Paul’s Gospel

[Lifelong_sinner]

O.S.A.S is only if you die in the grace of God!

until then it is conditional

Jn 15:1-5

Matt 24:13 endures to the end.

Mark 13:13
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

Heb 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;

Heb 6:11 And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:

1. Romans 11:22 – God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness

2. Colossians 1:21-23 – holy and blameless, if you continue in the faith"

3. The race of faith: the example of Paul

4. Hebrews 12:22-25: "we shall not escape if we turn away from Him"

5. Hebrews 4:1-3, 9-12: "strive to enter the rest of God"

6.Hebrews 6:4-9 – those who became partakers of the holy spirit and fell away

7. Hebrews 10:23-29, 35-39: "if we sin willfully", "if anyone draws back".

8. Matthew 24:13: He that endures to the end, the same shall be saved

9. Hebrews 3:4-6: Holding fast our confidence firm until the end

10. Matthew 24:13: "But the one who endures to the end will be saved"

11. 1 John 2:24-25 – "if what you heard from the beginning abides in you"

12. 2 John 8-9 : to "everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ

13. 2 Peter 1:5-11 : "Make every effort to supplement your faith"

14. Philippians 2:12-16: "work out your salvation with fear and trembling"

15. 1 Timothy 6:10-16: the love of money

16. Galatians 5:2-4 "Severed from Christ"

17. 2 Timothy 2:11-13: "if we deny him, he will also deny us"

18. James 5:19-20: the wandered brother

19. Some will abandon the faith

20. 1 Timothy 5:8: "he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever"

22. The real family of Jesus: "Those who hear the Word of God and do it"

23. 1 Corinthians 5:5: "so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord"

24. Peter 2: "It would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness"

25. Jude: "Turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness" - a much relevant warning

26. 1 Cor. 9:27 ....Lest I myself might become a castaway

Romans 1:5
By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
(Must remain obedient)




Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

So salvation by “faith alone” is completely false and impossible!

dude, you are so on ignore.

 

[ChristisGod]

I really enjoy smart and well spoken and learned people who think differently about things than I do. If my thoughts can't withstand challenge, well, I want to know that!

Much love!

Ditto

 

[theefaith]

dude, you are so on ignore.

more power to ya! But that’s scripture you’re ignoring

 

[GEN2REV]

OSAS is Biblical, and no one who believes in OSAS would deny your “striving.”

What is there to strive for from an eternal security perspective?

 

[theefaith]

What is there to strive for from an eternal security perspective?

perseverance! Jn 15:1-5
Matt 24:13

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

What is there to strive for from an eternal security perspective?

OSAS doesnt mean you can live however you want. And its not something that stands on its own. OSAS only applies to you after you have been saved and have the Holy Spirit in you. Without the Holy Spirit in you, there is no OSAS doctrine. And if a person freely sins, that means sinning without guilt or care, then the Holy Spirit is not in you and you were never saved to begin with.

 

[Netchaplain]

I think we strive against the flesh and any other enemy so that we will live according to the Spirit. Even to the point of blood if need be!

Much love!

True, even the Spirit works against the "old man" (flesh; sin nature) in us (Gal 5:17). The Spirit's part is to keep us from ever desiring it again by restraining it via Jesus' Cross; our part is to continue to learn to know His guidance and enablement to "put off" the "deeds" of it. Amen, the other two enemies besides our old man is Satan and unbelieving society (world; majority of mankind).

 

[Behold]

Gill is 100% Calvinist . When I was a Calvinist I used his sources all of the time .

Thank you for the update.
Thought so..
So, that is why NetChaplin uses his material.

 

[GEN2REV]

OSAS only applies to you after you have been saved and have the Holy Spirit in you. Without the Holy Spirit in you, there is no OSAS doctrine. And if a person freely sins, that means sinning without guilt or care, then the Holy Spirit is not in you and you were never saved to begin with.

So once the HS is in you, you are then incapable of sinning anymore?

No smart aleck. Just trying to construct a model in my mind of your doctrinal structure on this topic.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

So once the HS is in you, you are then incapable of sinning anymore?

No smart aleck. Just trying to construct a model in my mind of your doctrinal structure on this topic.

oh no, you’ll still sin. But you’ll try not to sin, you’ll actually care about sin. Think of it as a teenager back in HS, you did what was cool, and if it made your parents mad, you didnt care cause you were gonna live life your way. That would be the unsaved person.
Then think of yourself as an older person who does care how you treat your parents. You try not to make them mad, you take care of them when they get older, you’re like a changed person compared to your younger HS self. Thats how it is when the Holy Spirit is in you. You go from not caring to caring. Do you still make mistakes? You bet! But now you understand what sin is because the Holy Spirit reveals it to you, and you try not to do that.

hope that makes sense….

 

[GEN2REV]

oh no, you’ll still sin. But you’ll try not to sin, you’ll actually care about sin. Think of it as a teenager back in HS, you did what was cool, and if it made your parents mad, you didnt care cause you were gonna live life your way. That would be the unsaved person.
Then think of yourself as an older person who does care how you treat your parents. You try not to make them mad, you take care of them when they get older, you’re like a changed person compared to your younger HS self. Thats how it is when the Holy Spirit is in you. You go from not caring to caring. Do you still make mistakes? You bet! But now you understand what sin is because the Holy Spirit reveals it to you, and you try not to do that.

hope that makes sense….

It does. Thanks.

But ... it begs another question. Sorry.

If you're clear that a saved person, with the Holy Spirit, is capable of sin, but 'makes an effort' not to, what is the point of stiving against sin if you cannot be separated from God?

