WHAT IS THE WATER IN JOHN 3:5?

[Gary Mac]

How many other verses are you going to disregard Truly !

We're supposed to synchronize, harmonize, reconcile, the verses
NOT disregard them.

Most really do disregard them spiritually and only see the carnality side of them. For spiritually they are discerned, not what one thinks about it from his own perspectives. The hidden things in it are open only though the Spirit that God is be your own Spirit of mind to walk in it as He walks in it. That is why it is so important to be born again of God with that same renewing of mind that Jesus received from God in Matt 3:16 and said ye must be born again the very same. But not very many listen to Jesus spiritual side of it do they?

 

[GodsGrace]

it’s the covering.

A veil is a covering.

OK

Now what is the covering?

 

[GodsGrace]

Most really do disregard them spiritually and only see the carnality side of them. For spiritually they are discerned, not what one thinks about it from his own perspectives. The hidden things in it are open only though the Spirit that God is be your own Spirit of mind to walk in it as He walks in it. That is why it is so important to be born again of God with that same renewing of mind that Jesus received from God in Matt 3:16 and said ye must be born again the very same. But not very many listen to Jesus spiritual side of it do they?

Apparently there's a problem within Christianity Gary Mac.
We are instructed to walk in the spirit and not in the flesh.

We are taught that we should be careful not to lose the salvation we have gained.

We are taught not to sin.

Basically, we are taught to BELIEVE in Jesus.

§Do we all agree?
No.

How come?

 

[Waiting on him]

A veil is a covering.

OK

Now what is the covering?

And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.
— Isaiah 25:7

Baptism is merely a metaphor. Even to this day, when reading Moses the veil remains. When it is removed, then things are seen clearly.

 

[Muna]

It isnt an issue of not trying to sin, but is an issue of if one is born of God it is impossible to be in sin. 1 John 3:9.

Trying not to sin by following the law, you will fail miserably every time. If one is born of God, born again, those laws are fulfilled in you and who you actually become without any effort at all. It is the natural way of God, the unnatural way is by only trying.

I try not to lecture the verses. If someone asks for a scripture that says "do not sin", and so I post a scripture that says, "sin not" which contradicts their first claim that the scripture does not say that, and when you post the actual scripture, God's words are met with denial and a lecture.

Wouldn't this be true of them then?

John 8:47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

 

[Gary Mac]

Apparently there's a problem within Christianity Gary Mac.

Oh there is a great problem in Christiandom. Very few receive from God the same Christos as Jesus did in Matt 3:16 as God puts with man. These see a god of flesh instead.

We are instructed to walk in the spirit and not in the flesh.

Amen thank you for that statement.

We are taught that we should be careful not to lose the salvation we have gained.

IF one is saved by God you cant loose it it is who we become like Him and in His same image, Spirit of mind be our own.

We are taught not to sin.

Only man teach by law not to sin. Sin is man made laws, Jesus Wass made to be sin by those laws and in their sions was a blasphemer. But God Himself takes away the sins of this world and every man who is born of God, born again of Him, cannot sin because we are born of God. 1 John 3:9.

Basically, we are taught to BELIEVE in Jesus.

And Jesus teaches us to be like the God he was of, and even prayed to his God that we be in John 17, sating I pray they be in the father and the Father be in them as one as I am in the Father and the Father is in me as one.

It isnt about believing in Jesus, it is about obeying and becoming who Jesus said we would be like he was in the Father.

§Do we all agree?
No.

How come?

Because most prefer their own ways for a god that they can control by their laws to govern their beliefs for a god. Making this god obey to be in their same image,.

Belief is not real, only speculations, and one can believe anything about a god proven in all these different beliefs for a god.

The only truth comes one way and that is from the author of it who is a Spirit of Love and man is the kingdom in which He resides within, His temple. Jesus wa every clear in that in Luke 17:20-21, and he was very clear to Thomas the he said that Spirit that God is does not have flesh and bone as you see me. But man in his beliefs twist all that around that they can control their gods instead.

That is exactly why we have so many belief systems for a god. And as you say there is a problem in Christianity because they refuse to receive from the only Gopd of Love as their own mind. So simple yet so difficult for the carnal mind to understand for the carnal mins does not want to give op that right to self to become like the God of Love.

God never changes, is the same yesterday as He is today, and will be the same tomorrow, everything else changes except Love that God is , and that never changes and man is the place of it, His kingdom within.

