Bible alone

[CadyandZoe]

Most Protestants would disagree with you. The Nicene Creed is the accepted
standard for this board. You assert the Nicene Creed "adds concepts that are not biblical" but don't say what they are. That is a radical claim contrary to most of Christianity: Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox. You stand alone.

I'm okay with that. In my view, majority consensus is not a valid means to test the veracity of a truth statement.

All one needs to do is allow oneself to ask the question, "what does it really mean?" And if an answer is not found, one should feel free to reject it. That's what I did. I thoroughly investigated the matter for many months. I finally decided that the entire thing was nonsensical. And I concluded that the Bible would never teach anything so absurd. So I rejected it. I don't reject the incarnation. I just think the Council did a really bad job of explaining it, borrowing Greek ideas and inserting concepts that aren't Biblical.

Most Protestants I meet affirm the Nicene Creed, but have no idea what it means. Why would they do that? Someone very wise told it to me this way. "The doctrine of the Trinity is like an electrified fence. Get too close and you might get hurt or even killed." This explains why most Protestants affirm the doctrine. No one wants to be hurt, excommunicated, or burned at the stake.

Those who affirm the Nicene Creed fall into two camps: Those who think they understand it, and those who apprehend it as a mystery. Those who claim to understand it can't actually explain it. Rather, many resort to goofy analogies, which don't explain anything and most often explain modalism rather than the Trinity.

Most people, including me, would rather not argue about it.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Then explain eph 4:5 or many other verses

We could go and look at the Ephesians passage if you like. But remember, I am NOT rejecting baptism. I'm simply saying that John chapter 3 doesn't speak about baptism.

Ephesians 4:4-6
There is one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.​

The phrase in bold lettering contains what appears to be three items, but all three of these items bracket the same idea. The concept that they all have in common is "the gospel message." The message is a word about the Lord, who also happens to be the teacher of that word. His teaching is otherwise known as "the faith" and those who agree to dedicate their lives to the obedience of that teaching are known as disciples. And baptism in water was the initiation rite into that new life. In this context, "baptism" is a metonym for "the teaching we follow." There is only one teaching we follow and that is the one faith, which speaks about the only Lord we obey.

 

[CadyandZoe]

why go to the river to baptize???

John baptized in water, but Jesus baptizes in the Holy Spirit and Fire. Christians adopted the Jewish practice of baptism because Jesus commanded the apostles to baptize "in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit" designating these three to be the teachers.

Nonetheless, in John chapter 3, Jesus is training his kinsmen to stop thinking in terms of birthright, and start thinking in terms of proper inwardness. On those born from above will enter into the kingdom of God.

 

[GracePeace]

Jesus is speaking to a man who, according to the teachings of his brotherhood, believe that the Jews will enter the kingdom of God by virtue of their birth. Jesus is telling Nicodemus that birthright isn't enough.

Jesus : "...unless someone"--amniotic birth is already assumed--"is born again they cannot see the Kingdom of God."
Nicodemus : "How can one be born when he is old? Can he enter again into his mother's womb and be born again?"
Jesus : “...unless someone is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which has been born of the flesh is flesh, and that which has been born of the Spirit is spirit."

"...born again... born of water and the Spirit" : Since Nicodemus didn't understand what "born again" meant, Jesus repeats Himself and explains what it means--therefore, this has nothing to do with the old birth of flesh but explains the new birth of the Spirit.

Thanks for challenging me to explain my point further.

 

[amigo de christo]

And what about baptism?

1 Pet 3:20
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark all died and outside the church there is no salvation!)
The holy church founded by Christ is the ark of salvation!

Be hearers and doers of all things that JESUS and the apostles both did and taught .
I keep saying this my friend . If they said it and they did it , we say it and we do it .
But let no man, woman , child or even pet heed the RCC .

 

[amigo de christo]

type of the papacy

But it sure aint the Papacy of the RCC . This world would be far better
off if folks had stuck to converting folks to Christ and not the papacy and other traditions of men gone long wrong .

 

[Wrangler]

The one true Almighty God is Father,Son and Holy Spirit = the one true Almighty God!!

Obviously, trinitarians do not realize 3 is not 1. Numbers tells us God is not man. Malachi tells us God never changes.

Fully man is a type of man that God is not.

 

[GISMYS_7]

Obviously, trinitarians do not realize 3 is not 1. Numbers tells us God is not man. Malachi tells us God never changes.

Fully man is a type of man that God is not.

One but three just as we are one but three=one man is body,soul,spirit = three but one!!!
The one true Almighty God is Father,Son and Holy Spirit = the one true Almighty God!!

