Is it possible to lose salvation?

[Behold]

unless that person has faith in Him.

Faith is not the Savior.

God is the Savior, who saves the believer, through Faith.....one time., as our "faith is counted by God as (Christ's) Righteosness"......just once.

End result? = Born again.......just once.

So, the False theology of "holding onto faith".......or "faith saves".........is false.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Faith is not the Savior.

God is the Savior, who saves the believer, through Faith.....one time., as our "faith is counted by God as (Christ's) Righteosness"......just once.

End result? = Born again.......just once.

So, the False theology of "holding onto faith".......or "faith saves".........is false.

I never said it was.

However – Jesus didn’t “save” the world. He PAID for the sins of every person.
To achieve salvation takes our cooperation with that grace.

God’s gift is free – bur WE have to accept it in order for it to take effect.
Your car can be filled with gas - but until YOU turn the key, you ain't goin' anywhere . . .

 

[ProDeo]

I am not convinced you really believed in eternal security

Because you are trusting self and your ability and works. and not God. If you trusted in God. you would still believe in eternal security

so if you can never meet Gods standard. why do you think you must still try to keep yourself saved?

Calling me a liar EG ??

Rom 8:31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us?
Rom 8:32 He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies.

Oh wait, it's you.

 

[Behold]

God’s gift is free – bur WE have to accept it in order for it to take effect.

Yes, God's Salvation is freely given,..John 3:16-17.... and we receive it by faith.

We give God our Faith in Christ, and God gives us instantly what the Sacrifice of Christ accomplished on The Cross, that Jesus said from The Cross..."..IT is finished".

A.) "IT" = our Salvation.

 

[ProDeo]

And yes is a far more complicated thing that just accepting a set of facts about jesus.

biblical faith causes one to be born again, become a new creature, given the mind of Christ, and starts the process Jesus wioll perform tillwe go home of confoming us to His image.

True biblical faith is a massive transforming thing.

Well said and amen.

 

[nedsk]

LMBO "in the context of James"? I did not see a conflict but apparently you do. "In the context of James" is just useless words. Either it all agrees or it doesn't. Again I see no conflict but you do because James mucks up the drivel you've been taught

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Calling me a liar EG ??

Rom 8:31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us?
Rom 8:32 He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies.

Oh wait, it's you.

You have not proven to me you ever believed in eternal security.

I will continue to wait for you to share what you actually believed word for word.


I know many who claim they believed in eternal security. when it came right down to it. they believed in an offshoot.

Then again, Why are you trusting self now? You think accusing me of bringing a charge against the elect will help you?

Why won't you answer. why are you running?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

LMBO "in the context of James"? I did not see a conflict but apparently you do. "In the context of James" is just useless words. Either it all agrees or it doesn't. Again I see no conflict but you do because James mucks up the drivel you've been taught

Your interpretation of James

And Paul in romans 4 have James and Paul apposed to each other.

Plain and simple

 

[shepherdsword]

There were no Christians when Jesus was completing His Ministry.
There were only Jews., who were unsaved.

After Jesus died, Christianty was Born., So, "church doctrine" starts there.......not before.

Jude was written after the resurrection of Christ. However, are you saying that the words of Jesus do not apply to modern day believers?

 

[shepherdsword]

they were never saved,

hence why they never bore fruit

They had to be born again to be twice dead.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

They had to be born again to be twice dead.

Not really. the second death will come to all who have rejected Jesus.

God does not give eternal life. and a promise they will never die. and he will never leave nor forsake. and he will never let them go. to people who do not have true faith.

Salvation can not be lost because it can not be earned

 

[nedsk]

Your interpretation of James

And Paul in romans 4 have James and Paul apposed to each other.

Plain and simple

No they don't. You want to insist Paul means faith alone when he never says faith alone. For the 1 millionth time if faith alone was sufficient there would be no reason for James to write, faith is completed by works and we are saved by works AND not by faith alone. Unlike you I just read the words I don't have to engage in mental gymnastics to try and explain what James "means" I can read what he means. You people are hilarious

 

[nedsk]

Yes, God's Salvation is freely given,..John 3:16-17.... and we receive it by faith.

We give God our Faith in Christ, and God gives us instantly what the Sacrifice of Christ accomplished on The Cross, that Jesus said from The Cross..."..IT is finished".

