Rev20]

But it is not just that God has already seen and knows all of our life, but rather that just as the Lamb of God was slain before the foundation of the world, we too did everything we are now experiencing before the foundation of the world.

Scott, that assumes you applied "before the foundation of the world" correctly in the second clause, and that you were in fact chosen before the foundation of the world as implied in the third.

Rev