Now I will hear from the religious minds how ridiculous that sounds, and Jesus was crucified by those same ridiculous words. I and the Father of Love are one. That didnt make Jesus a god no more than it makes me a god for the very same reason. Some here has even falsely accused me of saying I think I am God just as though Jesus said said the same, or I think I am Jesus. And just as Jesus was crucified for the very same reason. We are innocent of those false accusations. we know who we are in the Father of Love. Has His same Spirit of, walk in it, live it, it is who we are.

Let us see now who disagrees with Love be our own Spirit of God. They will have a rebuttal against the God who is Love and man is the temple of Him as thay always do and have in this very forum.

 

[Gary Mac]

I try not to lecture the verses. If someone asks for a scripture that says "do not sin", and so I post a scripture that says, "sin not" which contradicts their first claim that the scripture does not say that, and when you post the actual scripture, God's words are met with denial and a lecture.

Wouldn't this be true of them then?

John 8:47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

I go only by what Jesus said about it, not what others had to say about it from their own perspectives about it. Not to say that I cannot identify with what others said about it, but by identification with the Author, Father, of it discernment is made. If it doesnt line ups with who Jesus said we should be in the father, then I have to question what someone else wrote about it from their own perspectives. Paul could be wrong, and was in mat accounts comparing with Jesus in who he said he was in God, Peter, James, I have to consider first what Jesus said about it and compere the differences.

For me Jesus had it right by my own identification with him in his God that he spoke of who was in him. He needed no man teach him, he got his information straight from God just as all do who has that same relationship with the same god as he had. God Himself is quite capable of conveying His will in man without mans help at all.

And Jesus even went as far to say in John 16:23. And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.

If I dont need Jesus, as he said, to give me information, then I certainly do not need the opinions of Paul or Peter or any other man. God Himself is quite capable.
Again -- now I will hear how untrue all of that is even though I quoted what Jesus said about it.

 

[Muna]

I go only by what Jesus said about it, not what others had to say about it from their own perspectives about it.

Then why are you going back and forth with me on Paul's words posted by me to another person?

 

[GodsGrace]

And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.
— Isaiah 25:7

Baptism is merely a metaphor. Even to this day, when reading Moses the veil remains. When it is removed, then things are seen clearly.

OK Waiting....
I'm afraid I've lost my train of thought....
I don't believe baptism is a metaphor....
The NT teaches that it is necessary for the removal of sin.


Acts 2:38
38And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins,


Acts 22:16
16And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized and wash away your sins,


1 Peter 3.21
21Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience,


Mark 16:16
16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved,

 

[GodsGrace]

Oh there is a great problem in Christiandom. Very few receive from God the same Christos as Jesus did in Matt 3:16 as God puts with man. These see a god of flesh instead.


Amen thank you for that statement.

IF one is saved by God you cant loose it it is who we become like Him and in His same image, Spirit of mind be our own.


Only man teach by law not to sin. Sin is man made laws, Jesus Wass made to be sin by those laws and in their sions was a blasphemer. But God Himself takes away the sins of this world and every man who is born of God, born again of Him, cannot sin because we are born of God. 1 John 3:9.

And Jesus teaches us to be like the God he was of, and even prayed to his God that we be in John 17, sating I pray they be in the father and the Father be in them as one as I am in the Father and the Father is in me as one.

It isnt about believing in Jesus, it is about obeying and becoming who Jesus said we would be like he was in the Father.


Because most prefer their own ways for a god that they can control by their laws to govern their beliefs for a god. Making this god obey to be in their same image,.

Belief is not real, only speculations, and one can believe anything about a god proven in all these different beliefs for a god.

The only truth comes one way and that is from the author of it who is a Spirit of Love and man is the kingdom in which He resides within, His temple. Jesus wa every clear in that in Luke 17:20-21, and he was very clear to Thomas the he said that Spirit that God is does not have flesh and bone as you see me. But man in his beliefs twist all that around that they can control their gods instead.

That is exactly why we have so many belief systems for a god. And as you say there is a problem in Christianity because they refuse to receive from the only Gopd of Love as their own mind. So simple yet so difficult for the carnal mind to understand for the carnal mins does not want to give op that right to self to become like the God of Love.

