WHAT IS THE WATER IN JOHN 3:5?

[David in NJ]

My 50 years as a Protestant taught me that but I no longer believe it.

That is ok

i was taught many things growing up RCC that i now reject because the LIGHT of JESUS and the Holy Scriptures shine thru

Forget all that you were taught and pray to JESUS to be baptized in the Holy Spirit and then read again the Holy Scriptures

John 14:15-18
“If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

 

[Hepzibah]

That is ok

i was taught many things growing up RCC that i now reject because the LIGHT of JESUS and the Holy Scriptures shine thru

Forget all that you were taught and pray to JESUS to be baptized in the Holy Spirit and then read again the Holy Scriptures

John 14:15-18
“If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

I was baptized in the Holy Spirit 35 years ago ie made holy, after coming to Christ 17 years earlier, but it took quite some time for the Lord to teach me as much as I know now, directly. After the baptism, He taught me solidly for three days, but as I said, I slowly gained spiritual understanding regarding certain scriptures since and this issue is the latest.

 

[David in NJ]

I was baptized in the Holy Spirit 35 years ago ie made holy, after coming to Christ 17 years earlier, but it took quite some time for the Lord to teach me as much as I know now, directly. After the baptism, He taught me solidly for three days, but as I said, I slowly gained spiritual understanding regarding certain scriptures since and this issue is the latest.

SEE how i REJOICE in your post here = thank you for sharing

 

[Hiddenthings]

Whereas here to the contrary speaking of this woman it says,

Rev 18:5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

When you say, No more sea = No more nations in Rev 21:1 might be a little difficult for me to catch because a few verses down from there it continues

Rev 21:24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

See what I mean?

Interesting, you answered Rev 21:1 with 21:24

How are there no more nations (sea)?

The Word of God has a way of doing this for us...

If the nations are now saved, they no longer nations!

 

[Hiddenthings]

Bummer response. Sowing division and hatred is not what the Bible teaches us to do.

I find it very revealing that the image posted has to 'correct' the verse for us... lol.

Sometimes a woman in the Bible is a woman.

It's often the obvious which escapes us!

Rome always claims to be the "Mother Church," recognising as her rather disobedient daughters, the State churches of the world. The
Tridentine Council described the papacy in such terms, stating: "The Roman Church is the Mother and Mistress of all churches." Her harlot daughters have been brought to the birth by her adulterous union with the "kings of the earth." The establishing of the Church of
England is a case in point. Originally, it was Roman Catholic, but because Rome refused the request of King Henry VIII for a divorce, he set up the Church of England as distinct from that of Rome, and refused to acknowledge the authority of the Pope. All State Protestant
Churches teach the basic doctrines of Rome in greater or lesser degree; whilst many of the ceremonies and beliefs of the mother church can be traced back to pagan Babylon.

And yes, a mother is a woman!

 

[Hiddenthings]

Sowing division and hatred is not what the Bible teaches us to do.

You inferred hatred...did you notice that? The division comes as a result of the negative influence the RCC has had on Christianity worldwide.

If you share in her doctrines, you might want to enquire their origin.

They are not found in the Holy Writ.

 

[Exegesis]

It's often the obvious which escapes us!

A good example is how it is physically impossible for a person to sit on more than one mountain at a time. Common sense.

Just as an FYI...

Mountains are symbolic of something rather important that has nothing to do with the Papacy or Rome or whatever.

It is euphemism. Moses went to the top of one to retrieve the Word of God... the Seed... and bring it to the bride waiting at the bottom.

Water flows from the head. What does a harlot do?

 

[Exegesis]

You inferred hatred...did you notice that? The division comes as a result of the negative influence the RCC has had on Christianity worldwide.

If you share in her doctrines, you might want to enquire their origin.

They are not found in the Holy Writ.

As a former Catholic, I understand a great deal. We have bigger problems to deal with though.

Remember, John *admired* her...

ADMIRA'TION, n. Wonder mingled with pleasing emotions, as approbation, esteem, love or veneration;

Did it ever occur to you that the Harlot is redeemed in the end? Moreover, she becomes God's bride...

Revelation 19:7-8 "Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready. And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints."

She becomes your new mom in Heaven...

Galatians 4:26 "But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all."

John loved her.

You can't have a New Jerusalem without and Old Jerusalem, right?

God is Love. Salvation comes in many forms.

 

[Hiddenthings]

A good example is how it is physically impossible for a person to sit on more than one mountain at a time. Common sense.

Just as an FYI...

Mountains are symbolic of something rather important that has nothing to do with the Papacy or Rome or whatever.

It is euphemism. Moses went to the top of one to retrieve the Word of God... the Seed... and bring it to the bride waiting at the bottom.