Sin separates us from God. Per Scripture. So if somebody is OSAS, what is their drive to strive against being separated from God? - if they can't be separated from God?

 

[Behold]

So once the HS is in you, you are then incapable of sinning anymore?

Thats a really good question.

If you turn to Romans 4:8, you'll find that Paul teaches that God does not charge SIN, to the born again, any more.
Why doesn't he?
Its because He's already Judged Jesus for them all, on the Cross.
Christ is the REDEEMER.
He Redeems you from all your sin, and thereby redeems you back to God.

Then..
You have the fact of being defined as a sinner.
Its the Law that defines you as a sinner.. And if you are not under the law, then it Cant.
The Born again are not under the Law, they are "under GRACE"
"Christ is the END OF THE LAW, to/for all who BELIEVE" = born again.
Where there is no law, there is no Law that is able to define you as a sinner.
This is why Paul refers to what the LAW defines as sin, as a "work of the flesh", or "flesh", in the Life of a Born Again Believer.

And more.....
Its not your body or mind that is born again...Its Your SPIRIT.
So, where does the born again Spirit exist?, as BORN AGAIN?
It exists IN CHRIST as "ONE WITH GOD", and there is no sin found there...

When a person is born again...God supernaturally separates their Spirit from their "flesh".
Colossians 2:11.
And this Spirit, born again,..... now exists in Spiritual Union with God, and there is no sin found there.
There is also no Moses law found there, or 10 commandments.
God does not need Moses Law or the 10 Commandments in Heaven...>He's above that stuff., and the Born Again are "ONE WITH GOD",.. "IN CHRIST"....not sinners, but SONS.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

It does. Thanks.

But ... it begs another question. Sorry.

If you're clear that a saved person, with the Holy Spirit, is capable of sin, but 'makes an effort' not to, what is the point of stiving against sin if you cannot be separated from God?

Sin separates us from God. Per Scripture. So if somebody is OSAS, what is their drive to strive against being separated from God? - if they can't be separated from God?

sin does separate us from God. Its why we all die, its why bad things happen to us. But i think what you’re asking is, what motivates us to not sin? 1. The Holy Spirit creates in us a desire to not go against God. We obey God because of love for Him. And 2. Judgement. Every sin you do, word, thought, deed, gesture, will be held against us. So you can be saved, commit a sin, still be saved, but you will answer for that sin. 1 corinthians 3:15. You will still be saved, but will have lost rewards in Heaven.

 

[GEN2REV]

sin does separate us from God. Its why we all die, its why bad things happen to us. But i think what you’re asking is, what motivates us to not sin? 1. The Holy Spirit creates in us a desire to not go against God. We obey God because of love for Him. And 2. Judgement. Every sin you do, word, thought, deed, gesture, will be held against us. So you can be saved, commit a sin, still be saved, but you will answer for that sin. 1 corinthians 3:15. You will still be saved, but will have lost rewards in Heaven.

Ok, that's what I was trying to get to. Thanks.

So those who believe in OSAS avoid sin sheerly by the motivation of losing rewards in heaven if they do.

To me, that's a flimsy motivation, and nowhere near dire enough for many professed Christians to avoid sin, but ... I'm aware that's the common belief today.

Gotcha.

ETA: I've heard multiple popular modern pastors make jokes from the pulpit about barely making it into heaven with your clothes smoking from how close you came to going to hell. Not very humorous at all to me and sends a very insincere message to those who are trying to learn about God and the Faith.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

Ok, that's what I was trying to get to. Thanks.

So those who believe in OSAS avoid sin sheerly by the motivation of losing rewards in heaven if they do.

To me, that's a flimsy motivation, and nowhere near dire enough for many professed Christians to avoid sin, but ... I'm aware that's the common belief today.

Gotcha.

ETA: I've heard multiple popular modern pastors make jokes from the pulpit about barely making it into heaven with your clothes smoking from how close you came to going to hell. Not very humorous at all to me and sends a very insincere message to those who are trying to learn about God and the Faith.

for me, getting saved is all about not going to hell. But what i struggle with is some say thats not a good reason. And so then i ask, what other reason is there?? I never can get a straight answer to that.

personally, i dont care about rewards, i just wanna escape going to hell. Quite honestly, its the only reason i even participate in religion to begin with. Better to live in a cardboard box in Heaven than a mansion in hell.

 

[GEN2REV]

Better to live in a cardboard box in Heaven than a mansion in hell.

Agreed.

What does a Calvinist consider to be sin; if not the breaking of the 10 Commandments?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

personally, i dont care about rewards, i just wanna escape going to hell.

First of all the “loosing rewards” doctrine is false. You’ll be loosing your salvation!

Second, if it were true - NO ONE WOULD GET ANY REWARDS BECAUSE Y’ALL BELIEVE NO ONE STOPS SINNING!

Oh the madness!

[lifelong sinner has me on ignore] it’s our little secret. LOL!!

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

Agreed.

What does a Calvinist consider to be sin; if not the breaking of the 10 Commandments?

more than just the 10 commandments. Paul was pretty clear what would keep you out of Heaven.

 

[GEN2REV]

First of all the “loosing rewards” doctrine is false. You’ll be loosing your salvation!

Second, if it were true - NO ONE WOULD GET ANY REWARDS BECAUSE Y’ALL BELIEVE NO ONE STOPS SINNING!

Oh the madness!

[lifelong sinner has me on ignore] it’s our little secret. LOL!!

Good points.

 

[theefaith]

So once the HS is in you, you are then incapable of sinning anymore?

No smart aleck. Just trying to construct a model in my mind of your doctrinal structure on this topic.

who is saved in this life?