God never changes, is the same yesterday as He is today, and will be the same tomorrow, everything else changes except Love that God is , and that never changes and man is the place of it, His kingdom within.

Now I will hear from the religious minds how ridiculous that sounds, and Jesus was crucified by those same ridiculous words. I and the Father of Love are one. That didnt make Jesus a god no more than it makes me a god for the very same reason. Some here has even falsely accused me of saying I think I am God just as though Jesus said said the same, or I think I am Jesus. And just as Jesus was crucified for the very same reason. We are innocent of those false accusations. we know who we are in the Father of Love. Has His same Spirit of, walk in it, live it, it is who we are.

Let us see now who disagrees with Love be our own Spirit of God. They will have a rebuttal against the God who is Love and man is the temple of Him as thay always do and have in this very forum.

Do you think we're like little Jesus'??

 

[Muna]

Speaking of Moses, here is a mention of being baptized in the cloud and in the seas here

1Cor.10​

[1] Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
[2] And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
[3] And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
[4] And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them:
and that Rock was Christ.
[5] But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.

 

[Gary Mac]

Then why are you going back and forth with me on Paul's words posted by me to another person?

Because Jesus had it right, not what Paul or any other said about it from their own perspectives.

If Paul is your way, then so be, it is that for me Jesus had his way in the Father right.

 

[Gary Mac]

Do you think we're like little Jesus'??

I dont know what you mean by little Jesus, Jesus was my brother, we have the same Father who is God. But if you are asking if I am like Jesus was in the Father, there is no difference at all. He in me and I in Him are one just as Jesus prayed to his God for me to be in John 17 that the Father be in me, and I be in Him as one as Jesus was in the Father and the Father was in Him as one.

Same mind, Spirit, is in me who was in Christ Jesus. Is supposed to be in you all as well.

 

[Muna]

Because Jesus had it right, not what Paul or any other said about it from their own perspectives.

If Paul is your way, then so be, it is that for me Jesus had his way in the Father right.

So you don't believe Jesus said to anyone not to sin?

John 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him,
Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

Paul said,

1 Cr 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.

Paul said,

1 Cr 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God:
I speak this to your shame.

Jesus again,

Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

 

[Gary Mac]

Speaking of Moses, here is a mention of being baptized in the cloud and in the seas here

1Cor.10​

[1] Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
[2] And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
[3] And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
[4] And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them:
and that Rock was Christ.
[5] But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.

That rock was, and is Christ, for Christ simply means man anointed of God, Christos, or saints Christos denotes. All of these who were anointed of Gods same Spirit who came to them were Christos, anointed of God, saints. And all today are the same, Christ in us.

Study shows that Christ comes from the Greek word χριστός (chrīstós), meaning "anointed one". The word is derived from the Greek verb χρίω (chrī́ō), meaning "to anoint." In the Greek Septuagint, χριστός was a semantic loan used to translate the Hebrew מָשִׁיחַ (Mašíaḥ, messiah), meaning "[one who is] anointed".

Paul came up with that nickname for Christos as Christ at Antioch, before that in the old we who are anointed of Gods same Spirit of mind were referred to as Christos, saints.

The term saint is derived from the Latin word sanctus, meaning "holy" or "consecrated." This is, in turn, a direct translation of the Greek word "άγιος" (hagios), which also means "holy." In its original scriptural usage it simply means "holy" or "sanctified."

And either one is of Christos, Christ, anointed of God and His saint, or one is not. And every person on this planet knows very well if they are anointed of God as Jesus was or not.

 

[Muna]

That rock was, and is Christ, for Christ simply means man anointed of God, Christos, or saints Christos denotes. All of these who were anointed of Gods same Spirit who came to them were Christos, anointed of God, saints. And all today are the same, Christ in us.

Study shows that Christ comes from the Greek word χριστός (chrīstós), meaning "anointed one". The word is derived from the Greek verb χρίω (chrī́ō), meaning "to anoint." In the Greek Septuagint, χριστός was a semantic loan used to translate the Hebrew מָשִׁיחַ (Mašíaḥ, messiah), meaning "[one who is] anointed".

Paul came up with that nickname for Christos as Christ at Antioch, before that in the old we who are anointed of Gods same Spirit of mind were referred to as Christos, saints.

The term saint is derived from the Latin word sanctus, meaning "holy" or "consecrated." This is, in turn, a direct translation of the Greek word "άγιος" (hagios), which also means "holy." In its original scriptural usage it simply means "holy" or "sanctified."

