The Godly Heresy of Sinless Perfectionism
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RLT63
Well-Known Member
Anticipated? The grammar only implies a possibility. Anticipated doesn’t fit the context. Especially after counseling not to.
RLT63
Well-Known Member
A remedy was provided so it must have been an expectation. Weren’t there sin offerings in Old Testament times? It seems it has always been an expectation .
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Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
To all:
John says to ”sin not.” (1 John 2:1). Jesus says to ”sin no more” (John 5:14) (John 8:11). It’s not possible to ”sin NOT” or “sin NO MORE” as instructed in God’s Word if the Bible did not teach such truths. Sure, there is grace if one stumbles (Psalms 51), and or even struggles with sin seeking to overcome it (Parable of the Prodigal Son and James 5:19-20), but there is no grace for those who believe they must sin again (as a part of being a slave to sin in this life) with the thinking they are saved.
The Bible makes it clear that we are to overcome sin in this life (See again 1 Peter 4:1-2, 2 Corinthians 7:1, and Galatians 5:24).
The Bible clearly warns against a group of believers in whom Jesus did not know because they worked lawlessness or iniquity (Matthew 7:22-23) (Luke 13:27). We are told to STRIVE to enter the straight gate (Luke 13:24). This narrow way or straight gate again is in context to believers because these types said…
#1. “Lord, Lord, open unto us;” (Calling Jesus Lord - indicating they are a believer in Jesus).
#2. ”We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.” (Indicating they were in the company of Jesus and thought they were in favor with Him).
Sin is what kept them out. Paul even says, “Be not deceived:” (1 Corinthians 6:9).
What could the believers in Corinth be deceived about?
Paul says, “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?” (1 Corinthians 6:9).
Paul continues: “Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.” (1 Corinthians 6:9-11).
So Paul is saying if we are still partaking of these kinds of sins after we have been saved, we will not inherit the Kingdom of God.
Meaning, we will not be saved. This applies to me, you, and everyone else on the planet. I could not make it into the Kingdom if don’t die in a righteous state of living holy. The only escape is by Jesus Christ and that is by seeking forgiveness with Him (1 John 1:9) (1 John 2:1), and in being sanctified by the washing of the water of the Word so that Christ might present to Himself a church that is holy and without blemish (Ephesians 5:25-27).
But Christians today want to justify sin. This is due to the falling away. A falling away from God’s Word.
Textual Criticism was something that was in smaller numbers before the 1970’s. Generally liberals and heretics used something else besides the King James Bible. Before Modern Textual Criticism fully took hold of the church in great numbers with the coming out of the NIV in the 1970’s, many believers in the English speaking world just believed their Bible in English (KJB) as the very words of God.
King James Bible believers in history:
The General Baptists of England published the "Orthodox Creed" In 1678. It says, "And by the holy Scriptures we understand the canonical books of the Old and New Testament, AS THEY ARE NOW TRANSLATED INTO OUR ENGLISH MOTHER TONGUE, of which there hath NEVER been any doubt of their verity, and authority, in the protestant churches of Christ to this day." They then list the books of the Old and New Testament and then say, "All which are given by the inspiration of God, to be the Rule of faith and life."
Taken from the Association of Baptists 25th meeting 1830
We the church of Jesus Christ being regularly baptised upon the profession of our faith in Christ are convinced the concessive of associate churches. WE BELIEVE THAT THE SCRIPTURES OF THE OLD AND THE NEW TESTAMENTS AS TRANSLATED BY THE AUTHORITY OF KING JAMES TO BE THE WORDS OF GOD AND IS THE ONLY TRUE RULE OF FAITH AND PRACTICE.
1857: “The general excellence of the English Version being admitted, ITS PERFECTION ASSUMED, AND THEREFORE ALL PRECEDING AND SUBSEQUENT VERSIONS MUST BE UNWORTHY OF NOTICE; nay, even the original text need not be consulted...” (Thomas Kingsmill Abbott, The English Bible, and Our Duty with Regard to It, 1857; 1871).
1882: “I unhesitatingly say, that the same Holy Ghost who gave inspiration to the Apostles to write out the New Testament, presided over and inspired those men in the translation and bringing out of the entire Bible in the English language. And I also say, that no version since, brought out in the English language, has the Divine sanction...Now, why would God cause at this age and in these trying times, versions in the same language to be brought out, to conflict...?...He would not...I FURTHERMORE SAY, THAT THE KING JAMES' TRANSLATION OF THE BIBLE IS THE ONLY DIVINELY INSPIRED...” (William Washington Simkins, The English Version of the New Testament, Compared with King James' Translation, 1882).
There are more with citations of things like this you can discover at the following source link.