A.) "IT" = our Salvation.

So you're adding the meaning

 

[Eternally Grateful]

No they don't. You want to insist Paul means faith alone when he never says faith alone. For the 1 millionth time if faith alone was sufficient there would be no reason for James to write, faith is completed by works and we are saved by works AND not by faith alone. Unlike you I just read the words I don't have to engage in mental gymnastics to try and explain what James "means" I can read what he means. You people are hilarious

How many times do I have to post this.

I do not have to assume anything, I just have to read the words of Paul. and stop listening to men.

Paul In also quoting Gen 15. and Abraham being imputed righteousness..

rom 4: 3 For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND HE ACOUNTED IT TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.” 4 Now TO HIM WHO WORKS, THE WAGES ARE NOT COUNTED AS GRACE BUT DEBT (Works cancels out grace. and makes it a wage) 5 But TO HIM WHO DOES NOT WORK but BELIEVES ON HIM WHO JUSTIFIES THE UNGOLDY , his HIS FAITH IS ACCOUNTED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS (AGAIN NO WORKS. PERIOD)

rom 4: 16 Therefore IT IF OF FAITH THAT IT MAY BE ACCORDING TO GRACE , so that THE PROMISE MAY BE SURE TO ALL THE SEED not only to those who are of the law, but also TO THOSE WHO ARE OF THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM , who is the father of us all (AGAIN, NO WORKS, IT IS OF GRACE THROUGH FAITH)

Rom 4: 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but ALSO FOR US, IT SHALL BE IMPUTED TO US WHO BELIEVE IN HIM WHO RAISED UP JESUS OUR LORD FROM THE DEAD , 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was RAISED BECAUSE OF OUR JUSTIFICATION (AGAIN NO WORKS)

We are saved by grace. purchased by Christ who was raised for our offenses (sins) and raised because of our justification. Not by any work we did. Lest we should boast.

Just read what Paul wrote.

Paul and James using YOUR interpretation of james, are apposed to each other. They can not both be right using YOUR interpretation of james.

 

[nedsk]

How many times do I have to post this.

I do not have to assume anything, I just have to read the words of Paul. and stop listening to men.

Paul In also quoting Gen 15. and Abraham being imputed righteousness..

rom 4: 3 For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND HE ACOUNTED IT TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.” 4 Now TO HIM WHO WORKS, THE WAGES ARE NOT COUNTED AS GRACE BUT DEBT (Works cancels out grace. and makes it a wage) 5 But TO HIM WHO DOES NOT WORK but BELIEVES ON HIM WHO JUSTIFIES THE UNGOLDY , his HIS FAITH IS ACCOUNTED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS (AGAIN NO WORKS. PERIOD)

rom 4: 16 Therefore IT IF OF FAITH THAT IT MAY BE ACCORDING TO GRACE , so that THE PROMISE MAY BE SURE TO ALL THE SEED not only to those who are of the law, but also TO THOSE WHO ARE OF THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM , who is the father of us all (AGAIN, NO WORKS, IT IS OF GRACE THROUGH FAITH)

Rom 4: 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but ALSO FOR US, IT SHALL BE IMPUTED TO US WHO BELIEVE IN HIM WHO RAISED UP JESUS OUR LORD FROM THE DEAD , 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was RAISED BECAUSE OF OUR JUSTIFICATION (AGAIN NO WORKS)

We are saved by grace. purchased by Christ who was raised for our offenses (sins) and raised because of our justification. Not by any work we did. Lest we should boast.

Just read what Paul wrote.

Paul and James using YOUR interpretation of james, are apposed to each other. They can not both be right using YOUR interpretation of james.

You can scream and wail all you like, "(again no works)" those are YOUR words. Every time you read the word "faith" that Paul has written that includes a faith that is completed by works. Why? Because you can see a man is saved by works AND not by faith alone. Why? Because faith without works is dead. A dead battery in your car wont get you to work and a dead faith (without works) wont get you to heaven. Opps. keep crying though its amusing.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I agree with that assessment.

