Prayer dilemmas

[Taken]

So you must have established a good relationship with the Muslim.

That’s what happened in my case.

One day at work I overheard a conversation about religion between a Muslim co-worker and an agnostic co-worker. It didn’t end well for either of them. When the agnostic left the office I told the Muslim that I would like to talk with him sometime about the God of Abraham. His eyes lit up and he said, “You’re a Christian. Do you believe in the God of Abraham?” I replied that I do. He said, “But Christians are trinitarians.” I told him that I wasn’t a trinitarian. When he heard that, a huge smile burst on his face. He practically screamed, “Oh my God! I’ve been waiting my whole life to speak to someone like you. I have so many questions I want to ask you.” It was the beginning of a friendship.

One day I told him that I had heard that if a non-Muslim asked a Muslim for a copy of the Quran that the Muslim would give the non-Muslim a copy. I told him that I had never read it but would like to. He said it was true, and the next day or two, he gave me a copy, in English. I told him I was sure I would have questions after I read it and he was delighted to hear it.

It took me 5 days to read it from cover to cover. I saw him the day after I finished reading it and told him I had completed reading and had some questions. I remember him telling me how amassed he was, that he hadn’t expected me to finish it so quickly. We had many subsequent conversations about it and how it agreed with the Bible in some places and differed from it in others. He told me that he was praying for me. I thanked him and told him that I was praying for him. He thanked me.

Just a quick anecdote to round out the story.

One day I was speaking with him and one of his Muslim friends. Somehow the Quran was brought up and I casually mentioned that I had read it. My Muslim friend had a displeased look on his face; his friend looked surprised, but didn’t say anything about it.

After his friend left he told me never to say to a Muslim that I had read the Quran. I was surprised and asked him, why? He said that in Islam a person who hasn’t read the Quran in Arabic is like a person who hasn’t read the Quran at all. He was relieved that his friend hadn’t asked me about reading Arabic. If he had and I told him I didn’t read Arabic - which I don’t - then his friend would have mocked and ridiculed me. Just something to keep in mind if you ever read an English translation of the Quran and get into a conversation with a Muslim.

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.
I have shared the gospel with prisoners, to English speakers.
Didn’t come across Muslims, but am aware of a growing US native population in prisons becoming Muslims. Sparked my curiosity, about the “English version” thing, and just am not picturing them becoming fluent in Arabic. Just a passing note.

As far as the Muslim I was speaking of, he was a manager of a local shop I use to frequent. Began as a usual, how, why ending up in the US, differences in cultures, difficulties living in a foreign country, foods, education systems, governing authorities, etc. All interesting, then of course the Religious interest exchanges. Can’t even remember his name. We exchanged names, but always greeted and said goodby, as “my Christian friend”, “my Muslim friend”.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Matthias]

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.
I have shared the gospel with prisoners, to English speakers.
Didn’t come across Muslims, but am aware of a growing US native population in prisons becoming Muslims. Sparked my curiosity, about the “English version” thing, and just am not picturing them becoming fluent in Arabic. Just a passing note.

As far as the Muslim I was speaking of, he was a manager of a local shop I use to frequent. Began as a usual, how, why ending up in the US, differences in cultures, difficulties living in a foreign country, foods, education systems, governing authorities, etc. All interesting, then of course the Religious interest exchanges. Can’t even remember his name. We exchanged names, but always greeted and said goodby, as “my Christian friend”, “my Muslim friend”.

Glory to God,
Taken

Loved hearing your story. So much better to hear Muslim and Christian thinking about one another as friends rather than enemies. That’s not to downplay the major (and serious) differences but to focus instead on peacemaking. In the situation you describe, real dialogue is possible.

I was trying to think of an equivalent situation about reading the Bible in English but not really reading it since most of us don’t read the Bible in the original language. Scholars talk about the differences in translation styles, translator bias, cultural practices, idioms, figures of speech, manuscript variability and other issues that accompany and complicate accurate translation from one language to another.

We deal those things and, generally speaking, don’t assert that reading one translation or another vs. reading in the original languages is akin to not reading the Bible at all - but that’s not the way Muslims think. If you’ve spent much time speaking with Muslims you’ll know that this comes across as unreliability to them.

My friend would say that when “we” read the Quran in the original language (Arabic) that “we” are reading the true spirit of the Quran, that something of that true spirit is lost in translation to English and other languages. So, when I read it in English, he would say something like “that’s the general idea, but you’re missing so much of what is being said in Arabic.”

The closest I can come to that in regard to the Bible from our perspective is perhaps reading original biblical languages vs. reading an English paraphrase.