Source:
KJB believers in history - BrandPlucked (Will Kinney)
Over the years, I had Christians tell me that I worship the KJB because I believe it is the perfect Word of God and or because I revere it to be the very words of God.
Psalms 119:140 says:
”Thy word is very pure: therefore thy servant loveth it.”
Loving God’s Word today has led others to say that I am into idolatry. But idolatry is bowing down to an object as if it was the entirety of God Himself. The Bible is merely the thoughts and or the mind of God in His desiring us to have faith in Him and to follow His will by faith (and not our own will like trying to defend sin by using 1 John 1:8, and Romans 7:14-24 out of context). Anyone can rip a verse or passage out of context to the chapter or the surrounding chapters.
We also have to realize we are in the last days. I believe the falling away spoken of by the apostle Paul has happened. Many in the church no longer believe in a perfect Bible as their final authority. Even those who do believe in a perfect Bible believe they can sin and still be saved. Times have truly gotten darker. Just as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be at the coming of the Son of Man. I believe we are nearing that day closer and closer. For could it be that the Antichrist could be among us today?
Check out this video here:
If so, get yourself ready with the LORD while there is still time. Don’t play games with your soul and justify sin and say how you must sin again as per a wrong interpretation on 1 John 1:8, and Romans 7:14-24 by the church at large. Jesus said narrow is the way that leads unto life and FEW be there that find it. Luke 13 makes this narrow way or straight gate out to be amongst the sphere of Christianity. Do not be deceived. The unrighteous will not inherit the kIngdom of God. Don’t justify sin like many believers today do. They are not going to make it into the Kingdom of God if they do so. They will be shocked at the Judgment that they were wrong for need heeding the Word of God with their defense of sin.
John says to ”sin not.” (1 John 2:1). Jesus says to ”sin no more” (John 5:14) (John 8:11). It’s not possible to ”sin NOT” or “sin NO MORE” as instructed in God’s Word if the Bible did not teach such truths. Sure, there is grace if one stumbles (Psalms 51), and or even struggles with sin seeking to overcome it (Parable of the Prodigal Son and James 5:19-20), but there is no grace for those who believe they must sin again (as a part of being a slave to sin in this life) with the thinking they are saved.
The Bible makes it clear that we are to overcome sin in this life (See again 1 Peter 4:1-2, 2 Corinthians 7:1, and Galatians 5:24).
The Bible clearly warns against a group of believers in whom Jesus did not know because they worked lawlessness or iniquity (Matthew 7:22-23) (Luke 13:27). We are told to STRIVE to enter the straight gate (Luke 13:24). This narrow way or straight gate again is in context to believers because these types said…
#1. “Lord, Lord, open unto us;” (Calling Jesus Lord - indicating they are a believer in Jesus).
#2. ”We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.” (Indicating they were in the company of Jesus and thought they were in favor with Him).
Sin is what kept them out. Paul even says, “Be not deceived:” (1 Corinthians 6:9).
What could the believers in Corinth be deceived about?
Paul says, “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?” (1 Corinthians 6:9).
Paul continues: “Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.” (1 Corinthians 6:9-11).
So Paul is saying if we are still partaking of these kinds of sins after we have been saved, we will not inherit the Kingdom of God.
Meaning, we will not be saved. This applies to me, you, and everyone else on the planet. I could not make it into the Kingdom if don’t die in a righteous state of living holy. The only escape is by Jesus Christ and that is by seeking forgiveness with Him (1 John 1:9) (1 John 2:1), and in being sanctified by the washing of the water of the Word so that Christ might present to Himself a church that is holy and without blemish (Ephesians 5:25-27).
But Christians today want to justify sin. This is due to the falling away. A falling away from God’s Word.
Textual Criticism was something that was in smaller numbers before the 1970’s. Generally liberals and heretics used something else besides the King James Bible. Before Modern Textual Criticism fully took hold of the church in great numbers with the coming out of the NIV in the 1970’s, many believers in the English speaking world just believed their Bible in English (KJB) as the very words of God.
King James Bible believers in history:
The General Baptists of England published the "Orthodox Creed" In 1678. It says, "And by the holy Scriptures we understand the canonical books of the Old and New Testament, AS THEY ARE NOW TRANSLATED INTO OUR ENGLISH MOTHER TONGUE, of which there hath NEVER been any doubt of their verity, and authority, in the protestant churches of Christ to this day." They then list the books of the Old and New Testament and then say, "All which are given by the inspiration of God, to be the Rule of faith and life."