I also know that the Bible teaches that it is something that can be lost by our own doing
(Matt. 7:19-23, Matt. 10:22, Matt. 24:13, Matt. 25:31–46, John 15:1-6, Rom. 11:22, 1 Cor. 4:4, 1 Cor. 9:27, 1 Cor. 10:12, 1 Tim. 4:1, 1 Tim. 4:16, 2 Tim. 2:12, Heb. 3:6, Heb. 3:12-14, Heb. 6:4-6, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Pet. 2:20-21, 2 Pet. 3:17, 1 John 2:24, 1 John 5:13, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).

You are misunderstanding these verses. what you are sayingf is that sins jesus already forgave, He unforgives.

One who was born agaqin- becomes un-born again.
One who was made a child of God- becomes an un child
One who has been perfected is now made unperfected.
One who it is written that Jesus will complete the work started- He no longer will.
One who was given eternal life- wasn't really given eternal life.
One who was made a new creature and the old one was passewd away- the old one was resurrected

 

[Behold]

Jude was written after the resurrection of Christ. However, are you saying that the words of Jesus do not apply to modern day believers?

THe words of Jesus will always apply to believers or unbelievers, as does the entire word of God.

But when we are talking specifics........specifically the Body of Christ, that began with The Cross of Christ.....then we are not dealing primarity with what Jesus told the JEWS......before He was crucified.

This has to be understood and realized or the bible student can't understand Church doctrine, or the Epistles correctly.

See, THE CROSS, changed everything..... It brought in a NEW Covenant, and a NEW TESTAMENT,.
So, what we do, is .......when we read verses in the bible that were given before the Cross was Raised, then we have to "rightly divided" the verse, by seeing how it applies to The Cross. We have to see these "pre-Cross" verses IN LIGHT of The Cross.
In other words.......THE CROSS started a NEW TESTAMENT and this is now God dealing with Gentiles, and the Body of Christ.......untill the Tribulation starts.

So, in this "TIME of the GENTILES".. there is specific Doctrine given by PAUL, to the body of Christ, as Paul is the only "Apostle to the Gentiles" and the body of Christ (the NT Church) is mostly : GENTILES.

 

[ProDeo]

You have not proven to me you ever believed in eternal security.

Why not take my word for it ?

I will continue to wait for you to share what you actually believed word for word.

I am not your slave.

Besides we have been there .

 

[GodsGrace]

A Chritian can become many types of things.

Calvinist.
MaryCult
Mormon
JW
Dead Faith

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Falling from Grace is not the idea of falling from Salvation.

Just saw this.
You say that falling from grace is not the idea of falling from salvation.

Very interesting concept.

IF we're saved by the grace of God.....

and we fall from His grace....

how could we possibly be saved??


See Behold,,,you believe that a particular belief system is demonic (you know which one)
but YOU are doing the same by teaching/posting a belief system that is clearly not biblical.

THINK of what you say at times.

If we fall from grace....
we fall from salvation.

YOU say we cannot fall away or go astray...
and yet JESUS HIMSELF states this.

Teach what Jesus teaches.

Salvation has an end result that happens as soon as you receive Salvation.. And this end result is that you are BORN.. AGAIN.
So, that never ends, as you cant end a Spiritual Birth.

However, the way you understand Theology.......regarding your Salvation, can become confused and subverted by people who teach wrong theology, who are become ministers of the Devil.
The NT says they are "ministers of righteousness".. yet, they are teaching it according to SELF Righteousness.
This is defined in Heb 13:9 as "doctrines of Devils".

The aim of a Doctrine of Devils is to ruin your understanding of God's Grace, so that you no longer have the Revelation.
And once that happens, then you are deceived, or as Paul defines it....>>"who has BEWITCHED you, so that you no longer obey the Truth".

So what stops this from happening?
Heb 13:9 explains that you must "establish your heart wtih GRACE"...
And that means you have to understand that Jesus not only saved you, but keeps you saved.

See the "keeps you saved" part ??????
This is the part that becomes "broken faith", in a person who is trying to stay saved.
They no longer believe that Jesus keeps them saved., and at that moment, they become "fallen from Grace".

 

[ProDeo]

Matt 24:13 But the one who endures to the end will be saved.

this is not talking about eternal salvation.

How is it not ?

Jesus demands to keep the faith till the end.

in order for you to endure to the end. you would have to be sinless..

No !

What a strange connection you make.

1Joh 1:8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Joh 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Joh 1:10 If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.