 

[Amazed@grace]

Woe into those who make an idol of the bible and insist Jesus cannot exist outside its confines.

I think it behooves any seeker after God and His Word to find how the Bible came to exist. And for that matter pagan Roman emperor Constantine and his impact on orthodoxy.

 

[Wrangler]

One but three

Contradiction.

 

[GISMYS_7]

1. John 1:1-5 Jesus is God and - The Eternal Word - In the beginning was ...
   The Eternal Word - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.
   

 

[Wrangler]

1. John 1:1-5 Jesus is God and - The Eternal Word - In the beginning was ...

 

[GracePeace]

Woe into those who make an idol of the bible and insist Jesus cannot exist outside its confines.

LOL! This right here explains so much!

 

[Marc RL Ministry]

Where does the Bible teach the doctrine of the Bible alone?

where does the Bible say what is and what is not scripture!

Where does the Bible say read for yourself and make your own doctrine or your own salvation?

John 15:1-7 The True Vine
1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. 3Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 4Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. 5I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. 6If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. 7If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

John 8:31-32 31Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

John 10:7-9 7Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. 10The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

 

[Amazed@grace]

LOL! This right here explains so much!

As does your laughter.

Fielty to God begins in following his truth. God is a spirit. And we who are his worship him in spirit.
While using ones God given intellect, and again seeking that we may find, why his church is divided on The Word by the words of men throughout the ages, is a leading of the spirit as well.

When you one day stop laughing at that you may know God in spirit.

 

[GracePeace]

As does your laughter.

Fielty to God begins in following his truth. God is a spirit. And we who are his worship him in spirit.
While using ones God given intellect, and again seeking that we may find, why his church is divided on The Word by the words of men throughout the ages, is a leading of the spirit as well.

When you one day stop laughing at that you may know God in spirit.

Just sayin'. LOL

 

[Philip James]

Thus, Jesus-Followers are not using the Bible alone; we have the benefit of the Bible AND the Holy Spirit.

Dear CadyandZoe,

Indeed! And that Holy Spirit has been guiding us inerrantly for 2000 years!
' for we have the mind of Christ'

And that same Spirit, in every generation calls out our brothers and our sons as judges for us.

And they proclaim, preserve, and pass on that which we have recieved from our fathers and our mothers before us.

The Truth does not change...

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding Feast of the Lamb of God!

Peace be with you!

 

[theefaith]

John 15:1-7 The True Vine
1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. 3Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 4Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. 5I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. 6If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. 7If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

John 8:31-32 31Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

John 10:7-9 7Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. 10The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

the church and the apostles are required for all these


Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 acts 9:4 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20 acts 2:42 1 Tim 3:15

Matt 16:17-19

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...

John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.

Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, so send in you. (The apostles) posses the same power mission and authority as Christ!
Peter, the apostles and their successors!

Must be taught by the holy church by the apostles! Matt 28:19-20 Lk 1:4 Acts 2:42

Hebrews 13:17
Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

 

[Marc RL Ministry]

the church and the apostles are required for all these


Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 acts 9:4 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20 acts 2:42 1 Tim 3:15

Matt 16:17-19

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...

John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.

Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, so send in you. (The apostles) posses the same power mission and authority as Christ!
Peter, the apostles and their successors!

Must be taught by the holy church by the apostles! Matt 28:19-20 Lk 1:4 Acts 2:42

Hebrews 13:17
Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

If this is the case and use are all doing the right thing following his disciple's and Paul's teachings beyond Jesus Christ words why has the Holy Spirit not come upon the Church? It is because they did not abide in his teachings after he left and your churches don't abide in Jesus Christ they have gone onto Maturity like the disciples in Hebrews 6 without even receiving the Spirit.

• John 8:31 (KJV)
  Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

Hebrew 6:1 1Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection

(THIS IS WHERE THE DESTRUCTION OF THE CHURCH CHRIST BEGAN)

• John 15:7 (KJV)
  If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
  

This is why I receive the Holy Spirit in November 2017, Jesus Christ Holy Spirit come to myself in my bedroom and entered the right side of my head. I am not equal to God but I am a son of the most high and we all can be if we abide in Christ as I did abide in his words and still do.

 

[n2thelight]

No the valid faithful bishops

Jude 1: 17 But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;

The holy church does not usurp Christ’s authority, the holy church establishes it throughout the whole world, and thru all time!

The holy apostles do not usurp Christ’s kingdom, the apostles administer the kingdom for Christ who ascended to heaven!

Ephesians 3:21
Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.

Ephesians 5:24
Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ...

Not answering my question, how was a evil pope allowed to run the church ?