Taken from the Association of Baptists 25th meeting 1830
We the church of Jesus Christ being regularly baptised upon the profession of our faith in Christ are convinced the concessive of associate churches. WE BELIEVE THAT THE SCRIPTURES OF THE OLD AND THE NEW TESTAMENTS AS TRANSLATED BY THE AUTHORITY OF KING JAMES TO BE THE WORDS OF GOD AND IS THE ONLY TRUE RULE OF FAITH AND PRACTICE.
1857: “The general excellence of the English Version being admitted, ITS PERFECTION ASSUMED, AND THEREFORE ALL PRECEDING AND SUBSEQUENT VERSIONS MUST BE UNWORTHY OF NOTICE; nay, even the original text need not be consulted...” (Thomas Kingsmill Abbott, The English Bible, and Our Duty with Regard to It, 1857; 1871).
1882: “I unhesitatingly say, that the same Holy Ghost who gave inspiration to the Apostles to write out the New Testament, presided over and inspired those men in the translation and bringing out of the entire Bible in the English language. And I also say, that no version since, brought out in the English language, has the Divine sanction...Now, why would God cause at this age and in these trying times, versions in the same language to be brought out, to conflict...?...He would not...I FURTHERMORE SAY, THAT THE KING JAMES' TRANSLATION OF THE BIBLE IS THE ONLY DIVINELY INSPIRED...” (William Washington Simkins, The English Version of the New Testament, Compared with King James' Translation, 1882).
There are more with citations of things like this you can discover at the following source link.
Source:
KJB believers in history - BrandPlucked (Will Kinney)
Over the years, I had Christians tell me that I worship the KJB because I believe it is the perfect Word of God and or because I revere it to be the very words of God.
Psalms 119:140 says:
”Thy word is very pure: therefore thy servant loveth it.”
Loving God’s Word today has led others to say that I am into idolatry. But idolatry is bowing down to an object as if it was the entirety of God Himself. The Bible is merely the thoughts and or the mind of God in His desiring us to have faith in Him and to follow His will by faith (and not our own will like trying to defend sin by using 1 John 1:8, and Romans 7:14-24 out of context). Anyone can rip a verse or passage out of context to the chapter or the surrounding chapters.
We also have to realize we are in the last days. I believe the falling away spoken of by the apostle Paul has happened. Many in the church no longer believe in a perfect Bible as their final authority. Even those who do believe in a perfect Bible believe they can sin and still be saved. Times have truly gotten darker. Just as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be at the coming of the Son of Man. I believe we are nearing that day closer and closer. For could it be that the Antichrist could be among us today?
Check out this video here:
If so, get yourself ready with the LORD while there is still time. Don’t play games with your soul and justify sin and say how you must sin again as per a wrong interpretation on 1 John 1:8, and Romans 7:14-24 by the church at large. Jesus said narrow is the way that leads unto life and FEW be there that find it. Luke 13 makes this narrow way or straight gate out to be amongst the sphere of Christianity. Do not be deceived. The unrighteous will not inherit the kIngdom of God. Don’t justify sin like many believers today do. They are not going to make it into the Kingdom of God if they do so. They will be shocked at the Judgment that they were wrong for need heeding the Word of God with their defense of sin.
Last edited:
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
If you don’t have a perfect Bible then how do you know you have the correct doctrines?
Modern Translations actually change doctrine for the worse and not for the better.
That makes no sense. The bible you believe that is perfect - is the AKJV, correct? So why is it that even people who agree with you about its PERFECTION all have differing views/doctrines?
When Christians make that assertion, it opens up a can of worms they cannot close. It doesn't take an Atheist to wipe the floor with that outrageous claim. There's no such thing as a perfect translation.
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
First, you didn’t answer my question.
Second, I cannot force you to see the truth and I imagine it is just as silly in your mind to believe God has preserved His Word today in a 1600’s English Bible. I imagine you think it is preposterous. But think. How many people today do you think the resurrection is just as equally preposterous.
Three, start reading in my post #820 on after. It will hopefully help explain to you where I am coming from.
I did answer the question, "If you don’t have a perfect Bible then how do you know you have the correct doctrines?"
You just didn't like the answer that there's so much disagreement among people who believe in a perfect bible that that alone proves there's no such thing.
I'm not going to spoon-feed the reasons why there isn't a perfect translation - you should already know.
People like you who claim a translation is error free and claims they have the truth makes a fool out of Christianity.
You want me to debunk your perfect bible? Or should I let an Atheist do it?
Even IF we did have an error free bible - the Protestants would still disagree on a zillion things.
RLT63
Well-Known Member
Why did he pick the 1600s? Why didn’t we have a perfect Bible before then? Why weren’t the original manuscripts saved forever so there would be no confusion, no question?