And either one is of Christos, Christ, anointed of God and His saint, or one is not. And every person on this planet knows very well if they are anointed of God as Jesus was or not.

Not really understanding why you would think anyone here would need to know Jesus was the rock or the anointed, I will post the scriptures though.

Jesus anointed

Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, (Isaiah 61:1, Acts 4:27, Acts 10:38, Heb 1:9 )

These anointed

2 Cr 1:22-23 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts. Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts. (1 John 2:27)

It just says, the disciples were called christians first in Antioch

Acts 11:25 Then departed Barnabas to Tarsus, for to seek Saul:
Acts 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

Jesus is "the way", but Paul said this

Acts 24:14 But this I confess unto thee, that after "the way" which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets

 

[Gary Mac]

So you don't believe Jesus said to anyone not to sin?

His instructions was to be of the same God he was of who cannot sin.

John 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him,
Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

If one rejects the holiness of love that God puts in man, and deliberatly goes against that Love, then they are of the worse thing.

Jesus got mad, went into a rage, entering the temple, turned over tables and chairs, made a whip and drove out those money changers.

Did he sin against these, I bet they accused him of, but the truth is his love of God only tried to correct their sins.
So describe sin. If I came into your house and did the same what would you think of me claiming to be Gods son?

Paul said,

1 Cr 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.

And that is exactly why I follow Jesus instead. Jim Jones, David Koresh, Warren Jeffs, said the very same thing. And that is wexactrly why I follow Jesus instead of what someone else says about him.

Most do not follow Jesus at all.

Paul said,

1 Cr 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God:
I speak this to your shame.

Jesus again,

Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

And Jesus said be as I am in the Father, He in you and you in Him as one, and in that we are perfected even as our Father inn heaven is perfect only if you are of the same God he was of and without sin.

And Jesus did teach those who were not in the Father do not sin, and what is sin? Separation from the same God that he was of and in himself. And to be separated from the same in you who was in Christ Jesus is the only sin that God recognizes and cannot forgive you of,

SO yeas Jesus said go and sin no more, be as I am in the One who takes away your sin to be like Him, holy, pure, in Love and without sin that separation that sin is.

Killing, stealing, chasing the neigfhpbors wife is not sin, only results of sin, from that separation from the righteousness of God be in yourself as your own disposition to be like Him instead.

Sin is not 10 laws that we try and follow, there were som 2500 original laws, those were reduced down to 613, about half was about mans relationship too God and half about man relationship to man. Moses reduced those down to ten. the first four dealt with mans relationship to God the last six were mans relationship to man. Jesus went a bit further and reduces those down to two. Love God, and Love man as thyself.

So how is the law fulfilled? Same way it was fulfilled in Jesus in Matt 3:16. By God Himself come to you and open in you that new heaven and earth that is not governed by these laws, but in actually who we become that isnt an effort that we try and follow, but it becomes who we actually are. We become His Love, we actually love people as ourselves, give ourselves to those in need, give up our own desired and wants, or own lives we live over to the other.

The beatitudes are not just poetic laws for who we should be, but who we actually become.

And now I will hear how all of that is blaspheme.

 

[Muna]

His instructions was to be of the same God he was of who cannot sin.

If one rejects the holiness of love that God puts in man, and deliberatly goes against that Love, then they are of the worse thing.

Jesus got mad, went into a rage, entering the temple, turned over tables and chairs, made a whip and drove out those money changers.

Did he sin against these, I bet they accused him of, but the truth is his love of God only tried to correct their sins.
So describe sin. If I came into your house and did the same what would you think of me claiming to be Gods son?


And that is exactly why I follow Jesus instead. Jim Jones, David Koresh, Warren Jeffs, said the very same thing. And that is wexactrly why I follow Jesus instead of what someone else says about him.

Most do not follow Jesus at all.



And Jesus said be as I am in the Father, He in you and you in Him as one, and in that we are perfected even as our Father inn heaven is perfect only if you are of the same God he was of and without sin.

And Jesus did teach those who were not in the Father do not sin, and what is sin? Separation from the same God that he was of and in himself. And to be separated from the same in you who was in Christ Jesus is the only sin that God recognizes and cannot forgive you of,

SO yeas Jesus said go and sin no more, be as I am in the One who takes away your sin to be like Him, holy, pure, in Love and without sin that separation that sin is.