A paraphrase may give us the general idea, but we’re missing so much of what is being said in Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic with a paraphrase.

 

[Lambano]

What about the reverse situation? Has a non-Christian ever asked you if you would like he or she to pray for you? Has a non-Christian ever told you that he or she was praying for you? If so, what would you say to that person?

Interesting question. When my wife had breast cancer, the Muslim lady down the street offered to pray for her. My wife accepted gratefully. I took my wife aside afterwards and asked her, "Are you sure you about this?" She said something to the effect that she'd take any prayers she could get and let the God of Abraham sort 'em out.

As an aside, this Muslim lady and her husband operate a restaurant, and they also provided a few meals while my wife was recovering from her mastectomy. We accepted those gladly also.

 

[Lambano]

Firstly, should we pray for people even though they've said they don't want us to?

I'm not about to let anyone tell me I can't pray for them. :cool: I can be a cantankerous S.O.B. sometimes, and I think in that situation, I'd ask God to bless 'em just out of spite. Okay, maybe that's not the attitude God wants His children to have. God probably gets a good chuckle out of some of my prayers.

So should we pray "blind" for people or ask them to give us more details first so that we'll know exactly what they want us to pray for?

While it's not a bad idea to ask for details, but when I tell God how I think He should answer my prayers... well, God is sovereign, He knows the situation far better than I ever could, He does what He wants to do, and He does it right well. I recently had an answer to a prayer that was in a way I didn't expect, but it was wonderful. When I gratefully thanked Him, I mentioned that this wasn't the way I thought He should have done it, and we had a good laugh together.

Maybe what we're praying for is less important than the relationship?

 

[Enoch111]

Firstly, should we pray for people even though they've said they don't want us to?

Sure. The Bible says that we are to pray for all men.

So should we pray "blind" for people or ask them to give us more details first so that we'll know exactly what they want us to pray for?

No need to ask for details. God knows all the details, and He will sort it all out.

 

[Pearl]

I'd say to them "I'll pray for you but only to ask God to cure you of your perversion"..:)

I wouldn't tell them anything like that and just quietly pray much the same as Angelina posted.

I think being aggressive towards people we don't agree with or find unscriptural is more likely to put them off Christianity for good,

 

[Dropship]

If a gay or lesbian couple asked me to pray for the success of their same-sex "marriage" I'd say to them "I'll pray for you but only to ask God to cure you of your perversion"..:)

..I think being aggressive towards people we don't agree with or find unscriptural is more likely to put them off Christianity for good,

On the other hand shouldn't we Christians stand like rocks amid the tide of perversion sweeping the world?
Praying for such people would make us seem soft and look like we're condoning their actions.
There are enough soft wishy-washy pol-correct churchmen around, getting Christianity a bad name, so i'll speak out even if they won't..:)
"Pray also for me, that whenever I open my mouth, words may be given me so that I will fearlessly make known the mystery of the gospel, for which I am an ambassador in chains. Pray that I may declare it fearlessly, as I should" (Ephesians 6:19-20)
"Praise be to the Lord who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle" (Psalms 144:1)
Onward Christian soldiers..:)

 

[Pearl]

On the other hand shouldn't we Christians stand like rocks amid the tide of perversion sweeping the world?
Praying for such people would make us seem soft and look like we're condoning their actions.
There are enough soft wishy-washy pol-correct churchmen around, getting Christianity a bad name, so i'll speak out even if they won't.

You can pray for people privately without calling people perverted which I don't think is very kind.

 

[Dropship]

You can pray for people privately without calling people perverted which I don't think is very kind.

Our God is a tough, no-nonsense straight-talking God, and as Christians are his children, we naturally take after him..:)




God zaps Sodom / Gomorrah-
1- LOT- "Don't look back!"
2- WIFE- "Stop telling me what to do!"
3- Zap zap zap
4- oops

 

[Mink57]

Firstly, should we pray for people even though they've said they don't want us to?
For example, a few years ago a chap who ran a net gaming forum said he was having to close it down because his time was fully taken up by looking after his sick wife who needed a heart/lung transplant, so I asked him if he'd like us to pray for her.
"Thanks but no thanks" he replied, "she's got people looking after her"
So should we have prayed for her regardless, even though he didn't want us to?

If I hear or see someone's dilemma, and I don't know if they're a believer, I won't ask them if they want me to pray for them. I simply do it. Silently. Adding the words, "Thy Will Be Done."