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
It really is not a true answer to solving the problem. How do you know you have correct doctrines without a perfect Bible? Your response would be like saying the answer to 2 + 2 = 5. It’s a response but it is not a true answer or solution. Your response is illogical and an evasion of the truth.
That is highly illogical. For example: There is a lot of disagreement over biblical Christianity. That does not invalidate it. So your point here is flawed. It’s not a real answer that solves the problem of the question.
I am not new to this kind of discussion. I have been discussing it with other believers for 11 years. There are many things on the Bible issue here that you are simply not aware of. If you only knew what I did, you would not believe the way you currently do.
How long have you been a Christian? To say that an atheist can defend a certain aspect of the Bible is ignorance. Atheists have no spiritual understanding to even understand God’s Word let alone are they able to show a truth that you think defends your viewpoint on the Bible.
Right. I agree with you on this. I am not a fan of Protestantism, either. I just believe the Bible alone + the Anointing to Understand It.
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Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
There is a symbiotic relationship between the Living Word (Jesus) and the Communicated Word (the Scriptures or the Holy Bible).
Here are 41 verses:
The Living Word & the Communicated Word.
The Symbiotic Relationship Between The Living Word, & the Communicated Word: Christ is good (John 10:11, John 10:14), and the word is good (1 Kings 2:42). Christ is the truth (John 14:6), and the word is the truth (John 17:17). Christ is called Faithful and True (Revelation 19:11), and...
www.christianforums.com
So if it took approximately 4,000 years for the Word to be made flesh and to be present among us humans (Since Adam was created on day six) then why cannot it take appx. 2,000 years for the Communicated Word (the Holy Bible) to arrive for the common man or for the Communicated Word to arrive so that many can have access to it?
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RLT63
Well-Known Member
I have to give it to you, you worked YEC in there with sinless perfection and King James Only. Not that I believe the earth is 4.5 billion years old but 6,000 years seems a little short.There is a symbiotic relationship between the Living Word (Jesus) and the Communicated Word (the Scriptures or the Holy Bible).
Here are 41 verses:
The Living Word & the Communicated Word.
The Symbiotic Relationship Between The Living Word, & the Communicated Word: Christ is good (John 10:11, John 10:14), and the word is good (1 Kings 2:42). Christ is the truth (John 14:6), and the word is the truth (John 17:17). Christ is called Faithful and True (Revelation 19:11), and...
So if it took approximately 4,000 years for the Word to be made flesh and to be present among us humans (Since Adam was created on day six) then why cannot it take appx. 2,000 years for the Communicated Word (the Holy Bible) to arrive for the common man or for the Communicated Word to arrive so that many can have access to it?
RLT63
Well-Known Member
bbyrd009
Groper
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the problem with the link being that they also believe Bible = Word, when the Bible Itself makes plain that they are not the same...There is a symbiotic relationship between the Living Word (Jesus) and the Communicated Word (the Scriptures or the Holy Bible).
Here are 41 verses:
The Living Word & the Communicated Word.
The Symbiotic Relationship Between The Living Word, & the Communicated Word: Christ is good (John 10:11, John 10:14), and the word is good (1 Kings 2:42). Christ is the truth (John 14:6), and the word is the truth (John 17:17). Christ is called Faithful and True (Revelation 19:11), and...
So if it took approximately 4,000 years for the Word to be made flesh and to be present among us humans (Since Adam was created on day six) then why cannot it take appx. 2,000 years for the Communicated Word (the Holy Bible) to arrive for the common man or for the Communicated Word to arrive so that many can have access to it?
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
Young-Earth Creationist View Summarized And Defended
There is a great amount of controversy in the church today regarding evolution and the age of the earth. Many competing views attract the attention of Christians producing great confusion and leading
answersingenesis.org
What does Scripture Mean About Perfection?
The Scriptures Teaching on Sinless Perfectionism: Sinless Perfectionism is the goal of our Sanctification. It is yet another Biblical doctrine that is commonly misunderstood and or denied amongst Eternal Security Proponents or those who do not believe that “Sin Cannot Separate a Believer From...
www.christianforums.com
30 Reasons why the KJV is the Divine and Pure Word of God for Today (Update: KJVO Posters Only)
30 Reasons Why the KJV is the Divine and Pure Word of God for Today: Updated Thread Rule: I created a new thread rule so as to stop the heated discussion and the personal attacks. I know Anti-KJV Only Proponents have already posted here for about 30 pages since the creation of this thread...
www.christianforums.com
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
Not true. Man shall not live by bread alone but by every word of God.
Matthew 4:4 is not talking about multiple versions of Jesus.
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
If he is Catholic that makes sense he is against the KJB.
Here is one of the Catholic books. Notice which version they don’t want you to read.
bbyrd009
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