Killing, stealing, chasing the neigfhpbors wife is not sin, only results of sin, from that separation from the righteousness of God be in yourself as your own disposition to be like Him instead.

Sin is not 10 laws that we try and follow, there were som 2500 original laws, those were reduced down to 613, about half was about mans relationship too God and half about man relationship to man. Moses reduced those down to ten. the first four dealt with mans relationship to God the last six were mans relationship to man. Jesus went a bit further and reduces those down to two. Love God, and Love man as thyself.

So how is the law fulfilled? Same way it was fulfilled in Jesus in Matt 3:16. By God Himself come to you and open in you that new heaven and earth that is not governed by these laws, but in actually who we become that isnt an effort that we try and follow, but it becomes who we actually are. We become His Love, we actually love people as ourselves, give ourselves to those in need, give up our own desired and wants, or own lives we live over to the other.

The beatitudes are not just poetic laws for who we should be, but who we actually become.

And now I will hear how all of that is blaspheme.

I am not even reading your posts at this point, you are kind of a drag, you seem to just lecture at the scripture and drone on in your own words, which I am not the least bit interested in.

So you won't be hearing anything more from me.

 

[Gary Mac]

Not really understanding why you would think anyone here would need to know Jesus was the rock or the anointed, I will post the scriptures though.

Jesus was of the rock, Anointed of God, Christos. God is the rock, man is only the place God lives within. Luke 17:20-21.

Jesus anointed

Yes of God, just as all are who is anointed of God same Spirit of mind. We are Christs, plural, and Christ is Gods. Paul did have a few things right.

Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, (Isaiah 61:1, Acts 4:27, Acts 10:38, Heb 1:9 )

The Spirit of God has anointed everyone who has received from God Himself His same disposition of mind, Spirit. Christ in us.

These anointed

2 Cr 1:22-23 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts. Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts. (1 John 2:27)

Again -- The Spirit of God has anointed everyone who has received from God Himself His same disposition of mind, Spirit.

It just says, the disciples were called christians first in Antioch

Yes and Paul came up with that nick name for Christos as Christ at Antioch.

Acts 11:25 Then departed Barnabas to Tarsus, for to seek Saul:
Acts 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

Jesus is "the way", but Paul said this

Jesus is my way, not Paul.

Acts 24:14 But this I confess unto thee, that after "the way" which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets

And the way of God for you to be that person of Christ who is anointed of God is heresy for you, that is very obvious.

As far as the law, it isnt someone we who are anointed of God with but who we actually become, Laws fulfilled in us.

 

[Gary Mac]

I am not even reading your posts at this point, you are kind of a drag, you seem to just lecture at the scripture and drone on in your own words, which I am not the least bit interested in.

My words? I didnt write who Jesus said he was in God, all I can do is copy and paste who Jesus said he was in God. And evidently what he said goads your own doctrine to a point of hatred of me for who Jesus said he was in the Father. Shame on you claiming to be of Christ yourself.

Sorry Jesus words are a drag for you, seems to be the theme here.

However I am honored that you think I wrote who Jesus said he was in the Father. But actually I cannot take credit for that, all I can do is copy and past who Jesus said he was in his God that he called Father.

So you won't be hearing anything more from me.

And I really do understand why, the truth from Jesus himself puts you under sever conviction from your own iniquities to be like Jesus was in the father to be perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect as Jesus himself commanded of you in Matt 5:48. Your own spirit has turned Jesus ways that you should be the same in the Father as he was in the Father, for you as hatred. And that is exactly why the world wants no part of your ideas for christianity.

Where is the Love of God in you? It sure isnt in this very post is it? If you were of Gods same mind, Spirit, of Love that God is, you would be saying amen God is the way to His kingdom just as Jesus said it is in Luke 17:20-21. instead of rejecting the very words of Jesus in who he was in God and your rejection of Jesus to be yourself.

BTW, Jesus didnt have a doctrine and said so. John 7:16. Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.

But you have a doctrine that you have heard from other men and creed to them instead of the doctrine that comes only by GHod Himself, Jesus was proof of that. But then you would have to believe what Jesus said of himself and his God that he obeyed and sent him.

And Truly, it is too bad you won't read this, you might have learned something about yourself and Jesus and God.