Secondly, a lady once came into a religious forum and asked us to pray that the marriage of her and her partner would be a success, so of course forum members said "Yes".
But she later admitted it was a lesbian relationship and she was amused at having suckered us into praying for them.
So should we pray "blind" for people or ask them to give us more details first so that we'll know exactly what they want us to pray for?

In both cases, when I pray, I add the words, "Thy Will Be Done" to whatever I'm asking for.

After all, didn't Jesus teach us to pray like that? Didn't he ask the Father to 'remove this cup from him', but ONLY if it was Father's Will to do so?

Shouldn't we pray the same way?

 

[Dropship]

If I hear or see someone's dilemma, and I don't know if they're a believer, I won't ask them if they want me to pray for them. I simply do it. Silently. Adding the words, "Thy Will Be Done."..

On the other hand we can simply wash our hands of them-
Jesus said “Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead” (Matthew 8:22)

 

[farouk]

"Thy Will Be Done."

@Mink57 These are words in the prayer the Lord Jesus taught His disciples.

 

[Mink57]

@Mink57 These are words in the prayer the Lord Jesus taught His disciples.

Jesus used those same words when he prayed in the Garden.

On the other hand we can simply wash our hands of them-
Jesus said “Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead” (Matthew 8:22)

Sure. We always have that option.

Wouldn't be very "Christian" though, would it?

 

[Dropship]

On the other hand we can simply wash our hands of them-
Jesus said “Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead” (Matthew 8:22)

Sure. We always have that option.
Wouldn't be very "Christian" though, would it?

You'd better argue it out with Jesus when you meet him..:)

 

[CadyandZoe]

Firstly, should we pray for people even though they've said they don't want us to?
For example, a few years ago a chap who ran a net gaming forum said he was having to close it down because his time was fully taken up by looking after his sick wife who needed a heart/lung transplant, so I asked him if he'd like us to pray for her.
"Thanks but no thanks" he replied, "she's got people looking after her"
So should we have prayed for her regardless, even though he didn't want us to?

Secondly, a lady once came into a religious forum and asked us to pray that the marriage of her and her partner would be a success, so of course forum members said "Yes".
But she later admitted it was a lesbian relationship and she was amused at having suckered us into praying for them.
So should we pray "blind" for people or ask them to give us more details first so that we'll know exactly what they want us to pray for?

We should always bring our concerns to our heavenly father, regardless of whether someone wants prayer or not. If someone says "no" then do it anyway, since that person is on YOUR heart, and since prayer is one of the ways we give expression to righteous sentiments.

 

[Angelina]

@Mink57

If I hear or see someone's dilemma, and I don't know if they're a believer, I won't ask them if they want me to pray for them. I simply do it. Silently. Adding the words, "Thy Will Be Done."

same as :)

 

[Pearl]

Our God is a tough, no-nonsense straight-talking God, and as Christians are his children, we naturally take after him

He is also kind compassionate and merciful and I would never call somebody a pervert to their face. No wonder people who need Jesus are put off by Christians.

 

[Mink57]

You'd better argue it out with Jesus when you meet him..:)

What do you think Jesus would say? "Mink! You shouldn't have prayed for that SINNER!"

Apparently, *MY* God's a bit more forgiving than yours...

@Mink57 same as :)

Exactly!

 

[Dropship]

He is also kind compassionate and merciful and I would never call somebody a pervert to their face. No wonder people who need Jesus are put off by Christians.

Wishy-washy hand-wringing wimpy christians are more like to put them off, rather than a straight-talking Christian who doesn't pull his/her punches..:)

 

[dhh712]

Firstly, should we pray for people even though they've said they don't want us to?
For example, a few years ago a chap who ran a net gaming forum said he was having to close it down because his time was fully taken up by looking after his sick wife who needed a heart/lung transplant, so I asked him if he'd like us to pray for her.
"Thanks but no thanks" he replied, "she's got people looking after her"
So should we have prayed for her regardless, even though he didn't want us to?

Secondly, a lady once came into a religious forum and asked us to pray that the marriage of her and her partner would be a success, so of course forum members said "Yes".
But she later admitted it was a lesbian relationship and she was amused at having suckered us into praying for them.
So should we pray "blind" for people or ask them to give us more details first so that we'll know exactly what they want us to pray for?

For the first, I would just pray that the family would come to know the Lord. The second, it is okay to pray without knowing the details. Since it was a sinful practice that the lesbian woman was engaging in, God will not bless their union. He would understand that we may not know the full details of something. Yet, I think it is a great idea to ask for details about someone's prayer request; that way, you can know more specifically how to pray for them and also may discover a request to pray against God's will as this woman was asking Christians to do.