Water flows from the head. What does a harlot do?

I agree with you, that is also a symbol which clearly represents the power and might of Rome.

“And I saw the woman, drunk with the blood of the saints and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus.” (Revelation 17:6)

This imagery portrays her as being intoxicated by the success of her persecutions against those who stood in opposition to her doctrines. The Inquisition, marked by its ruthless brutality, including torture and execution, was one of the tools used by Rome to assert and enforce its authority.

If one cannot discern the symbols, they will not be able to rightly interpret the prophecy.

 

[Hiddenthings]

As a former Catholic, I understand a great deal. We have bigger problems to deal with though.

Not really if you understand the development of the Babylonian apostacy.

Remember, John *admired* her...

ADMIRA'TION, n. Wonder mingled with pleasing emotions, as approbation, esteem, love or veneration;

Did it ever occur to you that the Harlot is redeemed in the end? Moreover, she becomes God's bride...

You're really stretching the exegesis there! borderline hallucinating

"Shall burn her with fire" The Greek katakaioo signifies to be "utterly burned" (Rev 18:8).

Symbolic of a terrifying end!

The rest of your post is just terrible exegesis!

 

[Truly]

Interesting, you answered Rev 21:1 with 21:24

How are there no more nations (sea)?

The Word of God has a way of doing this for us...

If the nations are now saved, they no longer nations!

It was this verse here Hiddenthings, it says,

Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

Which is where you had equated "no more sea" with meaning "no more nations" there

Which is why I brought in Rev 21:24 which says,

Rev 21:24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

Which shows there are nations mentioned as there are kings of the earth

And that maybe when it says the sea is no more might not be speaking specifically of nations, perhaps something else

Now that I think about it, I think I would feel kind of bummed out if there was no physical sea, I love the ocean, the sights, sounds and smell of it.

 

[Truly]

You're really stretching the exegesis there! borderline hallucinating

"Shall burn her with fire" The Greek katakaioo signifies to be "utterly burned" (Rev 18:8).

Symbolic of a terrifying end!

The rest of your post is just terrible exegesis!

I have to agree with you here

 

[Hiddenthings]

Rev 21:24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

So the first part of the verse is easy! It's what's left of the nation's coming into the New Covenant...have you studied the last part?

Who are the kings of the earth?

 

[Hiddenthings]

I have to agree with you here

A first for me since being here - that's humble of you - God can work with this in us...

 

[Hiddenthings]

@Truly

I put these thoughts here for you to ponder.

The "kings of the earth" mentioned here are not the same as those in Revelation 16:14, but rather those referred to in Revelation 5:9–10. The former will be replaced by the latter. The redeemed, those made kings and priests will become the rulers in the age to come (Luke 19:17–19; Revelation 20:4). Under their leadership, the communities they govern will be brought into submission to the Lord Jesus Christ (Psalm 68:31). This will be the expression of their glory.

Notably, in the most reliable manuscripts, the phrase "and honour" is absent. See also Isaiah 60:3 for a similar theme.

 

[Hiddenthings]

@Truly

You will not the next verse continues the theme...

“And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day” The gates of the literal Temple in Jerusalem will remain open, allowing continuous access for worshippers who desire to ascend for worship (Isaiah 60:11). Similarly, in the spiritual Jerusalem seen by John, there will be uninterrupted access. At the close of the Millennium, those who have faithfully served God throughout that period will be incorporated into this symbolic city.

In Solomon’s Temple, priests ministered day and night (Psalm 134), serving as a constant reminder to faithful Israelites that access to Yahweh was always available.

“For there shall be no night there” In a figurative sense, night represents a time when the Sun of Righteousness is absent (John 8:12; 9:4–5). In the age to come, the Lord Jesus Christ, the Light of the world, will shine continually (Malachi 4:1–2), ensuring there is no spiritual darkness.

It's a beautiful vision!

 

[Truly]

So the first part of the verse is easy! It's what's left of the nation's coming into the New Covenant...have you studied the last part?

Who are the kings of the earth?

Not seeing the sea being the nations

 

[Hiddenthings]

Not seeing the sea being the nations

What does the literal oceans have to do with New Jerusalem coming down from Heaven to Earth?

If you first thought is "nothing" then you will understand how it represents the nations and their end!

 

[Truly]

A first for me since being here - that's humble of you - God can work with this in us...

Hiddenthings, its really not a humble thing of me to simply agree with your observations concerning someone else stretching their exegesis, I am sure others who give it a quick glance can agree with you on that point.

 

[Hiddenthings]

Hiddenthings, its really not a humble thing of me to simply agree with your observations concerning someone else stretching their exegesis, I am sure others who give it a quick glance can agree with you on that point.

Do you know how often people agree with others in this site?