. . . That Jesus Christ is LORD . . .

[marks]

Isaiah 45:21-24 KJV
21) Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
22) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
23) I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
24) Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.

Considering what Isaiah wrote, Why would Paul say this?

Philippians 2:9-11 KJV
9) Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10) That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11) And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

If Jesus were not in fact YHWH, wasn't Paul risking a major misunderstanding, bordering on blasphemy?

Unto YHWH, unto Jesus, every knee will bow, and every tongue confess . . .

Much love!

 

[face2face]

Isaiah 45:21-24 KJV
21) Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
22) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
23) I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
24) Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.

Considering what Isaiah wrote, Why would Paul say this?

Philippians 2:9-11 KJV
9) Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10) That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11) And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

If Jesus were not in fact YHWH, wasn't Paul risking a major misunderstanding, bordering on blasphemy?

Unto YHWH, unto Jesus, every knee will bow, and every tongue confess . . .

Much love!

Part 1

Not at all!

What is God's objective with mankind?

Allow me to summarize what Scripture teaches me about His purpose with us all.

It's all in His Name.

Yahweh or Yah, as a noun, and signifying “He who will be,” is the memorial name the Deity chooses to be known by among his people. It reminds them that He will be manifested in a multitude; and that, in that great multitude which no man can number, of all nations and kindreds, and people, and tongues, which shall stand before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands (Revelation 7:9) in each and every one of them “He will be the all things in all” 1 Corinthians 15:28; or, as it is expressed in Ephsians 4:6, “there is one Deity and Father of all, who is upon all, and through all, and in you all.”

Now of all Yahwehs Children only one manifested (made known) His Character perfectly though suffered greatly in doing so.

The question I have for you Marks is this; if a Son with the help of His Father is able to obey Him in all things, even die a gruesome death on the cross, what would that Father be willing to reward that Son for doing so?

A Son who becomes a servant?

If your answer was Philippians 2:9-11 you would be right...however and sadly there must be a however, if you felt God wasn't able to do this in a Son and could only manufacture that type of obedience via a god-man (Himself), then what value is there highly exalting a Son, if he was always and already exalted?

You must go back to God's original plan and discover what his purpose was in calling a people out of the earth for His name Romans 1:5; Acts of the Apostles 15:14 and so on...

Whatever Jesus is...he is the firstborn; first begotten; firstfruits of all of us - he represents us in every respect, being those who desire to make known the Character of God which is His Name "I will be whom I will be" or "I will be known in Whom I will be known"

Part 2

His Word would always return to Him void if He endeavored to find a savoir born of earthly parents - His Word mixed with the line of men produced a man; born of a woman with a nature like ours, but with a mind like His Fathers, able to receive spiritual things and perceive wisdom much quicker than any before him. Isaiah 11:3; Isaiah 50:4-7

Finally,

Blasphemy is the opposite of what Paul was teaching concerning Jesus' exalted position. Jesus was a son who emptied himself of all privileges and became a servant.

Philippians 2:9 cmp Isaiah 52:13
Philippians 2:10 cmp Isaiah 45:23
Philippians 2:27 cmp 2 Kings 20:1

I reckon Paul's mind was in the time of Hezekiah and wanted to show the B&S that finally the fulfillment of 2 Kings 18:5 was finally here.

So Jesus is given a position above all others. Isaiah 11:1 says, "A shoot will come up from the stump of Jesse; from his roots a branch will bear fruit." And Philippians 2:9 says that "God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow."

Jesus to this day owes his existence to God his Father, but also to those he came from as per Romans 15:12 & Revelation 22:16; Isaiah 11:1 etc.

Of all mankind he was fruitful; all others are likened to a dried up tree.

Hope that helps

F2F

Note: "to the Glory of God the Father..." isn't that the fulfillment of Yahweh's name?

 

[marks]

If your answer was Philippians 2:9-11 you would be right...however and sadly there must be a however, if you felt God wasn't able to do this in a Son and could only manufacture that type of obedience via a god-man (Himself), then what value is there highly exalting a Son, if he was always and already exalted?

Wasn't able, that's not part of this equation.

Either this is what the Bible says He did, or it's not. If the Bible says God did such and such, it's secondary to ask if that were the only way, or that there could be other ways. We have the Bible to tell us the way He did what He's done.

The question I have for you Marks is this; if a Son with the help of His Father is able to obey Him in all things, even die a gruesome death on the cross, what would that Father be willing to reward that Son for doing so?

We have the passage at hand to tell us the circumstances, and the Father's response. It's all clearly laid out right there.

Jesus Christ emptied Himself, and took on the form of a servant, and the Sovereign of all creation became obedient, even to that death. Therefore God had exalted Him, it's all in the OP.

Whether all this seems right or logical or whatever, to me this is incidental towards whether this is what God is teaching us. First we learn His Word, and as we do His Spirit gives us the understanding.

Much love!

 

[Michiah-Imla]

The Holy Bible does not tell us anywhere that Jesus is God.

Don’t be so zealous over such an ambiguous issue.

Putting sin to death is more important.

“Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.” (Hebrews 12:1-2)

 

[Michiah-Imla]

“…ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant…” (Hebrews 12:22-24)

Two individual different persons…

If the trinity were true the writers had plenty of opportunity to flesh it out in their inspired writings.

 

[marks]

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;

This is the question being answered. Unto whom are we looking? A man? Our Creator?

The Author and Finisher of our faith.

Much love!

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Unto whom are we looking? A man? Our Creator?

The One who is…

set down at the right hand of the throne of God.” (Hebrews 12:1-2)

 

[face2face]

Wasn't able, that's not part of this equation.

Either this is what the Bible says He did, or it's not. If the Bible says God did such and such, it's secondary to ask if that were the only way, or that there could be other ways. We have the Bible to tell us the way He did what He's done.

Sorry, are you suggesting a perfect sacrifice could have come from two earthly parents?

The intervention was such that God could be in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, 1000's of year of history and even the very best quality of men such as Abraham and David showed a bais to sin was inevitable. A Son of God who was also the Son of Man was required...it did not require a god to do this Marks...it require a man by whom God could strengthen to overcome sin's flesh.

F2F

 

[Enoch111]

The Holy Bible does not tell us anywhere that Jesus is God.

You have either (1) not read the Holy Bible, (2) failed to read it properly, or (3) even after seeing many passages which say that Jesus is God, you have chosen to become an "antichrist" -- one who denies that Jesus is the Christ. That God became the Man Christ Jesus in order to die for our sins. First John 2 tells us about the antichrists, those who deny both the Father and the Son. Therefore they do not possess them. Therefore they are lost.

 

[marks]

Sorry, are you suggesting a perfect sacrifice could have come from two earthly parents?

No, I'm not suggesting that. I'm not sure why you are asking me that.

Much love!

 

[face2face]

No, I'm not suggesting that. I'm not sure why you are asking me that.

Much love!

So maybe you can explain as you bolded the text and then said "that's not part of the equation"

When it clearly is.

If God was able to raise up a man in perfect obedience from two human parents He would have!

What did He do instead?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

many passages which say that Jesus is God

Zero passages say that Jesus is God.

The fact that you didn’t quote any passages is evidence of this fact.

you have chosen to become an "antichrist" -- one who denies that Jesus is the Christ.

I don’t deny that Jesus is the Christ.

You shouldn’t slander people.

That God became the Man Christ Jesus in order to die for our sins.

Passage please.

First John 2 tells us about the antichrists, those who deny both the Father and the Son

I haven’t denied the Father nor the Son.

More slander.

 

[BeyondET]

What is the image and likeness of God, why couldn't God be in that image and likeness.

 

[face2face]

What is the image and likeness of God, why couldn't God be in that image and likeness.

That's an interesting question.
Clearly the Bible reveals we look like the Elohim and I doubt God is confined to a certain form due to Him being All Powerful.

 

[BeyondET]

That's an interesting question.
Clearly the Bible reveals we look like the Elohim and I doubt God is confined to a certain form due to Him being All Powerful.

And all knowing alpha and omega, wonder what was the reason for creating man in His own image and likeness, considering He can create anything in any image or likeness.

 

[face2face]

And all knowing alpha and omega, wonder what was the reason for creating man in His own image and likeness, considering He can create anything in any image or likeness.

True...but you still need to deal with the angels involvement in Genesis 1-3.
Flesh and blood cannot stand in Gods presence therefore all the activities in Gen 1-3 are angelic.
You need to accept that first.
F2F

 

[marks]

The question I have for you Marks is this; if a Son with the help of His Father is able to obey Him in all things, even die a gruesome death on the cross, what would that Father be willing to reward that Son for doing so?

A Son who becomes a servant?

If your answer was Philippians 2:9-11 you would be right...however and sadly there must be a however, if you felt God wasn't able to do this in a Son and could only manufacture that type of obedience via a god-man (Himself), then what value is there highly exalting a Son, if he was always and already exalted?

So maybe you can explain as you bolded the text and then said "that's not part of the equation"
When it clearly is.
If God was able to raise up a man in perfect obedience from two human parents He would have!
What did He do instead?

You had asked, What would the Father reward that Son?

Then you supplied an hypothetical answer, "If you felt God wasn't able to do this in a Son . . ."

And I'm answering, that's neither here nor there, whatever you or I or someone elst felt that God was or wasn't able to do any particular thing, that has no bearing on whether or not God actually could or might or has done such a thing. And has no bearing on whether or not such is in fact revealed in the Word. As they say . . . facts don't care about feelings.

Much love!

 

[face2face]

You had asked, What would the Father reward that Son?

Then you supplied an hypothetical answer, "If you felt God wasn't able to do this in a Son . . ."

And I'm answering, that's neither here nor there, whatever you or I or someone elst felt that God was or wasn't able to do any particular thing, that has no bearing on whether or not God actually could or might or has done such a thing. And has no bearing on whether or not such is in fact revealed in the Word. As they say . . . facts don't care about feelings.

Much love!

Replace "felt" with "thought" if that's an issue for you!

Point remains the same.

 

[BeyondET]

True...but you still need to deal with the angels involvement in Genesis 1-3.
Flesh and blood cannot stand in Gods presence therefore all the activities in Gen 1-3 are angelic.
You need to accept that first.
F2F

Like the serving lights in the expanse.

 

[Enoch111]

I don’t deny that Jesus is the Christ.

When you deny that Jesus is God, you actually deny that Jesus is the Christ. Only the God-Man Jesus of Nazareth could take away our sins. And because He finished the work of redemption, God the Father has declared Him to be BOTH Lord and Christ.